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Post by Sio on Feb 5, 2023 17:19:39 GMT 1
We're an odd fanbase, aren't we. *Almost* universal agreement that the current goings on aren't acceptable and that answers are needed. A group of fans make it known that there is discontent. How do many of us respond? Take digs at that group of fans. Never known a fanbase so eager to seek disagreement among itself. Perhaps I'm naive to how things go on at other clubs! Nah, it just think we’re naive about what’s going on and what to do about it. And their banner was as tinpot/misguided as their threats for action and to express their ‘thoughts’. You can’t criticise the club, including MF, and then show no difference and not expect criticism. Yes we’re alll frustrated. But that doesn’t mean we are all agreed on how to express it or where. And I wouldn’t take the microcosm of DATM to be a barromoter for all things at the club. I don't quite follow you? I think I understand that you're suggesting a banner (or protest as some are calling it) isn't the right way to show concern about the club. Genuine question, if that's the case - what would your approach be, if any? |
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Tiro
Jimmy Glazzard Terrier
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Post by Tiro on Feb 5, 2023 18:28:39 GMT 1
Nah, it just think we’re naive about what’s going on and what to do about it. And their banner was as tinpot/misguided as their threats for action and to express their ‘thoughts’. You can’t criticise the club, including MF, and then show no difference and not expect criticism. Yes we’re alll frustrated. But that doesn’t mean we are all agreed on how to express it or where. And I wouldn’t take the microcosm of DATM to be a barromoter for all things at the club. I don't quite follow you? I think I understand that you're suggesting a banner (or protest as some are calling it) isn't the right way to show concern about the club. Genuine question, if that's the case - what would your approach be, if any? Kinda, yes. But what I think is that all means of protest are silly right now if you take the context. I don’t think anyone should be sparring any blame to the board, especially Dave Baldwin who is running the club and working hard to maintain operations, make football decisions and find a buyer. As I explained earlier, neither DH or PH are operating the club. They’re essentially silent partners. Both Hoyle and Hodgkinsom would sell tomorrow if they could, but any potential buyer (and there are some who are keen) won’t purchase the club without knowing what league we will be in. It makes perfect business sense. And Baldwin isnt there to fund the club. He’s there to work under the constraints. And I know that the club won’t sit down with them, but if the supporters trust or other want proper and real answers, it doesn’t make any business sense to do so right now unless they want to sign non disclosure agreements which would defeat the object. So to just blame the ‘circus’ and rally against the board in general is in my opinion misguided and demonstrates a lack of understanding. If they’re going to express frustrations choose a better time and subject. But honestly, they’re gonna get fuck all change protesting DH, PH or MF right now. All it does is stand to make themselves feel better. In all honesty, I don’t think anyone of the board or otherwise doesn’t already understand the frustrations of the fans. It’s frustrating as fuck, but that’s the reality of it. So yeah, it’s fair game to critique their febrile banner. Especially when their actions are as shallow as the words that they’re protesting against. |
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Post by turbo2 on Feb 5, 2023 18:43:00 GMT 1
We're an odd fanbase, aren't we. *Almost* universal agreement that the current goings on aren't acceptable and that answers are needed. A group of fans make it known that there is discontent. How do many of us respond? Take digs at that group of fans. Never known a fanbase so eager to seek disagreement among itself. Perhaps I'm naive to how things go on at other clubs! Mate of mine (chestwanker) saying it’s dreading the away end at the florists. Fighting each other in clumps |
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Post by Sio on Feb 5, 2023 18:52:12 GMT 1
I don't quite follow you? I think I understand that you're suggesting a banner (or protest as some are calling it) isn't the right way to show concern about the club. Genuine question, if that's the case - what would your approach be, if any? Kinda, yes. But what I think is that all means of protest are silly right now if you take the context. I don’t think anyone should be sparring any blame to the board, especially Dave Baldwin who is running the club and working hard to maintain operations, make football decisions and find a buyer. As I explained earlier, neither DH or PH are operating the club. They’re essentially silent partners. Both Hoyle and Hodgkinsom would sell tomorrow if they could, but any potential buyer (and there are some who are keen) won’t purchase the club without knowing what league we will be in. It makes perfect business sense. And Baldwin isnt there to fund the club. He’s there to work under the constraints. And I know that the club won’t sit down with them, but if the supporters trust or other want proper and real answers, it doesn’t make any business sense to do so right now unless they want to sign non disclosure agreements which would defeat the object. So to just blame the ‘circus’ and rally against the board in general is in my opinion misguided and demonstrates a lack of understanding. If they’re going to express frustrations choose a better time and subject. But honestly, they’re gonna get fuck all change protesting DH, PH or MF right now. All it does is stand to make themselves feel better. In all honesty, I don’t think anyone of the board or otherwise doesn’t already understand the frustrations