ldotm
David Wagner Terrier
Posts: 2,877
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Post by ldotm on Sept 5, 2020 3:40:10 GMT 1
Had a few beers but fuck it, feel like this needs to be said and no it’s nothing to do with being a happy clapper, more the fact of we can’t change the past so let’s just see what happens.
This place has always been prone to a level of toxicity but it has gone to a new level recently despite playing no games of football. Right now so many fans criticise the club no matter what they do, a million miles away from the year we went up and the excitement around the club in that season.
I absolutely get it, that there is justification to be pissed off, frustrated and negative as we have watched an absolute car crash of a couple of seasons and watched our team get to the highest level we’ve ever seen, only to throw it away in a ridiculous fashion.
However, we can’t change the past, it’s done and dusted and we need to look forward with a completely new management team. Phil has put his cock on the block and taken a gamble.. it could turn out to be the worst decision of his life and he will certainly know about it but it also could be a genius move where he’s taken a risk and it may well just pay off.
Yes, the transfer activity generally has been uninspiring but it’s not over yet and regardless look at how little we spent in the year we got promoted. It’s not always about the most talented players, it’s about finding individuals that buy into the system, culture and the club and it all clicking.
It’s very hard to get right but at least we should see some attacking intent and a team that will go for it and give us something to be entertained. The club have made numerous mistakes and we are all aware of that but this is a new chapter in our career and we have to see how we are performing 5/10 games in.
I’ve no doubt a few will reply to this giving it the big one slating the club or slating me for being deluded or over optimistic but I can assure you I don’t have a clue how we will do next year and it’s an unknown quantity right now. I’ve hurt just as much as any of us town fans of going from a club that I was so proud to boast about, to a team I’ve hated discussing how poor we’ve become and losing interest in my club.
But all it takes is a good season with a new manager to get us all buzzing (I know COVID ruins it massively too). Yes, there’s a big chance we could flop and do nothing but it’s football and we also could just throw a few surprises.
Here’s to a new start with optimism that we will have a team to believe in again and to hopefully not being too long before we can cheer them on in the stands and enjoy football and our club again.
UTT
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Mav
Tom Cowan Terrier
Posts: 754
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Post by Mav on Sept 5, 2020 7:06:49 GMT 1
Excellent grammar after a few beers at 4 in the morning.
Good work sir.
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Post by Metch on Sept 5, 2020 7:13:41 GMT 1
It should be what we all have before a ball is kicked, hope! Often misplaced but it's a great feeling before reality kicks in. For what it's worth, i think we will do better than expected and Carlos will be alright.
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Post by Baby Ate My Eight Ball on Sept 5, 2020 7:24:48 GMT 1
I’ve got a good feeling about the new management team, and at least we’re being bold. A bit of optimism isn’t going to kill anyone so why not embrace it.
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Post by boooothy on Sept 5, 2020 9:20:23 GMT 1
When the promotion season kicked off we all knew we were in for a good season (not promotion obviously). The vision was clear, we were signing winners, captains, leaders. A goalkeeper actually playing games for Liverpool!!
No one wants this season to be a good one more than me but unless we sign some players it won’t be.
Excellent post though, even i get bored of listening to myself moaning about what’s gone before.
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Post by benhomly on Sept 5, 2020 9:35:38 GMT 1
Nice post but I think the missed opportunity and wasted millions will be talked about on here for many years to come once we become a side that flits between the Championship and L1 again which seems inevitable. I will always buy a season ticket to support my club as long as I’m able but won’t have a problem with those who want a moan and probably will myself in the years to come.
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Post by willo on Sept 5, 2020 9:43:20 GMT 1
The emerging youth talent and the unknown of CC are about the only 2 things I can get excited about as it stands. We knew almost immediately with DW that we had something special on our hands and this guy will get a few months from me before judgement is passed.
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Post by capitalterrier on Sept 5, 2020 9:43:30 GMT 1
Nice post but I think the missed opportunity and wasted millions will be talked about on here for many years to come once we become a side that flits between the Championship and L1 again which seems inevitable. I will always buy a season ticket to support my club as long as I’m able but won’t have a problem with those who want a moan and probably will myself in the years to come. That's the real shame of it. With £280m (two hundred and eighty million pounds!) we should've been set up to be a competitive championship force for many years to come. The mismanagement of that income is utterly disgraceful and I believe we're doing our best to rectify it.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Sept 5, 2020 9:52:24 GMT 1
Genuinely looking forward to this season and some positive attacking football.
