I'd never say were are too big for League One,but I stand by the fact we should and could have avoided relegation.
Mate, I think we'd all agree that we could (and [as you say] probably SHOULD) have escaped relegation.
It was just the way your** post was set out, it seemed like it was the way a Chestwanker or Wendy would have put it, which is why I put the asterisked bit that you probably didn't intend it that way; most of us on here seem to be of an age where we've experienced this crappy division before and don't think we're too big for it
** I assume it was yours given you answered but I haven't checked
It was my post,but nah, " we should'nt be in this division" is a long,long way from "we're massive and too big for this division" which I don't think a Town fan would ever say,in my opinion.
I like this and the last few posts you've made - its become very circular, pointless & boring. Its time we moved on to hearing a new diary and reacting to the stadium ownership having been settled and getting excited for an upcoming run rattling through games starting next Tuesday through to March where we've finally got over the ridiculously annoying stop-start international breaks etc.
It doesn't really help when one party is out there saying they're going to learn and do better etc whilst at the same time doing the opposite and batting away any questioning/reasoning with a "well this is me, tough" dismission. I've been thinking back, and justaguy on here is in a similar position to what Sean Jarvis was - there is a difference in that Sean WAS employed by the club, although what he brought to DATM was rarely related to his actual job, and he was in that 'gauging and engaging' the fan base space that justaguy suggests he's in.
But what I don't really understand is, from what I recall, there was barely any rhetoric aimed at Sean even during the few seasons in the bottom third of the Championship ahead of that unusual year.
Whats the difference? Did Sean engage on Twitter (I've no idea) with random people?? Or was it just the luck of the situation that we were on a vaguely upward trajectory throughout his time here (until we weren't).
I'm really not trying to catch Dave out here but I do think the link to the club is being downplayed. It doesn't really matter either way but I'd be curious to know what the official relationship is.
This article here states quite explicitly that Dave - in his words - 'works for' the club.
No issue of course. Seems a good guy, social media daftness aside.
I'm really not trying to catch Dave out here but I do think the link to the club is being downplayed. It doesn't really matter either way but I'd be curious to know what the official relationship is.
This article here states quite explicitly that Dave - in his words - 'works for' the club.
No issue of course. Seems a good guy, social media daftness aside.
I'm really not trying to catch Dave out here but I do think the link to the club is being downplayed. It doesn't really matter either way but I'd be curious to know what the official relationship is.
This article here states quite explicitly that Dave - in his words - 'works for' the club.
No issue of course. Seems a good guy, social media daftness aside.
Mate, I think we'd all agree that we could (and [as you say] probably SHOULD) have escaped relegation.
It was just the way your** post was set out, it seemed like it was the way a Chestwanker or Wendy would have put it, which is why I put the asterisked bit that you probably didn't intend it that way; most of us on here seem to be of an age where we've experienced this crappy division before and don't think we're too big for it
** I assume it was yours given you answered but I haven't checked
It was my post,but nah, " we should'nt be in this division" is a long,long way from "we're massive and too big for this division" which I don't think a Town fan would ever say,in my opinion.
I think it was just the layout, the way you put it on a separate line to (seemingly) enhance it. Please note I'm not arguing with you, I'm just trying to explain why it MAY have come across as such - you've certainly made it clear that's not the way it was intended lol.
The bold bit - there's plenty (even on here) who've said things like "we should be beating the likes of ****" and the amount of people on Fakebook and the like who said we'd piss the league behind Brum, expressing anger that we "only" drew against Wrexham, and I'm sure I read on one of the threads at the beginning of the season how we were (paraphrasing here) not long out of the Prem and were too big for League 1.
Possibly they were of the newer post-2016 fans? I don't know and I'm not the kind of sad arse to go trawling through past threads to prove myself right or wrong
It was my post,but nah, " we should'nt be in this division" is a long,long way from "we're massive and too big for this division" which I don't think a Town fan would ever say,in my opinion.
I think it was just the layout, the way you put it on a separate line to (seemingly) enhance it. Please note I'm not arguing with you, I'm just trying to explain why it MAY have come across as such - you've certainly made it clear that's not the way it was intended lol.
