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Post by detox on Dec 8, 2015 12:33:35 GMT 1
There will be many fans apart from those at Huddersfield and Reading who are not very chuffed about the 3rd round draw.
In fact half the Premier League clubs got drawn against each other and 58% of Championship clubs were drawn against each other. So there
is hardly any excitement there I wouldn't think. The draw includes 20 clubs from the lower reaches of football who go into the bag with 44 clubs from the top 2 divisions,hoping for a money spinning draw. When 24 out of the 44 top clubs get drawn against each other it kinda leaves the lower clubs with just a 50/50 chance of a plum tie rather than 2 in 1 chance.
So,why not sort the draw out so the top 32 clubs are in one bag, and lower 32 clubs are in another ?
20 Premier League clubs plus the top half of the Championship as at December 1st (or whatever)... It might add a bit of early season spice to the Championship too with clubs (maybe) vying for a seeded position (or not) for the cup draw ?
Surely this would at least ensure that we don't end up with what we have this season, 10 Premier and 14 Championship clubs playing what is effectively another league game, while the lower clubs miss out ...and we don't keep getting shite draws against Reading, Charlton et al ?
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Post by Gag_N_Bone_Man on Dec 8, 2015 12:36:30 GMT 1
Your proposal means that most years by round 4 there will be no lower or non league teams in the competition, which is part of its romance...
So not for me, ta
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Post by runner76 on Dec 8, 2015 12:36:51 GMT 1
keep it as it is, it's reet
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Post by Grandfather Berty of Cleck on Dec 8, 2015 12:39:29 GMT 1
Keep it as it is,
but have the draw at 12.30pm
and you are only allowed to listen to it on a small transistor radio,
surrounded by your mates,
and you must not know what number your team is.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 8, 2015 12:39:44 GMT 1
20 Premier League clubs plus the top half of the Championship as at December 1st (or whatever)......and we don't keep getting shite draws against Reading, Charlton et al ? That seeding would have INCREASED our likelihood of being drawn against Reading! |
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Post by detox on Dec 8, 2015 12:42:01 GMT 1
20 Premier League clubs plus the top half of the Championship as at December 1st (or whatever)......and we don't keep getting shite draws against Reading, Charlton et al ? That seeding would have INCREASED our likelihood of being drawn against Reading! ssssshhh - you're not supposed to notice that ! |
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Post by detox on Dec 8, 2015 12:52:28 GMT 1
It might be negligible though - seeding would mean 12/32 chance of getting a team in your own league,but not seeding meant 23/63 ?
You could correlate the coefficient of teams being drawn together at each stage of the draw too...and that would surely improve the odds..wouldn't it ?
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Post by galpharm2400 on Dec 8, 2015 12:52:51 GMT 1
fa cup.. its seeded till round 3..
from there on in its the 'luck' of the draw..
never change it..
its a draw, we were as likely to get man utd at home as reading???
thats the beauty of it..the only anomaly is 20 premier teams against 23 championship clubs..
the magic is in the possibilities for everyone in the draw..
simple, we have to beat reading at home to keep the possibilities alive..
I musy say I liked the idea that a load of balls in a bag that are dumped in a concave bowl where the blokes drawing them cant see in, needed a load of stirring, because 2 similar numbers were drawn together??
the numbered balls dont stick close to each other in numbered order you berks.. watch the national lottery, its a lottery!!!!!
still it was better than watching garth crooks sweating whilst just picking balls out of a jar..
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Post by stevvy on Dec 8, 2015 12:55:22 GMT 1
What about once you get to R3, it goes to a group stage with 16 groups of 4, with at least 1 team from the PL or Championship guaranteed to be in each group, then the top 2 go through to R4. Means someone like Eastleigh could be drawn in a group with Man City, Walsall and Northampton for example, so they'd make a decent amount of money from playing 3 games, though would mean at least one of those games being in midweek I guess which may not be ideal, but guarantees them a mix of tests and the chance to earn a bit of money even if they go out. Ok so we may end up with a group like Swansea, Burton and Yeovil which might be naff, but can't be much worse than knowing you'll only ever play Charlton or Reading............can it?
I admit it's probably a rubbish idea though.
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Post by detox on Dec 8, 2015 12:56:20 GMT 1
Didn't hartson draw out 43, 42 41, 45 or something ?