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Post by galpharm2400 on Sept 5, 2020 10:09:40 GMT 1
Had a few beers but fuck it, feel like this needs to be said and no it’s nothing to do with being a happy clapper, more the fact of we can’t change the past so let’s just see what happens. This place has always been prone to a level of toxicity but it has gone to a new level recently despite playing no games of football. Right now so many fans criticise the club no matter what they do, a million miles away from the year we went up and the excitement around the club in that season. I absolutely get it, that there is justification to be pissed off, frustrated and negative as we have watched an absolute car crash of a couple of seasons and watched our team get to the highest level we’ve ever seen, only to throw it away in a ridiculous fashion. However, we can’t change the past, it’s done and dusted and we need to look forward with a completely new management team. Phil has put his cock on the block and taken a gamble.. it could turn out to be the worst decision of his life and he will certainly know about it but it also could be a genius move where he’s taken a risk and it may well just pay off. Yes, the transfer activity generally has been uninspiring but it’s not over yet and regardless look at how little we spent in the year we got promoted. It’s not always about the most talented players, it’s about finding individuals that buy into the system, culture and the club and it all clicking. It’s very hard to get right but at least we should see some attacking intent and a team that will go for it and give us something to be entertained. The club have made numerous mistakes and we are all aware of that but this is a new chapter in our career and we have to see how we are performing 5/10 games in. I’ve no doubt a few will reply to this giving it the big one slating the club or slating me for being deluded or over optimistic but I can assure you I don’t have a clue how we will do next year and it’s an unknown quantity right now. I’ve hurt just as much as any of us town fans of going from a club that I was so proud to boast about, to a team I’ve hated discussing how poor we’ve become and losing interest in my club. But all it takes is a good season with a new manager to get us all buzzing (I know COVID ruins it massively too). Yes, there’s a big chance we could flop and do nothing but it’s football and we also could just throw a few surprises. Here’s to a new start with optimism that we will have a team to believe in again and to hopefully not being too long before we can cheer them on in the stands and enjoy football and our club again. UTT You had me at 'some attacking intent'... Fuck me that will be a change... I'll back carlos to hell and back if he cattle prods Hoggy when he turns a full circle but still ends up looking and playing backwards...😉
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Wingman
Mental Health Support Group
Posts: 3,758
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Post by Wingman on Sept 5, 2020 11:12:44 GMT 1
Before each season I get a gut feeling how things’ll pan out. It felt like we were onto something in Warnock’s second season and Wagner’s first full season...and we did well.
This year I’m slightly nervous due to lack of incomings but also I’m slowly becoming more confident CC will do just fine. I expected a real struggle but maybe mid-table is more appropriate.
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Post by bluesandtwos on Sept 5, 2020 11:41:36 GMT 1
Excellent grammar after a few beers at 4 in the morning. Good work sir. He started it at midnight though 😉
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Post by Porrohman on Sept 5, 2020 11:45:11 GMT 1
Nice post but I think the missed opportunity and wasted millions will be talked about on here for many years to come once we become a side that flits between the Championship and L1 again which seems inevitable. I will always buy a season ticket to support my club as long as I’m able but won’t have a problem with those who want a moan and probably will myself in the years to come. That's the real shame of it. With £280m (two hundred and eighty million pounds!) we should've been set up to be a competitive championship force for many years to come. The mismanagement of that income is utterly disgraceful and I believe we're doing our best to rectify it. And the mismanagement happened before PH took over so let's get off his back and support him instead
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Post by 65terrier on Sept 6, 2020 7:51:22 GMT 1
We have a tough start to the season. Games against a relegated team and 2 top 7 from last season, I think most would accept 2 or 3 points from these 3 games right now. These games, given we only had 2 pre-season games without several key players and no signings, can almost be written off PROVIDING they are used to bed in new signings of the right quality and experience. If we have a one in one out policy and spend even 25% of the transfer fees gained, i can see a mid-table season. If the investment is not at this level, then I worry that we will really struggle, which will not help the development of younger players.
