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Post by Deleted on Jun 30, 2015 21:26:05 GMT 1
Good luck to them.. A great initiative.. But they're still skint and won't be going up Think that echoes where you are but the chance of udders getting relegated is high Bet you lot can't wait for your cup final
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Post by Deleted on Jun 30, 2015 21:31:39 GMT 1
Bet you lot can't wait for your cup final Glad you're here actually. Please explain to me how OUR Cup Final always provides YOUR highest attendance and since we get relatively few tickets, who exactly makes up the numbers? Hmmm ...
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Post by Deleted on Jun 30, 2015 21:34:33 GMT 1
Something I've always wondered too.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 30, 2015 21:41:10 GMT 1
Twentys plenty,good on Bradford, shows it can be done That's the thing. We can all criticise their inferior training ground, questionable kit colours, wage budget.... But they finished last season not that far behind us in the football pyramid, and have had 2 good cup runs in recent years, and here's the main thing, they have reduced their debt so they are now debt free, and operate without financial losses. Every club should be trying to do that. If Bradford refuse to pay big wages, because their finances don't allow it, good on them.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 30, 2015 21:44:46 GMT 1
Blackpool don't have any debts either.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 30, 2015 21:46:45 GMT 1
Blackpool don't have any debts either. Or a first XI ...
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Post by Deleted on Jun 30, 2015 21:56:20 GMT 1
And Bradford seem to be struggling to afford a player who is the wrong side of 30 and made a big difference to them last season. Even in the Ken Davey era I would think we could have afforded an equivalent of Jon Stead. (if that makes sense).
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Post by softboy on Jul 1, 2015 23:46:01 GMT 1
completely sick of this argument about how many season tickets sold surely if a club want to develop it's how much money they can generate from all sources of income (ie) ticket sales merchandise football league payouts commercial activity etc as I see it Bradford City are still in league one (a division below us) and have shown nothing to suggest they will be in the championship any time soon
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Post by Deleted on Jul 2, 2015 2:22:51 GMT 1
Twentys plenty,good on Bradford, shows it can be done That's the thing. We can all criticise their inferior training ground, questionable kit colours, wage budget.... But they finished last season not that far behind us in the football pyramid, and have had 2 good cup runs in recent years, and here's the main thing, they have reduced their debt so they are now debt free, and operate without financial losses. Every club should be trying to do that. If Bradford refuse to pay big wages, because their finances don't allow it, good on them. Dean Hoyle wanted to get promoted and have something more attractive.
Ken Davy was gradually moving the club towards operating without loss, and he was roundly slated for that.
Its an incredible balancing act. Take away a couple of random out of the blue cup runs (not actually included in season tickets although they've been using them to advertise them!) and suddenly Bradfords situation looks as shitty as our first 5 years or so in that league were.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 2, 2015 8:16:39 GMT 1
That's the thing. We can all criticise their inferior training ground, questionable kit colours, wage budget.... But they finished last season not that far behind us in the football pyramid, and have had 2 good cup runs in recent years, and here's the main thing, they have reduced their debt so they are now debt free, and operate without financial losses. Every club should be trying to do that. If Bradford refuse to pay big wages, because their finances don't allow it, good on them. Dean Hoyle wanted to get promoted and have something more attractive.
Ken Davy was gradually moving the club towards operating without loss, and he was roundly slated for that.
Its an incredible balancing act. Take away a couple of random out of the blue cup runs (not actually included in season tickets although they've been using them to advertise them!) and suddenly Bradfords situation looks as shitty as our first 5 years or so in that league were.
Exactly and in those first five years we finished a point off the playoffs and got into the playoffs and we were a long way behind where we are now in every respect, just like we are currently with Bradford. Their cup runs must have been great, but they were never planned. I'm not comparing our cup runs to theirs, but in those dark days in league 1, we had 2 trips to Stamford Bridge and beat premier league Birmingham.
