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Post by benhomly on Oct 10, 2019 12:51:36 GMT 1
No I'm thinking of the one I saw start most games for town in the Premier League when we could compete and weren't an embarrassment. Anyway this thread is nowt to do with Ince. Sent from my SM-G920F using proboards That was nothing to do with Ince. We had mainly the same players second season as we did first. By the second season the confidence of promotion had gone and the rot of struggling each week was setting in. If Ince had stayed he would have been even poorer last season than he was 2017/18 (if that was possible given how average he was anyway) Name me one player who was better last season than 2017/18? Even quality players like Schindler and Mooy were a shadow of the players they were just a few months earlier You do know it's a team game don't you? And that no-one can afford to carry players, especially in the Premier League and especially newly promoted ones?
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Post by royrace on Oct 10, 2019 12:58:16 GMT 1
No I'm thinking of the one I saw start most games for town in the Premier League when we could compete and weren't an embarrassment. Anyway this thread is nowt to do with Ince. Sent from my SM-G920F using proboards That was nothing to do with Ince. We had mainly the same players second season as we did first. By the second season the confidence of promotion had gone and the rot of struggling each week was setting in. If Ince had stayed he would have been even poorer last season than he was 2017/18 (if that was possible given how average he was anyway) Name me one player who was better last season than 2017/18? Even quality players like Schindler and Mooy were a shadow of the players they were just a few months earlier I'm simply saying that the team and squad would have been better off had we not purchased the 3 wingers and that Ince would have contributed more. Basically we would have had a quality professional who was fit to start PL games in any position across the attacking midfield. Whatever your feelings on Inces quality you cant deny the squad would have been better off with a player who had proven he had the necessary attributes to play for Town in the PL. That's in comparison to 3 players who proved they weren't up to it. Are you saying if we had simply stood still that summer and left the squad as is we'd have done as badly? Not a chance, we'd likely have been relegated yes but we'd almost certainly have amassed a bigger points total. Bringing in sub standard unsuitable players broke the team and its spirit. Anyway its history.
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Champers
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Diakhaby
Oct 10, 2019 14:58:56 GMT 1
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Post by Champers on Oct 10, 2019 14:58:56 GMT 1
No I'm thinking of the one I saw start most games for town in the Premier League when we could compete and weren't an embarrassment. Anyway this thread is nowt to do with Ince. Sent from my SM-G920F using proboards That was nothing to do with Ince. We had mainly the same players second season as we did first. By the second season the confidence of promotion had gone and the rot of struggling each week was setting in. If Ince had stayed he would have been even poorer last season than he was 2017/18 (if that was possible given how average he was anyway) Name me one player who was better last season than 2017/18? Even quality players like Schindler and Mooy were a shadow of the players they were just a few months earlier The hell happened to you? Your comments used to make me want to throttle you, but I don't think I've disagreed with a thing you've said in about 3 months. Including this. Bang on 👍🏼
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Post by Porrohman on Oct 10, 2019 15:18:17 GMT 1
That was nothing to do with Ince. We had mainly the same players second season as we did first. By the second season the confidence of promotion had gone and the rot of struggling each week was setting in. If Ince had stayed he would have been even poorer last season than he was 2017/18 (if that was possible given how average he was anyway) Name me one player who was better last season than 2017/18? Even quality players like Schindler and Mooy were a shadow of the players they were just a few months earlier I'm simply saying that the team and squad would have been better off had we not purchased the 3 wingers and that Ince would have contributed more. Basically we would have had a quality professional who was fit to start PL games in any position across the attacking midfield. Whatever your feelings on Inces quality you cant deny the squad would have been better off with a player who had That's in comparison to 3 players who proved they weren't up to it. Are you saying if we had simply stood still that summer and left the squad as is we'd have done as badly? Not a chance, we'd likely have been relegated yes but we'd almost certainly have amassed a bigger points total. Bringing in sub standard unsuitable players broke the team and its spirit. Anyway its history. Proven he had the necessary attributes to play for Town in the PL ? The same one that's flopped everytime hed been given a chance in the PL. The one we sold at the first opportunity and is now extremely disliked at his new club. That one ?