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Post by Malvern Tom (WAHLS) on Sept 6, 2020 8:22:41 GMT 1
The cry baby fans actually make me laugh. We are what we are! It's not our money being risked. If you don't want to watch what we have.......... Don't! Huddersfield Town fans are the best in the world. Huddersfield Town is the finest club in the world. This is fall out from 2 seasons of being in the top 20 clubs in Britain. Now we are only in the top 40 teams in Britain....... Get over it. WAM, RTB, NOTTCE
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Post by shawsie on Sept 6, 2020 8:31:05 GMT 1
The saddest thing for me is how many fans simply dont seem that bothered anymore. There are clearly contrasting views and apportionment of blame but the mismanagement of the club started well before PHs tenure imho and to suggest otherwise is wrong. I will still continue to support as its my team..... but it doesnt ruin my weekend anymore when we lose (now used to it!) and sadly i dont believe the unity which DW brought is returning anytime soon either. We live in hope though eh?!
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Post by dugnet on Sept 6, 2020 8:48:06 GMT 1
Firstly I am all for being positive but I am also a realist. The reality is we need to recognise that we are still in a downward spiral. We don't have a deep enough squad, moreover we still have players who are mentally shot (far too used to losing) and as a result we have no character, spirit or belief.
The kids look like there maybe talent but they cannot in any way be relied upon to be the way forward. Allowing them to develop in an environment that has essentially become used to losing and has lost all collective and individual belief will be wholly damaging to their development.
What really worries me is that PH may think the kids are good enough and our "better" players will find their form. I don't think either are true. Carlos cannot be expected to lift players who are mentally on the floor and he equally cannot be expected to integrate potentially talented youngsters into such an environment.
At some point someone has to wake up and smell the coffee and start getting real. When you look at clubs who have unravelled you observe and think "how the hell was that allowed to happen"? Well I hate to say it but it's happening right in front of our eyes. That's not being negative or disrespectful to anyone. It is a cold hard fact.
Someone in charge, be it PH, MD, LB, CC or DH (I assume he still has some sort of a say) has to be honest and say it as it is. Positive words are valueless. Most people know that black isn't white and won't be persuaded by an argument that something is bright grey. As with any problem in life you first have to admit that it exists before you can hope to address it.
I fear that there still is a delusional bunker mentality at the top of the club that things are actually better than they are. I've news for them, they aren't and it's about time there was some humility and positive action to acknowledge and address this.
Irrespective of the fact that we have seen the club generate revenues far in excess of anything previously invested in the club (It's sobering to think our Premier League stay generated over 4 times what DH invested) there are fundamental issues that need addressing. Recruitment has been poor. There has been a tacit lack of a coherent strategy (the decision to bring in Carlos needs more than hoping he's a magician). The engagement with the fans has become increasingly shoddy, we are left with the feeling we should be grateful for the success we had and if it goes pear shaped well you can wait another 45 years.
The really galling thing to me is that the arguments always revolve around money. Money guarantees nothing. Were we not proud of achieving the "miracle" on a tight budget? Why the hell didn't we have a plan to sustain a longer period of success in the same vein? No one can tell me that the way the club has gone in the past 2 years isn't bloody amateur hour and as embarrassing as it is alarming.
I completely accept that the Carlos plan will take time. I also accept that the current world circumstances mean that things are more difficult but at the moment I don't see any semblance of a plan to move us forward. We are selling players, when it is clear our squad is clearly lacking.
The shadow of the decision to sack the Cowleys will lengthen with every poor result and performance. Whatever your view on that call it is something people will point back to.
I have just renewed my season ticket. It's what I do, I support the club. This doesn't make me a hero, any more entitled to an opinion or in any way special. It does depress me to see such a wonderful period of success disintegrate before my eyes. It is so sad. It's even worse when you feel those in charge are essentially taking you for granted and feel you should be sustained by 2 magical years in a lifetime of hopes largely dashed. I don't feel entitled to anything as a HTAFC fan other than hard work, honesty and integrity. Some of those qualities are in precious little evidence at the moment.
The rot has to be stopped. There's only a handful of people who can do this. Their first job is to acknowledge it is happening and then do something about it.
Over the past few months I feel I'm a stuck record. I genuinely hope for the best but can't be blindly optimistic when the facts are clear.
