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Post by Chips Longhorn on Aug 9, 2020 14:36:06 GMT 1
Huddersfield Town. Years since being in the top division ... ONE Brentford. Years since being in the top division... SIXTY PLUS Otium. Minutes since he felt he had to have yet another pop at something he purports to care for... ONE That's rubbish pal...complete dogshit. We were lucky to get there, lucky to stay there and went down with the 2nd worst record in Prem history. We have just become the team with the worst 8 year win record in the football league just overtaking Sunderland. Its been a few highlights and mostly dire crud. Minus goals every season...even when we went up. We have not found any great players, we do not have any great players, we have sold one very good player who we got on the cheap in 7 seasons. Man Utds reserve team would eat out first team right now 29 times out of 30...that's how far away we are/were. If I said the sky was blue you would say it wasn't. Blah blah blah.. Sorry when were Brentford last in the top league? I challenge you to give me the correct answer without half a page of wafflebollocks
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Post by HuddsTerrier on Aug 9, 2020 14:54:33 GMT 1
Two and half years ago the club proudly proclaimed the “Terrier identify” - based on gegenpressing
The whole club apparently would adopt a 4231 formation to enable natural transition through to the first team
That plan seemingly has long since been thrown out
Hopefully this one lasts longer than a few months. Decisions have been the scattergun and short termist for two years now and a massive turnover of players and key people also can’t have helped
The club needs to properly settle on a approach they believe in and stick to it - hopefully they will this time
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Post by sabailand on Aug 9, 2020 15:36:04 GMT 1
That's rubbish pal...complete dogshit. We were lucky to get there, lucky to stay there and went down with the 2nd worst record in Prem history. We have just become the team with the worst 8 year win record in the football league just overtaking Sunderland. Its been a few highlights and mostly dire crud. Minus goals every season...even when we went up. We have not found any great players, we do not have any great players, we have sold one very good player who we got on the cheap in 7 seasons. Man Utds reserve team would eat out first team right now 29 times out of 30...that's how far away we are/were. If I said the sky was blue you would say it wasn't. Blah blah blah.. Sorry when were Brentford last in the top league? I challenge you to give me the correct answer without half a page of wafflebollocks Got promoted to the top flight in 1935, no football from 1939-45 cos of the war, eventually got relegated in 1947, soz i cant help myself at times.
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Post by otium (EPBS) on Aug 9, 2020 15:40:48 GMT 1
You seem to forget that we don't have, and will never have, £200 mill to spend. Brentfords model is buy low and sell high. Sensible. Who had £200 million readily available to spend? Leeds, West Brom and Fulham these last 3 years.
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Post by otium (EPBS) on Aug 9, 2020 15:44:39 GMT 1
That's rubbish pal...complete dogshit. We were lucky to get there, lucky to stay there and went down with the 2nd worst record in Prem history. We have just become the team with the worst 8 year win record in the football league just overtaking Sunderland. Its been a few highlights and mostly dire crud. Minus goals every season...even when we went up. We have not found any great players, we do not have any great players, we have sold one very good player who we got on the cheap in 7 seasons. Man Utds reserve team would eat out first team right now 29 times out of 30...that's how far away we are/were. If I said the sky was blue you would say it wasn't. Blah blah blah.. Sorry when were Brentford last in the top league? I challenge you to give me the correct answer without half a page of wafflebollocks Wow, 2 sentences for a change...you used to debate Chippy and now you just deride. Your posts become less and relevant. I think Brentford was 1935....someone posted it on here two weeks back. I am not interested in the past now, it does not help us. My £100 v yours for charity says Brentford finish above us the next 2 seasons in a row?
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Post by ACW on Aug 9, 2020 18:06:46 GMT 1
Constantly challenging and not achieing actual success does not seem a positive business model to me. Yea they play fast attacking football but this achieved no success for them. Agree with a lot you say, but I think you're being ridiculously 'black and white' here. You can't effectively have the result in one game against Fulham being the determinant of them being successful or not. On the face of it, an incredibly well run club. Punching above their weight; regularly making the best use of their resources. Totally agree. Success is relative and Brentford are a very well managed club who are doing well both on and off the pitch. They were 90 mins from the Premier League this season. If Town had acheived the same things, I am sure we would all look back on the season as a very good one.