of the fans. It’s frustrating as fuck, but that’s the reality of it. So yeah, it’s fair game to critique their febrile banner. Especially when their actions are as shallow as the words that they’re protesting against. Completely fair on the DH and PH stuff - no argument that answers definitely won't be coming from those any time soon for obvious reasons. Let's not forget, though, that we still have an absolute no-mark manager in charge for reasons beyond most of our understanding, an increasingly problematic DoF still in a job, and under serious threat of relegation. Agreed that perhaps the most senior two are now beyond reach, but we are far from out of this mess just because we're up for sale; and for me, I can't think of many lower times supporting town, which feels to me like the most appropriate time for discontent to be vocalised. Will it achieve anything, probably not, but isn't it just the same as 75% of the ground booing at half time? That certainly doesn't get criticised. |
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Tiro
Jimmy Glazzard Terrier
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Post by Tiro on Feb 5, 2023 18:58:43 GMT 1
Kinda, yes. But what I think is that all means of protest are silly right now if you take the context. I don’t think anyone should be sparring any blame to the board, especially Dave Baldwin who is running the club and working hard to maintain operations, make football decisions and find a buyer. As I explained earlier, neither DH or PH are operating the club. They’re essentially silent partners. Both Hoyle and Hodgkinsom would sell tomorrow if they could, but any potential buyer (and there are some who are keen) won’t purchase the club without knowing what league we will be in. It makes perfect business sense. And Baldwin isnt there to fund the club. He’s there to work under the constraints. And I know that the club won’t sit down with them, but if the supporters trust or other want proper and real answers, it doesn’t make any business sense to do so right now unless they want to sign non disclosure agreements which would defeat the object. So to just blame the ‘circus’ and rally against the board in general is in my opinion misguided and demonstrates a lack of understanding. If they’re going to express frustrations choose a better time and subject. But honestly, they’re gonna get fuck all change protesting DH, PH or MF right now. All it does is stand to make themselves feel better. In all honesty, I don’t think anyone of the board or otherwise doesn’t already understand the frustrations of the fans. It’s frustrating as fuck, but that’s the reality of it. So yeah, it’s fair game to critique their febrile banner. Especially when their actions are as shallow as the words that they’re protesting against. Completely fair on the DH and PH stuff - no argument that answers definitely won't be coming from those any time soon for obvious reasons. Let's not forget, though, that we still have an absolute no-mark manager in charge for reasons beyond most of our understanding, an increasingly problematic DoF still in a job, and under serious threat of relegation. Agreed that perhaps the most senior two are now beyond reach, but we are far from out of this mess just because we're up for sale; and for me, I can't think of many lower times supporting town, which feels to me like the most appropriate time for discontent to be vocalised. Will it achieve anything, probably not, but isn't it just the same as 75% of the ground booing at half time? That certainly doesn't get criticised. So then is it not fair to say that they should just be lobbying anti-MF sentiment instead of calling everything a circus? What do they actually want and what are they protesting against? It’s not clear to me. As I say, we’re all frustrated, but there are constraints and under the circumstances, I think they’re misguided. And I don’t think there is an exception to booing; it gets called out too. But I’d argue that booing is probably more successful if MF is the target of their grievances. This is my initial point; in danger of looking as daft as the target of their issues. |
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Post by Sio on Feb 5, 2023 19:03:20 GMT 1
Completely fair on the DH and PH stuff - no argument that answers definitely won't be coming from those any time soon for obvious reasons. Let's not forget, though, that we still have an absolute no-mark manager in charge for reasons beyond most of our understanding, an increasingly problematic DoF still in a job, and under serious threat of relegation. Agreed that perhaps the most senior two are now beyond reach, but we are far from out of this mess just because we're up for sale; and for me, I can't think of many lower times supporting town, which feels to me like the most appropriate time for discontent to be vocalised. Will it achieve anything, probably not, but isn't it just the same as 75% of the ground booing at half time? That certainly doesn't get criticised. So then is it not fair to say that they should just be lobbying anti-MF sentiment instead of calling everything a circus? What do they actually want and what are they protesting against? It’s not clear to me. As I say, we’re all frustrated, but there are constraints and under the circumstances, I think they’re misguided. And I don’t think there is an exception to booing; it gets called out too. But I’d argue that booing is probably more successful if MF is the target of their grievances. This is my initial point; in danger of looking as daft as the target of their issues. Fair enough Tiro! To each their own on this one. |
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4 pts
Steve Kindon Terrier
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Post by 4 pts on Feb 5, 2023 20:32:31 GMT 1
