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Post by softboy on Dec 20, 2014 19:31:12 GMT 1
We go into a game with one of our fellow candidates for relegation & we play a loan striker up front (who goes back in 9 days) and our leading scorer on the bench.
When we fall behind it takes 6 mins to bring the subs on & we take our best striker on the day (Harry Bunn) off.
We got exactly what we deserver today nothing!
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Post by stinkypete on Dec 20, 2014 19:36:03 GMT 1
Nobody can defend Powell today, was crying out for a change after 20 mins! Poor management .
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Post by fredcarno1 on Dec 20, 2014 19:39:09 GMT 1
Agreed if Holt has been poor for a few weeks now, that being the case I'd sooner be trying to play our own striker in Wells back into a bit of form. I'm not sure what Powell is actually trying to do at the minute but one thing is for sure the so called football is dreadful and the total lack of fight and tempo is glaringly apparent.
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Post by terrierfortythree on Dec 20, 2014 19:41:48 GMT 1
needed one of the midfield three to really take the game by the scruff, and drive the ball forward but everytime they had the ball it was punted long to holt. When we did retain it up top (which was rare) all 3 were reluctant be that 'number 10' today
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Post by softboy on Dec 20, 2014 19:42:37 GMT 1
I think it is clear Powell does not rate Wells - the way to build his confidence is play him not keep him on the bench.
We were shit today - the goal we conceded was poor - but no way was it a free kick - Donaldson basically barged into Gerrard.
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Yesss
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Post by Yesss on Dec 21, 2014 1:20:01 GMT 1
Holt was good at the start of his loan spell. However, what a donkey he has become into, lazy, does not look intrested and half of the time isn't even in the box and Is sat out wide doing nothing. But yet we will continue to play him In front of Vaughan and Wells. Laughable really
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Post by impact on Dec 21, 2014 1:33:15 GMT 1
Holt was good at the start of his loan spell. However, what a donkey he has become into, lazy, does not look intrested and half of the time isn't even in the box and Is sat out wide doing nothing. But yet we will continue to play him In front of Vaughan and Wells. Laughable really Mainly because he had a cracking game v Brentford, Wells has been poor recently and Vaughan needs bringing back slowly to stop him getting injured again. |
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Yesss
Tom Cowan Terrier
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Post by Yesss on Dec 21, 2014 14:29:58 GMT 1
Holt was good at the start of his loan spell. However, what a donkey he has become into, lazy, does not look intrested and half of the time isn't even in the box and Is sat out wide doing nothing. But yet we will continue to play him In front of Vaughan and Wells. Laughable really Mainly because he had a cracking game v Brentford, Wells has been poor recently and Vaughan needs bringing back slowly to stop him getting injured again. at least play Wells with him upfront. Yesterday we created nothing and grant Holt was useless and didn't do a thing, like the last couple of games too. |
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Post by impact on Dec 21, 2014 14:41:54 GMT 1
Mainly because he had a cracking game v Brentford, Wells has been poor recently and Vaughan needs bringing back slowly to stop him getting injured again. at least play Wells with him upfront. Yesterday we created nothing and grant Holt was useless and didn't do a thing, like the last couple of games too. Again, that's rubbish as he played very well against Brentford 2 games ago. I can't comment on Norwich as I didn't go. Look at Carroll and Nolan. They have a great partnership because Nolan gets up to support Carroll and feeds off his knock downs. We had no one doing that. Not 1 player from midfield busted a gut to support Holt. He can do nothing when he has no one within 20 yards of him. |
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Post by Headless Chicken on Dec 21, 2014 15:06:09 GMT 1
The issue isn't necessarily playing one up front, we and many others have scored plenty of goals with this formation.
What kills us is that when we do none of the midfield three supports Holt, neither fullback shows any intent to get forward, compounded by the CB's quality of passing.
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Yesss
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Post by Yesss on Dec 21, 2014 15:38:21 GMT 1
at least play Wells with him upfront. Yesterday we created nothing and grant Holt was useless and didn't do a thing, like the last couple of games too. Again, that's rubbish as he played very well against Brentford 2 games ago. I can't comment on Norwich as I didn't go. Look at Carroll and Nolan. They have a great partnership because Nolan gets up to support Carroll and feeds off his knock downs. We had no one doing that. Not 1 player from midfield busted a gut to support Holt. He can do nothing when he has no one within 20 yards of him. yes he did have a good game against Brentford, but that was one good game he had in 7 games. What use is that at championship level? I went to Norwich so I can say that he was absolute garbage, and he was yesterday. He sits on the wing doing nothing during the game. I wouldn't mind if he was putting effort in and getting Into the box but he dosent even do that. We defiantly need to sign a big man in January to help Wells upfront because we can only count on Vaughan for 10-15 games a season. But regarding Holt, cya later |
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Post by Giggity on Dec 21, 2014 18:22:08 GMT 1
Formation was correct and Wells deserved to be on the bench. It was the tactics that were wrong (again).