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Post by yoy on Jul 2, 2015 10:26:06 GMT 1
Yes, but our chairman funds us enough to be in the championship. I'd rather that, then make it cheaper and have us stuck in league 1. Ultimately kids get tired of seeing a standard lower than what they see on tv, so the better quality football brings children in and keeps them in. We had 11 years in the lower leagues and it was dreadful to have to put up with season after season after season. So glad we ditched the cheap season tickets, otherwise we'd have been stuck there. Some people on here have very short memories and won't acknowledge how crap it was because it doesn't fit in with their agenda of slagging off their own club at every given opportunity. I'd have liked to have had your cup runs, but they soon get forgotten about. Playing teams like Wolves, Derby and Wednesday don't go away until we end up back in league 1, which I hope doesn't happen again for a very long time. Things are pretty good with us and they'd be even better if some of our "supporters" actually supported us. My 'sugar daddy' comment wasn't aimed at Town. I had more of the Chelsea/Man City types in mind. Hoyle seems to run a pretty tight ship but even then he's millions in the hole. When a man as rich as Dean Hoyle is needed to sustain second tier football then there's something rotten in the state of Denmark. I agree entirely. Different set of circumstances but look at stockport and their fate. Not exactly an expensively assembled side.
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Post by togterrier on Jul 2, 2015 11:05:18 GMT 1
Twentys plenty,good on Bradford, shows it can be done That's the thing. We can all criticise their inferior training ground, questionable kit colours, wage budget.... But they finished last season not that far behind us in the football pyramid, and have had 2 good cup runs in recent years, and here's the main thing, they have reduced their debt so they are now debt free, and operate without financial losses. Every club should be trying to do that. If Bradford refuse to pay big wages, because their finances don't allow it, good on them. The reality is though that there is an ever increasing gap between the divisions - where do you think Bratfud would have finished in our division with the same playing sguad? And where would we have finished in their division with our squad? I'd wager they'd have been relegated and we'd have been promoted Hypothetical tosh...................
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Post by benhomly on Jul 2, 2015 12:23:03 GMT 1
Dean Hoyle wanted to get promoted and have something more attractive.
Ken Davy was gradually moving the club towards operating without loss, and he was roundly slated for that.
Its an incredible balancing act. Take away a couple of random out of the blue cup runs (not actually included in season tickets although they've been using them to advertise them!) and suddenly Bradfords situation looks as shitty as our first 5 years or so in that league were.
Exactly and in those first five years we finished a point off the playoffs and got into the playoffs and we were a long way behind where we are now in every respect, just like we are currently with Bradford. Their cup runs must have been great, but they were never planned. I'm not comparing our cup runs to theirs, but in those dark days in league 1, we had 2 trips to Stamford Bridge and beat premier league Birmingham. I'm glad you're not comparing our cup runs to theirs, or anyone else's for that matter, because in my 40 plus years of watching Town we've never had one.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 2, 2015 14:04:15 GMT 1
Sorry. I didn't realise we had gone out in the first round of every cup competition for the last 40 years, so therefore haven't had a cup run at any point in the last 40 years, which is what you've just said. I must have imagined winning away at Stamford Bridge in the league cup and playing Chelsea in the 5th round 7 years ago, after starting in the first round or playing Wigan in the 5th round 2 years ago, so we must have managed to reach 5th rounds with some sort of cup run.
I have no intention of comparing our cup runs in the last 40 years to any other team. Suffice to say if I did though it would show as being less impressive than some a d more impressive than others (at a rough guess, I would say 50% of all football league teams).
I am not saying we've done well in the cups or indeed the league in the last 40 years, but since you've brought it up. I've replied.
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Post by benhomly on Jul 2, 2015 14:55:14 GMT 1
Sorry. I didn't realise we had gone out in the first round of every cup competition for the last 40 years, so therefore haven't had a cup run at any point in the last 40 years, which is what you've just said. I must have imagined winning away at Stamford Bridge in the league cup and playing Chelsea in the 5th round 7 years ago, after starting in the first round or playing Wigan in the 5th round 2 years ago, so we must have managed to reach 5th rounds with some sort of cup run. I have no intention of comparing our cup runs in the last 40 years to any other team. Suffice to say if I did though it would show as being less impressive than some a d more impressive than others (at a rough guess, I would say 50% of all football league teams). I am not saying we've done well in the cups or indeed the league in the last 40 years, but since you've brought it up. I've replied. Wrong time of the month? It was meant as a light hearted remark but if you reckon 50% of teams have had a worse record in cups than us over the last 40 years I'd like to wager it's nearer 10%.
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Post by galpharm2400 on Jul 2, 2015 15:30:44 GMT 1
id like to put out our best team trying to win every game..cup or league.. poor approach to the cups last season.. you can do as much as you possibly can to win any game, aiming for a cup run does not appear to be a viable ambition.. winning the next game does...as you have no idea who you might play in the next round makes it impossible to 'plan for'...
