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Post by Made In Yorkshire on Jan 13, 2018 20:04:22 GMT 1
I'm sorry but Tommy Smith is nowhere near good enough at this level. He was atrocious today and has been for slot of this season. We need a quality right back. Today was very poor and the insistence we have at playing the ball out from the back serves nothing other than to invite pressure onto ourselves and keeps us nowhere near the opposition goal. There's nothing wrong with playing the ball out from the back as long as it is done sensibly and the ball is worked forward through the team. Our problems today were passing out when it wasn't on, and continually going backwards and sideways in our own half. We didn't look forward enough. The tactic is OK, but the way we implement it is lacking. The tactic is not okay for the simple reason that the opposition knows that we do it and realise it's a weakness that can easily be capitalised on.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 13, 2018 20:05:09 GMT 1
i thought eden hazzard was another who was quality against us Have to admit the only home game I've missed was Chelsea, so yeah, I don't doubt we got hammered by them due to Hazard.
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Post by HuddsTerrier on Jan 13, 2018 20:06:08 GMT 1
our midfield was pretty pathetic. smith was hopeless. zanka was utter bab. the gap between depoitre and the midfield was huge again. all the players need a long hard look at themselves after that shite. No point singling smith out as there isn't a defender on our books who could have stopped the flick and finish for West Ham's second - class flick and quality strike, MA just too strong In the same vein on the fourth, MA made a complete mug of Schlindler receiving a simple ball to feet on the half way line - too good and too strong for him We got beat by two quality players in MA and Lanzini - they are on a different level to anything on our books
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Post by Ox Terrier on Jan 13, 2018 20:10:03 GMT 1
Passing - Woeful Ball retention - Woeful Giving the ball away in dangerous areas - Excellent Substitutions (timings) - terrible Honestly, why start Lolley? It's only to put him in the shop window, so he scored a goal, but fuck me! Pritchard should be starting, never mind putting him on the bench. Football is a simple game, he doesn't need to watch for 65 minutes, he's match fit for Gods sake. Start him. Why wait until 65 minutes to make a substitution?!?! 4-1 down! No point at this stage. Gifted 2 goals and looked terrible. It's going to be a long remainder of the season unless things change. Embarrassing today. Poor all-round. I don't blame those fans that left before the 80th minute at all. Actually our ball retention was ok.Yes we did give the ball away and it cost us two goals but your comments regarding Pritchard and lolley are out of order.but you are expressing a point of view but in what was a good game we were beaten by the better side but we played some good stuff ourselves.And your comment that you don't blame fans who left early I will leave that for others to judge. How are the comments out of order? Sure it's all subjective and opinion based, but I fail to see how it's out of order. I don't think Lolley should be in the starting 11 and I think that Pritchard should be straight in. I don't subscribe to the opinion that he needs to learn how we play by not playing. I could be wrong, but I don't think I'm being out of order.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 13, 2018 20:10:44 GMT 1
our midfield was pretty pathetic. smith was hopeless. zanka was utter bab. the gap between depoitre and the midfield was huge again. all the players need a long hard look at themselves after that shite. No point singling smith out as there isn't a defender on our books who could have stopped the flick and finish for West Ham's second - class flick and quality strike, MA just too strong In the same vein on the fourth, MA made a complete mug of Schlindler receiving a simple ball to feet on the half way line - too good and too strong for him We got beat by two quality players in MA and Lanzini - they are on a different level to anything on our books Exactly my point. Almost no one in the Prem makes a fool out of Schindler - that's how good Arnautovic was today. Lanzini should give him half his goalscoring bonus.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 13, 2018 20:13:46 GMT 1
When are we just going to select the best 11 players.... ffs lolley/smith/malone should have been nowhere near that team today with the players we have availiable. For me it has to be Lossl Hadajonaj Zanka Schinds Kongolo hogg mooy RVLP (although how he is playing in the prem is beyond me... he needs replacing next) Pritchard Ince Depoitre There is no question that, that is the best team we can put out... fucking pritchard on the bench??? . Smith starting... WTFF. Malone playing above league 1.... WTFFF. Wagner to blame today... got it all wrong and our tactics were shocking with aurnautavic and lanzini ripping us a new one. On to stoke. but thats as bad a performance as i have seen town give. EVER and ive seen some dark days. One shot on goal. FFFFFFS Williams is better than Hogg Better passer I'd swap them then agree on the rest
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Post by Deleted on Jan 13, 2018 20:15:40 GMT 1
Beat Swansea, Bournemouth & Watford at home alongwith one of Newcastle, West Brom or Stoke away and I reckon we’re safe. We’ll get anothe couple of points at least along the way.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 13, 2018 20:19:10 GMT 1
Beat Swansea, Bournemouth & Watford at home alongwith one of Newcastle, West Brom or Stoke away and I reckon we’re safe. We’ll get anothe couple of points at least along the way. And we've got £25m worth of talent more than what we started the game with today. DW has acquired the tools required to kick on a bit from what we've been watching.