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Post by galpharm2400 on Dec 21, 2014 18:38:09 GMT 1
given that some think powell was right to go ultra defensive after a 5-0 arseholing. what does he do now following a 5-0 arseholing and a 1-0 home defeat where nothing positive was requested or happened???
do we go 6 in midfield and no striker at all in this fucking stupid attempt to obtain a 0-0 draw???
after we scored 4 against blackpool should this not have led to powell playing 3 up front, using his own system of playing the next game in a style that is dictated by the previous one??
clueless, springs to mind about what we do now.
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Post by Tim Nice But Dim on Dec 21, 2014 19:30:45 GMT 1
The issue isn't necessarily playing one up front, we and many others have scored plenty of goals with this formation. What kills us is that when we do none of the midfield three supports Holt, neither fullback shows any intent to get forward, compounded by the CB's quality of passing. Spot on. There isn't a problem playing one up front, but they have to be supported especially by someone from midfield and we don't have that type of player. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 21, 2014 20:13:51 GMT 1
Nobody can defend Powell today, was crying out for a change after 20 mins! Poor management . After20minutes? how stupid |
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Post by stinkypete on Dec 21, 2014 23:40:25 GMT 1
Nobody can defend Powell today, was crying out for a change after 20 mins! Poor management . After20minutes? how stupid Why is it stupid? It clearly wasn't working, is there some unwritten rule that you can't make a sub before half time? No there isn't, it's called having the balls to make a decision when you can clearly see when things aren't going to plan. It's those types of decisions that make top managers. I find it more stupid having 2 strikers sat on the bench for 76 minutes when we are offering nothing in the way of attacking threat at home against a woeful Birmingham side who were there for the taking. |
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Post by Floyds on Dec 22, 2014 2:07:09 GMT 1
Looked like we were playing for 0-0, although the worst thing was the amount of time after we conceded to make a change.
Fucking rubbish management of you want my opinion.
Football is such a simple game yet we continually make a complete mess of it.
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Post by htfcfcfc on Dec 22, 2014 2:15:10 GMT 1
given that some think powell was right to go ultra defensive after a 5-0 arseholing. what does he do now following a 5-0 arseholing and a 1-0 home defeat where nothing positive was requested or happened??? do we go 6 in midfield and no striker at all in this fucking stupid attempt to obtain a 0-0 draw??? after we scored 4 against blackpool should this not have led to powell playing 3 up front, using his own system of playing the next game in a style that is dictated by the previous one?? clueless, springs to mind about what we do now. Have to agree. With 10 men for most of the game, Norwich was one of those you write off and go out to rectify with 3 points the next game. What exactly did we learn from going for 0-0 and achieving a 0-1? |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 22, 2014 10:01:36 GMT 1
Blame Powell as much as you want, but once the players step out onto the pitch it is up to them to win the game.
having said that.......
What did I see on Saturday?
We were so slow. We had no urgency. We seemed (and to be honest this is a powell thing) content to let inferior opposition have the ball for long periods while not really attempting to get it back.
We played Holt isolated up front. No midfielder joining him. We might as well have played with 10 men.
I said the other day we should start with Wells and Vaughan. To play one striker up front on his own against a team that was there for the taking is just insulting. We lost that game in the pre-match team selection. They must have been pissin emselves laffing when they saw the team sheet.
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Post by Doc Halladay 32 on Dec 22, 2014 10:18:20 GMT 1
But when we started with this formation at home to Blackpool no one was complaining when we were 3-0 up after 16 mins.
I think Powell was hoping for that sort of reaction, it obviously didn't happen. I really think too much stock is put into the one up front v two up front positivity argument.
The Blackpool start was obviously our best of the season and there was not one post talking of negativity that day. But because the players didn't perform as well on saturday (all Powell's fault obviously) he's slated as being a negative manager.
