pal8485
Iain Dunn Terrier
Posts: 430
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Post by pal8485 on May 19, 2012 14:03:50 GMT 1
:rofl3: stick his transfers on here,that will sort it.in and out.what he s spent in fees and what he s recouped(or will do).dont bother with the wages argument its ridiculous.fees,in and out.put this stupid spunked millions rubbish to bed for good. off the top of my head its blatanty obvious that Clark will have made a profit. im not arguing that, hes done well finding pilks, peltier and rhodes. What im saying is with the money from that and most other transfer money has been wasted. Just becuase hes made a profit doesnt mean he hasnt wasted money. The money i would say was wasted or to be better put "spent more wisely" would be: Ainsworth,lee,robinson,Gobern,naysmith,mccombe,Simpson,Gudjonson,mcdermot,Kaye. Cant think of anymore but im sure there are more. This is just my opinion but i feel money in fees and wages has been wasted so far on these players and we should have spent more wisely. The money for these players in fees alone would be around 1million so he wasted that money in my eyes. I know people dont agree but thats just my opinion. |
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Post by 3 pipe problem on May 19, 2012 14:05:40 GMT 1
stick his transfers on here,that will sort it.in and out.what he s spent in fees and what he s recouped(or will do).dont bother with the wages argument its ridiculous.fees,in and out.put this stupid spunked millions rubbish to bed for good. I agree with this but the problem is the undisclosed fees. Some of it would involve guesswork. |
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Post by fitzyblue on May 19, 2012 14:11:46 GMT 1
he s made a profit yet wasted the money  .i agree on a few things pal.some(in hindsight) were mistakes.simpson is the only one i know of that he flew against popular opinion on.(including on here) some have flopped that,on paper,should nt have done.the myth that he s poured millions of pounds down the drain,is wrong.dean needs to take some of the brunt(which he realises) as he was ,in fairness ,allowed to bring in too many.massive mistake on all parts including LC.mistake in respect to the fact he could never settle a side and create form.the posts that he does nt know a player and he spunked millions away,are wrong.simple in my eyes. :spaz: |
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Post by fitzyblue on May 19, 2012 14:12:34 GMT 1
stick his transfers on here,that will sort it.in and out.what he s spent in fees and what he s recouped(or will do).dont bother with the wages argument its ridiculous.fees,in and out.put this stupid spunked millions rubbish to bed for good. I agree with this but the problem is the undisclosed fees. Some of it would involve guesswork. believe me the guessworks not usually far out. |
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pal8485
Iain Dunn Terrier
Posts: 430
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Post by pal8485 on May 19, 2012 14:24:37 GMT 1
You don't have to apologise, I just can't work with something that makes no sense.
I know Clark wasted some funds on some players who for one reason or another didn't cut it at the club. There isn't a manager in the game who hasn't made a signing that didn't work out. You joined in the argument halfway through when I'd moved on from that. He signed enough good players too, some of them have made or potentially will make the club a lot of money. Some of them like Bennett and Clarke, Woods and Novak have given the club great service. He's signed enough good players to get us to two consecutive play-off finals.
I've also said I'm happy with the current manager, I've moved on and I've also never denied Clark's mismanagement of certain players and the fact that towards the end he'd worn himself out.
What I will do though is defend him against folk making him out to be a worse manager than he was, he brought a lot of good on the club and some of the stick he gets from certain posters on here is over the top and out of order. A lot of it boils down to the premise that because the club spent a few bob it gives us a divine right to promotion.
I've no intention either of going round and round in circles all weekend, as soon as the Blackpool game starts I'm out of this thread. Enjoy your weekend and I'm sorry if you feel insulted.[/quote]
No worries fella. I just feel Clark wasted a fair bit of money thats all. Its not that i didnt like Clark, loved him to be honest and was pretty gutted it didnt work out for him. Hes the only Town manager i can remember that ive actually liked and felt cared for the club. He brought some great players to Town but just not enough of them. Plus he signed Higginbotham whos the next messiah who we will sell for 15million in 2 years time so guess i can forgive Clark for signing a few crap players!