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Diakhaby
Oct 10, 2019 16:31:46 GMT 1
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Post by bluestripe on Oct 10, 2019 16:31:46 GMT 1
I'm simply saying that the team and squad would have been better off had we not purchased the 3 wingers and that Ince would have contributed more. Basically we would have had a quality professional who was fit to start PL games in any position across the attacking midfield. Whatever your feelings on Inces quality you cant deny the squad would have been better off with a player who had That's in comparison to 3 players who proved they weren't up to it. Are you saying if we had simply stood still that summer and left the squad as is we'd have done as badly? Not a chance, we'd likely have been relegated yes but we'd almost certainly have amassed a bigger points total. Bringing in sub standard unsuitable players broke the team and its spirit. Anyway its history. Proven m he had the necessary attributes to play for Town in the PL ? The same one that's flopped everytime hed been given a chance in the PL. The one we sold at the first opportunity and is now extremely disliked at his new club. That one ? Ince Vs Kachunga. Who is the worst? 🤪🤪👍
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Post by Porrohman on Oct 10, 2019 16:38:39 GMT 1
Proven m he had the necessary attributes to play for Town in the PL ? The same one that's flopped everytime hed been given a chance in the PL. The one we sold at the first opportunity and is now extremely disliked at his new club. That one ? Ince Vs Kachunga. Who is the worst? 🤪🤪👍 No score draw 😉😄, but I'm trying to not say owt bad about Kach now 🤫
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Post by hypotenuse on Oct 12, 2019 14:52:37 GMT 1
Proven m he had the necessary attributes to play for Town in the PL ? The same one that's flopped everytime hed been given a chance in the PL. The one we sold at the first opportunity and is now extremely disliked at his new club. That one ? Ince Vs Kachunga. Who is the worst? 🤪🤪👍 I think that both those players embody the spirit of the club. They are/were terrific ambassadors for the club, doing lots of voluntary stuff and Ince came across extremely well when being interviewed. Yes, both players (in particular Kachunga) found it tough in the Prem but neither player ever shirked their duties on the pitch. It was right to sell Ince when the offer came in (as it was with Lolley) but those who replaced them were less well prepared for the Premier League and contributed pretty much the square root of fuck all last season.
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Diakhaby
Oct 12, 2019 16:27:26 GMT 1
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Post by bluestripe on Oct 12, 2019 16:27:26 GMT 1
Ince Vs Kachunga. Who is the worst? 🤪🤪👍 I think that both those players embody the spirit of the club. They are/were terrific ambassadors for the club, doing lots of voluntary stuff and Ince came across extremely well when being interviewed. Yes, both players (in particular Kachunga) found it tough in the Prem but neither player ever shirked their duties on the pitch. It was right to sell Ince when the offer came in (as it was with Lolley) but those who replaced them were less well prepared for the Premier League and contributed pretty much the square root of fuck all last season. Just to be clear, I was playing to my audience. 😀. I would be happy for 16/17 Kachunga and 17/18 Ince to be playing for Town.
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Diakhaby
Oct 12, 2019 16:40:55 GMT 1
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Post by Porrohman on Oct 12, 2019 16:40:55 GMT 1
I think that both those players embody the spirit of the club. They are/were terrific ambassadors for the club, doing lots of voluntary stuff and Ince came across extremely well when being interviewed. Yes, both players (in particular Kachunga) found it tough in the Prem but neither player ever shirked their duties on the pitch. It was right to sell Ince when the offer came in (as it was with Lolley) but those who replaced them were less well prepared for the Premier League and contributed pretty much the square root of fuck all last season. Just to be clear, I was playing to my audience. 😀. I would be happy for 16/17 Kachunga and 17/18 Ince to be playing for Town. 17/18 Ince ? Maybe the one from before he signed instead
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 8, 2020 10:36:25 GMT 1
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Post by HuddsTerrier on Jul 8, 2020 10:42:05 GMT 1
We like to identify players based on database stats On the stats that will show a touch which beat a man, followed by a very rapid sprint and the ball running out of play
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Post by Deleted on Jul 8, 2020 11:10:04 GMT 1
We like to identify players based on database stats On the stats that will show a touch which beat a man, followed by a very rapid sprint and the ball running out of play
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Diakhaby
Jul 8, 2020 11:12:29 GMT 1
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Post by Is It Eidur Gudjohnsen on Jul 8, 2020 11:12:29 GMT 1
Wow, has he actually got worse! ?
