wigster
Andy Booth Terrier
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Post by wigster on Feb 25, 2021 20:51:31 GMT 1
because of having to play matches behind closed doors.
An absolutely minuscule amount when compared with what was spent during our stay in the Premier league. Miniscule.
I reckon the wages, not transfer fees, of, say, Pritchard and Diakhaby would be in the same ballpark. Easily.
Wouldn't it be lovely to get some answers from those in charge then ?
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Post by lesgirondins on Feb 25, 2021 20:57:11 GMT 1
Certainly would. Smoke & mirrors deal by DH & PH.
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Post by Der Kopf des Konigs 1230 on Feb 25, 2021 21:05:14 GMT 1
That's fuck all some silly bastard spent that on that Sohbi. Who ever he was?
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Post by Bigcolquaner on Feb 25, 2021 21:08:07 GMT 1
That's fuck all some silly bastard spent that on that Sohbi. Who ever he was? And another couple of grand on bespoke shorts to cover his massive arse.
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Post by philatrickstarbuck on Feb 25, 2021 21:12:36 GMT 1
Maybe DH could loan it us back 🤫
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Post by Mr Breitside on Feb 25, 2021 21:12:37 GMT 1
Have the club fed them this to keep up the justification as to why we haven’t signed enough quality players and have such a shit squad.
Keep saying it Phil.. we get the point. No one has been asking for the club to spend millions though.
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Post by durhamterrier on Feb 25, 2021 21:35:18 GMT 1
That's fuck all some silly bastard spent that on that Sohbi. Who ever he was? But it’s probably split over 200 years . 25k a year inflow guaranteed
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 25, 2021 21:43:01 GMT 1
because of having to play matches behind closed doors. An absolutely minuscule amount when compared with what was spent during our stay in the Premier league. Miniscule. I reckon the wages, not transfer fees, of, say, Pritchard and Diakhaby would be in the same ballpark. Easily. Wouldn't it be lovely to get some answers from those in charge then ? Wouldn't it be lovely for the Examiner to not print yet another nonsensical article!? They're claiming it'll cost the club £5m in lost match day income this season. Except of course, what is described as "match day income" (separate from retail and commercial income) *includes* season ticket income. Lets guess that 2/3rd of season ticket holders pay £249, with the remaining 1/3rd being kids and OAP's at £129 (I think under 8's were cheaper, but I reckon I'm being generous with my proportions as it is) - thats already approaching £2.5m of the Examiners 'missing' £5m that the club *HAVE* actually received, from the 11,000 season ticket holders who bought this season. And with that knowledge, any article that states the club is missing/lost £5m, or anyone from the club who starts vocalising such a figure, should frankly be ignored, as its either commentary from someone who doesn't know what they're talking about (aka what would be known as the Examiners excuse), or it would be someone purposely trying to pull wool over eyes (aka what would be a club sources reason). ^^Note - the club have NOT suggested such a figure for lost income or come out and complained about losses or held them up as an excuse for where we're at as far as I'm aware?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 25, 2021 21:49:38 GMT 1
That £5m revenue figure was from a season when we had perhaps 18,500 season ticket holders and averaged about 2,000 pay on the day punters.
In more realistic terms, the "loss" (assuming we go with that 2/3 adult to 1/3 discounted ratio) is more like...
18500-11000 = 7500 season ticket holders = around £1.5m. + 2000 * 23 * cost of a seat = roughly £900k
= £2.4m.
Less than half of the Examiners proclamation!
(although with the same results you can bet that had matches been open, that average 2000 pay on the day would be closer to 750 this season (including away fans)) - so the real loss of match day income DUE TO COVID is probably less than £2m.
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wigster
Andy Booth Terrier
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Post by wigster on Feb 25, 2021 22:17:43 GMT 1
That £5m revenue figure was from a season when we had perhaps 18,500 season ticket holders and averaged about 2,000 pay on the day punters. In more realistic terms, the "loss" (assuming we go with that 2/3 adult to 1/3 discounted ratio) is more like... 18500-11000 = 7500 season ticket holders = around £1.5m. + 2000 * 23 * cost of a seat = roughly £900k = £2.4m. Less than half of the Examiners proclamation! (although with the same results you can bet that had matches been open, that average 2000 pay on the day would be closer to 750 this season (including away fans)) - so the real loss of match day income DUE TO COVID is probably less than £2m. Isn't that the figure - £2m - that Mark Devlin quoted a few months ago ?
