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Post by Captainslapper on Jan 18, 2009 21:59:56 GMT 1
berrett would be best to replace goodwin at moment not for a second is worthys passing good enough for the way we are playing. i agree berrett is lightweight and so is collins and this is something both should be in the gym working hard on. all our build up play is through the often superb passing of goodwin and with worthy in there this would suffer, the back four dont need the same protection as they are starting to look very good. berrett reads the game very well and positions himslef well, yes he will have to work harder and Blackie will be getting the players fit enough to put that work rate in. as for worthy i think we have seen the last of him in a town shirt and will go on to have a good career in league 2. i wish the basics of his game were better as he has the passion we all love but he just doesnt have the technical ability move town forward. if/when he goes i wish him all the best and thank him for his efforts for town. So you'd go for the lightweight midfield option ( your words) of berrett and Collins. Interesting. A sound tactic just so long as the other team don't try and attack us through the middle. Shawsie, Collins and berrett are very similar types of player. Ok they play a slightly different role with collins getting forward more than berrett would, but that aside they are both slight of build , composed and comfortable on the ball. Neither have the tenacity or physical strength to play as a defensive midfielder, protecting the back 4. I feel a little sorry for Berrett cos he was ideal for the sweeper role in a back 3 but as that system is now past history Im not sure how hes going to figure in a midfield 4 unless theres a lot of injuries. Behind Collins and Craney in the attacking role and behind Goodwin and Worthington in the defensive. Worthys passing ability is more than good enough for that role as he showed plenty of times earlier this season, if you were willing to see it of course. yes he plays the odd stray pass, but there again so does every player, Goodwin included. 4 or 5 loose passes yesterday for example ,though in general he used the ball well. The big difference is those loose passes don't seem to register, in the same way an accurate Worthington pass doesn't. If Clark can bring in a better replacement for Worthington, then fine, let him go. If not we'd be weakening the squad if he went.
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Post by shawsie on Jan 18, 2009 23:03:27 GMT 1
berrett would be best to replace goodwin at moment not for a second is worthys passing good enough for the way we are playing. i agree berrett is lightweight and so is collins and this is something both should be in the gym working hard on. all our build up play is through the often superb passing of goodwin and with worthy in there this would suffer, the back four dont need the same protection as they are starting to look very good. berrett reads the game very well and positions himslef well, yes he will have to work harder and Blackie will be getting the players fit enough to put that work rate in. as for worthy i think we have seen the last of him in a town shirt and will go on to have a good career in league 2. i wish the basics of his game were better as he has the passion we all love but he just doesnt have the technical ability move town forward. if/when he goes i wish him all the best and thank him for his efforts for town. So you'd go for the lightweight midfield option ( your words) of berrett and Collins. Interesting. A sound tactic just so long as the other team don't try and attack us through the middle. Shawsie, Collins and berrett are very similar types of player. Ok they play a slightly different role with collins getting forward more than berrett would, but that aside they are both slight of build , composed and comfortable on the ball. Neither have the tenacity or physical strength to play as a defensive midfielder, protecting the back 4. I feel a little sorry for Berrett cos he was ideal for the sweeper role in a back 3 but as that system is now past history Im not sure how hes going to figure in a midfield 4 unless theres a lot of injuries. Behind Collins and Craney in the attacking role and behind Goodwin and Worthington in the defensive. Worthys passing ability is more than good enough for that role as he showed plenty of times earlier this season, if you were willing to see it of course. yes he plays the odd stray pass, but there again so does every player, Goodwin included. 4 or 5 loose passes yesterday for example ,though in general he used the ball well. The big difference is those loose passes don't seem to register, in the same way an accurate Worthington pass doesn't. If Clark can bring in a better replacement for Worthington, then fine, let him go. If not we'd be weakening the squad if he went. Sorry slapps - they aint anything like each other! Collins is a forward running player who is box to box and looking to create things - Berrett is a holding player, neat and tidy on the ball and breaks play up with his reading of the game not physicality. As for worthy's passing - dear oh dear, if you think he can play high tempo one touch football then we will again have to differ. The fact he isnt in the 16 tells you that also - we arent going back to a 3 man defence and clark has decided clarke/berrett cover the defensive side and craney/an other the more offensive side. Worthy is a decent league 1 player - we want to get out of league 1 and he isnt good enough to play at a higher level than that - i dont want him to go per se, cos he does offer cover, but he is 24 now and needs first team football. It will be interesting to see if he moves on to a championship/top league 1 club as you have said in the past - rumours i hear are that two league 2 clubs and a lowly placed league 1 side have contacted us about him and that we wont stand in his way.
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Post by thrice on Jan 18, 2009 23:08:34 GMT 1
If Berrett can play in the backline (he wasn't a sweeper) I'm sure he can play the holding midfield role with ease should Goodwin go missing through form, fitness or suspension.
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Post by rantinray on Jan 18, 2009 23:13:40 GMT 1
Worthington as far as I can see is dead in the water.