The bold bit - there's plenty (even on here) who've said things like "we should be beating the likes of ****" and the amount of people on Fakebook and the like who said we'd piss the league behind Brum, expressing anger that we "only" drew against Wrexham, and I'm sure I read on one of the threads at the beginning of the season how we were (paraphrasing here) not long out of the Prem and were too big for League 1.
Possibly they were of the newer post-2016 fans? I don't know and I'm not the kind of sad arse to go trawling through past threads to prove myself right or wrong
Okay,maybe I should've put "realistic" town fans then,of which I like to think I'm one.
Just try and step back and listen to yourself Chris.
You're older and wiser than this nonsense
Sorry Pete you're right, everyone should just shut up and be greatful for the fact that we sit 5th in League one.
I'm curious Pete, where exactly would you draw the line? At what point would the failure become enough for you to warrant at least the faintest bit of criticism?
Believe me when I say that I am critical of lots of things - currently and over the past few seasons. I'm not convinced that shouting it over social media is helpful or productive. I do try to look for positives where possible.
Watching Town has been and currently is pretty awful. It's hard to feel any excitement in our play or for any individual. It's easy to question the lack of ability, desire or passion in this squad.
We're scraping results but it's not convincing.
Does that enable me to be viewed as realistic rather than a blind and deaf happy clapper?
It's in my nature to try and rise above the relentless doom, gloom and negativity but I appreciate that other choices are available
This attitude reminds me of the mocking of fans that aren’t happy with Cartwright on the last diary.
The funny thing is it’s the fans that are right and them who are wrong.
Something as simple as this just shows how Cartwright got his job ‘back’ at interview and continues to have a job. Unfortunately the clueless hierarchy are very clueless and very easy to hoodwink.
They'll get promoted though and then be competitive in the championship next season without needing to necessarily replace half the team. They've had the odd blip but they're still dominating teams week in week out. They'll go up, no doubt about it. We on the other hand are scraping past teams at the bottom of the league. I'm not saying we should have spent as much but I don't think they can be criticised yet unfortunately, their plan to buy the league seems on track to me.
You think? Think their expectation would be that theyd be well clear at the top by now. £35m in this division 'should' ensure that. Half their 10 wins have been by a single goal...so perhaps theyre scraping past teams too?
Think they will go up though as Id guess their squad strength will be a huge advantage through the winter when injuries and suspensions really hamper other sides....but theyre nowhere near as dominant as I expected them to be spending those kind of sums.
After all the disappointment at the loss of Alfie May to them, are his 5 goals in 15 appearances for his £20k a week that much better than Koroma's 4 goals in 12 ?
I'm only going on stats to be perfectly honest which I know can be misleading and don't always show the whole picture. The stats though in games I've looked at show them coming out on top in almost every area. Way more possession and chances. They're obviously not going to win every single game but the stats suggest they are out classing teams most weeks. Their squad looks a decent champ squad so it's not surprising. I don't think you can compare their narrow wins to ours although the scorelines may suggest some parity.
I'd love it if they failed but I don't see it, I think they're miles ahead of us and it looks like Wrexham and Wycombe are miles ahead in terms of being a cohesive unit whilst not necessarily having a better squad than us.
What's really annoying is the amount of players brought in and money spent to achieve the square root of FA. Zero resale value either. They're literally buying liabilities.
Going back to the original cause of the debate I would hope that the powers that be might reflect on how, essentially, bickering plays to the sort of club we aspire to be.
To use a clumsy analogy are we are aspiring to be a credible and celebrated theatre production or a pantomime? Right now we are looking the latter.
I make the point because although I appreciate engagement with the fans there is a point when you can look a little silly and, more importantly, unprofessional. It also raises questions about how Town are seen in the football world. Although I appreciate money is the most significant factor having a credible plan and ambition is surely important to attracting both players and business partners. How many people look at us and make comments such as "oh the club is run by a bunch of clowns who spend more time on social media arguing with their fans". Now I know that Mr Nagle and Dave might not appreciate me making that observation but surely it is a perception that might exist?
I often bang on about having a plan. A vision of what you want the club to be is essential. Although I can see many good things I am not sure I am able to join the dots up with the overall plan.