I don't quite follow you? I think I understand that you're suggesting a banner (or protest as some are calling it) isn't the right way to show concern about the club. Genuine question, if that's the case - what would your approach be, if any? Kinda, yes. But what I think is that all means of protest are silly right now if you take the context. I don’t think anyone should be sparring any blame to the board, especially Dave Baldwin who is running the club and working hard to maintain operations, make football decisions and find a buyer. As I explained earlier, neither DH or PH are operating the club. They’re essentially silent partners. Both Hoyle and Hodgkinsom would sell tomorrow if they could, but any potential buyer (and there are some who are keen) won’t purchase the club without knowing what league we will be in. It makes perfect business sense. And Baldwin isnt there to fund the club. He’s there to work under the constraints. And I know that the club won’t sit down with them, but if the supporters trust or other want proper and real answers, it doesn’t make any business sense to do so right now unless they want to sign non disclosure agreements which would defeat the object. So to just blame the ‘circus’ and rally against the board in general is in my opinion misguided and demonstrates a lack of understanding. If they’re going to express frustrations choose a better time and subject. But honestly, they’re gonna get fuck all change protesting DH, PH or MF right now. All it does is stand to make themselves feel better. In all honesty, I don’t think anyone of the board or otherwise doesn’t already understand the frustrations of the fans. It’s frustrating as fuck, but that’s the reality of it. So yeah, it’s fair game to critique their febrile banner. Especially when their actions are as shallow as the words that they’re protesting against. Bad decision after bad decision have been made and all under Hoyles watch. The guy doesn't learn from his mistakes. He appoints DS which was bizarre, sacks him and we were told that the next managerial appointment HAD to be absolutely bang on and a clown is appointed. Harsh but true. Only a couple of months ago we were told that it would be catastrophic if the club was relegated. Its now February and we're becoming cut adrift watching Sunday League football. Yet no action is taken. From the outside looking in as we all do, what isn't circus and clowns regarding the state of the club. I'm no part of the cowshed lot but the banner is pretty spot on |
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Post by space hardware on Feb 5, 2023 20:56:24 GMT 1
Town fans must be some of the most docile, placid and passive fans of any club in the country.
Worse than that, some of the more simpy and cuckolded ones are aghast that there might be something to be unhappy about.
It's fucking rubbish at the moment, after a series of really bad decisions at every level of the club. Why shouldn't fans protest, in a way that they feel is justified?
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Post by keithAM11532 on Feb 5, 2023 22:07:07 GMT 1
I don't quite follow you? I think I understand that you're suggesting a banner (or protest as some are calling it) isn't the right way to show concern about the club. Genuine question, if that's the case - what would your approach be, if any? Kinda, yes. But what I think is that all means of protest are silly right now if you take the context. I don’t think anyone should be sparring any blame to the board, especially Dave Baldwin who is running the club and working hard to maintain operations, make football decisions and find a buyer. As I explained earlier, neither DH or PH are operating the club. They’re essentially silent partners. Both Hoyle and Hodgkinsom would sell tomorrow if they could, but any potential buyer (and there are some who are keen) won’t purchase the club without knowing what league we will be in. It makes perfect business sense. And Baldwin isnt there to fund the club. He’s there to work under the constraints. And I know that the club won’t sit down with them, but if the supporters trust or other want proper and real answers, it doesn’t make any business sense to do so right now unless they want to sign non disclosure agreements which would defeat the object. So to just blame the ‘circus’ and rally against the board in general is in my opinion misguided and demonstrates a lack of understanding. If they’re going to express frustrations choose a better time and subject. But honestly, they’re gonna get fuck all change protesting DH, PH or MF right now. All it does is stand to make themselves feel better. In all honesty, I don’t think anyone of the board or otherwise doesn’t already understand the frustrations of the fans. It’s frustrating as fuck, but that’s the reality of it. So yeah, it’s fair game to critique their febrile banner. Especially when their actions are as shallow as the words that they’re protesting against. Are you sure about PH selling tomorrow. You see I don't think he will. because if he did, all that money gained (unless its a pound obvs) would go to his creditors. The longer he can hold out the better he will be in the long run. |
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Tiro
Jimmy Glazzard Terrier
Posts: 4,025
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Post by Tiro on Feb 5, 2023 23:58:22 GMT 1
Town fans must be some of the most docile, placid and passive fans of any club in the country. Worse than that, some of the more simpy and cuckolded ones are aghast that there might be something to be unhappy about. It's fucking rubbish at the moment, after a series of really bad decisions at every level of the club. Why shouldn't fans protest, in a way that they feel is justified? You’ve fallen into the same trap haven’t you, thinking the expressions of a few on DATM speak for all and represent all. And you’ve also mistaken a lot of points (deliberately or otherwise) to legitimise your own opinion whilst victimising yourself as a person that doesn’t have the same perspective. I don’t think anyone has said anything to the contrary about it being shit or worthy of voicing opinion; but they are saying the action needs to be at least accurate and/or different/focussed rather than just regurging the usual shite in crayon. But these are just the thoughts of me, I don’t speak for all 17,000+ that attended yesterday (*ahem). And neither do the cowshed loyal. So maybe don’t try to make out that anyone who disagrees with the statement made or who would prefer to be measured is weak or any less passionate. |
