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Post by bluesandtwos on Apr 25, 2019 17:19:18 GMT 1
Pretty much as soon as we got promoted we got posts saying this or that player is not good enough for the Premier League. I find it presumptuous and disrespectful to judge the level any player is capable of playing at but also I do not think those assessments can be made in isolation. They all have good and bad days and it is a lot harder to play to your best in a demoralised team. The failures this season have been from the boardroom down but the players are the ones in the spotlight and individuals regularly get picked out for much wider failings. There are plenty of players in the Premier League no better than our squad but they are in better teams. Either better overall quality or just better balanced or organised. Lets ease off on the criticisms and see how we set up next season when hopefully we will see the best from them all. I'm sure they will all be good enough for the Championship.  |
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Post by terracesider on Apr 25, 2019 17:23:22 GMT 1
Pretty much as soon as we got promoted we got posts saying this or that player is not good enough for the Premier League. I find it presumptuous and disrespectful to judge the level any player is capable of playing at but also I do not think those assessments can be made in isolation. They all have good and bad days and it is a lot harder to play to your best in a demoralised team. The failures this season have been from the boardroom down but the players are the ones in the spotlight and individuals regularly get picked out for much wider failings. There are plenty of players in the Premier League no better than our squad but they are in better teams. Either better overall quality or just better balanced or organised. Lets ease off on the criticisms and see how we set up next season when hopefully we will see the best from them all. I'm sure they will all be good enough for the Championship. In respect to that point -- Can you (or anyone else) tell me which of our players over the two seasons would get into a Premier League team placed above say 15th in the table? |
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Post by bluesandtwos on Apr 25, 2019 17:27:07 GMT 1
Pretty much as soon as we got promoted we got posts saying this or that player is not good enough for the Premier League. I find it presumptuous and disrespectful to judge the level any player is capable of playing at but also I do not think those assessments can be made in isolation. They all have good and bad days and it is a lot harder to play to your best in a demoralised team. The failures this season have been from the boardroom down but the players are the ones in the spotlight and individuals regularly get picked out for much wider failings. There are plenty of players in the Premier League no better than our squad but they are in better teams. Either better overall quality or just better balanced or organised. Lets ease off on the criticisms and see how we set up next season when hopefully we will see the best from them all. I'm sure they will all be good enough for the Championship. In respect to that point -- Can you (or anyone else) tell me which of our players over the two seasons would get into a Premier League team placed above say 15th in the table? I know it sounds like a cop out but without seeing them have a go in those teams I really couldn't guess. I know it was a one off but Scott Arfield was a case in point. |
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digs
Andy Booth Terrier
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Post by digs on Apr 25, 2019 17:28:44 GMT 1
Why do they play so shit then? basic things like cant pass,control the ball ect
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Post by sapphireblue on Apr 25, 2019 17:32:11 GMT 1
When topics such as thus come up I am reminded of when Barnsley got promoted to the Prem.
At the civic "do" to celebrate promotion, Danny Wilson was asked by a halfwit from Radio Sheffield
a fair question but at the wrong time.
"How many of your players are good enough to play in the Premier league?"
His answer :-
"All of them, but not all in the same team"
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Post by bluesandtwos on Apr 25, 2019 18:00:56 GMT 1
Why do they play so shit then? basic things like cant pass,control the ball ect I think confidence is shot to hell for a start. Confident players just don't seem to struggle with the basics. Grant when he arrived had come off a good run, albeit two divisions down, and you could, and still can, see the confidence in the things he does. |
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digs
Andy Booth Terrier
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Post by digs on Apr 25, 2019 18:13:56 GMT 1
So was Wagner good enough for the Premier league? if so was it the players that weren't good enough,or are the players good enough and Wagner wasn't,or both?
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Post by Sugy , Paignton Devon Terrier on Apr 25, 2019 18:30:43 GMT 1
Surely someone saw something in the failed players that made them believe that they could make it at the highest level of British football
Surely that person has long departed the club , and its here that lessons need to be learnt when it comes down to investing the remaing /incoming funds which are vital to the clubs future.
There are bargains out there ,but these players must gell together if they are to be made into a team that can compete at the highest level of the league they find themselves in
This must also include players that can provide strength and depth in the squad to cover for suspensions ,injuries and players showing poor form
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Post by terracesider on Apr 25, 2019 20:56:36 GMT 1
So was Wagner good enough for the Premier league? if so was it the players that weren't good enough,or are the players good enough and Wagner wasn't,or both? David Wagner IMO had two major attributes: 1) The ability/knowledge to squeeze the last drop of juice out of some very decent players - by blending them into a reasonable (and hard to beat) top end second division TEAM. 2) An outrageous slice of Napoleon's basic requirement of his generals ---- LUCK To answer my own question further up the thread: IMO Terence Kongolo is probably the only player that would interest one of the top 15 clubs in this league. No doubt he'll be gone before July... As ever though I am optimistic - after beating Liverpool, Man U and Soton - we'll bring in three-four players to complement Arron Mooy (staying I hope) and have a good cut at division 2 next season UTT |
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Post by Mr Breitside on Apr 25, 2019 22:02:46 GMT 1
Pretty much as soon as we got promoted we got posts saying this or that player is not good enough for the Premier League. I find it presumptuous and disrespectful to judge the level any player is capable of playing at but also I do not think those assessments can be made in isolation. They all have good and bad days and it is a lot harder to play to your best in a demoralised team. The failures this season have been from the boardroom down but the players are the ones in the spotlight and individuals regularly get picked out for much wider failings. There are plenty of players in the Premier League no better than our squad but they are in better teams. Either better overall quality or just better balanced or organised. Lets ease off on the criticisms and see how we set up next season when hopefully we will see the best from them all. I'm sure they will all be good enough for the Championship. In respect to that point -- Can you (or anyone else) tell me which of our players over the two seasons would get into a Premier League team placed above say 15th in the table? We might find out next season if some of our players join premier league clubs. There are 20 teams in the league so I guess the original poster meant any premier league club not top 15. The bottom 3 tend to have players good enough for the premier league as they were good enough to get theIr club promoted... unfortunately they are only good enough for the bottom part of the league. |
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Post by otium (EPBS) on Apr 25, 2019 22:15:02 GMT 1
Pretty much as soon as we got promoted we got posts saying this or that player is not good enough for the Premier League. I find it presumptuous and disrespectful to judge the level any player is capable of playing at but also I do not think those assessments can be made in isolation. They all have good and bad days and it is a lot harder to play to your best in a demoralised team. The failures this season have been from the boardroom down but the players are the ones in the spotlight and individuals regularly get picked out for much wider failings. There are plenty of players in the Premier League no better than our squad but they are in better teams. Either better overall quality or just better balanced or organised. Lets ease off on the criticisms and see how we set up next season when hopefully we will see the best from them all. I'm sure they will all be good enough for the Championship. In respect to that point -- Can you (or anyone else) tell me which of our players over the two seasons would get into a Premier League team placed above say 15th in the table? Or, after playing there and against them for two years, is wanted by another Prem club? Not good enough is the simple truth. Mooy would do OK in a decent team...the rest have questions marks a-plenty. |
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Post by canuckterrier99 on Apr 26, 2019 9:42:03 GMT 1
Any one of our players could be in Man City's team and they'd still be challenging for the title.