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Post by andyhudd on Jan 18, 2009 23:29:41 GMT 1
I rate Berrett very highly and given the right physical and techincal coachning he could play anwhere in defence or midfield he is a good footballer but he is not yet capable of playing the holding role in midfield. If we played Collins and Berrett in central midfield they would be over run and not win the battle. Cads is a battler but not technically good defensively and roberts is brilliant going forward but not very good defensively. It would be a sucidal act to play Cads, Collins, Berrett and Roberts across midfield. Our only hope would be to outscore teams and with our strikerforce that won't happen. We need to play either goodwin or worthy unless we trry and convert craney after doing such a good job away at brighton. berrett simply isn't ready for that role. I can see why people don't rate worthy but i think it would be interesting to see those who slate him how many have played the game. Worthy is not pretty and as a spectator he is not what you pay your hard earned to see. He does the simple things well and if you have ever played the game you will know that you need players like that in your side. Lee Clark was a quality central midfelder who played at the highelst level but he will know for every kaka, scholes, ginola etc you need a batty, keane , butt etc I honestly think clark will see worthy has a part to play but worhty may decide he needs to move on to play every week. i hope he doesn't as if anything happends to goodwin he would be straight in. I'd say Worthy's exactly what you pay your "hard earned" to see ... Crunching tackles, heart on his sleeve ... really battling for the cause.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 18, 2009 23:33:29 GMT 1
I rate Berrett very highly and given the right physical and techincal coachning he could play anwhere in defence or midfield he is a good footballer but he is not yet capable of playing the holding role in midfield. If we played Collins and Berrett in central midfield they would be over run and not win the battle. Cads is a battler but not technically good defensively and roberts is brilliant going forward but not very good defensively. It would be a sucidal act to play Cads, Collins, Berrett and Roberts across midfield. Our only hope would be to outscore teams and with our strikerforce that won't happen. We need to play either goodwin or worthy unless we trry and convert craney after doing such a good job away at brighton. berrett simply isn't ready for that role. I can see why people don't rate worthy but i think it would be interesting to see those who slate him how many have played the game. Worthy is not pretty and as a spectator he is not what you pay your hard earned to see. He does the simple things well and if you have ever played the game you will know that you need players like that in your side. Lee Clark was a quality central midfelder who played at the highelst level but he will know for every kaka, scholes, ginola etc you need a batty, keane , butt etc I honestly think clark will see worthy has a part to play but worhty may decide he needs to move on to play every week. i hope he doesn't as if anything happends to goodwin he would be straight in. I'd say Worthy's exactly what you pay your "hard earned" to see ... Crunching tackles, heart on his sleeve ... really battling for the cause. Disagree!!! People want to see a great goal or a fancy roberts flick. Granted the crowd will love a worthy guts and all tackle but if you think worthy does two of them a game and thats all you do you don't understand the game. He does so much more!!!
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Post by andyhudd on Jan 18, 2009 23:58:36 GMT 1
Yeah, I know he does!
I'm just saying that fans appreciate that side to his game. The stats speak for themselves - Worthy's involvement has often improved our win ratio - and it's great to have this kind of depth and competition for places.
In pre-season - there were plenty of people suggesting we get rid of Worthy, then he worked his way into Ternent's team - and people raved about him. Now, a lot want rid again.
I rate Worthy and think he's a fantastic player to have at the club ... it's just an issue that he's probably keen for first team football, which we can't guarantee.
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Post by shawsie on Jan 19, 2009 0:35:53 GMT 1
Yeah, I know he does! I'm just saying that fans appreciate that side to his game. The stats speak for themselves - Worthy's involvement has often improved our win ratio - and it's great to have this kind of depth and competition for places. In pre-season - there were plenty of people suggesting we get rid of Worthy, then he worked his way into Ternent's team - and people raved about him. Now, a lot want rid again. I rate Worthy and think he's a fantastic player to have at the club ... it's just an issue that he's probably keen for first team football, which we can't guarantee. I only want rid because the lad deserves 1st team football and he isnt good enough for where we aspire to. I have never verbally abused worthy during a game because his effort and commitment cant be questioned - ability wise though he doesnt cut it. We are all fully behind clark saying he is only considering bringin in players good enough to perform at the level above - by the same rights that means we have to let those definitely not good enough go to get first team football elsewhere - as such i expect to see worthy, unsworth, lucketti all go either in the window or the summer. There will be others but those three are definites for me, particularly given their wages!
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midlander
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Post by midlander on Jan 19, 2009 1:14:00 GMT 1
I'm not so sure Berrett is the lightweight player some are making out. I'm sure I recall him having Becchio in his pocket at Elland Road. He stood up to the physical side very well that day. Just because he's not a big lad and likes to pass the ball, doesn't mean he is lightweight.
Equally, I can see an improvement in Collins' upper body strength. Two or three times yesterday he held off forceful challenges and kept possession.
The premise of making Worthy the logical replacement for Goodwin's role also doesn't add up. Worthy has never been a holding midfielder. His game has been about getting about the park and getting stuck in. He has never sat in front of the back four in his career. I'm not saying he couldn't do the job, but he'd have to learn the role as he has a tendency to follow the ball, rather than maintain a position in front of the centre-backs. Goodwin is very disciplined in his positioning, only committing himself forwards when Town are on top.
I like Worthy as he gives 100% every match. I just don't see him fitting in much at this current time. I wouldn't rule him out, just like I haven't given up on Lucketti (if Butler or Clarke got injured), but equally I could easily see him moving on.
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