midlander
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Post by midlander on May 30, 2019 11:33:57 GMT 1
Comparative data based on time on pitch for each of our strikers last season. Mounie obviously shows up very well aerially, but also has more touches, passes, shots and is dispossessed less than the other two. Clearly Grant is more likely to find the net, but both are similar in the amount of big chances they miss. If, and it's an IF, we can get Mounie's mind and confidence healthy, we shouldn't be writing him off at all.
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Post by turbo2 on May 30, 2019 11:38:37 GMT 1
Get the stats for ground covered. That’ll tell you everything you need to know about mounie
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midlander
David Wagner Terrier
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Post by midlander on May 30, 2019 11:44:12 GMT 1
Get the stats for ground covered. That’ll tell you everything you need to know about mounie Tried mate - but they aren't available anywhere publicly. However, whilst these stats only show you a basic comparison - they do show that Mounie is more involved on the pitch in touches and passes than Grant -also that Grant is almost as likely to miss a big chance as Mounie is. Clearly Grant hit the ground running with us, buoyed by a confidence-boosting 5 months at Charlton where he was scoring for fun. Mounie's confidence clearly absolutely at rock bottom. Also, feel that he had bulked his upper body up a bit too much from last season which reduced his sprinting. He gets labelled with the lazy tag far too easily by some - he clearly is one of the players that gives a damn about the club and its community and the fact that, even when playing poorly like most of last season, he still dominates in the air more than the vast majority of PL strikers. A confident Mounie is still a big asset to us. |
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Post by turbo2 on May 30, 2019 11:52:52 GMT 1
I’m not having this down on confidence stuff
He walked onto the pitch and Southampton. Literally walked on.
Put some fucking effort in and he might get some reward
Stroll around and he defo won’t
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Post by Torquayterrier on May 30, 2019 12:01:37 GMT 1
I'm not overly convinced about the aerial stuff either. He isn't scoring with headers and I don't recall much of him laying it on to someone else with a header for them to score either so where's the ball going? to one of ours to retain posession? to an opposition player? out of play?
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Post by terriersyndrome on May 30, 2019 12:20:29 GMT 1
Get the stats for ground covered. That’ll tell you everything you need to know about mounie Mounie averaged 6.61km per match. Grant averaged 7.99km per match. |
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Post by royrace on May 30, 2019 12:22:28 GMT 1
I'm not sure comparing big chances missed is valid when one has converted way more than the other. I think those stats just confirm Grant was the much more effective striker. I haven't written Mounie off yet but I've no idea how the 2 strikers will fit into Jan's 'style' which nobody has seen yet unless I'm mistaken.
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Post by Doc Halladay 32 on May 30, 2019 12:37:07 GMT 1
Without Mounie's contribution in our first PL season I am sure we would have been relegated that season.
For all the justifiable complaints about Mounie and Depoitre last year, their chance conversion rate in their first season was more than decent and IMO there wasn't any foretelling signs of the dreadful seasons they just had.
I fully expect Mounie will return to his usual scoring ways this season, be it with us or somebody else.
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Post by Doc Halladay 32 on May 30, 2019 13:00:20 GMT 1
Get the stats for ground covered. That’ll tell you everything you need to know about mounie Mounie averaged 6.61km per match. Grant averaged 7.99km per match. Do you have a link for these stats as the OP said he couldn't find them. |
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Post by terriersyndrome on May 30, 2019 13:04:14 GMT 1
Mounie averaged 6.61km per match. Grant averaged 7.99km per match. Do you have a link for these stats as the OP said he couldn't find them. I have no clue how to link from my phone but you'll find it at www.premierleague.com/statsClick on the dashboard & click player comparison & you'll find distance covered there under matches. |
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Post by Doc Halladay 32 on May 30, 2019 13:34:10 GMT 1
Do you have a link for these stats as the OP said he couldn't find them. I have no clue how to link from my phone but you'll find it at www.premierleague.com/statsClick on the dashboard & click player comparison & you'll find distance covered there under matches. I thought they were on the low side, they used the total distance covered divided by games played (or appearances) NOT for every 90 minutes played. For clarification.... Mounie covered 204.79km in 1776 minutes for an average distance of 10.38km per 90 mins Grant covered 103.89km in 874 minutes for an average distance of 10.70km per 90 mins The difference is minimal (3.1% more for Grant) so it kind of debunks the widely held opinion/myth than Mounie is a lazy barsteward and Grant is a willing runner. For reference and balance..... Chris Lowe who according to his thread is held as a consumate professional covered less than both at 10.07km per 90 mins Fellow striker Depoitre covered more distance than both at 11.31km per 90 mins |