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Diakhaby
Jul 8, 2020 12:40:09 GMT 1
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Post by Porrohman on Jul 8, 2020 12:40:09 GMT 1
Wow, has he actually got worse! ? Depends, Mick McCarthy was purring over him at the weekend when he left Derbys right back for dead and put a cross in
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Diakhaby
Jul 8, 2020 12:47:53 GMT 1
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Post by rastrick32 on Jul 8, 2020 12:47:53 GMT 1
I'm still willing to put my neck on the DATM chopping block and say that there is a chance that this lad might come good and/or useful.
If he could be coached correctly during a pre-season, we could use that pace because we lack any pace anywhere else on the pitch. I'm just throwing ideas out here so please don't shoot me down. How about wing back with a very disciplined centre half close by? Through the middle as an impact sub if we are trying to hold onto something in a game? Humour me...
Mbenza on the other hand, is just plain shite.
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Post by overtonterrierspirit on Jul 8, 2020 13:06:07 GMT 1
I'm still willing to put my neck on the DATM chopping block and say that there is a chance that this lad might come good and/or useful. If he could be coached correctly during a pre-season, we could use that pace because we lack any pace anywhere else on the pitch. I'm just throwing ideas out here so please don't shoot me down. How about wing back with a very disciplined centre half close by? Through the middle as an impact sub if we are trying to hold onto something in a game? Humour me... Mbenza on the other hand, is just plain shite. Get your point. But haven’t we tried using him as an impact sub before? In fairness, I remember him having one good game where he looked dangerous and was doing everything we’d been told he could. I can’t remember who we were playing but he followed that game up with his usual very poor performances. He got a temporary move away from us and you would think he would take the opportunity but going by remarks made by some Forest fans, nothing has changed.
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digs
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Post by digs on Jul 8, 2020 14:06:44 GMT 1
I'm still willing to put my neck on the DATM chopping block and say that there is a chance that this lad might come good and/or useful. If he could be coached correctly during a pre-season, we could use that pace because we lack any pace anywhere else on the pitch. I'm just throwing ideas out here so please don't shoot me down. How about wing back with a very disciplined centre half close by? Through the middle as an impact sub if we are trying to hold onto something in a game? Humour me... Mbenza on the other hand, is just plain shite. he'd be more use as an impact screwdriver
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 8, 2020 14:29:28 GMT 1
I'm still willing to put my neck on the DATM chopping block and say that there is a chance that this lad might come good and/or useful. If he could be coached correctly during a pre-season, we could use that pace because we lack any pace anywhere else on the pitch. I'm just throwing ideas out here so please don't shoot me down. How about wing back with a very disciplined centre half close by? Through the middle as an impact sub if we are trying to hold onto something in a game? Humour me... Mbenza on the other hand, is just plain shite. I half agree with you. Mbenza could easily be a decent footballer too. Neither of them is half as bad as they are regularly made out to be, and they've both got really positive physical attributes which puts their real value as higher than players we're left playing out the season with such as Pritchard, Kachunga and Quaner. To be honest if it wasn't for the goals, I'd suggest that there's more potential to eek out of either of them than Grant even...BUT...he HAS scored the goals. Its a real shame they're not here, as having no crowd could really benefit players like this for a few months, in the same way that Chalobah seems to get more impressive and confident with every performance at the moment, or the impressive display that Willock turned in yesterday that certainly wouldn't have happened had he played out the last couple of matches to the moans and groans that would have associated with his half-assed performances since the restart, and just turned him into another can't-be-bothered-I'm-only-on-loan-for-another-month-just-going-though-the-motion type player.
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Post by sociallydistant on Jul 8, 2020 14:50:35 GMT 1
I'm still willing to put my neck on the DATM chopping block and say that there is a chance that this lad might come good and/or useful. If he could be coached correctly during a pre-season, we could use that pace because we lack any pace anywhere else on the pitch. I'm just throwing ideas out here so please don't shoot me down. How about wing back with a very disciplined centre half close by? Through the middle as an impact sub if we are trying to hold onto something in a game? Humour me... Mbenza on the other hand, is just plain shite. MBenza has shown something, somewhere, to get in the Belgium U21s. He can also put in a decent cross (well, he did at least once v Burnley) and has got a better karate kick than James Vaughan on him....