Optimistic, pessimistic, angry, frustrated, disillusioned or simply disinterested. Which ever camp you are in we all went better for our club. I hope those who can make a positive change feel the same and actually realise that work needs to be done.
UTT
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Post by Headless Chicken on Sept 6, 2020 8:55:14 GMT 1
The saddest thing for me is how many fans simply dont seem that bothered anymore. There are clearly contrasting views and apportionment of blame but the mismanagement of the club started well before PHs tenure imho and to suggest otherwise is wrong. I will still continue to support as its my team..... but it doesnt ruin my weekend anymore when we lose (now used to it!) and sadly i dont believe the unity which DW brought is returning anytime soon either. We live in hope though eh?! Exactly, it started long before. Decisions around the recruitment structure, long periods of of having no-one in the role of Head of Football (or similar) or having one that doesn't seem aligned with the Head Coach, etc. We don’t even know if the academy decision was a good one or another cost saver. Potentially it's even when the major errors occurred and we're now just seeing the consequences, which PH doesn't have the financial clout or experience to mitigate. I suspect he's compounding it to a degree, but probably taking an unfair share of the blame. I'm happy to be more patient; blooding some youngsters, rather than always diving into the transfer market. Any who isn’t and moans about wages and moan about player loyalty, need to consider the correlation. However, that doesn't mean half a team of kids and with a chunk of the more seasoned pros seeming on the decline.
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Post by lindleyterrier88 on Sept 6, 2020 9:44:47 GMT 1
This does make me sad. I’ll admit despite been a dour old Yorkshireman I do try to me a ‘happy clapper’ just because it takes less energy than the negativity. However I genuinely don’t see how this club is moving forward at the moment, it’s all looks backward.
Carlos might be an amazing manager, or he might not but we’ll never find out if we don’t give him the tools to do his job and ask him to do with his hands tied behind his back!!
I haven’t got a clue if Phil is ‘potless’ or not but I do know we seem to be in much worse financial shape now than when we went up to the premier league which is baffling for simple minded me! I think the bloke honestly cares and he’s trying his best, but he has some very unlikeable personality traits. I happened to stumble over his Pure business on Glassdoor recently when looking for another company, and that showed his employees in the business world aren’t too fond of him either. Must make me it hard for anybody to work in that environment, again I’ve no idea what the fix is to that!
I should probably have given up looking on DATM for hope and positivity a while ago 😊
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Post by artysid on Sept 6, 2020 9:52:55 GMT 1
It's been an horrible time to be a Town fan for the last couple of seasons. Yesterday offered no signs of a quick improvement
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Sept 6, 2020 10:08:00 GMT 1
The saddest thing for me is how many fans simply dont seem that bothered anymore. There are clearly contrasting views and apportionment of blame but the mismanagement of the club started well before PHs tenure imho and to suggest otherwise is wrong. I will still continue to support as its my team..... but it doesnt ruin my weekend anymore when we lose (now used to it!) and sadly i dont believe the unity which DW brought is returning anytime soon either. We live in hope though eh?! Were you bothered enough in the end? downatthemac.proboards.com/post/2716229FWIW, I’ve spent the last 2 and a half seasons feeling this...and back in Feb decided not to renew as I found Cowleys whole approach utterly turgid...really basic lower league approach to the game and the twatty touchline behaviour combined with all press interviews being about ensuring the protection of the Cowley brand just burned it for me, I liked the apportiontment of CC...it’s bold, and risky. And I like the approach I’ve seen so far. Off the back of that , I renewed. I suspect it’ll be disappointing as we’ve ended up with a very poor squad somehow (with folk lauding kids who barring one and a half really aren’t close to being good enough to play competitive Championship football regularly in anything other than a relegation team)....BUT....I realised I’d prefer to see a team trying to play and entertain who aren’t really good enough, rather than watch a team who are good enough just mentally strolling through games. The Town of pre season and good proportions of yesterday are really quite watchable. It’s not really their fault they probably aren’t quite good enough.
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Post by In sooth- - on Sept 6, 2020 10:12:00 GMT 1
I keep thinking of clubs like Bolton,Blackburn Wigan and even Bradford Where they are now and and feel very worried. Many of us have been there before and feel we are at a crossroad.