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Post by Captainslapper on Jan 13, 2018 20:20:19 GMT 1
Passing - Woeful Ball retention - Woeful Giving the ball away in dangerous areas - Excellent Substitutions (timings) - terrible Honestly, why start Lolley? It's only to put him in the shop window, so he scored a goal, but fuck me! Pritchard should be starting, never mind putting him on the bench. Football is a simple game, he doesn't need to watch for 65 minutes, he's match fit for Gods sake. Start him. Why wait until 65 minutes to make a substitution?!?! 4-1 down! No point at this stage. Gifted 2 goals and looked terrible. It's going to be a long remainder of the season unless things change. Embarrassing today. Poor all-round. I don't blame those fans that left before the 80th minute at all. Ball retention in the first half was the best we've witnessed in weeks, are you blind? He started Lolley because Pritchard only joined yesterday, Sabiri doesn't look ready for this level, and we have nobody else. Pritchard looked interesting..looked to get involved but I think hes going to find the physical step a big struggle. Kongolo looked like he'd never seen a football before. Hopefully that was related to coming on late into a lost game...definitely wouldn't expect him to dislodge Zanka or Schindler any time soon. Eh? I thought he did very well. Used the ball really well with some neat passes down the line and didnt give it away once or mis-control it once. I have no idea what you were watching to make a comment like that. Him and Pritchard were the 2 positives on the day. We can just about cope with a couple of players off their game, but when we have literally 8 or 9 well below par, we'll get a spanking. And that was the problem today. The keeper had a shocker, Smith had a shocker, Zanka, Schindler and malone were all poor. Hogg had a shocker, Ince mooy and VLP were lousy. Depoitre did well but with not a lot of service and lolley was lousy until he scored then did well but got taken off. All in all a shit performance against a side that wasn't that great, Anautovic (sp) appart. He was great and our CBs couldn't cope with him at all.
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Post by ldotm on Jan 13, 2018 20:20:55 GMT 1
i thought eden hazzard was another who was quality against us Actually thought Willian was more impressive in that game. Overall, obviously Hazard the better player though.
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Post by townrwe on Jan 13, 2018 20:29:55 GMT 1
Ball retention in the first half was the best we've witnessed in weeks, are you blind? He started Lolley because Pritchard only joined yesterday, Sabiri doesn't look ready for this level, and we have nobody else. Pritchard looked interesting..looked to get involved but I think hes going to find the physical step a big struggle. Kongolo looked like he'd never seen a football before. Hopefully that was related to coming on late into a lost game...definitely wouldn't expect him to dislodge Zanka or Schindler any time soon. Eh? I thought he did very well. Used the ball really well with some neat passes down the line and didnt give it away once or mis-control it once. I have no idea what you were watching to make a comment like that. Him and Pritchard were the 2 positives on the day. We can just about cope with a couple of players off their game, but when we have literally 8 or 9 well below par, we'll get a spanking. And that was the problem today. The keeper had a shocker, Smith had a shocker, Zanka, Schindler and malone were all poor. Hogg had a shocker, Ince mooy and VLP were lousy. Depoitre did well but with not a lot of service and lolley was lousy until he scored then did well but got taken off. All in all a shit performance against a side that wasn't that great, Anautovic (sp) appart. He was great and our CBs couldn't cope with him at all. I thought Kongolo should have been given the man of the match.... ooozed class for the last 20 minutes.