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Post by Deleted on Dec 8, 2015 13:00:18 GMT 1
Didn't hartson draw out 43, 42 41, 45 or something ? Which is just as likely as drawing out 1, 18, 52, 49 and has no significance. |
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Post by Walton-on-the-Hill Terrier on Dec 8, 2015 13:01:29 GMT 1
Don't agree with the OP. His suggestion effectively means seeded draws, which goes against tradition.
What is needed is for the balls to be given a real good shake before the draw is made. I blame John Hartson for the draw. He hardly shuffled the balls at all despite being told to do so, and early on he drew numbers 42, 43 and 44 out in succession (or something like that)! Probably no more of a coincidence than Town v Reading two years running, but there you go, that's my theory!
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Post by Torquayterrier on Dec 8, 2015 13:06:09 GMT 1
I miss the velvety bags personally.
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Post by detox on Dec 8, 2015 13:07:07 GMT 1
I don't recall the days in the lower divisions battling through 2 earlier rounds hoping for a plum 3rdround tie against Reading...but I'm just rambling now..and bow to popular opinion which is to leave it as it is..(not that I have any influence on these matters)
going shopping now.
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Post by detox on Dec 8, 2015 13:13:49 GMT 1
I miss the velvety bags personally. Nigella ? |
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Post by galpharm2400 on Dec 8, 2015 13:21:17 GMT 1
Didn't hartson draw out 43, 42 41, 45 or something ? remember one draw where 1 played 2 and 5 played 6??? its a lottery..after they are put in a bag and them emptied out owt can happen.. what if you shuffle them round for 5 minutes and end up pulling out numbers that are close to each other?? you are as liable to draw any number.. hartson didnt know what order they were as he dropped them into the container..he didnt know how they would bounce off each other as they hit the bottom or each other.. plus there is another bloke drawing balls... the presenter was a dick over reacting.. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 8, 2015 13:24:03 GMT 1
Your proposal means that most years by round 4 there will be no lower or non league teams in the competition, which is part of its romance... So not for me, ta unless they draw us |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 8, 2015 13:28:47 GMT 1
I don't recall the days in the lower divisions battling through 2 earlier rounds hoping for a plum 3rdround tie against Reading...but I'm just rambling now..and bow to popular opinion which is to leave it as it is..(not that I have any influence on these matters) going shopping now. I remember. Rochdale and Chester to get a plum tie against Sheff Utd. Or Lincoln and Rochdale to get spanked by mighty Millwall. Scunthorpe and Bradford for the right to face Gillingham (and a glamour 4th round defeat to Southend!). FA Cup don't like us. But that was all before. |
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Post by galpharm2400 on Dec 8, 2015 13:51:03 GMT 1
I don't recall the days in the lower divisions battling through 2 earlier rounds hoping for a plum 3rdround tie against Reading...but I'm just rambling now..and bow to popular opinion which is to leave it as it is..(not that I have any influence on these matters) going shopping now. I remember. Rochdale and Chester to get a plum tie against Sheff Utd. Or Lincoln and Rochdale to get spanked by mighty Millwall. Scunthorpe and Bradford for the right to face Gillingham (and a glamour 4th round defeat to Southend!). FA Cup don't like us. But that was all before. nt.. it likes us a bit, we are at home..I was ready to go to Hull as the draw unfolded.. |
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Post by AndySk on Dec 8, 2015 14:17:26 GMT 1
They should go back to having endless replays after draws, balls to too many games!
Main thing they need to do is take the Semi's away from Wembley and have them at neutral club grounds again. But that wont happen
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Post by detox on Dec 8, 2015 14:46:44 GMT 1
They should go back to having endless replays after draws, balls to too many games! Main thing they need to do is take the Semi's away from Wembley and have them at neutral club grounds again. But that wont happen Unless you get to the semi finals, in which case you'd be happy. Anyway, think the FA have signed a 50 year contract with Wembley Stadium to play semi's there, helps to pay off the costs of building it - |
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Post by galpharm2400 on Dec 8, 2015 14:57:40 GMT 1
They should go back to having endless replays after draws, balls to too many games! Main thing they need to do is take the Semi's away from Wembley and have them at neutral club grounds again. But that wont happen Unless you get to the semi finals, in which case you'd be happy. Anyway, think the FA have signed a 50 year contract with Wembley Stadium to play semi's there, helps to pay off the costs of building it - for london teams they might get 2 games at wembley without having to travel too far and get home etc after ludicrous kick off times..the rest of us can clearly eat shit and die.. its a great day out but it costs a fortune, try doing it twice in a short period of time.. once in the play offs would do.. they will be playing 3rd round all london ties at wembley soon to try and recoup some of the overspend.. |
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Post by Venezuelan Pete on Dec 8, 2015 15:11:15 GMT 1
Don't agree with the OP. His suggestion effectively means seeded draws, which goes against tradition. What is needed is for the balls to be given a real good shake before the draw is made. I blame John Hartson for the draw. He hardly shuffled the balls at all despite being told to do so, and early on he drew numbers 42, 43 and 44 out in succession (or something like that)! Probably no more of a coincidence than Town v Reading two years running, but there you go, that's my theory! DATM moan of the year 2015 winner. |
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Post by galpharm2400 on Dec 8, 2015 15:22:17 GMT 1
the balls are put in a bag..dropped about 18 inches into a concave bowl..do the balls stick together out of loyalty?? 2 different people from 2 different sides of the bowl then pull balls out??