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Tiro
Jimmy Glazzard Terrier
Posts: 4,025
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Post by Tiro on Feb 6, 2023 0:11:33 GMT 1
Kinda, yes. But what I think is that all means of protest are silly right now if you take the context. I don’t think anyone should be sparring any blame to the board, especially Dave Baldwin who is running the club and working hard to maintain operations, make football decisions and find a buyer. As I explained earlier, neither DH or PH are operating the club. They’re essentially silent partners. Both Hoyle and Hodgkinsom would sell tomorrow if they could, but any potential buyer (and there are some who are keen) won’t purchase the club without knowing what league we will be in. It makes perfect business sense. And Baldwin isnt there to fund the club. He’s there to work under the constraints. And I know that the club won’t sit down with them, but if the supporters trust or other want proper and real answers, it doesn’t make any business sense to do so right now unless they want to sign non disclosure agreements which would defeat the object. So to just blame the ‘circus’ and rally against the board in general is in my opinion misguided and demonstrates a lack of understanding. If they’re going to express frustrations choose a better time and subject. But honestly, they’re gonna get fuck all change protesting DH, PH or MF right now. All it does is stand to make themselves feel better. In all honesty, I don’t think anyone of the board or otherwise doesn’t already understand the frustrations of the fans. It’s frustrating as fuck, but that’s the reality of it. So yeah, it’s fair game to critique their febrile banner. Especially when their actions are as shallow as the words that they’re protesting against. Are you sure about PH selling tomorrow. You see I don't think he will. because if he did, all that money gained (unless its a pound obvs) would go to his creditors. The longer he can hold out the better he will be in the long run. You may be right. I’m just going off what little I/we know and admittedly that’s not a lot. |
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Post by harris on Feb 6, 2023 0:11:40 GMT 1
Town fans must be some of the most docile, placid and passive fans of any club in the country. Worse than that, some of the more simpy and cuckolded ones are aghast that there might be something to be unhappy about. It's fucking rubbish at the moment, after a series of really bad decisions at every level of the club. Why shouldn't fans protest, in a way that they feel is justified? Because it was a group of 15 year olds with a shitey banner, no organisation, kept quiet etc. Because we’re close to a takeover that relies on us doing well to happen, and this jeopardised that. |
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Post by Big Ern on Feb 6, 2023 0:17:49 GMT 1
Town fans must be some of the most docile, placid and passive fans of any club in the country. Worse than that, some of the more simpy and cuckolded ones are aghast that there might be something to be unhappy about. It's fucking rubbish at the moment, after a series of really bad decisions at every level of the club. Why shouldn't fans protest, in a way that they feel is justified? Because it was a group of 15 year olds with a shitey banner, no organisation, kept quiet etc. Because we’re close to a takeover that relies on us doing well to happen, and this jeopardised that. Did it chuff, and that's coming from someone who thinks a protest is stupid right now. To think a prospective owner would be put off by a banner condemning the current owner is absolutely bonkers. It didn't stop Derby being taken over did it? Man U have had protests for the past however many years the Glazers have been in charge and many many other clubs have protests. |
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Post by space hardware on Feb 6, 2023 8:49:55 GMT 1
Town fans must be some of the most docile, placid and passive fans of any club in the country. Worse than that, some of the more simpy and cuckolded ones are aghast that there might be something to be unhappy about. It's fucking rubbish at the moment, after a series of really bad decisions at every level of the club. Why shouldn't fans protest, in a way that they feel is justified? You’ve fallen into the same trap haven’t you, thinking the expressions of a few on DATM speak for all and represent all. And you’ve also mistaken a lot of points (deliberately or otherwise) to legitimise your own opinion whilst victimising yourself as a person that doesn’t have the same perspective. I don’t think anyone has said anything to the contrary about it being shit or worthy of voicing opinion; but they are saying the action needs to be at least accurate and/or different/focussed rather than just regurging the usual shite in crayon. But these are just the thoughts of me, I don’t speak for all 17,000+ that attended yesterday (*ahem). And neither do the cowshed loyal. So maybe don’t try to make out that anyone who disagrees with the statement made or who would prefer to be measured is weak or any less passionate. It's not just "a few on DATM" though. What were your thoughts on the public vilification of Ken Davy? The Fight For Answers Stuff? Sold For Two Quid (or whatever it was called)? |
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Post by Captainslapper on Feb 6, 2023 10:00:41 GMT 1
Any new owners are more likely to be put off buying the club by the orcus in the boardroom!