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Post by shedds on Jan 13, 2018 20:31:53 GMT 1
i thought eden hazzard was another who was quality against us Actually thought Willian was more impressive in that game. Overall, obviously Hazard the better player though. thinking about it youre right about willian he was probably more impressive overall ,between the 2 of them they ran the show that night
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Post by thebluebrigadier on Jan 13, 2018 20:32:24 GMT 1
I don’t know if it’s been mentioned elsewhere but fur those of us brave or foolish enough there is a full 90 minute re-run on Sky’s Nissan game of the day at 8:30.
Maybe we can see where we went wrong.
😏
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Post by Deleted on Jan 13, 2018 20:34:21 GMT 1
Really?
His control looked very messy to me. Played like a defender from a league where when the defenders get the ball the other team back off and leave them to it.
Looks like he needs a few more weeks before he'll oust Lowe and Malone...but I do like that we've finally got a left sided full back who isn't a midget.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 13, 2018 20:35:04 GMT 1
I’ve channeled Malcom Tucker to review today’s fucking OMNISHAMBLES. Beware, there’s s lot of profane language and violent sexual imagery... bit.ly/2AVDjU1Pretty much on the money there except the bit about Depoitre who suffers from a chronic lack of service. Yep, he was starved of any meaningful service today. Although when he did get the ball to feet (which was rare) it just bounced straight off him
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Post by raggytash on Jan 13, 2018 20:35:14 GMT 1
One positive from today. We can't possibly play as poorly against Stoke next Saturday. Knew I'd find one if I searched long enough. ;-) Don’t bank on it!
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Post by Deleted on Jan 13, 2018 20:37:07 GMT 1
I don't think today was half as bad as some are making out. Sometimes, there are days when you have to take it on the chin. They had a bit more quality than us and they look a good, fit, well-drilled, and well coached side. I though their front two and Noble were very good and I thought that Obiang was exceptional in the second half. I cannot see them going down. We had a few out-of-sorts performances but I think they have been covered extensively in this and other threads so there is no need for me to go over old ground. Pritchard looks very promising and he brought Depoitre into the game. He has a lovely first touch, he is very neat and tidy and he looks to get us on the front foot; he will be a key asset in the run-in. I thought the goal immediately after half time killed us. We switched off and forgot the basics and, just like against Man City, we paid a very heavy price. We looked shell-shocked after that and West Ham sensed it and capitalised. Small margins and all that! Next week is another big game and if we perform and take a point or all three, we will be able to put this doom and gloom behind us. The business end of the season is upon us, let's look forward positively. Cheers, UTT.
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Post by nuro on Jan 13, 2018 20:37:37 GMT 1
Was very alarming today as to how we just gave goals away. Can't get away from that imo.
However I will say that West Ham have real experienced quality in their side. If it wasn't for a terrible manager they would be the best of the rest imo.
They were very very well organised and just cancelled us out. First half was drab but you could see a few times that it was only a matter of time as they just lacked that final bit of quality.
Bad day at the office but I think this further shows the gulf in class and just how well we are doing so far.
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Post by dm on Jan 13, 2018 20:41:19 GMT 1
Man City play out from the back. Town play out from the back. The difference is that their multi million pound players are quick of thought and quick of execution. We dawdle with the ball, allowing the opposition to get set up and start pressuring our players, which leads to mistakes and ultimately conceded goals.
I'm the complete opposite of a 'gerrit forrad, kick it long' type of football fan, but sometimes it's better than just giving the opposition chance to hurt us. It could even occasionally lead to a Town goal
Don't just play yourself into trouble because it is brave to try and play out from the back. Common sense occasionally required.
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Post by ACW on Jan 13, 2018 20:48:30 GMT 1
There's nothing wrong with playing the ball out from the back as long as it is done sensibly and the ball is worked forward through the team. Our problems today were passing out when it wasn't on, and continually going backwards and sideways in our own half. We didn't look forward enough. The tactic is OK, but the way we implement it is lacking. The tactic is not okay for the simple reason that the opposition knows that we do it and realise it's a weakness that can easily be capitalised on. So you suggest that the goalie kicks the ball long every time? That would give possession away and cause other problems. And whether you or I think it's right or not, it won't change. Wagner believes in playing out from the back. And in general I agree with him. No need throw the baby out with the bath water. We just need to realise that there are times when we need to clear the ball.