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Post by ShortbreadPete on Feb 25, 2021 22:18:16 GMT 1
Have the club fed them this to keep up the justification as to why we haven’t signed enough quality players and have such a shit squad. Keep saying it Phil.. we get the point. No one has been asking for the club to spend millions though. All some folk are asking for is a 'proven' goalscorer at this level. Wonder how much one of them would cost in fees and wages at this level?
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Post by workshyfop on Feb 25, 2021 22:22:35 GMT 1
Do Covid and the financial implications only affect Town?
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Post by Christ in Shades (art) on Feb 25, 2021 22:24:53 GMT 1
Matchday income at Town can't be that much, although 5 million quid is 5 million quid.
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Post by Christ in Shades (art) on Feb 25, 2021 22:25:55 GMT 1
Do Covid and the financial implications only affect Town? Other clubs will have lost a damn sight more on matchday revenue but its same for all clubs.
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Amigo
Jimmy Glazzard Terrier
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Post by Amigo on Feb 25, 2021 22:30:02 GMT 1
That £5m revenue figure was from a season when we had perhaps 18,500 season ticket holders and averaged about 2,000 pay on the day punters. In more realistic terms, the "loss" (assuming we go with that 2/3 adult to 1/3 discounted ratio) is more like... 18500-11000 = 7500 season ticket holders = around £1.5m. + 2000 * 23 * cost of a seat = roughly £900k = £2.4m. Less than half of the Examiners proclamation! (although with the same results you can bet that had matches been open, that average 2000 pay on the day would be closer to 750 this season (including away fans)) - so the real loss of match day income DUE TO COVID is probably less than £2m. Isn't that the figure - £2m - that Mark Devlin quoted a few months ago ? Yes the club said £2m and that was discussed to death on here so I'm not sure why there's now a thread because a newspaper is saying more than the club actually did. If anything the thread should just be about the Examiner talking bollocks as the club hasn't said it's lost £5m.
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wigster
Andy Booth Terrier
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Post by wigster on Feb 25, 2021 23:01:31 GMT 1
Isn't that the figure - £2m - that Mark Devlin quoted a few months ago ? Yes the club said £2m and that was discussed to death on here so I'm not sure why there's now a thread because a newspaper is saying more than the club actually did. If anything the thread should just be about the Examiner talking bollocks as the club hasn't said it's lost £5m. In reply to you Slyman, I started the thread because one of the messages coming out of Town this season - and there have been precious few of them - has been that lots of clubs are going to go to the wall (PH actually suggested, I think, this might start before Xmas) because of COVID, and there was the implication that because we are being sensibly run that would not be happening to us. It also explained why we wouldn't be splashing out on decent proven players and backed up our obvious transfer "policy". We all know where that policy has left us. It now seems, and others may well have recognised it long before me, that COVID is going to cost us £2-5million (an exaggerated figure for some - see above) but it isn't the main reason we seem desperately short of funds. I therefore make no apology for starting a thread because of a NEW article in our local paper that seems to show that Town's COVID-caused losses are a tiny fraction of what we paid out on the dross that was brought in two years ago - a tiny fraction - and perhaps our depressing transfer policy this season - sell the best players/replace with cheap/youngsters/long-unattached is in no way necessary because of COVID. You may say it's just another stick to beat certain people who used to be in charge at Town with - and perhaps it is. But a large part of me makes no apology for that. This club, to me, seems to have become a right mess from top to bottom - from transfer dealings, to fitness, to football. As I've said before, I don't actually blame PH for this. It seems he's having to sort it out.
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Post by Mr Breitside on Feb 25, 2021 23:21:25 GMT 1
Have the club fed them this to keep up the justification as to why we haven’t signed enough quality players and have such a shit squad. Keep saying it Phil.. we get the point. No one has been asking for the club to spend millions though. All some folk are asking for is a 'proven' goalscorer at this level. Wonder how much one of them would cost in fees and wages at this level? Agreed in that sense Pete, there are very few of them around which wouldn’t cost a fortune. We in my view are simply looking for potential to be championship quality.