Killer whales will have your arm off in no time.
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Post by townarentbest on Feb 6, 2023 10:14:32 GMT 1
You’ve fallen into the same trap haven’t you, thinking the expressions of a few on DATM speak for all and represent all. And you’ve also mistaken a lot of points (deliberately or otherwise) to legitimise your own opinion whilst victimising yourself as a person that doesn’t have the same perspective. I don’t think anyone has said anything to the contrary about it being shit or worthy of voicing opinion; but they are saying the action needs to be at least accurate and/or different/focussed rather than just regurging the usual shite in crayon. But these are just the thoughts of me, I don’t speak for all 17,000+ that attended yesterday (*ahem). And neither do the cowshed loyal. So maybe don’t try to make out that anyone who disagrees with the statement made or who would prefer to be measured is weak or any less passionate. It's not just "a few on DATM" though. What were your thoughts on the public vilification of Ken Davy? The Fight For Answers Stuff? Sold For Two Quid (or whatever it was called)? The evidence on Saturday is that it IS just a few on DATM. There was the handful of folk with the odd 'Orcus' banner, and some weird bloke higher up in that stand near me who had his own little banner, and then spent the rest of the afternoon chatting to his mates saying he's not a Town fan anyway! Then during the game, a bright start from Town was roundly backed, even when QPR scored, which would have been the obvious time for any "Fotheringham Out" / "Sack the Board" type stuff to happen, there was NOTHING. Took the team a while to get back into the game, but the crowd let them get on with it - I think we dropped off a bit after scoring, but half-time was generally well received with clapping and a bit of booing which I think was directed at the ref (who seemed pretty poor towards both teams?). With a second half that was mainly an ebb and flow of Town on top trying laboriously to work opportunities against QPR who were happy to just sit back and rely on poor forward play on the occasional break - again there was no hint of discontent. As the game faded away to an inevitable draw (despite a couple of late chances for us and that strange nothing ball across the six yard box for them when it seemed easier to create a goal scoring chance), probably fewer left early than have done at any game in the last few months. The fans are generally accepting of where we are, and can see and appreciate that the guys on the pitch are TRYING to win games. |
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Post by Captainslapper on Feb 6, 2023 10:29:25 GMT 1
It's not just "a few on DATM" though. What were your thoughts on the public vilification of Ken Davy? The Fight For Answers Stuff? Sold For Two Quid (or whatever it was called)? The evidence on Saturday is that it IS just a few on DATM. There was the handful of folk with the odd 'Orcus' banner, and some weird bloke higher up in that stand near me who had his own little banner, and then spent the rest of the afternoon chatting to his mates saying he's not a Town fan anyway! Then during the game, a bright start from Town was roundly backed, even when QPR scored, which would have been the obvious time for any "Fotheringham Out" / "Sack the Board" type stuff to happen, there was NOTHING. Took the team a while to get back into the game, but the crowd let them get on with it - I think we dropped off a bit after scoring, but half-time was generally well received with clapping and a bit of booing which I think was directed at the ref (who seemed pretty poor towards both teams?). With a second half that was mainly an ebb and flow of Town on top trying laboriously to work opportunities against QPR who were happy to just sit back and rely on poor forward play on the occasional break - again there was no hint of discontent. As the game faded away to an inevitable draw (despite a couple of late chances for us and that strange nothing ball across the six yard box for them when it seemed easier to create a goal scoring chance), probably fewer left early than have done at any game in the last few months. The fans are generally accepting of where we are, and can see and appreciate that the guys on the pitch are TRYING to win games. The vast vast majority of fans have been supporting this club a good while and whilst they obviously wont be happy about the struggles of this season, they dont see it as being totally 'unacceptable' for Town to be scrapping against relegation from the 2nd tier.. they've seen us do it many times before. I wondered how many holding up the ace orcus banner started going around 2016/17.. a season we had a large intake of new, younger fans? |
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Post by Sio on Feb 6, 2023 10:32:26 GMT 1