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pal8485
Iain Dunn Terrier
Posts: 430
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Post by pal8485 on May 19, 2012 14:35:12 GMT 1
he s made a profit yet wasted the money .i agree on a few things pal.some(in hindsight) were mistakes.simpson is the only one i know of that he flew against popular opinion on.(including on here) some have flopped that,on paper,should nt have done.the myth that he s poured millions of pounds down the drain,is wrong.dean needs to take some of the brunt(which he realises) as he was ,in fairness ,allowed to bring in too many.massive mistake on all parts including LC.mistake in respect to the fact he could never settle a side and create form.the posts that he does nt know a player and he spunked millions away,are wrong.simple in my eyes.  I mean just because he sells a few players for a good profit at the end of the season doesnt mean he hadnt wasted money on players who havent been good enough. Hoyle needs to take blame too but he was supporting the manager in what he wanted to do and trusted his judgment. i agree Hoyle needs to to take the blame too but so does clark. So many players shouldnt have been signed, it got ridiculous really with the size of our squad at one point. I hope Grayson can find the 11 players he wants for the team and has the squad players to support this team with only a few comings and goings, harder said than done though really. |
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Post by fitzyblue on May 19, 2012 14:41:36 GMT 1
in that case then the clarke spunked millions brigade,should also add...and made millions.the arguments flawed.its whats used to fit,in order to have a pop at him.crap players? no. players that cant reach potential because the squads too big? yes.form,form,form.justified go at him squad size.ability to recruit,then no.he was alot more measured than this board would have you believe,honestly.
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Post by thrice on May 19, 2012 17:26:49 GMT 1
Correct me if I am wrong but these are the real published figures that need to be taken into consideration and there is not a dime made anywhere.
2009: Turover £4.321m Loss £3.977m
2010: Turnover £5.557m Loss £4.698m
2011: Turover £7.986m Loss £4.054m
2012: Aint going to look any prettier!
If you dont think that the difference is in those figures can be accounted for by player transfer fees & wages what the hell do you think all that cash is being "spunked" on?
Those figures would be hard enough to swallow anyway but the fact that we are still in the third division makes them scandalous.
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Post by 3 pipe problem on May 19, 2012 18:25:02 GMT 1
Stadium rent accounts for a big slice of our running costs. I stated that last night but you appear to be another one with thin air between the ears.
Stadium rent was well over £600,000 pa in 04/05 (thanks Mr Davy) .. maybe mids could clarify if that has topped the million mark now. I wouldn't be surprised.
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Post by Captainslapper on May 19, 2012 18:29:18 GMT 1
Is it a simplistic view to invent things people say? That question makes absolutely no sense whatsoever. Ture but neither does inventing things people say to try and make an argument. |
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Post by 3 pipe problem on May 19, 2012 18:34:15 GMT 1
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Post by 3 pipe problem on May 19, 2012 18:35:11 GMT 1
That question makes absolutely no sense whatsoever. Ture but neither does inventing things people say to try and make an argument. Show me where I've done that. |
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Post by Captainslapper on May 19, 2012 18:47:16 GMT 1
What I expected, ( and i suspect dean Hoyle understandably did too) was that a decent majority of signings would be good, an improvement on what we already had, particularly the ones that cost huge sums of money both in fees and wages. They were an improvement on what we already had, hence our season on season improvement every year under Clark ... or are you going to rewrite the record books, exaggerate something or completely ignore something in order to deny that fact we acheived a better league position, every season, from the very season he took over. A decent majority of signings have been good, hence why we're in our second consecutive play-off final. You don't do that if you're shite. 