I can point to several Wells threads about him being off form and needing to be dropped prior to the game so he is and because we LOSE it is now viewed as a bad decision
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Post by Deleted on Dec 22, 2014 10:43:37 GMT 1
But when we started with this formation at home to Blackpool no one was complaining when we were 3-0 up after 16 mins. I think Powell was hoping for that sort of reaction, it obviously didn't happen. I really think too much stock is put into the one up front v two up front positivity argument. The Blackpool start was obviously our best of the season and there was not one post talking of negativity that day. But because the players didn't perform as well on saturday (all Powell's fault obviously) he's slated as being a negative manager. I can point to several Wells threads about him being off form and needing to be dropped prior to the game so he is and because we LOSE it is now viewed as a bad decision i just think that if you look back (hindsight being a wonderful thing) we were crying out for a change after half time. Maybe we really should consider the possibility that we have a pretty dire squad? Powell must think so otherwise what was the point of playing for a point at home? |
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rocky
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Post by rocky on Dec 22, 2014 10:50:19 GMT 1
But when we started with this formation at home to Blackpool no one was complaining when we were 3-0 up after 16 mins. I think Powell was hoping for that sort of reaction, it obviously didn't happen. I really think too much stock is put into the one up front v two up front positivity argument. The Blackpool start was obviously our best of the season and there was not one post talking of negativity that day. But because the players didn't perform as well on saturday (all Powell's fault obviously) he's slated as being a negative manager. I can point to several Wells threads about him being off form and needing to be dropped prior to the game so he is and because we LOSE it is now viewed as a bad decision Couldn't agree more mate. It's just the standard crap that's trotted out after every bad performance, yet conveniently overlooked when we win with the same formation. It's also spouted by people with no concept of how the modern game works at this level. Very few teams play with 2 out & out strikers these days. Football has never been more tactical & more thought than 'let's just play lots of attackers & we'll win the game' has to go into it. |
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Post by Floyds on Dec 22, 2014 11:50:49 GMT 1
Who else plays one up front and has three central midfielders "sitting" and unable/unwilling to get anywhere near the one up front?
Hopeless tactics, given our propensity for conceding soft goals and our abysmal away form, we really needed to go for the three points against Birmingham.
Holt is about as mobile as a dustbin, in the second half he was played in, yet no one within 50 yards and obviously he doesn't have the pace or technique to beat a man, so he ended up throwing himself to the floor and claiming (unsuccessfully for a free kick.
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Post by terraceterrier on Dec 22, 2014 12:15:14 GMT 1
Looked like we were playing for 0-0, although the worst thing was the amount of time after we conceded to make a change. Fucking rubbish management of you want my opinion. Football is such a simple game yet we continually make a complete mess of it. Powell admitted he was playing for a draw in the post match.." it was a 0-0 game" blah blah......its like my brother said after the match "We get arseholed one week and the club need to win the fans back, but the the trouble is the manager (like his predecessors) shits himself and we go ultra defensive hence the drivel that was served up" |
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Post by wasp on Dec 22, 2014 14:00:54 GMT 1
When is Hoyle hoyle bottom boil gonna get it right?
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Post by patfield on Dec 22, 2014 22:47:35 GMT 1
My main gripe was we played not to lose. We were playing brum not Barcelona, setting out not to lose gives the opposition a positive mindset. We should have taken the bull by the horns and taken the game to them. A very winnable game we lost.
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Post by alwayswright on Dec 23, 2014 0:49:25 GMT 1
Once Wigan made it clear Holt was going back at the end of the agreed loan spell, his main objective at Town was to avoid injury at all costs.
With respect to his positional play, he has no chance of winning an aerial challenge against your average 6 foot plus central defender. He has therefore been encouraged to take the wider positions which will also account for much of Smithies' apparently eratic distribution
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Post by galpharm2400 on Dec 23, 2014 1:21:33 GMT 1
we were hoping he could hold it up for the wide midfielder to join him, it was clear that none of the 3 central midfielders were going to go that far up the pitch. In truth it wasn't even a proper workout for the back 4 as Birmingham produced very little and it was nothing much to do with our tactics. Birmingham even got cocky at the start of the second half and pushed on a bit, didn't produce anything but we did back off even more a give them the opportunity. The 'camera save' by their keeper towards the end at least made me smile a bit and we did do a countdown to vaughans booking, we started at ten, you could see it coming that far ahead..
rather than him kicking someone, should the ref not just book him when he comes on? no point ruining two players days..
gross stupidity isn't 'putting yourself about', its foolish and pretty pointless, unless you want x mas off.
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