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Post by swam4mwg on Aug 9, 2020 19:13:54 GMT 1
Modern football talk! Visions and models etc. All very good if it gets results. Devlin and Bromby talk it up, but you have to win games .
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Post by otium (EPBS) on Aug 9, 2020 19:23:19 GMT 1
Modern football talk! Visions and models etc. All very good if it gets results. Devlin and Bromby talk it up, but you have to win games . That's true but if you cut out the static there are ways to get an edge....enough to make the fight worthwhile. Nothing sweeter than David beating Goliath.
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Post by swam4mwg on Aug 9, 2020 19:26:52 GMT 1
Modern football talk! Visions and models etc. All very good if it gets results. Devlin and Bromby talk it up, but you have to win games . That's true but if you cut out the static there are ways to get an edge....enough to make the fight worthwhile. Nothing sweeter than David beating Goliath. Static and edge? You been out on the town with Devlin and Bromby?
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Post by overtonterrierspirit on Aug 9, 2020 19:33:22 GMT 1
That's true but if you cut out the static there are ways to get an edge....enough to make the fight worthwhile. Nothing sweeter than David beating Goliath. Static and edge? You been out on the town with Devlin and Bromby? Could be a good name for a new TV Detective duo.
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Post by softboy on Aug 9, 2020 19:44:36 GMT 1
Agree with a lot you say, but I think you're being ridiculously 'black and white' here. You can't effectively have the result in one game against Fulham being the determinant of them being successful or not. On the face of it, an incredibly well run club. Punching above their weight; regularly making the best use of their resources. Totally agree. Success is relative and Brentford are a very well managed club who are doing well both on and off the pitch. They were 90 mins from the Premier League this season. If Town had acheived the same things, I am sure we would all look back on the season as a very good one. We did a few years ago, we won a play off final and got to the PL.
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Post by otium (EPBS) on Aug 9, 2020 19:50:00 GMT 1
That's true but if you cut out the static there are ways to get an edge....enough to make the fight worthwhile. Nothing sweeter than David beating Goliath. Static and edge? You been out on the town with Devlin and Bromby? I could give you 50 examples. Here is one. Teams cancel each other out. 50% of the goals at the last World Cup were set pieces....9 of Englands 12 goals were. Southgate spent most of the coaching periods doing set pieces. Concentrate a lot more on set pieces because they are where there is more randomness near the goal.
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Post by swam4mwg on Aug 9, 2020 19:59:56 GMT 1
Static and edge? You been out on the town with Devlin and Bromby? I could give you 50 examples. Here is one. Teams cancel each other out. 50% of the goals at the last World Cup were set pieces....9 of Englands 12 goals were. Southgate spent most of the coaching periods doing set pieces. Concentrate a lot more on set pieces because they are where there is more randomness near the goal. Well hopefully Carlos will be on DATM and take on board your philosophy.
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Post by Headless Chicken on Aug 9, 2020 20:14:42 GMT 1
Totally agree. Success is relative and Brentford are a very well managed club who are doing well both on and off the pitch. They were 90 mins from the Premier League this season. If Town had acheived the same things, I am sure we would all look back on the season as a very good one. We did a few years ago, we won a play off final and got to the PL. We shouldn't denigrate that success we had, unlike a few irritants for some perverse reason seem to like doing, but that wasn't down to the model; it was lower level decisions made by Wagner and having one of the most dominant players seen in the Championship in Mooy. If they go up, they're in a much better position to make a fist of it and not come down in a mess.
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Post by bluesandtwos on Aug 9, 2020 21:40:32 GMT 1
Static and edge? You been out on the town with Devlin and Bromby? I could give you 50 examples. Here is one. Teams cancel each other out. 50% of the goals at the last World Cup were set pieces....9 of Englands 12 goals were. Southgate spent most of the coaching periods doing set pieces. Concentrate a lot more on set pieces because they are where there is more randomness near the goal. I believe the Cowleys were big on set pieces, though you wouldn’t have known it from most of ours last season. Also you really need to get into the final third for them to be dangerous, something we also failed to do over much. Anyone know how Leeds did last season from set pieces, because that is probably the model we are looking at.