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Post by tvor on Sept 6, 2020 10:40:51 GMT 1
One of the big diffs between DH and PH is the relationship with the fans and the levels of communication. Often there’d be people getting into a froth on here and social media and DH would hold a Q&A and there’d be some explanation. It helped massively that Dean had a decent history with the club and there was always some good news. Phil tried that approach and it bit him on the arse. As a result there hasn’t been much comment from him recently and nothing on the Cowleys’ sacking and their replacement. This is probably understandable because of the stick he gets but that would have been unthinkable under DH. My guess is that he’ll front up if and when there is some good news but it’s like turning around an oil tanker at the moment.
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Post by boooothy on Sept 6, 2020 10:47:10 GMT 1
I keep thinking of clubs like Bolton,Blackburn Wigan and even Bradford Where they are now and and feel very worried. Many of us have been there before and feel we are at a crossroad. It feels just like Bradford. They had David Wetherall against Liverpool, we had Depoitre against Chelsea. A win that should have set the club up, in hindsight games it would have been better to lose.
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Post by btwoowah on Sept 6, 2020 10:49:43 GMT 1
Firstly I am all for being positive but I am also a realist. The reality is we need to recognise that we are still in a downward spiral. We don't have a deep enough squad, moreover we still have players who are mentally shot (far too used to losing) and as a result we have no character, spirit or belief. The kids look like there maybe talent but they cannot in any way be relied upon to be the way forward. Allowing them to develop in an environment that has essentially become used to losing and has lost all collective and individual belief will be wholly damaging to their development. What really worries me is that PH may think the kids are good enough and our "better" players will find their form. I don't think either are true. Carlos cannot be expected to lift players who are mentally on the floor and he equally cannot be expected to integrate potentially talented youngsters into such an environment. At some point someone has to wake up and smell the coffee and start getting real. When you look at clubs who have unravelled you observe and think "how the hell was that allowed to happen"? Well I hate to say it but it's happening right in front of our eyes. That's not being negative or disrespectful to anyone. It is a cold hard fact. Someone in charge, be it PH, MD, LB, CC or DH (I assume he still has some sort of a say) has to be honest and say it as it is. Positive words are valueless. Most people know that black isn't white and won't be persuaded by an argument that something is bright grey. As with any problem in life you first have to admit that it exists before you can hope to address it. I fear that there still is a delusional bunker mentality at the top of the club that things are actually better than they are. I've news for them, they aren't and it's about time there was some humility and positive action to acknowledge and address this. Irrespective of the fact that we have seen the club generate revenues far in excess of anything previously invested in the club (It's sobering to think our Premier League stay generated over 4 times what DH invested) there are fundamental issues that need addressing. Recruitment has been poor. There has been a tacit lack of a coherent strategy (the decision to bring in Carlos needs more than hoping he's a magician). The engagement with the fans has become increasingly shoddy, we are left with the feeling we should be grateful for the success we had and if it goes pear shaped well you can wait another 45 years. The really galling thing to me is that the arguments always revolve around money. Money guarantees nothing. Were we not proud of achieving the "miracle" on a tight budget? Why the hell didn't we have a plan to sustain a longer period of success in the same vein? No one can tell me that the way the club has gone in the past 2 years isn't bloody amateur hour and as embarrassing as it is alarming. I completely accept that the Carlos plan will take time. I also accept that the current world circumstances mean that things are more difficult but at the moment I don't see any semblance of a plan to move us forward. We are selling players, when it is clear our squad is clearly lacking. The shadow of the decision to sack the Cowleys will lengthen with every poor result and performance. Whatever your view on that call it is something people will point back to. I have just renewed my season ticket. It's what I do, I support the club. This doesn't make me a hero, any more entitled to an opinion or in any way special. It does depress me to see such a wonderful period of success disintegrate before my eyes. It is so sad. It's even worse when you feel those in charge are essentially taking you for granted and feel you should be sustained by 2 magical years in a lifetime of hopes largely dashed. I don't feel entitled to anything as a HTAFC fan other than hard work, honesty and integrity. Some of those qualities are in precious little evidence at the moment. The rot has to be stopped. There's only a handful of people who can do this. Their first job is to acknowledge it is happening and then do something about it. Over the past few months I feel I'm