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Post by royrace on Jul 8, 2020 15:06:15 GMT 1
I'm still willing to put my neck on the DATM chopping block and say that there is a chance that this lad might come good and/or useful. If he could be coached correctly during a pre-season, we could use that pace because we lack any pace anywhere else on the pitch. I'm just throwing ideas out here so please don't shoot me down. How about wing back with a very disciplined centre half close by? Through the middle as an impact sub if we are trying to hold onto something in a game? Humour me... Mbenza on the other hand, is just plain shite. I half agree with you. Mbenza could easily be a decent footballer too. Neither of them is half as bad as they are regularly made out to be, and they've both got really positive physical attributes which puts their real value as higher than players we're left playing out the season with such as Pritchard, Kachunga and Quaner. To be honest if it wasn't for the goals, I'd suggest that there's more potential to eek out of either of them than Grant even...BUT...he HAS scored the goals. Its a real shame they're not here, as having no crowd could really benefit players like this for a few months, in the same way that Chalobah seems to get more impressive and confident with every performance at the moment, or the impressive display that Willock turned in yesterday that certainly wouldn't have happened had he played out the last couple of matches to the moans and groans that would have associated with his half-assed performances since the restart, and just turned him into another can't-be-bothered-I'm-only-on-loan-for-another-month-just-going-though-the-motion type player. They're both utter dog shit! Neither is good enough to play in the top two divisions in this country and never will be. They should never have been signed. £21M plus massive wages down the toilet. Their real value is higher than AP, EK and CQ is it? Cos they can run fast? I've heard it all now. More potential than Grant?!?!?!?!!?!?!??!?! FFS Town need to get you making this sales pitch to the rest of the football world so we can get rid of the absolute wasters without having to pay someone to take them off our hands Usain Bolts is/was the fastest man on the planet but not good enough for non league football. There's a lack of ability, nothing to do with pressure and even if it was being able to play in front of an expectant crowd and handle pressure is part of being a pro footballer.
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Post by royrace on Jul 8, 2020 15:08:01 GMT 1
I'm still willing to put my neck on the DATM chopping block and say that there is a chance that this lad might come good and/or useful. If he could be coached correctly during a pre-season, we could use that pace because we lack any pace anywhere else on the pitch. I'm just throwing ideas out here so please don't shoot me down. How about wing back with a very disciplined centre half close by? Through the middle as an impact sub if we are trying to hold onto something in a game? Humour me... Mbenza on the other hand, is just plain shite. MBenza has shown something, somewhere, to get in the Belgium U21s. He can also put in a decent cross (well, he did at least once v Burnley) and has got a better karate kick than James Vaughan on him....
This would be hilarious if we weren't talking about our £13M transfer!!!
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Post by Venezuelan Pete on Jul 8, 2020 15:21:03 GMT 1
They are both dreadful and will never play consistently at a level higher than League One
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Diakhaby
Jul 8, 2020 16:17:08 GMT 1
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Post by rastrick32 on Jul 8, 2020 16:17:08 GMT 1
They are both dreadful and will never play consistently at a level higher than League One I suppose I'm playing devil's advocate but I think we need to get past the 'they're wank and we should offload them for nowt' stance. We paid far too much money and they will be on lucrative contracts, even accounting for a relegation or two. Their market value is rock bottom and rightly so. So...is it too much of a gamble to give them a second chance with the Cowley's. Let the coaches coach them and get inside their heads and try and find a role that brings some value to the club. I don't think we have much to lose with this strategy. We probably don't have too much choice either.
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Post by Venezuelan Pete on Jul 8, 2020 16:21:20 GMT 1
They are both dreadful and will never play consistently at a level higher than League One I suppose I'm playing devil's advocate but I think we need to get past the 'they're wank and we should offload them for nowt' stance. We paid far too much money and they will be on lucrative contracts, even accounting for a relegation or two. Their market value is rock bottom and rightly so. So...is it too much of a gamble to give them a second chance with the Cowley's. Let the coaches coach them and get inside their heads and try and find a role that brings some value to the club. I don't think we have much to lose with this strategy. We probably don't have too much choice either. The argument is whether we attempt to save ourselves future outlay or risk keeping them and hoping they 'turn good'. Let's assume they are each on a £20k p/w contract, that's £40k p/w for both of them. Over the next year that's £2m+ in wages alone, in what is going to be a very difficult time for us financially. If we could get rid of them for nothing and even worst-case scenario agree to pay half their salaries, we're saving £1m.