I don't know who those in charge would compare ourselves to/aspire to emulate in terms of structure and success but to make a comparison of clubs of similar size do you hear stories of a Brentford or Brighton owners/executives engaging in colourful argument with fans on social media? Perception very quickly becomes reality.
This is deeper than the one Tweet though, Pete. It’s about the context behind it. Dave will say different but certainly the one quoting a Town fan with the score was done to provoke and get a reaction, which it has to be fair.
Not sure if you use social media but if you do you'll see lots of instances of Dave and Kev name calling fans. Is that acceptable? How would you feel if you expressed an opinion and 2 blokes started calling you names and mocking you? You mention playground bullies in your post, thats ironic given thats the way they come across sometimes.
People are absolutely allowed to be positive, however in doing so they dont need to resort to cheap shots at others, especially when they are discussing perfectly legitimate concerns, concerns that are known to them by all accounts.
Dave himself has said he his happy to be judged on his messages. If people form a negative opinion on them thenz by Daves own admission thats absolutely fine.
This is 100% where I should let this go, but I’m a stubborn idiot.
I’m happy to be judged on my messages, but I’d like to get it right.
What specific name calling are we referring to when we were being “playground bullies”?
“Negative Neary”? I’m honest to god asking you what they were, maybe I missed something.
“Provoking a reaction?”
Yeah that’s fair, I was hoping for a smile. That wasn’t me mocking or being condescending, it was me saying, as I’ve said here in this thread, “hey we won, can we smile for a day?”
If that’s not what they want to do, that’s ok. I’m not a fan gatekeeper. People can fan how they want to fan.
My only issue here is you’re making it seem like Kevin and I are out on the prowl for naysaying Town Fan looking for blood if they dare say anything negative. The reality is more like this, forgive the language:
Twitter person: “Hey Dave you tosser! Tell your cu*t friend Kev to f*ck off back to America and take Carthorse with him!”
Me: hey Negative ______, we’ve won today. Can’t we be happy?”
Some other fans: “HOW DARE THEY ANTAGONIZE FANS WHO HAVE BEEN HERE SINCE 1861 HOW CHEEKY AND NAIVE AND PATRONIZING”
I’m obviously dramatizing but not that much. Search my mentions and “Town” and see what you find, not to mention the direct messages I’ll happily share privately.
And here’s the thing: it’s FINE. I’m fine with it it’s part of the gig and passion is passion. I’m 100% not complaining, but when I’m called a bully or playground name caller you’re going to get an eye roll so huge from me they might fall out the back of my head.
And yes, it’s Twitter and could easily be ignored. I think that’s the “standard” you talk about- be the bigger man, let it go, etc- but you also say I’m ok responding and being judged for it.
As far as not understanding things, though it’s not exactly the same, I’d remind you I’ve been a fan of the Sacramento Kings my entire life. The team that just literally broke a 100 year old record for futility. No championships. Never even been to a championship. Year after year. Including this year that’s currently 16 games in of 82, and I already know we likely suck.
And yet, a few times a year, I’ll be happy after wins, even knowing that in the long run we’ve no chance at a title (in a league where over half the teams make the playoffs).
And yea I know it’s American net ball that people only play when it rains outside, but it’s what we have and I’m a die-hard. Even without relegation.
So far it appears I’m guilty of:
- being naive
- name calling
- daring to be positive after a win
- being tone deaf
- not reading the room
- being a bully
As if having a handful of fans calling you a c*nt because you pointed out we matched our win total last year makes me the bully. Sounds strange to me.
Anyway there’s no win here. It’s ok. It’s not for everyone, and honestly the football is the product, not some moron’s tweets (me, I’m the moron to be clear). As Pozza said, I will be me, be judged on it, as will KN. Everything I say or do here or online comes from the place of loving this team and fanbase, but hey maybe the interactions are overrated.
Either way I’ll see you at Bolton. Look for the guy with the big nose smoking at the half and come on up and say hello (or whatever you wish).
As long as we get three points.
I’m genuinely surprised you refer to “Carthorse” whether it be in a quote or not. I don’t agree with a lot of what you say/post but the fact you even mention Carthorse 😂😂 brilliant!