The evidence on Saturday is that it IS just a few on DATM. There was the handful of folk with the odd 'Orcus' banner, and some weird bloke higher up in that stand near me who had his own little banner, and then spent the rest of the afternoon chatting to his mates saying he's not a Town fan anyway! Then during the game, a bright start from Town was roundly backed, even when QPR scored, which would have been the obvious time for any "Fotheringham Out" / "Sack the Board" type stuff to happen, there was NOTHING. Took the team a while to get back into the game, but the crowd let them get on with it - I think we dropped off a bit after scoring, but half-time was generally well received with clapping and a bit of booing which I think was directed at the ref (who seemed pretty poor towards both teams?). With a second half that was mainly an ebb and flow of Town on top trying laboriously to work opportunities against QPR who were happy to just sit back and rely on poor forward play on the occasional break - again there was no hint of discontent. As the game faded away to an inevitable draw (despite a couple of late chances for us and that strange nothing ball across the six yard box for them when it seemed easier to create a goal scoring chance), probably fewer left early than have done at any game in the last few months. The fans are generally accepting of where we are, and can see and appreciate that the guys on the pitch are TRYING to win games. The vast vast majority of fans have been supporting this club a good while and whilst they obviously wont be happy about the struggles of this season, they dont see it as being totally 'unacceptable' for Town to be scrapping against relegation from the 2nd tier.. they've seen us do it many times before. I wondered how many holding up the ace orcus banner started going around 2016/17.. a season we had a large intake of new, younger fans? I can dispel this myth that the CL is a bunch of new fans, for one thing. Most been supporting Town since the 80s or 90s. |
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Post by space hardware on Feb 6, 2023 11:03:13 GMT 1
The evidence on Saturday is that it IS just a few on DATM. There was the handful of folk with the odd 'Orcus' banner, and some weird bloke higher up in that stand near me who had his own little banner, and then spent the rest of the afternoon chatting to his mates saying he's not a Town fan anyway! Then during the game, a bright start from Town was roundly backed, even when QPR scored, which would have been the obvious time for any "Fotheringham Out" / "Sack the Board" type stuff to happen, there was NOTHING. Took the team a while to get back into the game, but the crowd let them get on with it - I think we dropped off a bit after scoring, but half-time was generally well received with clapping and a bit of booing which I think was directed at the ref (who seemed pretty poor towards both teams?). With a second half that was mainly an ebb and flow of Town on top trying laboriously to work opportunities against QPR who were happy to just sit back and rely on poor forward play on the occasional break - again there was no hint of discontent. As the game faded away to an inevitable draw (despite a couple of late chances for us and that strange nothing ball across the six yard box for them when it seemed easier to create a goal scoring chance), probably fewer left early than have done at any game in the last few months. The fans are generally accepting of where we are, and can see and appreciate that the guys on the pitch are TRYING to win games. The vast vast majority of fans have been supporting this club a good while and whilst they obviously wont be happy about the struggles of this season, they dont see it as being totally 'unacceptable' for Town to be scrapping against relegation from the 2nd tier.. they've seen us do it many times before. I wondered how many holding up the ace orcus banner started going around 2016/17.. a season we had a large intake of new, younger fans? Many of us with functioning memories can remember the vitriol and bile directed at Ken Davy on a daily basis on DATM, by lots of prolific posters who are still active now. Yet when he was introduced to the crowd on several occasions, he got a warm and generous reception. Davy was subjected to far worse than a few poorly painted words on a banner but I suppose that was acceptable, because your side were "right". FFS, the hypocrisy is absolutely blatant. |
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Post by hthp on Feb 6, 2023 11:03:56 GMT 1
It's not just "a few on DATM" though. What were your thoughts on the public vilification of Ken Davy? The Fight For Answers Stuff? Sold For Two Quid (or whatever it was called)? The evidence on Saturday is that it IS just a few on DATM. There was the handful of folk with the odd 'Orcus' banner, and some weird bloke higher up in that stand near me who had his own little banner, and then spent the rest of the afternoon chatting to his mates saying he's not a Town fan anyway! Then during the game, a bright start from Town was roundly backed, even when QPR scored, which would have been the obvious time for any "Fotheringham Out" / "Sack the Board" type stuff to happen, there was NOTHING. Took the team a while to get back into the game, but the crowd let them get on with it - I think we dropped off a bit after scoring, but half-time was generally well received with