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Post by UtahTerrier on Mar 5, 2015 0:23:04 GMT 1
Had a season ticket since I was 5. I'm 23 now. I think I genuinly enjoyed division 3 more than watching town now. Atm I play hudds district league alternate Saturday's. I think I'd rather do that every week than watch town at least till the end of this season
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Post by keithAM11532 on Mar 5, 2015 3:52:36 GMT 1
Interesting and reasonable moans on this thread. The thing is, what can the club DO to reverse the trend?
You can't just magic up entertaining football, an awesome atmosphere, and a world class event attendance experience that people are compelled to attend overnight, especially when you're losing £5m a year.
I don't know the answers, although I could think of a few difficult suggestions that I wouldn't write down on here as they wouldn't be fair to people whose job it is. And most importantly, I don't really know what could be done that would encouraged me as what I would now class as an "occasional supporter" to come more often, spend money outside of the core ticket price (on merchandise, food, programmes, whatever), and be actively engaged with the club and effectively resell it to others....(I USED to invite a few Liverpool, Man City and Leeds supporting mates along to a couple of games a year and "show off" the club, and we'd have a day out of it, but we've not done that for about 4 seasons now)... and eventually become a possible future returning season ticket holder.
So what would Mary Portas or Gordon Ramsey do?
Or... do we write me off as a lost customer, and target some NEW potential ticket buyer?? As someone wrote elsewhere, people stop attending and people start attending all the time. The only difference since 1990 and earlier is that those that have stopped attending still have a voice.
Maybe Sky and the Premier League didn't spoil the game, maybe the popular growth of the internet did? Football needs to reinvent itself or it will die like the dinasaurs did. In the US there are just 32 NFL teams. They sell out week after week. The real fact is our tiny population just cannot sustain 92 professional teams. Then when you consider the hostility, the violence the non family atmosphere is it any wonder modern young family's have no time or enthusiasm for the game when they can watch premier league on TV.
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Post by detox on Mar 5, 2015 10:34:09 GMT 1
don't get caught up in the 'you never had it so good' approach.. it was used by politicians when the wages went up but the same standard of living went up a bit more than the wages, it was well hidden for a while but that's what happened.. simply put, we need more people to watch the games and buy into the club.. this wont happen as we are at the moment.. we will stagnate, we already are to some extent.. this will lead to poorer attendances, less invest and relegation..either sooner or later, slow painful exit or next season goes totally tonto.. Those who cant stand the moaning and whingeing(I do neither at the games-no point, waste of energy) will then be able to stand/sit wherever they like to get away from it because the ground will have at least an extra empty third for you to have a laugh with your mates??? by the way, the price to do so wont be noticeably different to now.. up to the club now..sorry but it is.. The funny thing is if you look at the average gate from 70-71 when we were in the top flight, its not vastly different to what we get now (17k) the year before when we got promoted form Div 2 (now the Championship )it was only 10k. So its not really up to the club, history shows that there are only so many people in Huddersfield interested in coming to the games. always has been always will be. So can people stop beating the drum about the club having no ambition. It survives for the supporters who follow it, and they are never going to get to the levels that will see the team progress any higher than mid table. Erm, not true...the average attendance in 1969/70 when we won the league was 17,522 (1st half of season 12,441, second half 22,142) and our first season in league one ,as was, we averaged 23,227 .......
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Post by detox on Mar 5, 2015 11:10:17 GMT 1
I started watching Town in 1961,in league 2 (equiv to Championship)..we spent the next 10 years in this league and there was never the same clamour for promotion to league one as there is now. Things were different then, the experience of match days satisfied most fans desires and we were starved of football on the TV at that time..so this was your 'fix'. having said that Town nearly always competed..finishing 7th, 6th, 12th, 8th, 4th, 6th, 14th and 6th before we won that league...in 69/70. In that mix we had a bunch of exciting players and international players...crowd favourites where we made up chants to support them....the old 'uns amongst us will remember them...Nowadays all the players just seem grey clones of one another, the tacticians (FIFA badged coaches and statisticians) have taken over the assylum and the clamour for the top league is incessant. The game has changed but more so the fans have changed too...more critical I'd say (and I've been one of them ...) all seater stadiums have had an impact to dull the match day experience as well. It's a different product completely, and in my opinion not as good. I now just attend the odd game, and often wonder why I bothered.... Town need to re-invent the match day experience to attract the missing fans, both on and off the pitch. That's my opinion anyway, after 54 years of watching Town...