'The ones that cost huge sums of money both in fees and wages.' Again you go on about fees and wages, Clark didn't agree the fees and he didn't set the wages. Does that fact just keep on sailing in one ear and out the other to you ? So you're going to ignore how the team actually played - ie- the quality of our game, and even more crucially, the varying strengths of the divisions over Clarks reign- something which deteriorated a lot IMO. Very simplistic. Accepting Johnsons been out all season more or less which has been a big miss, the rest of the central midfield options Clark signed last summer- Miller, gobern, Robinson, McDermott didn't improve the position one iota IMO. If you think our central midfield has improved, or infact looked anything other than dire this season, you can't have watched us play. Morrison Ill give you has been a cracking loan signing and Clark made a few like Ward and johnson. But if you look at his list of loans over the 3 years its probably about 1 good one for every 3 or 4 who had little or no impact- similar to his recoprd on permanent signings IMO. And you seriously think Clark wasn't part of the buying process? How naive are you or do you have no understanding of how these things work at clubs at all?? Do you think clibbens- an lawyer I believe, who might never have kicked a ball in his life, let alone be knowledgable about football to the extent he can accurately value players, will have gone out and decided what we should be paying for players without any input or guidance from the actual manager of the team, a professional footballing man whos worked in the game for decades!! yeah right of course he did, so yes your 'facts' do tend to go in one ear and out the other pal as they tend to be bollocks. |
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Post by Captainslapper on May 19, 2012 18:49:14 GMT 1
Ture but neither does inventing things people say to try and make an argument. Show me where I've done that. here you go- 'You are naive in the extreme to expect every signing made by a manager to be an instant success.' You show me where I said that. |
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Post by fitzyblue on May 19, 2012 18:58:05 GMT 1
Correct me if I am wrong but these are the real published figures that need to be taken into consideration and there is not a dime made anywhere. 2009: Turover £4.321m Loss £3.977m 2010: Turnover £5.557m Loss £4.698m 2011: Turover £7.986m Loss £4.054m 2012: Aint going to look any prettier! If you dont think that the difference is in those figures can be accounted for by player transfer fees & wages what the hell do you think all that cash is being "spunked" on? Those figures would be hard enough to swallow anyway but the fact that we are still in the third division makes them scandalous. jesus man :shake: its his transfer policy that in question is nt it you roping lee clarke into the running of the entire club? just put up his ins and outs(which as been ignored) to qualify your opinion.who knows?,it might change mine. :nodding: |
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Post by Richard1986 on May 19, 2012 19:15:35 GMT 1
The clue was in the title
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Post by cheesyhtfc on May 19, 2012 23:00:09 GMT 1
I prefer not to look at how much players cost, that way I don't have any expectations of how good they are going to be. Not really fussed how much Deano is willing to pay; as long as the club isn't on the road to going bust it doesn't bother me. I'd rather say a player is a poor player because they don't play football very well, rather than because they don't play as well as they should be for the amount they are paid/they cost us.
For what it's worth, I think the majority of Clark's signings were alright, nothing special. A few real gems and a few flops. They have consistently got us in the top 6 which is more than can be said for most of the previous seasons. Ultimately, the majority of teams in the top half of the league are all ok players with a few very good ones to make the difference. We were very unlucky last year and his first season was some of the best football since Bruce. Didn't get promotion but I think he did alright, even if he did fail in his ultimate goal. Having only started watching in 2000 I've seen almost nothing but disappointment from Town; has been nice to finally have some optimism.
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Post by monkbar on May 19, 2012 23:17:44 GMT 1
Best thread ever.
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Post by monkbar on May 19, 2012 23:18:25 GMT 1
Oh and in ref to the OP Robinson has been a massive disappointment.
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bugliner
Andy Booth Terrier
Posts: 3,032
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Post by bugliner on May 20, 2012 18:07:38 GMT 1
& left us in a sticky situation. |
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Post by huddstownonly on May 20, 2012 20:33:48 GMT 1
Anton Robinson - I nearly left the "t" out and then he would be "anon" - which suits him in my opinion.
Not good enough for the bench - would also try and speak to Roberts and see if he appears interested if I were Simon Grayson.
I know that will be unpopular as most have written him off - but if he tries and it is a big stage he could be a potential match winner and if not a good penalty taker !!
Put Arfield on bench instead of Robinson.
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