clapping and a bit of booing which I think was directed at the ref (who seemed pretty poor towards both teams?). With a second half that was mainly an ebb and flow of Town on top trying laboriously to work opportunities against QPR who were happy to just sit back and rely on poor forward play on the occasional break - again there was no hint of discontent. As the game faded away to an inevitable draw (despite a couple of late chances for us and that strange nothing ball across the six yard box for them when it seemed easier to create a goal scoring chance), probably fewer left early than have done at any game in the last few months. The fans are generally accepting of where we are, and can see and appreciate that the guys on the pitch are TRYING to win games. Chants of "We want Bromby out" and also "sacked in the morning" and "you don't know what you're doing" aimed at Fotheringham in the first half in the Riverside Lower. |
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Post by Captainslapper on Feb 6, 2023 11:47:04 GMT 1
The vast vast majority of fans have been supporting this club a good while and whilst they obviously wont be happy about the struggles of this season, they dont see it as being totally 'unacceptable' for Town to be scrapping against relegation from the 2nd tier.. they've seen us do it many times before. I wondered how many holding up the ace orcus banner started going around 2016/17.. a season we had a large intake of new, younger fans? Many of us with functioning memories can remember the vitriol and bile directed at Ken Davy on a daily basis on DATM, by lots of prolific posters who are still active now. Yet when he was introduced to the crowd on several occasions, he got a warm and generous reception. Davy was subjected to far worse than a few poorly painted words on a banner but I suppose that was acceptable, because your side were "right". FFS, the hypocrisy is absolutely blatant. At the time there was no indication Davy wanted to let the club go. At this time everyone knows that the owner is actively trying to let the club go. If Davy had been I doubt there'd have been any protests against him. So the two protests seem entirely different even if you think there is any similarities in those two owners ( one who secretly asset stripped the club.. and one who has publicly done the direct opposite ) . Im not sure what that protest was trying to achieve..it seemed to be demanding that people who want to leave the club, leave the club because struggling in the championship is now totally unacceptable for HTFC. |
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Post by 3Pipe on Feb 6, 2023 11:51:54 GMT 1
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Post by dugnet on Feb 6, 2023 13:34:16 GMT 1
All I think the "protest" has done is to draw a bit of derision, let's be honest I am not sure the message was particularly helpful and the presentation was a little bit unclear, and achieve some attention in the media. Moving on from that I was wondering what the "end game" is here.
We can express our confusion, disappointment, frustration at DH (the justification for that is a long running debate, with no real agreed outcome) but he is selling. So on what basis does he want out? He controls the cards, although he cannot make people offer something for the club but he can influence the type of deal they may offer.
From a footballing point of view we are in the last chance saloon. The only change that can be made now is to remove MF. The players we have are the players we are hoping can keep our Championship status. MF, or whoever, has those resources to get the points required. In my view that looks a tough ask.
Off the field, given there will be change, everything points to giving the club the best chance to stabilise, re-set and move in a new direction. Although it is only February time is precious. It may seem ridiculous to some but the start of next season isn't that far away. For me it is important that we start planning as quickly as we can. In the short term season tickets will need to be marketed. In the current climate how many can honestly say they wouldn't think twice about renewing?
Despite the communication from Dave Baldwin, end of October? We have no inkling about what is potentially happening. Surely it is time, understanding that NDA's will be in place, to give supporters an update of the direction of travel. There are some areas that are unclear and need addressing:
The situation with the stadium, especially given that it was reported that KSDL had issues and DB said that a resolution was imminent
The price being sought for the club - the press reports we were for sale for £1 look misleading (as people will surely only pay what it is worth), what is the truth?
What happens if we aren't sold and, worse case I assume, we are also relegated?
At the moment we are unclear but the longer there isn't a resolution the more it hinders our recovery, or attempts to recover, as a club.
I appreciate that there is a lot of emotion but we need to take that out and start asking those in charge some reasonable questions. If only in the hope that it may allow us to move forward.