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Post by Deleted on Jul 2, 2015 15:50:42 GMT 1
Sorry. I didn't realise we had gone out in the first round of every cup competition for the last 40 years, so therefore haven't had a cup run at any point in the last 40 years, which is what you've just said. I must have imagined winning away at Stamford Bridge in the league cup and playing Chelsea in the 5th round 7 years ago, after starting in the first round or playing Wigan in the 5th round 2 years ago, so we must have managed to reach 5th rounds with some sort of cup run. I have no intention of comparing our cup runs in the last 40 years to any other team. Suffice to say if I did though it would show as being less impressive than some a d more impressive than others (at a rough guess, I would say 50% of all football league teams). I am not saying we've done well in the cups or indeed the league in the last 40 years, but since you've brought it up. I've replied. Wrong time of the month? It was meant as a light hearted remark but if you reckon 50% of teams have had a worse record in cups than us over the last 40 years I'd like to wager it's nearer 10%. Ok, fair enough, I apologise, but I still would say about 50% of all teams in football league. We've had 4 fifth round appearances in last 20 years and got knocked out by Premier league teams, Wimbledon, Derby, Chelsea and Wigan, so we haven't done that bad really.
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Post by Bilo the Bantam on Jul 2, 2015 19:13:17 GMT 1
i didnt guess.. stead moves for a better offer.. what that offer is and who has made it, is what you are guessing at.. i never mentioned money or 'imagined' size of clubs making that offer.. I havent guessed wether its more/less money, longer terms or better terms.. im not guessing why he is leaving or why parkinson thought it neccessary to make a statement about it.. if he leaves he got for himself and his own personal reasons a better move.. its easier to see reasons as to why players go to chelsea/real madrid etc, its a pure guess for lower league players, especially slightly older ones... some would guess at purely money, they may be right in some cases.. who knows..? Id like to think stead raised a bit more interest than the clubs you mentioned but im not having a guess.. Stead has joined Notts County in L2. That's the better offer you were talking about, well done.
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Post by Giggity on Jul 2, 2015 19:19:34 GMT 1
Bradford have made some decent signings this window. Steve Davies in particular is a very good signing for a League 1 club. Could be outsiders.
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Post by queenybantam07 on Jul 2, 2015 20:08:09 GMT 1
Just under 16,500 sold - 4 days remaining!
Will the average crowds be bolstered by decent Championship away support again next season?
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Post by Deleted on Jul 2, 2015 20:23:22 GMT 1
Yes the extra few hundred who turn up to the championship games compared to league 1 will bolster our attendances. Can you "sell" the same amount we did when we did cheap season tickets? If not, why the fuck not? Bradford is a far bigger place.
By the way, how many have you actually sold? Surely a few thousand have been given away.
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Post by queenybantam07 on Jul 2, 2015 21:03:26 GMT 1
Yes the extra few hundred who turn up to the championship games compared to league 1 will bolster our attendances. Can you "sell" the same amount we did when we did cheap season tickets? If not, why the fuck not? Bradford is a far bigger place. By the way, how many have you actually sold? Surely a few thousand have been given away. The average away following at most Championship grounds is circa 1,500 - compare that the the 638 we had last season, and you'll see what I'm getting at. Bradford is a big place, you're right. What a clever little sausage you are. Believe it or not, we haven't given any away (however, £149 is a steal price). As per my original post, we've sold just under 16,500....and that's with a 1,000 ST holders from last season yet to renew. We'll sell around 17,500 - so yes, more than what you sold even ours are slightly dearer.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 2, 2015 21:20:24 GMT 1
So a few hundred more away fans in the championship? Didn't I just say that. Ours were more expensive in reality. They were a minimum of £100 and a maximum of £200. Yours are a minimum of free and a maximum of £149.
Its a good offer for your fans, so well done to your chairmen, but its a bit sad when you see this as a reason to say, oh look we get better support than the dog botherers and they're in a higher division. It's utter bollocks. Nine seasons of cheap season tickets and you've finally made them cheap enough to get higher attendances than us.
Compare your crowds when you were last charging normal prices and compare them to what we were getting. Circa 8000 compared to 5 figure gates and both in league 1 for 3 seasons between 2004 and 07.
Anyway I hope the under 11s enjoy their handouts, before they get bored of watching an average league 1 team, without a pot to piss in.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 2, 2015 21:40:31 GMT 1
Bradford have made some decent signings this window. Steve Davies in particular is a very good signing for a League 1 club. Could be outsiders. He'll be useful if they're needing snookers to avoid relegation.