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Post by Deleted on May 30, 2019 13:40:12 GMT 1
I’m not having this down on confidence stuff He walked onto the pitch and Southampton. Literally walked on. Put some fucking effort in and he might get some reward Stroll around and he defo won’t I've got the full 90 min. saints game, actual effort he put in whilst on the pitch wasn't lacking. |
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Post by Torquayterrier on May 30, 2019 13:45:57 GMT 1
I fully expect Mounie will return to his usual scoring ways this season, be it with us or somebody else. I think his working relationship with Sievert will be critical in this. |
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Post by turbo2 on May 30, 2019 16:11:34 GMT 1
I’m not having this down on confidence stuff He walked onto the pitch and Southampton. Literally walked on. Put some fucking effort in and he might get some reward Stroll around and he defo won’t I've got the full 90 min. saints game, actual effort he put in whilst on the pitch wasn't lacking. I was there and believe me it was lacking He came on in the 86th minute and I’m not sure he even touched the ball. |
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Post by Deleted on May 30, 2019 17:57:41 GMT 1
I've got the full 90 min. saints game, actual effort he put in whilst on the pitch wasn't lacking. I was there and believe me it was lacking He came on in the 86th minute and I’m not sure he even touched the ball. Not for the want of trying. He was heavily involved in a passing move involving Kongolo, Mooy and Daly. His final pass to Daly unfortunately cut out. He was making himself available in and around the box so I don't know what you were watching. |
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Post by ACW on May 30, 2019 18:16:51 GMT 1
I'm not overly convinced about the aerial stuff either. He isn't scoring with headers and I don't recall much of him laying it on to someone else with a header for them to score either so where's the ball going? to one of ours to retain posession? to an opposition player? out of play? I suspect very strongly that his stats for winning headers are far, far better than his stats for retaining possession from them. It could be argued that we don't support him enough - which is probably fair - but although he wins the majority of his aerial duels, he doesn't direct his headers in a way Boothy used to do. |
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Post by joeyjoneslocker on May 30, 2019 18:30:13 GMT 1
I'm not overly convinced about the aerial stuff either. He isn't scoring with headers and I don't recall much of him laying it on to someone else with a header for them to score either so where's the ball going? to one of ours to retain posession? to an opposition player? out of play? I suspect very strongly that his stats for winning headers are far, far better than his stats for retaining possession from them. It could be argued that we don't support him enough - which is probably fair - but although he wins the majority of his aerial duels, he doesn't direct his headers in a way Boothy used to do. Boothy’s went straight in the onion bag. |
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Post by ACW on May 30, 2019 18:41:56 GMT 1
I suspect very strongly that his stats for winning headers are far, far better than his stats for retaining possession from them. It could be argued that we don't support him enough - which is probably fair - but although he wins the majority of his aerial duels, he doesn't direct his headers in a way Boothy used to do. Boothy’s went straight in the onion bag. They did, but he could also bring others into play with his headers, particularly when he came back after playing in the Premier League. His goal scoring record was not as good second time around, but his general hold up play, and ability to bring others into the game was markedly better - with both head and feet. Shame his knees were knackered! |
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Post by CaptainHart on May 31, 2019 10:43:04 GMT 1
I'm not overly convinced about the aerial stuff either. He isn't scoring with headers and I don't recall much of him laying it on to someone else with a header for them to score either so where's the ball going? to one of ours to retain posession? to an opposition player? out of play? I suspect very strongly that his stats for winning headers are far, far better than his stats for retaining possession from them. It could be argued that we don't support him enough - which is probably fair - but although he wins the majority of his aerial duels, he doesn't direct his headers in a way Boothy used to do. That's because most of the time they're long balls out of defence and there's no one for him to play it to. If you watch him when we have the ball in midfield he moves away from the centre onto the shoulder of the last defender looking for a ball that's chipped over the top and we never play that pass. |
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Post by hypotenuse on May 31, 2019 11:14:30 GMT 1
I have to be honest and say that I’m not sure I rate any of our strikers, Grant included. I’d be quite happy to accept offers for Grant and Mounié and buy a couple of quality mobile strikers like Maupay.