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Post by ACW on Aug 9, 2020 23:20:23 GMT 1
Totally agree. Success is relative and Brentford are a very well managed club who are doing well both on and off the pitch. They were 90 mins from the Premier League this season. If Town had acheived the same things, I am sure we would all look back on the season as a very good one. We did a few years ago, we won a play off final and got to the PL. I'm not sure what your point is. We're talking about whether LAST season should be considered a successful one for Brentford. I was suggesting that had Town finished third and lost in the final of the play offs that most Town fans would have rightly considered it a pretty good season. Our promotion via the play offs in 2017 is irrelevant. That was a different season with a different final outcome. You seem to consider Brentford's season a failure because they lost the play off final. I would argue that dismisses all their good work over the full season. They fell at the final hurdle, but that doesn't make the season a failure. Unless you only see things in black and white We'll agree to disagree on this one.
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Post by ACW on Aug 9, 2020 23:29:53 GMT 1
I could give you 50 examples. Here is one. Teams cancel each other out. 50% of the goals at the last World Cup were set pieces....9 of Englands 12 goals were. Southgate spent most of the coaching periods doing set pieces. Concentrate a lot more on set pieces because they are where there is more randomness near the goal. I believe the Cowleys were big on set pieces, though you wouldn’t have known it from most of ours last season. Also you really need to get into the final third for them to be dangerous, something we also failed to do over much. Anyone know how Leeds did last season from set pieces, because that is probably the model we are looking at. I was very disappointed with our set pieces under the Cowleys. There were occasional innovative routines tried, but towards the end their set pieces seemed to involve hopeful hoofs into the box from all areas of the pitch. I think they were undermined by the lack of a quality set piece taker - Bacuna excepted - but the lack of variety/innovation was poor. Boot it high to a centre half or Mounie. That was it. I also noticed our throw in routines regressed under the Cowleys. Instead of throwing to a team mate's feet we reverted to chucking the ball down the line in the hope we might win a header. The sort of thing you'd see in the lower leagues.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 10, 2020 11:49:05 GMT 1
And yet I absolutely loved what we did with Wagner for the first 2 and a half years, The best football I have seen since Bruce had that one season. * 60% of a season
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Post by bluesandtwos on Aug 10, 2020 20:39:00 GMT 1
I believe the Cowleys were big on set pieces, though you wouldn’t have known it from most of ours last season. Also you really need to get into the final third for them to be dangerous, something we also failed to do over much. Anyone know how Leeds did last season from set pieces, because that is probably the model we are looking at. I was very disappointed with our set pieces under the Cowleys. There were occasional innovative routines tried, but towards the end their set pieces seemed to involve hopeful hoofs into the box from all areas of the pitch. I think they were undermined by the lack of a quality set piece taker - Bacuna excepted - but the lack of variety/innovation was poor. Boot it high to a centre half or Mounie. That was it. I also noticed our throw in routines regressed under the Cowleys. Instead of throwing to a team mate's feet we reverted to chucking the ball down the line in the hope we might win a header. The sort of thing you'd see in the lower leagues. I do agree about lack of quality with a regular set piece taker. The four who could hit a decent dead ball seemed to be Bacuna, ESR, Grant and Toffolo. ESR and Bacuna took them occasionally, Toffolo started taking them late in the season, and if a left footer was required, and Grant took most of the corners. I should maybe add Pritchard to that but he played so little it is hard to know if he would have been any good at it. It was an area I expected us to get more traction and although we had a few which brought results most were very tame.
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Post by ACW on Aug 10, 2020 21:00:22 GMT 1
And yet I absolutely loved what we did with Wagner for the first 2 and a half years, The best football I have seen since Bruce had that one season. * 60% of a season Yes. The football towards the end of that season was nowhere near as good as the stuff we produced earlier. I always thought the home game against Charlton - where they won and taught us a lesson - just after Xmas was the turning point. We were never the same after that match, even though we still had Stewart for another month.