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Diakhaby
Jul 8, 2020 16:26:17 GMT 1
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Post by overtonterrierspirit on Jul 8, 2020 16:26:17 GMT 1
I'm still willing to put my neck on the DATM chopping block and say that there is a chance that this lad might come good and/or useful. If he could be coached correctly during a pre-season, we could use that pace because we lack any pace anywhere else on the pitch. I'm just throwing ideas out here so please don't shoot me down. How about wing back with a very disciplined centre half close by? Through the middle as an impact sub if we are trying to hold onto something in a game? Humour me... Mbenza on the other hand, is just plain shite. MBenza has shown something, somewhere, to get in the Belgium U21s. He can also put in a decent cross (well, he did at least once v Burnley) and has got a better karate kick than James Vaughan on him....
To be really clear though. Apart from his goal, gifted to him by Luke Shaw v Man Utd and 1 good cross he has done absolutely nothing since joining this club.
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Post by Art Vandelay on Jul 8, 2020 16:46:43 GMT 1
I'm still willing to put my neck on the DATM chopping block and say that there is a chance that this lad might come good and/or useful. If he could be coached correctly during a pre-season, we could use that pace because we lack any pace anywhere else on the pitch. I'm just throwing ideas out here so please don't shoot me down. How about wing back with a very disciplined centre half close by? Through the middle as an impact sub if we are trying to hold onto something in a game? Humour me... Mbenza on the other hand, is just plain shite. Get your point. But haven’t we tried using him as an impact sub before? In fairness, I remember him having one good game where he looked dangerous and was doing everything we’d been told he could. I can’t remember who we were playing but he followed that game up with his usual very poor performances. He got a temporary move away from us and you would think he would take the opportunity but going by remarks made by some Forest fans, nothing has changed. He had a decent week when we played Millwall, Stoke and Hull. I thought that would be the turning point in his Town career but he quickly reverted to type. I wouldn’t be against giving him a second chance as he has pace and that isn’t something we don’t have but I think he has burnt his bridges here.
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Diakhaby
Jul 8, 2020 17:01:42 GMT 1
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Post by Porrohman on Jul 8, 2020 17:01:42 GMT 1
MBenza has shown something, somewhere, to get in the Belgium U21s. He can also put in a decent cross (well, he did at least once v Burnley) and has got a better karate kick than James Vaughan on him....
To be really clear though. Apart from his goal, gifted to him by Luke Shaw v Man Utd and 1 good cross he has done absolutely nothing since joining this club. There's always hope, Stoke gave us £10m for a shit winger with no assists
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Post by turbo2 on Jul 8, 2020 17:13:06 GMT 1
To be really clear though. Apart from his goal, gifted to him by Luke Shaw v Man Utd and 1 good cross he has done absolutely nothing since joining this club. There's always hope, Stoke gave us £10m for a shit winger with no assists You can slag ince off all day long but at least he could pass a ball, trap a ball and had some general idea of what he was doing on the pitch
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Diakhaby
Jul 8, 2020 17:28:31 GMT 1
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Post by Porrohman on Jul 8, 2020 17:28:31 GMT 1
There's always hope, Stoke gave us £10m for a shit winger with no assists You can slag ince off all day long but at least he could pass a ball, trap a ball and had some general idea of what he was doing on the pitch Shame he couldn't beat a man, cross or shoot
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Post by softboy on Jul 8, 2020 18:07:31 GMT 1
Did he not create the assist for our first win at Stoke and I seem to remember a win shortly thereafter at home. He just seems a young man, lost, away from home, with an agent who is probably all about money. I would certainly welcome him back into the fold and see what we can do. If the Cowley's can develop him that's good, if not then let him go. I cannot imagine we are going to loose any more money in 3/6 months than we would if we got rid now.
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