a stuck record. I genuinely hope for the best but can't be blindly optimistic when the facts are clear. Optimistic, pessimistic, angry, frustrated, disillusioned or simply disinterested. Which ever camp you are in we all went better for our club. I hope those who can make a positive change feel the same and actually realise that work needs to be done. UTT Excellent post. I would go just a little further and say sacking the Cowleys was the worst possible thing to do in these particular circumstances. If people are bored of me saying this, I understand, but every passing day makes me more sure of it. I totally understand that people found the football hard to love, particularly after lockdown. But I think more and more people are going to recognise what a near miracle it was to avoid relegation with that squad of players - to get a tune out of several key members who wanted to be elsewhere, to rally stalwarts such as Hogg and Schindler whose nerves were shot after nearly two years of losing week in and week out. We needed to build on that. We needed to get rid of those who wanted to be elsewhere and strengthen the core of the side - to give Schindler and Hogg experienced help or deputies, or even say a fond farewell and replace/upgrade them. This on top of filling those glaring holes we knew would need filling after loanee returns/inevitable departures: at right back, on either wing, up front. All this was obvious at the end of last season. The plan was clear. The positive, logical squad building in January looked set to continue. The Cowleys had spent hours, days, weeks in lockdown planning for this season, watching hundreds of games worth of footage, identifying targets. We threw this progress away, this planning, this careful, fragile hope for the future, and replaced it with chaos - with a young coaching team who needed time we didn’t have, to ‘assess‘ a squad we already knew had faults, had glaring holes, carried psychological scars, thus putting others new to their roles - eg Bromby - on the back foot from the off. We put ourselves in a position where we’re two or three bad results away from spiralling out again. Why? Maybe Phil’s ego got in the way, and the Cowleys’ big personalities and the control they asked for over footballing matters was something he couldn’t live with, or perhaps the financial position is worse than I’ve let myself believe until now. Either way, I fear the decision to sack the Cowleys is going to haunt him, and us for years.
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Post by joeyjoneslocker on Sept 6, 2020 10:50:29 GMT 1
The main problem with any Q&A is the Groundhog Day effect.
Where has the money gone? Is Phil potless? Who authorised Mbenza (player name optional) signing? Why can’t I park at Canalside anymore?
If we didn’t have a higher than average number of idiotic fans then maybe they would hold more sessions.
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Post by btwoowah on Sept 6, 2020 10:55:20 GMT 1
I keep thinking of clubs like Bolton,Blackburn Wigan and even Bradford Where they are now and and feel very worried. Many of us have been there before and feel we are at a crossroad. Have you watched Sunderland ‘til I Die? Some of the delusional thinking at the top echoes particularly uncomfortably - a ‘fan’ chairman, who never thought he’d be in a financial position to own the club he loves...
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 6, 2020 11:03:56 GMT 1
Firstly I am all for being positive but I am also a realist. The reality is we need to recognise that we are still in a downward spiral. We don't have a deep enough squad, moreover we still have players who are mentally shot (far too used to losing) and as a result we have no character, spirit or belief. The kids look like there maybe talent but they cannot in any way be relied upon to be the way forward. Allowing them to develop in an environment that has essentially become used to losing and has lost all collective and individual belief will be wholly damaging to their development. What really worries me is that PH may think the kids are good enough and our "better" players will find their form. I don't think either are true. Carlos cannot be expected to lift players who are mentally on the floor and he equally cannot be expected to integrate potentially talented youngsters into such an environment. At some point someone has to wake up and smell the coffee and start getting real. When you look at clubs who have unravelled you observe and think "how the hell was that allowed to happen"? Well I hate to say it but it's happening right in front of our eyes. That's not being negative or disrespectful to anyone. It is a cold hard fact. Someone in charge, be it PH, MD, LB, CC or DH (I assume he still has some sort of a say) has to be honest and say it as it is. Positive words are valueless. Most people know that black isn't white and won't be persuaded by an argument that something is bright grey. As with any problem in life you first have to admit that it exists before you can hope to address it. I fear that there still is a delusional bunker mentality at the top of the club that things are actually better than they are. I've news for them, they aren't and it's about time there was some humility and positive action to acknowledge and address this. Irrespective of the fact that we have seen the club generate revenues far in excess of anything previously invested in the club (It's sobering to think our Premier League stay generated over 4 times what DH invested) there