a machine a few times a week randonly shuffles balls and still picks numbers in ascending /descending order... you are as likely for 2 people to pick out 1-64 in that order as anything else, it hasnt happened yet but if you did it enough it would..
whatever happens its still a random draw..
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Post by Jello Biafra on Dec 8, 2015 15:22:36 GMT 1
Unbelievable.
An absolute toilet of a thread and Nick has nowt to do with it.
Football in general would be a lot better if ALL cup draws were like the FA Cup (as they used to be before the greedy bastards took over the World) and there was no seeding at all. After all, that's the fucking idea of a cup draw - pot luck. The best team usually wins the League, the cup should be completely random and not favour anyone.
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Post by keithAM11532 on Dec 8, 2015 15:32:30 GMT 1
I recall years ago being very happy that the big boys got drawn against each other - so they are knocked out quickly. It improves your chances of going further. I remember back in the day, if Iain Dunne had run the ball to the corner flag we would have made it to the Quarter Finals. You don't get that sort of excitement with a one off against Manchester whomever I can tell you. (editors note - plus the gut wrenching sickness that floods your head with disbelief knowing you wont win the replay at their place.)
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Post by tockyterrier on Dec 8, 2015 15:40:03 GMT 1
Let's not forget that lower placed club could still make decent money by beating other lower placed clubs both because some off those clubs are well supported and because they get prize money for each round they reach
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Post by Essex Terrier on Dec 8, 2015 15:42:51 GMT 1
There will be many fans apart from those at Huddersfield and Reading who are not very chuffed about the 3rd round draw. In fact half the Premier League clubs got drawn against each other and 58% of Championship clubs were drawn against each other. So there is hardly any excitement there I wouldn't think. The draw includes 20 clubs from the lower reaches of football who go into the bag with 44 clubs from the top 2 divisions,hoping for a money spinning draw. When 24 out of the 44 top clubs get drawn against each other it kinda leaves the lower clubs with just a 50/50 chance of a plum tie rather than 2 in 1 chance. So,why not sort the draw out so the top 32 clubs are in one bag, and lower 32 clubs are in another ? 20 Premier League clubs plus the top half of the Championship as at December 1st (or whatever)... It might add a bit of early season spice to the Championship too with clubs (maybe) vying for a seeded position (or not) for the cup draw ? Surely this would at least ensure that we don't end up with what we have this season, 10 Premier and 14 Championship clubs playing what is effectively another league game, while the lower clubs miss out ...and we don't keep getting shite draws against Reading, Charlton et al ? No. |
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Tinpot
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Post by Tinpot on Dec 8, 2015 16:09:44 GMT 1
If the big clubs are drawn against each other, people whine because the smaller clubs aren't going to play against them. If the big clubs are drawn against the smaller clubs, people will whine because there's no interest from smaller clubs in the latter stages of the competition. Keep it random & you keep a level of interest. If you're going to fanny about with a cup competition, do it with the League Cup.
The only change I'd make to the FA Cup is to give the winners a place in the Champions League. Winning the world's greatest domestic cup competition should be worth more than finishing 4th in the league.
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Post by stevvy on Dec 8, 2015 16:16:57 GMT 1
Yeah but can you imagine if Reading had won it 2 years ago and gone into the CL, being honest they'd have struggled to pick up even one point, and it'd mean worse performance by English teams so more chance of us losing a CL place to Italy for example. The FA can't be having that can they?
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