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Amigo
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Post by Amigo on Feb 25, 2021 23:48:56 GMT 1
Yes the club said £2m and that was discussed to death on here so I'm not sure why there's now a thread because a newspaper is saying more than the club actually did. If anything the thread should just be about the Examiner talking bollocks as the club hasn't said it's lost £5m. In reply to you Slyman, I started the thread because one of the messages coming out of Town this season - and there have been precious few of them - has been that lots of clubs are going to go to the wall (PH actually suggested, I think, this might start before Xmas) because of COVID, and there was the implication that because we are being sensibly run that would not be happening to us. It also explained why we wouldn't be splashing out on decent proven players and backed up our obvious transfer "policy". We all know where that policy has left us. It now seems, and others may well have recognised it long before me, that COVID is going to cost us £2-5million (an exaggerated figure for some - see above) but it isn't the main reason we seem desperately short of funds. I therefore make no apology for starting a thread because of a NEW article in our local paper that seems to show that Town's COVID-caused losses are a tiny fraction of what we paid out on the dross that was brought in two years ago - a tiny fraction - and perhaps our depressing transfer policy this season - sell the best players/replace with cheap/youngsters/long-unattached is in no way necessary because of COVID. You may say it's just another stick to beat certain people who used to be in charge at Town with - and perhaps it is. But a large part of me makes no apology for that. This club, to me, seems to have become a right mess from top to bottom - from transfer dealings, to fitness, to football. As I've said before, I don't actually blame PH for this. It seems he's having to sort it out. In reply to you Wigster, it was highly possible that clubs could have been going under and still could so it was hardly a ridiculous comment to suggest that was possible, listen to Darragh MacAnthony's podcast and he'll explain in far more detail than I can be bothered to. The vast majority of clubs don't have messages coming out of them, Hoyle used to release bits of information more regularly than most but it's not the norm. You say "it now seems that COVID is going to cost us £2-5m" that's hardly new information the club said that ages ago. The actual figure is obviously higher because of the reduced parachute payments and sponsorships etc. I'm not sure anyone has said that it is the sole reason for us not splashing the cash though? The money we spent on dross a couple of years ago was because we had far more income to spend on dross so comparing that money now to then is just silly. "Transfer policy this season - sell the best players/replace with cheap/youngsters". Who are these best players we've sold? Grant didn't want to be here from last Christmas, yes we need another striker but had Koroma have stayed fit he would have been very close to Grant's figures and taking away penalties probably beyond them. Mounie? I actually liked but most thought he wasn't a miss. Stankovic didn't want to sign a contract. Diakhaby? Coleman? Hamer? Hadergjonaj? Kachunga? Quaner? Sobhi? Most people thought these lot were shit. Pipa, Sarr, Eiting, Holmes, Vallejo (Aarons hasn't played enough yet) are all better footballers than those that have gone. It is just another stick to beat certain people who used to be in charge at Town with and create the 1000th thread on pretty much the same subject. We know where the money is going, we know why we don't have loads of cash, we know why we're having to reduce the wage bill I can't see the point in going over and over it again and again. You say you don't blame Phil for this but he's the only one at the club you ever seem to be critical of and the only one you've mentioned in your post.
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wigster
Andy Booth Terrier
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Post by wigster on Feb 26, 2021 0:23:30 GMT 1
Some fair points Slyman, some of which I don't agree with - but that's the beauty of this board.
The only one I would address is the one about being critical of Phil - if you went through all my posts - and I don't for a second suggest anybody would want to - you would see that I do NOT constantly criticise Phil Hodgkinson. Nearly all my criticism has been directed at Dean Hoyle - the tens and tens of millions wasted on his watch, the damage "the deal" seems to be doing to our club - but I've said that so much that even I am sick of it. I keep vowing not to keep going on about it, then I watch Town perform again like Tuesday night.
Attached to that your implication is that we all know all about the financial situation at Town. We do not. I have no idea whether the club is nearly bankrupt, in danger of administration, or is in a lot healthier position than most other Championship clubs. I have no idea whether Phil H bought the club for £1.00 or £20million. I can guess. Again, whether "ordinary" supporters should be told anything about the financial state of their club can be argued either way.
I can understand your frustration about "the 1000th thread" but I would suggest that's not going to go away until Town start winning/strengthening or avoiding relegation. An interview with Mr Hoyle would be informative and helpful, but I don't think that is going to happen.
Let's agree to disagree. By all means add any comments, but I won't be replying, purely because I'd be repeating myself, and I suspect we both have some valid points.