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Post by The Roaring Twenties on Jan 13, 2018 20:51:48 GMT 1
Passing - Woeful Ball retention - Woeful Giving the ball away in dangerous areas - Excellent Substitutions (timings) - terrible Honestly, why start Lolley? It's only to put him in the shop window, so he scored a goal, but fuck me! Pritchard should be starting, never mind putting him on the bench. Football is a simple game, he doesn't need to watch for 65 minutes, he's match fit for Gods sake. Start him. Why wait until 65 minutes to make a substitution?!?! 4-1 down! No point at this stage. Gifted 2 goals and looked terrible. It's going to be a long remainder of the season unless things change. Embarrassing today. Poor all-round. I don't blame those fans that left before the 80th minute at all. Ball retention in the first half was the best we've witnessed in weeks, are you blind? He started Lolley because Pritchard only joined yesterday, Sabiri doesn't look ready for this level, and we have nobody else. Pritchard looked interesting..looked to get involved but I think hes going to find the physical step a big struggle. Kongolo looked like he'd never seen a football before. Hopefully that was related to coming on late into a lost game...definitely wouldn't expect him to dislodge Zanka or Schindler any time soon. Bizarre comment re Kongolo, looked very assured to me. Definitely be in at left back for Stoke if it were up to me.
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Post by davethesprout on Jan 13, 2018 20:53:50 GMT 1
Stupid To Bring Two Players on when 4-1 Down ! Did not See the Point Myself !
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Post by Deleted on Jan 13, 2018 20:53:59 GMT 1
Artaunovic second only to Kane in quality players we've seen at JSS this season. Yet no standing ovation.
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Post by ACW on Jan 13, 2018 20:58:01 GMT 1
Ball retention in the first half was the best we've witnessed in weeks, are you blind? He started Lolley because Pritchard only joined yesterday, Sabiri doesn't look ready for this level, and we have nobody else. Pritchard looked interesting..looked to get involved but I think hes going to find the physical step a big struggle. Kongolo looked like he'd never seen a football before. Hopefully that was related to coming on late into a lost game...definitely wouldn't expect him to dislodge Zanka or Schindler any time soon. Eh? I thought he did very well. Used the ball really well with some neat passes down the line and didnt give it away once or mis-control it once. I have no idea what you were watching to make a comment like that. Him and Pritchard were the 2 positives on the day. We can just about cope with a couple of players off their game, but when we have literally 8 or 9 well below par, we'll get a spanking. And that was the problem today. The keeper had a shocker, Smith had a shocker, Zanka, Schindler and malone were all poor. Hogg had a shocker, Ince mooy and VLP were lousy. Depoitre did well but with not a lot of service and lolley was lousy until he scored then did well but got taken off. All in all a shit performance against a side that wasn't that great, Anautovic (sp) appart. He was great and our CBs couldn't cope with him at all. Harsh on West Ham. They had alot of good players today. Lanzini was great up front and Noble was good in midfield. Better player than I thought. Colins was also very solid at the back. We were poor, but West Ham were good. Strong, quick and very skillful at times.
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Post by galpharm2400 on Jan 13, 2018 20:58:17 GMT 1
Couple of things which I noticed; • mooy would pass then move next to the person he had passed to, cutting down their options and space. • mooy Would ignore Pritchard in space then carry the ball near to him (congesting the area) then play it to him. • Pritchards set pieces were ten times better than others we have had • Malone was running into the box at every opportunity leaving us vulnerable at the back • there seems to be a belief that we can only turn into an attack if we are camped on the edge of their area, rather than look to cut through them. you missed out that we never really have a man moving forward in front of the ball in their half.. the ball has to go back or sidewards, the opposition are never having to cover a runner.. we play in front of so many teams its getting harder to watch week by week.. we passed it 3 times today instead of shooting, yes the pass was on but so was the shot, passing it means more time lost and there needs to then be another pass/cross or the next man from a worse angle has a shot??? malone and VLP shirked a number of challenges today, for that alone they would not get a shirt from me.. VLP then proceeded to niggly foul at least 3 times after we were 1-4 down, clearly he is a bit of a twat..