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Post by terraceterrier on Mar 5, 2015 14:09:37 GMT 1
Interesting and reasonable moans on this thread. The thing is, what can the club DO to reverse the trend?
You can't just magic up entertaining football, an awesome atmosphere, and a world class event attendance experience that people are compelled to attend overnight, especially when you're losing £5m a year.
I don't know the answers, although I could think of a few difficult suggestions that I wouldn't write down on here as they wouldn't be fair to people whose job it is. And most importantly, I don't really know what could be done that would encouraged me as what I would now class as an "occasional supporter" to come more often, spend money outside of the core ticket price (on merchandise, food, programmes, whatever), and be actively engaged with the club and effectively resell it to others....(I USED to invite a few Liverpool, Man City and Leeds supporting mates along to a couple of games a year and "show off" the club, and we'd have a day out of it, but we've not done that for about 4 seasons now)... and eventually become a possible future returning season ticket holder.
So what would Mary Portas or Gordon Ramsey do?
Or... do we write me off as a lost customer, and target some NEW potential ticket buyer?? As someone wrote elsewhere, people stop attending and people start attending all the time. The only difference since 1990 and earlier is that those that have stopped attending still have a voice.
Maybe Sky and the Premier League didn't spoil the game, maybe the popular growth of the internet did? Football needs to reinvent itself or it will die like the dinasaurs did. In the US there are just 32 NFL teams. They sell out week after week. The real fact is our tiny population just cannot sustain 92 professional teams. Then when you consider the hostility, the violence the non family atmosphere is it any wonder modern young family's have no time or enthusiasm for the game when they can watch premier league on TV.
You bring up great points but id add the cost of live footy to this lack of enthusiasm.....the Roman Gladiatorial games lasted centuries but they ended up the same as the dinosaurs because the masses simply weren't entertained anymore......I can see within the next few decades Football being watched by millions on tv whilst the grounds becoming gradually empty, this wont be sustainable on any front and because the crowd/atmosphere is a huge part of the tv watching experience the TV milions will drift away as well
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Post by keithAM11532 on Mar 5, 2015 14:21:45 GMT 1
Football needs to reinvent itself or it will die like the dinasaurs did. In the US there are just 32 NFL teams. They sell out week after week. The real fact is our tiny population just cannot sustain 92 professional teams. Then when you consider the hostility, the violence the non family atmosphere is it any wonder modern young family's have no time or enthusiasm for the game when they can watch premier league on TV.
You bring up great points but id add the cost of live footy to this lack of enthusiasm.....the Roman Gladiatorial games lasted centuries but they ended up the same as the dinosaurs because the masses simply weren't entertained anymore......I can see within the next few decades Football being watched by millions on tv whilst the grounds becoming gradually empty, this wont be sustainable on any front and because the crowd/atmosphere is a huge part of the tv watching experience the TV milions will drift away as well
I know some on here will blow fuses at this, but I despair at the separation, which I think only fuels the hostility. I cannot name any other live sports where opposing fans have to be separated. I am a life long Town fan, my brother and his family support Leeds. I would love to be able to go to a game, sit together and enjoy the tussle. Some people wont even type Leeds. How moronic is that.