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willo
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Post by willo on Feb 26, 2021 1:24:51 GMT 1
Have the club fed them this to keep up the justification as to why we haven’t signed enough quality players and have such a shit squad. Keep saying it Phil.. we get the point. No one has been asking for the club to spend millions though. All some folk are asking for is a 'proven' goalscorer at this level. Wonder how much one of them would cost in fees and wages at this level? I don’t know but probably worth paying to avoid relegation.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 26, 2021 1:26:38 GMT 1
That £5m revenue figure was from a season when we had perhaps 18,500 season ticket holders and averaged about 2,000 pay on the day punters. In more realistic terms, the "loss" (assuming we go with that 2/3 adult to 1/3 discounted ratio) is more like... 18500-11000 = 7500 season ticket holders = around £1.5m. + 2000 * 23 * cost of a seat = roughly £900k = £2.4m. Less than half of the Examiners proclamation! (although with the same results you can bet that had matches been open, that average 2000 pay on the day would be closer to 750 this season (including away fans)) - so the real loss of match day income DUE TO COVID is probably less than £2m. Isn't that the figure - £2m - that Mark Devlin quoted a few months ago ? No idea, but I’d guess that’s about the right order of magnitude. Also known as “lost approximately nothing..why do we bother letting fans in anyway”.
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Post by detox on Feb 26, 2021 1:38:11 GMT 1
I presume we've renegotiated the rent we pay KSDL..
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TTCMatt
Iain Dunn Terrier
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Post by TTCMatt on Feb 26, 2021 2:58:31 GMT 1
because of having to play matches behind closed doors. An absolutely minuscule amount when compared with what was spent during our stay in the Premier league. Miniscule. I reckon the wages, not transfer fees, of, say, Pritchard and Diakhaby would be in the same ballpark. Easily. Wouldn't it be lovely to get some answers from those in charge then ? Wouldn't it be lovely for the Examiner to not print yet another nonsensical article!? They're claiming it'll cost the club £5m in lost match day income this season. Except of course, what is described as "match day income" (separate from retail and commercial income) *includes* season ticket income. Lets guess that 2/3rd of season ticket holders pay £249, with the remaining 1/3rd being kids and OAP's at £129 (I think under 8's were cheaper, but I reckon I'm being generous with my proportions as it is) - thats already approaching £2.5m of the Examiners 'missing' £5m that the club *HAVE* actually received, from the 11,000 season ticket holders who bought this season. And with that knowledge, any article that states the club is missing/lost £5m, or anyone from the club who starts vocalising such a figure, should frankly be ignored, as its either commentary from someone who doesn't know what they're talking about (aka what would be known as the Examiners excuse), or it would be someone purposely trying to pull wool over eyes (aka what would be a club sources reason). ^^Note - the club have NOT suggested such a figure for lost income or come out and complained about losses or held them up as an excuse for where we're at as far as I'm aware? I dare say they are just picking over the bones of this: www.htafc.com/news/2021/february/an-update-from-chairman-phil-hodgkinson/Where Phil says "Our estimates, based on what has happened so far, indicate that we will be down around £5 million from lost revenue and new costs from day-to-day operations."
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Post by mids on Feb 26, 2021 4:49:16 GMT 1
Matchday income at Town can't be that much, although 5 million quid is 5 million quid. Indeed it is, it's a hell of a lot of money. Yet some on here would have you believe that they'd write off over ten times that amount if they were in Dean's shoes. Odd logic.
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Post by lochnessterrier on Feb 26, 2021 8:13:03 GMT 1
Hopefully we should be able to make a massive claim for furlough pay, given that very few of the squad are working just now.
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Post by Farsley Terrier (UK product) on Feb 26, 2021 8:24:46 GMT 1
of course that will be taken care of by using some of the parachute payments...
Oh wait..
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Post by themanfromatlantis on Feb 26, 2021 8:28:14 GMT 1
Great, a thread about club finances. About time someone raised this as a discussion point on here...
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Post by Gag_N_Bone_Man on Feb 26, 2021 9:12:59 GMT 1
Have the club fed them this to keep up the justification as to why we haven’t signed enough quality players and have such a shit squad. Keep saying it Phil.. we get the point. No one has been asking for the club to spend millions though. That was my immediate reaction. They could say they'd lost 50p I wouldn't believe them while Phil was involved.
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Post by detox on Feb 26, 2021 9:57:47 GMT 1
Great, a thread about club finances. About time someone raised this as a discussion point on here... You know you don't HAVE to comment Oti...
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k1man999
Andy Booth Terrier
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Post by k1man999 on Feb 26, 2021 10:15:14 GMT 1
As has been pointed out elsewhere Look at some of the clubs on the list who have lost more match days income than us they still invested and don't have parachute monies to help even if a little less than advertised coming in.
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