are fundamental issues that need addressing. Recruitment has been poor. There has been a tacit lack of a coherent strategy (the decision to bring in Carlos needs more than hoping he's a magician). The engagement with the fans has become increasingly shoddy, we are left with the feeling we should be grateful for the success we had and if it goes pear shaped well you can wait another 45 years. The really galling thing to me is that the arguments always revolve around money. Money guarantees nothing. Were we not proud of achieving the "miracle" on a tight budget? Why the hell didn't we have a plan to sustain a longer period of success in the same vein? No one can tell me that the way the club has gone in the past 2 years isn't bloody amateur hour and as embarrassing as it is alarming. I completely accept that the Carlos plan will take time. I also accept that the current world circumstances mean that things are more difficult but at the moment I don't see any semblance of a plan to move us forward. We are selling players, when it is clear our squad is clearly lacking. The shadow of the decision to sack the Cowleys will lengthen with every poor result and performance. Whatever your view on that call it is something people will point back to. I have just renewed my season ticket. It's what I do, I support the club. This doesn't make me a hero, any more entitled to an opinion or in any way special. It does depress me to see such a wonderful period of success disintegrate before my eyes. It is so sad. It's even worse when you feel those in charge are essentially taking you for granted and feel you should be sustained by 2 magical years in a lifetime of hopes largely dashed. I don't feel entitled to anything as a HTAFC fan other than hard work, honesty and integrity. Some of those qualities are in precious little evidence at the moment. The rot has to be stopped. There's only a handful of people who can do this. Their first job is to acknowledge it is happening and then do something about it. Over the past few months I feel I'm a stuck record. I genuinely hope for the best but can't be blindly optimistic when the facts are clear. Optimistic, pessimistic, angry, frustrated, disillusioned or simply disinterested. Which ever camp you are in we all went better for our club. I hope those who can make a positive change feel the same and actually realise that work needs to be done. UTT Excellent post. I would go just a little further and say sacking the Cowleys was the worst possible thing to do in these particular circumstances. If people are bored of me saying this, I understand, but every passing day makes me more sure of it. I totally understand that people found the football hard to love, particularly after lockdown. But I think more and more people are going to recognise what a near miracle it was to avoid relegation with that squad of players - to get a tune out of several key members who wanted to be elsewhere, to rally stalwarts such as Hogg and Schindler whose nerves were shot after nearly two years of losing week in and week out. We needed to build on that. We needed to get rid of those who wanted to be elsewhere and strengthen the core of the side - to give Schindler and Hogg experienced help or deputies, or even say a fond farewell and replace/upgrade them. This on top of filling those glaring holes we knew would need filling after loanee returns/inevitable departures: at right back, on either wing, up front. All this was obvious at the end of last season. The plan was clear. The positive, logical squad building in January looked set to continue. The Cowleys had spent hours, days, weeks in lockdown planning for this season, watching hundreds of games worth of footage, identifying targets. We threw this progress away, this planning, this careful, fragile hope for the future, and replaced it with chaos - with a young coaching team who needed time we didn’t have, to ‘assess‘ a squad we already knew had faults, had glaring holes, carried psychological scars, thus putting others new to their roles - eg Bromby - on the back foot from the off. We put ourselves in a position where we’re two or three bad results away from spiralling out again. Why? Maybe Phil’s ego got in the way, and the Cowleys’ big personalities and the control they asked for over footballing matters was something he couldn’t live with, or perhaps the financial position is worse than I’ve let myself believe until now. Either way, I fear the decision to sack the Cowleys is going to haunt him, and us for years. That’s all very well but there is no evidence of the quality or what the Cowleys would have done with this supposed painstaking research. One of their biggest weaknesses last season was to set the team up seemingly unaware of how the other team play, compounded by incredibly slow reaction during games as the opposition changed their approach. We seemed to be caught by surprise an awful lot. One of the comments I’ve noticed so far under CC is players referring to the detailed preparedness. The players never mentioned that with Cowley. He may have had a lesson plan, but this is masters degree level football, not High School. Don’t forget also that CC is already well aware of the Championship from his involvement over the last 3 seasons. For the Cowleys it was all new. It’s going to be entertaining...we’ve got a far thinner less talented squad now than we finished last season with, we’ll soon find out if CC is any good...avoiding the bottom 5 would be a far greater achievement than the same task was last year.