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htfc63
Darren Bullock Terrier
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Post by htfc63 on Mar 5, 2015 15:48:30 GMT 1
With you on sitting together Keith as I think its pathetic in this day and age that you cannot have a bit of banter with your opponents supporters. In saying that Millwall showed last Saturday why this still cannot happen until those causing trouble or using threatening behaviour can be excluded from the grounds. The whole experience both on and off the field needs to be looked at for crowds to come back. I still think the points system needs to be looked at to encourage away teams to go for a win and for off field technology to be used to correct/ confirm refereeing decisions or catch those players who dive, feign injury or are culprits of continual cheating.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 5, 2015 16:59:09 GMT 1
The funny thing is if you look at the average gate from 70-71 when we were in the top flight, its not vastly different to what we get now (17k) the year before when we got promoted form Div 2 (now the Championship )it was only 10k. So its not really up to the club, history shows that there are only so many people in Huddersfield interested in coming to the games. always has been always will be. So can people stop beating the drum about the club having no ambition. It survives for the supporters who follow it, and they are never going to get to the levels that will see the team progress any higher than mid table. Erm, not true...the average attendance in 1969/70 when we won the league was 17,522 (1st half of season 12,441, second half 22,142) and our first season in league one ,as was, we averaged 23,227 ....... Plus that would have been mostly men, from what I recall even going into the 80s and 90s. Very few toddlers attending back then too.
Would be interesting to see a % breakdown of men/women/kids that attend now.
I'd hazard a guess that the numbers of adult male support, who earned this sport its "working mans game" label has likely decreased by a high relative amount over time, and in the same period, the number of women and kids below High School age has increased dramatically. Based on nothing more than pure observation, I reckon their are less male seniors attending now than their used to be (and probably similar female seniors)..... or it could be as a youngster I presumed more folk who are in their 40s and 50s were OAPs?!
In order to sustain and grow crowds then, the club needs to attract Junior School aged girls to football, who will support the club and go on to have a longer life than a typical man, and continue to actively support the club into their senior years.
I know there is an increasing commitment to get school girls into playing football as part of their PE curriculum, perhaps as football moved from a working man dominated game to a "family" supported game, it will become something driven by females over the next 30 years??
As such, (and obviously there are girls who like to stand), I think this is one reason why safe standing areas are unlikely to be brought back into higher level football, and there will be an increasing commitment to "looking after" female supporters, give them improved toilet facilities, food and drinks that aren't aimed at the old stereotype of pie and pint whilst you have a smoke out the back, comfy, warm, dry seated areas, no swearing, and polite applause replacing caveman ritualistic chanting??
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Post by Carlito Brigante on Mar 5, 2015 17:18:25 GMT 1
You bring up great points but id add the cost of live footy to this lack of enthusiasm.....the Roman Gladiatorial games lasted centuries but they ended up the same as the dinosaurs because the masses simply weren't entertained anymore......I can see within the next few decades Football being watched by millions on tv whilst the grounds becoming gradually empty, this wont be sustainable on any front and because the crowd/atmosphere is a huge part of the tv watching experience the TV milions will drift away as well
I know some on here will blow fuses at this, but I despair at the separation, which I think only fuels the hostility. I cannot name any other live sports where opposing fans have to be separated. I am a life long Town fan, my brother and his family support Leeds. I would love to be able to go to a game, sit together and enjoy the tussle. Some people wont even type L666s. How moronic is that. That is better
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Post by Sugy , Paignton Devon Terrier on Mar 5, 2015 18:02:09 GMT 1
I started watching Town in 1961,in league 2 (equiv to Championship)..we spent the next 10 years in this league and there was never the same clamour for promotion to league one as there is now. Things were different then, the experience of match days satisfied most fans desires and we were starved of football on the TV at that time..so this was your 'fix'. having said that Town nearly always competed..finishing 7th, 6th, 12th, 8th, 4th, 6th, 14th and 6th before we won that league...in 69/70. In that mix we had a bunch of exciting players and international players...crowd favourites where we made up chants to support them....the old 'uns amongst us will remember them...Nowadays all the players just seem grey clones of one another, the tacticians (FIFA badged coaches and statisticians) have taken over the assylum and the clamour for the top league is incessant. The game has changed but more so the fans have changed too...more critical I'd say (and I've been one of them ...) all seater stadiums have had an impact to dull the match day experience as well. It's a different product completely, and in my opinion not as good. I now just attend the odd game, and often wonder why I bothered.... Town need to re-invent the match day experience to attract the missing fans, both on and off the pitch. That's my opinion anyway, after 54 years of watching Town... Ian Greaves would have left Edgar, Hudson and Wallace on the bench , that bench being the one outside Huddersfield railway station with each player given a one way ticket back to where they came from. For the mentioned players to describe themselves as defenders surely breaks the trades description act.