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Post by queenybantam07 on Jul 3, 2015 0:32:48 GMT 1
So a few hundred more away fans in the championship? Didn't I just say that. Ours were more expensive in reality. They were a minimum of £100 and a maximum of £200. Yours are a minimum of free and a maximum of £149. Its a good offer for your fans, so well done to your chairmen, but its a bit sad when you see this as a reason to say, oh look we get better support than the dog botherers and they're in a higher division. It's utter bollocks. Nine seasons of cheap season tickets and you've finally made them cheap enough to get higher attendances than us. Compare your crowds when you were last charging normal prices and compare them to what we were getting. Circa 8000 compared to 5 figure gates and both in league 1 for 3 seasons between 2004 and 07. Anyway I hope the under 11s enjoy their handouts, before they get bored of watching an average league 1 team, without a pot to piss in. But those "oh, a few hundred more" fans meant that you averaged more in terms of averages - isn't that the sole pointer of discussion - or are you doing what typical and convenient for a pup and moving goalpost when suiting fit? You ramble on about our ST's being £149, and right you are - but you fail to take into consideration that we've sold 700 tickets in the Bantams Bar - and a further 800 tickets in the Suites in the main stand at £110 more. So that's 1,500 tickets (minimum) at £259....cheap? Right you are. We do sell out all 17 boxes annually at just over £10,000 per season, but again, in stark reality we do give those away too....but that's just between me and you! Shhh! Thing is, we can all troll back through history and pick out a year where a club averaged X amount (like when you averaged 3,600 in 1989), but its all about what counts currently. Try not to worry about the free U11 handouts, I'm sure all 1,500 of them will thoroughly enjoy their outing alongside their full paying parent, and whilst football clubs in general rely heavily on success to build support (of which you'll only really encounter in the Prem - so the latter will apply to the minority), clubs outside of the Premier League will still charge ridiculous amounts of moula to entice new supporters to come and watch their stagnating team. What a fanatic incentive. Now, take a step back and evaluate that for just one moment, and think again the next time you mock a league club for making football affordable.
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Post by BottomLip on Jul 3, 2015 2:04:03 GMT 1
So a few hundred more away fans in the championship? Didn't I just say that. Ours were more expensive in reality. They were a minimum of £100 and a maximum of £200. Yours are a minimum of free and a maximum of £149. Its a good offer for your fans, so well done to your chairmen, but its a bit sad when you see this as a reason to say, oh look we get better support than the dog botherers and they're in a higher division. It's utter bollocks. Nine seasons of cheap season tickets and you've finally made them cheap enough to get higher attendances than us. Compare your crowds when you were last charging normal prices and compare them to what we were getting. Circa 8000 compared to 5 figure gates and both in league 1 for 3 seasons between 2004 and 07. Anyway I hope the under 11s enjoy their handouts, before they get bored of watching an average league 1 team, without a pot to piss in. But those "oh, a few hundred more" fans meant that you averaged more in terms of averages - isn't that the sole pointer of discussion - or are you doing what typical and convenient for a pup and moving goalpost when suiting fit? You ramble on about our ST's being £149, and right you are - but you fail to take into consideration that we've sold 700 tickets in the Bantams Bar - and a further 800 tickets in the Suites in the main stand at £110 more. So that's 1,500 tickets (minimum) at £259....cheap? Right you are. We do sell out all 17 boxes annually at just over £10,000 per season, but again, in stark reality we do give those away too....but that's just between me and you! Shhh! Thing is, we can all troll back through history and pick out a year where a club averaged X amount (like when you averaged 3,600 in 1989), but its all about what counts currently. Try not to worry about the free U11 handouts, I'm sure all 1,500 of them will thoroughly enjoy their outing alongside their full paying parent, and whilst football clubs in general rely heavily on success to build support (of which you'll only really encounter in the Prem - so the latter will apply to the minority), clubs outside of the Premier League will still charge ridiculous amounts of moula to entice new supporters to come and watch their stagnating team. What a fanatic incentive. Now, take a step back and evaluate that for just one moment, and think again the next time you mock a league club for making football affordable. You've sold this amount etc etc blah blah. Answer me the major whos cock is bigger than whos question, as this is the game youre playing..... what league you in? Couldnt give a rats if we sell 5k and you sell 25k. Youre still plodding down to Burton next year. Enjoy
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Post by Deleted on Jul 3, 2015 6:03:27 GMT 1
Out of interest, does anyone compare the average number of customers at their favourite restaurant to those at their mates' favourite restaurant? Or is this tedious debate reserved entirely for sports clubs.