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Post by dugnet on Sept 6, 2020 11:05:35 GMT 1
One of the big diffs between DH and PH is the relationship with the fans and the levels of communication. Often there’d be people getting into a froth on here and social media and DH would hold a Q&A and there’d be some explanation. It helped massively that Dean had a decent history with the club and there was always some good news. Phil tried that approach and it bit him on the arse. As a result there hasn’t been much comment from him recently and nothing on the Cowleys’ sacking and their replacement. This is probably understandable because of the stick he gets but that would have been unthinkable under DH. My guess is that he’ll front up if and when there is some good news but it’s like turning around an oil tanker at the moment. There's a degree of truth in what you say but you get the impression PH doesn't take criticism (I am not talking about people blindly abusing him - that's never acceptable) well. I really think it would help if someone acknowledged mistakes had been made (I know Devlin said so) but if PH, or DH, did people would say "what are you doing about it"? To make such an effort to get the Cowleys and then dramatically sack them was such a big decision you'd think he'd stand behind it. Although it isn't an easy environment to change things at the moment patience is(has) wearing thin. We surely can't expect Carlos to build a more successful (the bar isn't that high at the moment) team out of serial losers and kids? As fans we think/assume where we are going but in reality it's not that clear. As you say in the past DH spelled out exactly what the plan was. The truth is the transition to PH was never really explained and as such the gap between club and fans has continued to widen.
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Post by btwoowah on Sept 6, 2020 11:12:44 GMT 1
Excellent post. I would go just a little further and say sacking the Cowleys was the worst possible thing to do in these particular circumstances. If people are bored of me saying this, I understand, but every passing day makes me more sure of it. I totally understand that people found the football hard to love, particularly after lockdown. But I think more and more people are going to recognise what a near miracle it was to avoid relegation with that squad of players - to get a tune out of several key members who wanted to be elsewhere, to rally stalwarts such as Hogg and Schindler whose nerves were shot after nearly two years of losing week in and week out. We needed to build on that. We needed to get rid of those who wanted to be elsewhere and strengthen the core of the side - to give Schindler and Hogg experienced help or deputies, or even say a fond farewell and replace/upgrade them. This on top of filling those glaring holes we knew would need filling after loanee returns/inevitable departures: at right back, on either wing, up front. All this was obvious at the end of last season. The plan was clear. The positive, logical squad building in January looked set to continue. The Cowleys had spent hours, days, weeks in lockdown planning for this season, watching hundreds of games worth of footage, identifying targets. We threw this progress away, this planning, this careful, fragile hope for the future, and replaced it with chaos - with a young coaching team who needed time we didn’t have, to ‘assess‘ a squad we already knew had faults, had glaring holes, carried psychological scars, thus putting others new to their roles - eg Bromby - on the back foot from the off. We put ourselves in a position where we’re two or three bad results away from spiralling out again. Why? Maybe Phil’s ego got in the way, and the Cowleys’ big personalities and the control they asked for over footballing matters was something he couldn’t live with, or perhaps the financial position is worse than I’ve let myself believe until now. Either way, I fear the decision to sack the Cowleys is going to haunt him, and us for years. That’s all very well but there is no evidence of the quality or what the Cowleys would have done with this supposed painstaking research. One of their biggest weaknesses last season was to set the team up seemingly unaware of how the other team play, compounded by incredibly slow reaction during games as the opposition changed their approach. We seemed to be caught by surprise an awful lot. One of the comments I’ve noticed so far under CC is players referring to the detailed preparedness. The players never mentioned that with Cowley. He may have had a lesson plan, but this is masters degree level football, not High School. Don’t forget also that CC is already well aware of the Championship from his involvement over the last 3 seasons. For the Cowleys it was all new. It’s going to be entertaining...we’ve got a far thinner less talented squad now than we finished last season with, we’ll soon find out if CC is any good...avoiding the bottom 5 would be a far greater achievement than the same task was last year. I disagree that we have no evidence of what improvement the Cowleys might have brought this season. I think it would have been reasonable to expect another forward step comparable to the one they’d made the previous one in turning serial losers headed for league one into a stable, if uninspiring, mid-table unit....
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