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Post by patfield on Mar 5, 2015 19:17:53 GMT 1
My question to ex ST holders is what would make you return and buy a season ticket ? This is what the club needs to ask.
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Post by patfield on Mar 5, 2015 19:34:52 GMT 1
You bring up great points but id add the cost of live footy to this lack of enthusiasm.....the Roman Gladiatorial games lasted centuries but they ended up the same as the dinosaurs because the masses simply weren't entertained anymore......I can see within the next few decades Football being watched by millions on tv whilst the grounds becoming gradually empty, this wont be sustainable on any front and because the crowd/atmosphere is a huge part of the tv watching experience the TV milions will drift away as well
I know some on here will blow fuses at this, but I despair at the separation, which I think only fuels the hostility. I cannot name any other live sports where opposing fans have to be separated. I am a life long Town fan, my brother and his family support Leeds. I would love to be able to go to a game, sit together and enjoy the tussle. Some people wont even type Leeds. How moronic is that. Keitha whilst I respect your post I prefer a bit of edge to the matches, I'm not on about people kicking each others heads in, but a bit of crowd hostility adds to the thrill of the day. In the cowshed with a few naughty boys singing naughty songs , couldn't beat it. Football grounds Imo are too sterile these days, but then again so is football in general. Fart and a player falls over. Bring back the days of bone crunching tackles
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Post by claytonwestblue on Mar 5, 2015 19:36:58 GMT 1
Got mine last min this season but must admit it's been one of the worst seasons so far the home game experience has lost it's gloss everyone you talk to about town can see the same old problems that 3 managers have failed to correct mainly the defence no way will I renew next season fed up of been fed the same old storey and why do so many fans get free tickets every home game I know of a group who get hold of 10 every week from a contact at the university
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Post by keithAM11532 on Mar 5, 2015 19:49:33 GMT 1
I know some on here will blow fuses at this, but I despair at the separation, which I think only fuels the hostility. I cannot name any other live sports where opposing fans have to be separated. I am a life long Town fan, my brother and his family support Leeds. I would love to be able to go to a game, sit together and enjoy the tussle. Some people wont even type Leeds. How moronic is that. Keitha whilst I respect your post I prefer a bit of edge to the matches, I'm not on about people kicking each others heads in, but a bit of crowd hostility adds to the thrill of the day. In the cowshed with a few naughty boys singing naughty songs , couldn't beat it. Football grounds Imo are too sterile these days, but then again so is football in general. Fart and a player falls over. Bring back the days of bone crunching tackles Hi Pat. its a funny old game check out these links: sexism: www.bbc.com/sport/0/football/31750397Player behavior: www.bbc.com/sport/0/football/31750913Actually I like the singing and the bit of edge, but I also understand why crowds are shrinking.