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goodbet
Jimmy Glazzard Terrier
Posts: 4,610
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Post by goodbet on Feb 6, 2023 13:43:23 GMT 1
Town fans must be some of the most docile, placid and passive fans of any club in the country. Worse than that, some of the more simpy and cuckolded ones are aghast that there might be something to be unhappy about. It's fucking rubbish at the moment, after a series of really bad decisions at every level of the club. Why shouldn't fans protest, in a way that they feel is justified? Because it was a group of 15 year olds with a shitey banner, no organisation, kept quiet etc. Because we’re close to a takeover that relies on us doing well to happen, and this jeopardised that. I don't see how a banner and a few people in the stands would put off a takeover. If it did it would be just as well because owning a football team is not all sun and roses. |
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goodbet
Jimmy Glazzard Terrier
Posts: 4,610
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Post by goodbet on Feb 6, 2023 14:06:08 GMT 1
The evidence on Saturday is that it IS just a few on DATM. There was the handful of folk with the odd 'Orcus' banner, and some weird bloke higher up in that stand near me who had his own little banner, and then spent the rest of the afternoon chatting to his mates saying he's not a Town fan anyway! Then during the game, a bright start from Town was roundly backed, even when QPR scored, which would have been the obvious time for any "Fotheringham Out" / "Sack the Board" type stuff to happen, there was NOTHING. Took the team a while to get back into the game, but the crowd let them get on with it - I think we dropped off a bit after scoring, but half-time was generally well received with clapping and a bit of booing which I think was directed at the ref (who seemed pretty poor towards both teams?). With a second half that was mainly an ebb and flow of Town on top trying laboriously to work opportunities against QPR who were happy to just sit back and rely on poor forward play on the occasional break - again there was no hint of discontent. As the game faded away to an inevitable draw (despite a couple of late chances for us and that strange nothing ball across the six yard box for them when it seemed easier to create a goal scoring chance), probably fewer left early than have done at any game in the last few months. The fans are generally accepting of where we are, and can see and appreciate that the guys on the pitch are TRYING to win games. The vast vast majority of fans have been supporting this club a good while and whilst they obviously wont be happy about the struggles of this season, they dont see it as being totally 'unacceptable' for Town to be scrapping against relegation from the 2nd tier.. they've seen us do it many times before. I wondered how many holding up the ace orcus banner started going around 2016/17.. a season we had a large intake of new, younger fans? It is not totally unacceptable to be in a relegation fight but to get here from the position we were in last season, I believe that it is. The club decided in the summer that we have a good side, so we can loose the coach set on an inexperienced one to replace him with no consideration of what he brought to the team. On top of that you look at the transfers we made to weaken the team it became obvious that this is a self inflicted wound. We struggled and then we were told that the new coach had to be just right. Low and behold we get yet another inexperienced coach and surprisingly (not) we are still in the relegation zone. Come the January window and in the main we get old players that have not played a game for some time or injured. We drop the young players that have shown promise and bring straight in to the first team a returning player that could not get a game for another struggling team. We struggle to get a shot on target and play with a back 5 and a midfield packed with holding players. You may be willing to accept this but not everyone is. |
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Post by harris on Feb 6, 2023 14:13:22 GMT 1
Because it was a group of 15 year olds with a shitey banner, no organisation, kept quiet etc. Because we’re close to a takeover that relies on us doing well to happen, and this jeopardised that. I don't see how a banner and a few people in the stands would put off a takeover. If it did it would be just as well because owning a football team is not all sun and roses. Jeopardised us doing well on the pitch |
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goodbet
Jimmy Glazzard Terrier
Posts: 4,610
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Post by goodbet on Feb 6, 2023 14:32:49 GMT 1
I don't see how a banner and a few people in the stands would put off a takeover. If it did it would be just as well because owning a football team is not all sun and roses. Jeopardised us doing well on the pitch We must have been protesting all season long then  |
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Post by kirkheatonterrier on Feb 6, 2023 14:44:26 GMT 1
Are we close to a takeover though? I think we are nearer going into Administration. Heard that DH and PH can't agree over the sale of PH's shares and DH is considering no longer covering the wage bill at Town. Worrying times
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Post by Sio on Feb 6, 2023 15:00:03 GMT 1
I don't see how a banner and a few people in the stands would put off a takeover. If it did it would be just as well because owning a football team is not all sun and roses. Jeopardised us doing well on the pitch You're mad if you think the players so much as noticed the banner, let alone stopped to read it, get offended, then play worse because of comments aimed at the club ownership. |
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Post by Ginger Ogre on Feb 6, 2023 15:01:07 GMT 1
Huge respect for the protest yesterday from CL. Took all of 48 seconds before bursting out into Blue and White Army. The level of restraint to hold out for that long was incredibly impressive. What's wrong with this exactly? The CL wanted to express their dissatisfaction with how the club is being run. That has nothing to do with the team on the pitch which we wholeheartedly support and want to do well. Its is possible to dislike off field matters but still want the team to do well. |
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