The Bradford ST sales volume vs. sales revenue debate is an interesting one. It's just unfortunate that it always descends into (presumably) grown adults comparing the number of fans the two clubs have. Given that the debate's gone on for my entire lifetime, it's perhaps fair to conclude that we're pretty similar in terms of support and move on with our lives?
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Post by Deleted on Jul 3, 2015 7:55:48 GMT 1
So a few hundred more away fans in the championship? Didn't I just say that. Ours were more expensive in reality. They were a minimum of £100 and a maximum of £200. Yours are a minimum of free and a maximum of £149. Its a good offer for your fans, so well done to your chairmen, but its a bit sad when you see this as a reason to say, oh look we get better support than the dog botherers and they're in a higher division. It's utter bollocks. Nine seasons of cheap season tickets and you've finally made them cheap enough to get higher attendances than us. Compare your crowds when you were last charging normal prices and compare them to what we were getting. Circa 8000 compared to 5 figure gates and both in league 1 for 3 seasons between 2004 and 07. Anyway I hope the under 11s enjoy their handouts, before they get bored of watching an average league 1 team, without a pot to piss in. But those "oh, a few hundred more" fans meant that you averaged more in terms of averages - isn't that the sole pointer of discussion - or are you doing what typical and convenient for a pup and moving goalpost when suiting fit? You ramble on about our ST's being £149, and right you are - but you fail to take into consideration that we've sold 700 tickets in the Bantams Bar - and a further 800 tickets in the Suites in the main stand at £110 more. So that's 1,500 tickets (minimum) at £259....cheap? Right you are. We do sell out all 17 boxes annually at just over £10,000 per season, but again, in stark reality we do give those away too....but that's just between me and you! Shhh! Thing is, we can all troll back through history and pick out a year where a club averaged X amount (like when you averaged 3,600 in 1989), but its all about what counts currently. Try not to worry about the free U11 handouts, I'm sure all 1,500 of them will thoroughly enjoy their outing alongside their full paying parent, and whilst football clubs in general rely heavily on success to build support (of which you'll only really encounter in the Prem - so the latter will apply to the minority), clubs outside of the Premier League will still charge ridiculous amounts of moula to entice new supporters to come and watch their stagnating team. What a fanatic incentive. Now, take a step back and evaluate that for just one moment, and think again the next time you mock a league club for making football affordable. Basically what you've just said their is rubbish and we're not mocking you for making it affordable. We are mocking you're supporters, or some of them for seeing it as an excuse to say, oh look we get fantastic crowd and we're only in league 1. The amount youre bringing in throught the turnstiles must be no more than your average league 1 team, which means you miss out on players such as Jon Stead to leage 2 Notts County. Oh and we averaged 5821 and 5630 in 88-89 and 89-90 (only took me 30 seconds to look that up) so don't know where you got your 3600 from. Making things up again, I presume. Not really worth debating if you're gonna do that. And just one final thing, which I think will end the debate and bring this to a conclusion, you say that we conveniently forget that we ge t higher away followings. Ok, yes we do, between 700-900. Can you now conveniently remember that your crowds are bolstered by very cheap season tickets. If you can do that, that's it, end of debate. We both agree.
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Post by galpharm2400 on Jul 3, 2015 14:39:26 GMT 1
i didnt guess.. stead moves for a better offer.. what that offer is and who has made it, is what you are guessing at.. i never mentioned money or 'imagined' size of clubs making that offer.. I havent guessed wether its more/less money, longer terms or better terms.. im not guessing why he is leaving or why parkinson thought it neccessary to make a statement about it.. if he leaves he got for himself and his own personal reasons a better move.. its easier to see reasons as to why players go to chelsea/real madrid etc, its a pure guess for lower league players, especially slightly older ones... some would guess at purely money, they may be right in some cases.. who knows..? Id like to think stead raised a bit more interest than the clubs you mentioned but im not having a guess.. Stead has joined Notts County in L2. That's the better offer you were talking about, well done.
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Post by Captainslapper on Jul 3, 2015 14:47:31 GMT 1
Nottinghams a nice city. Some great historic places ( pubs) , a great city centre , the trent, handy tram system. All In all Ive always found it a pretty good place as cities go. Whereas bradford is a right scruffy shit hole.
Seems like a better offer to me for Steady.
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