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Post by Captainslapper on Jan 13, 2018 21:02:58 GMT 1
Eh? I thought he did very well. Used the ball really well with some neat passes down the line and didnt give it away once or mis-control it once. I have no idea what you were watching to make a comment like that. Him and Pritchard were the 2 positives on the day. We can just about cope with a couple of players off their game, but when we have literally 8 or 9 well below par, we'll get a spanking. And that was the problem today. The keeper had a shocker, Smith had a shocker, Zanka, Schindler and malone were all poor. Hogg had a shocker, Ince mooy and VLP were lousy. Depoitre did well but with not a lot of service and lolley was lousy until he scored then did well but got taken off. All in all a shit performance against a side that wasn't that great, Anautovic (sp) appart. He was great and our CBs couldn't cope with him at all. Harsh on West Ham. They had alot of good players today. Lanzini was great up front and Noble was good in midfield. Better player than I thought. Colins was also very solid at the back. We were poor, but West Ham were good. Strong, quick and very skillful at times. Might be a bit harsh on them. Just thought they werent anything special barring one or two stand out players and came up against a very poor Town on the day. Think if wed been anywhere near our best we'd have beaten them.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 13, 2018 21:03:38 GMT 1
our midfield was pretty pathetic. smith was hopeless. zanka was utter bab. the gap between depoitre and the midfield was huge again. all the players need a long hard look at themselves after that shite. No point singling smith out as there isn't a defender on our books who could have stopped the flick and finish for West Ham's second - class flick and quality strike, MA just too strong In the same vein on the fourth, MA made a complete mug of Schlindler receiving a simple ball to feet on the half way line - too good and too strong for him We got beat by two quality players in MA and Lanzini - they are on a different level to anything on our books I'd like to see the 2nd goal again because that looked like lousy weak as anything defending from Smith when happening live
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Post by ACW on Jan 13, 2018 21:06:52 GMT 1
Harsh on West Ham. They had alot of good players today. Lanzini was great up front and Noble was good in midfield. Better player than I thought. Colins was also very solid at the back. We were poor, but West Ham were good. Strong, quick and very skillful at times. Might be a bit harsh on them. Just thought they werent anything special barring one or two stand out players and came up against a very poor Town on the day. Think if wed been anywhere near our best we'd have beaten them. If we'd matched d their physicality and workmate we might have had a chance, but they were much quicker in thought and deed today. Not unbeatable, but we'd have needed to be near our best to get a result against them today. They played a totally different style to the one that beat us at their place, but again we couldn't live with their speed and physicality. Disappointing.
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Post by shawsie on Jan 13, 2018 21:07:21 GMT 1
No point singling smith out as there isn't a defender on our books who could have stopped the flick and finish for West Ham's second - class flick and quality strike, MA just too strong In the same vein on the fourth, MA made a complete mug of Schlindler receiving a simple ball to feet on the half way line - too good and too strong for him We got beat by two quality players in MA and Lanzini - they are on a different level to anything on our books I'd like to see the 2nd goal again because that looked like lousy weak as anything defending from Smith when happening live It was!
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Post by HuddsTerrier on Jan 13, 2018 21:09:43 GMT 1
No point singling smith out as there isn't a defender on our books who could have stopped the flick and finish for West Ham's second - class flick and quality strike, MA just too strong In the same vein on the fourth, MA made a complete mug of Schlindler receiving a simple ball to feet on the half way line - too good and too strong for him We got beat by two quality players in MA and Lanzini - they are on a different level to anything on our books I'd like to see the 2nd goal again because that looked like lousy weak as anything defending from Smith when happening live Saw the replay on the big screen in the ground Zanka loses the initial flick on Then MA lifts it on his right, across his body on to his left and smashes it MA is 6ft 4 and both Zanka and Schindler couldn't handle his strength - nor did Smith on the goal Two good feet, strong and Smith off balance from the right boot to left foot flick It's not a easy goal to stop IMO
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