Granted that says more about how good City's players are.
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Post by Torquayterrier on Apr 26, 2019 10:14:32 GMT 1
Any one of our players could be in Man City's team and they'd still be challenging for the title. Granted that says more about how good City's players are. Hamer? |
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Post by hartyhtfc on Apr 26, 2019 11:33:33 GMT 1
Pretty much as soon as we got promoted we got posts saying this or that player is not good enough for the Premier League. I find it presumptuous and disrespectful to judge the level any player is capable of playing at but also I do not think those assessments can be made in isolation. They all have good and bad days and it is a lot harder to play to your best in a demoralised team. The failures this season have been from the boardroom down but the players are the ones in the spotlight and individuals regularly get picked out for much wider failings. There are plenty of players in the Premier League no better than our squad but they are in better teams. Either better overall quality or just better balanced or organised. Lets ease off on the criticisms and see how we set up next season when hopefully we will see the best from them all. I'm sure they will all be good enough for the Championship. I agree in general - there's been plenty of players who have left us at every level, with our fans convinced they would fade into the lower league, who have gone onto great things. It happens. Think what others have alluded to is that whilst the players we have are not 'superstar' level, with the ability to create chances and score goals on their own, we have also completely failed to build a squad that can do this as a collective instead. It simply doesn't work |
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Post by canuckterrier99 on Apr 26, 2019 12:26:50 GMT 1
Any one of our players could be in Man City's team and they'd still be challenging for the title. Granted that says more about how good City's players are. Hamer? Fair point! |
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Post by villageidiot on Apr 26, 2019 14:01:37 GMT 1
Pretty much as soon as we got promoted we got posts saying this or that player is not good enough for the Premier League. I find it presumptuous and disrespectful to judge the level any player is capable of playing at but also I do not think those assessments can be made in isolation. They all have good and bad days and it is a lot harder to play to your best in a demoralised team. The failures this season have been from the boardroom down but the players are the ones in the spotlight and individuals regularly get picked out for much wider failings. There are plenty of players in the Premier League no better than our squad but they are in better teams. Either better overall quality or just better balanced or organised. Lets ease off on the criticisms and see how we set up next season when hopefully we will see the best from them all. I'm sure they will all be good enough for the Championship. proof or otherwise will be whether there is a feeding frenzy to snap up our players by the other teams and retain them as premier league players . they will be relatively cheap .. but not sure there will be many takers. Depends who gets promoted.. could see Norwich/Sheef Utd chasing Schindler/Mooy. hopefully Derby get promoted and we can offload all our dross at top dollar prices |
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Post by bluesandtwos on Apr 26, 2019 14:08:20 GMT 1
Pretty much as soon as we got promoted we got posts saying this or that player is not good enough for the Premier League. I find it presumptuous and disrespectful to judge the level any player is capable of playing at but also I do not think those assessments can be made in isolation. They all have good and bad days and it is a lot harder to play to your best in a demoralised team. The failures this season have been from the boardroom down but the players are the ones in the spotlight and individuals regularly get picked out for much wider failings. There are plenty of players in the Premier League no better than our squad but they are in better teams. Either better overall quality or just better balanced or organised. Lets ease off on the criticisms and see how we set up next season when hopefully we will see the best from them all. I'm sure they will all be good enough for the Championship. I agree in general - there's been plenty of players who have left us at every level, with our fans convinced they would fade into the lower league, who have gone onto great things. It happens. Think what others have alluded to is that whilst the players we have are not 'superstar' level, with the ability to create chances and score goals on their own, we have also completely failed to build a squad that can do this as a collective instead. It simply doesn't work You are right, IMO, about the squads lack of achievement as a collective. My post was to do with the individuals who posters have said are not good enough for the division. These were about Joe Lolley: "I reckon he could eventually play mid-table League 1. No higher than that." "Can't understand what a championship club have seen in him that we havnt.... He's lg 1 at best" "Never rated him and he had more than enough chances to shine, a league one player in my opinion" "not good enough for championship - Maybe lg 2" Joe's stats at Forest this season: Matches 44 Goals 10 Assists 11 Collectively, as a club, not good enough but there is no way to be able to predict what individuals on a bad run in a poor team are ultimately capable of. |
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