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midlander
David Wagner Terrier
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Post by midlander on May 31, 2019 12:16:55 GMT 1
I have to be honest and say that I’m not sure I rate any of our strikers, Grant included. I’d be quite happy to accept offers for Grant and Mounié and buy a couple of quality mobile strikers like Maupay. Grant works hard, runs the channels well and gets into good scoring positions. However, he isn't a natural finisher by any stretch. Next season will be massive for him. Kicks on and he could well have a good few years at top Champ/lower Prem level. However, he lacks that killer instinct for me and that is hard to come by. |
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Post by terriersyndrome on May 31, 2019 13:05:19 GMT 1
The DATM striker coaching experts are out in force today.
If people think we're going to go out & spend £15-£20m on Maupay then be prepared to be disappointed.
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midlander
David Wagner Terrier
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Post by midlander on May 31, 2019 13:25:38 GMT 1
The DATM striker coaching experts are out in force today. If people think we're going to go out & spend £15-£20m on Maupay then be prepared to be disappointed. Where has anyone said we are going to spend that sort of money? Only a head in clouds type would think that. Maupay chances sailed a long time ago. |
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Post by terriersyndrome on May 31, 2019 13:26:54 GMT 1
The DATM striker coaching experts are out in force today. If people think we're going to go out & spend £15-£20m on Maupay then be prepared to be disappointed. Where has anyone said we are going to spend that sort of money? Only a head in clouds type would think that. Maupay chances sailed a long time ago. About 4/5 posts up. |
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Post by bluestripe on May 31, 2019 13:29:41 GMT 1
The DATM striker coaching experts are out in force today. If people think we're going to go out & spend £15-£20m on Maupay then be prepared to be disappointed. Where has anyone said we are going to spend that sort of money? Only a head in clouds type would think that. Maupay chances sailed a long time ago. Hypotenuse above |
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Post by hypotenuse on Jun 1, 2019 10:53:17 GMT 1
I referred to “quality, mobile strikers LIKE Maupay”.
I didn’t actually mean Maupay but was struggling to come up with some alternative names at the time. I clearly don’t think we will be signing Maupay after our relegation.
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Post by impact on Jun 1, 2019 11:11:05 GMT 1
There's a big difference between big chance missed and big chance saved. There's also a big difference between chance and has to score.
The couple of chances I remember Grant missing were on target saved by keepers. I can only think of 2 though.
The big ones Mounie missed were mostly sitters which he put wide.
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midlander
David Wagner Terrier
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Post by midlander on Jun 1, 2019 11:35:36 GMT 1
There's a big difference between big chance missed and big chance saved. There's also a big difference between chance and has to score. The couple of chances I remember Grant missing were on target saved by keepers. I can only think of 2 though. The big ones Mounie missed were mostly sitters which he put wide. He missed an absolute sitter against Wolves at home which resulted in Mounié poking the ball home. The other two I remember weren't ones where he has to score, but were rather tame efforts at the keeper when through on goal from a slight angle. Not having a pop at Grant as he was a rare positive in a season of despair. Equally, I don't see the 25 goal a season striker that some of our fans seem to be convinced he'll turn into in the Championship. Time will tell though. I think that both he and Mounié 'could' do very well for us next season. However, a third option is definitely needed. |
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Post by terriersyndrome on Jun 1, 2019 11:37:55 GMT 1
I referred to “quality, mobile strikers LIKE Maupay”. I didn’t actually mean Maupay but was struggling to come up with some alternative names at the time. I clearly don’t think we will be signing Maupay after our relegation. You clearly don't think Grant is up to it so which "quality, mobile strikers LIKE Maupay" do you think we can get that will be a) within budget & b) better than Grant? |
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Post by hypotenuse on Jun 1, 2019 12:05:40 GMT 1
I referred to “quality, mobile strikers LIKE Maupay”. I didn’t actually mean Maupay but was struggling to come up with some alternative names at the time. I clearly don’t think we will be signing Maupay after our relegation. You clearly don't think Grant is up to it so which "quality, mobile strikers LIKE Maupay" do you think we can get that will be a) within budget & b) better than Grant? I’m not convinced by Grant but the main reason I think we need other strikers is that I’m fairly certain Grant won’t be with us next season. As for strikers within budget, I have no idea what our budget is but would be prepared to make a loan bid (probably on very high wages) for Gayle or Abraham. Pay ‘em, say, £55-£60k per week plus an ‘arrangement’ fee and there is no long term cost. The parachute money should be focussed on 3 or 4 high quality loans (think who we had in 2016/17) as they will make the difference between a season of struggle and a possible top 6 tilt. |
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