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Post by terrier25 on Aug 10, 2020 21:19:46 GMT 1
Yes. The football towards the end of that season was nowhere near as good as the stuff we produced earlier. I always thought the home game against Charlton - where they won and taught us a lesson - just after Xmas was the turning point. We were never the same after that match, even though we still had Stewart for another month. It went wrong on boxing day at Crewe that season. 2nd half of season was just hanging on. ....and finally falling off at Fulham.
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Post by ACW on Aug 11, 2020 0:23:41 GMT 1
Yes. The football towards the end of that season was nowhere near as good as the stuff we produced earlier. I always thought the home game against Charlton - where they won and taught us a lesson - just after Xmas was the turning point. We were never the same after that match, even though we still had Stewart for another month. It went wrong on boxing day at Crewe that season. 2nd half of season was just hanging on. ....and finally falling off at Fulham. I was at Craven Cottage that day. Lovely sunny day and a good turn out by the fans. Unfortunately the team put in one of the most inept performances I have ever seen from my team. Considering what we had to play for. Hardly strung three passes together and created the square root of fuck all. Didn't even go down fighting. Watching Town that day I could scarcely believe that a few short months before we'd been playing some of the best football I'd seen from my team. Although it's a longer time frame, I feel similar about Town since that glorious night at Stamford Bridge. Town certainly know how to bring us back down to earth!
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Post by southowram on Aug 11, 2020 8:14:52 GMT 1
Brentford have been at the cutting edge of ‘data’, scouting and statistical analysis for a good few years.
That’s what’s got them top quality player after player. I don’t see why we can’t imitate elements of what they do yet retain our own identity.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 11, 2020 12:56:15 GMT 1
It went wrong on boxing day at Crewe that season. 2nd half of season was just hanging on. ....and finally falling off at Fulham. I was at Craven Cottage that day. Lovely sunny day and a good turn out by the fans. Unfortunately the team put in one of the most inept performances I have ever seen from my team. Considering what we had to play for. Hardly strung three passes together and created the square root of fuck all. Didn't even go down fighting. Watching Town that day I could scarcely believe that a few short months before we'd been playing some of the best football I'd seen from my team. Although it's a longer time frame, I feel similar about Town since that glorious night at Stamford Bridge. Town certainly know how to bring us back down to earth! I expected nothing less than the capitulation at home against Stockport the previous weekend. That made the recent defeat to Luton look like a performance of champions! I think we ended up the game with five up front all tripping each other up!
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Post by specialun on Aug 11, 2020 13:10:54 GMT 1
Two and half years ago the club proudly proclaimed the “Terrier identify” - based on gegenpressing The whole club apparently would adopt a 4231 formation to enable natural transition through to the first team That plan seemingly has long since been thrown out Hopefully this one lasts longer than a few months. Decisions have been the scattergun and short termist for two years now and a massive turnover of players and key people also can’t have helped The club needs to properly settle on a approach they believe in and stick to it - hopefully they will this time Agreed. We can’t be sat here in 12 months with another coach, HOF, CEO & direction. As I put in another thread whilst I’m not convinced some of those in their jobs are the quality / suitability we need (I don’t mean Carlos) but if all on the same page then that’s at least a way to take the club forward
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Post by ACW on Aug 11, 2020 20:55:37 GMT 1
I was at Craven Cottage that day. Lovely sunny day and a good turn out by the fans. Unfortunately the team put in one of the most inept performances I have ever seen from my team. Considering what we had to play for. Hardly strung three passes together and created the square root of fuck all. Didn't even go down fighting. Watching Town that day I could scarcely believe that a few short months before we'd been playing some of the best football I'd seen from my team. Although it's a longer time frame, I feel similar about Town since that glorious night at Stamford Bridge. Town certainly know how to bring us back down to earth! I expected nothing less than the capitulation at home against Stockport the previous weekend. That made the recent defeat to Luton look like a performance of champions! I think we ended up the game with five up front all tripping each other up! Yeah, I remember the Stockport game too. Didn't they score twice early on and then sit back and soak up our pathetic attempts to get back into the game?
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