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Post by Christ in Shades (art) on Mar 5, 2015 19:52:51 GMT 1
You bring up great points but id add the cost of live footy to this lack of enthusiasm.....the Roman Gladiatorial games lasted centuries but they ended up the same as the dinosaurs because the masses simply weren't entertained anymore......I can see within the next few decades Football being watched by millions on tv whilst the grounds becoming gradually empty, this wont be sustainable on any front and because the crowd/atmosphere is a huge part of the tv watching experience the TV milions will drift away as well
I know some on here will blow fuses at this, but I despair at the separation, which I think only fuels the hostility. I cannot name any other live sports where opposing fans have to be separated. I am a life long Town fan, my brother and his family support Leeds. I would love to be able to go to a game, sit together and enjoy the tussle. Some people wont even type Leeds. How moronic is that. This is where I disagree Keith, this what makes the experience as a fan better, being kept apart. If fans of the same team are altogether chanting, it makes the atmosphere, there is camaraderie between the fans. Football fans are tribal, its better to be sat with your own kind. Its like cities who have more than one team, certain areas of the city will be a stronghold of support for one club. Its what makes it for me. Just for the record, I'm no hooligan and i have no desire to physically harm someone cos they support another club. I dislike how the working class identity of the game has been eroded too.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 5, 2015 19:55:53 GMT 1
I know some on here will blow fuses at this, but I despair at the separation, which I think only fuels the hostility. I cannot name any other live sports where opposing fans have to be separated. I am a life long Town fan, my brother and his family support Leeds. I would love to be able to go to a game, sit together and enjoy the tussle. Some people wont even type Leeds. How moronic is that. This is where I disagree Keith, this what makes the experience as a fan better, being kept apart. If fans of the same team are altogether chanting, it makes the atmosphere, there is camaraderie between the fans. Football fans are tribal, its better to be sat with your own kind. Its like cities who have more than one team, certain areas of the city will be a stronghold of support for one club. Its what makes it for me. Just for the record, I'm no hooligan and i have no desire to physically harm someone cos they support another club. I dislike how the working class identity of the game has been eroded too. I couldn't sit with the away fans, no chance. I'm not even fussed about having the much lauded "banter" with away fans either, although I know its an issue for a lot of folk.
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Post by keithAM11532 on Mar 5, 2015 19:56:53 GMT 1
I know some on here will blow fuses at this, but I despair at the separation, which I think only fuels the hostility. I cannot name any other live sports where opposing fans have to be separated. I am a life long Town fan, my brother and his family support Leeds. I would love to be able to go to a game, sit together and enjoy the tussle. Some people wont even type Leeds. How moronic is that. This is where I disagree Keith, this what makes the experience as a fan better, being kept apart. If fans of the same team are altogether chanting, it makes the atmosphere, there is camaraderie between the fans. Football fans are tribal, its better to be sat with your own kind. Its like cities who have more than one team, certain areas of the city will be a stronghold of support for one club. Its what makes it for me. Just for the record, I'm no hooligan and i have no desire to physically harm someone cos they support another club. I dislike how the working class identity of the game has been eroded too. I get that Art. As I said in the post above - I quite like that too. But I can see why modern people do not. Its frightening to kids, it puts women off (some) and they are the fans of the future. I have had terrific experiences at Twickenham, being mixed in amongst everyone. you should try it.
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Post by Christ in Shades (art) on Mar 5, 2015 20:09:11 GMT 1
This is where I disagree Keith, this what makes the experience as a fan better, being kept apart. If fans of the same team are altogether chanting, it makes the atmosphere, there is camaraderie between the fans. Football fans are tribal, its better to be sat with your own kind. Its like cities who have more than one team, certain areas of the city will be a stronghold of support for one club. Its what makes it for me. Just for the record, I'm no hooligan and i have no desire to physically harm someone cos they support another club. I dislike how the working class identity of the game has been eroded too. I get that Art. As I said in the post above - I quite like that too. But I can see why modern people do not. Its frightening to kids, it puts women off (some) and they are the fans of the future. I have had terrific experiences at Twickenham, being mixed in amongst everyone. you should try it. Think if you grew up watching football in 70's and 80's you'll have a more of a tribal attitude to the game than maybe a 'new breed' fan.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 5, 2015 20:12:38 GMT 1
I agree with Christ in Shades (art) on this Keith, there isn't a chance I'll ever sit amoungst opposition fans no matter who they are. Segregation is what brings atmosphere.
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Post by keithAM11532 on Mar 5, 2015 20:13:11 GMT 1
I get that Art. As I said in the post above - I quite like that too. But I can see why modern people do not. Its frightening to kids, it puts women off (some) and they are the fans of the future. I have had terrific experiences at Twickenham, being mixed in amongst everyone. you should try it. Think if you grew up watching football in 70's and 80's you'll have a more of a tribal attitude to the game than maybe a 'new breed' fan. I did - I am just not so tribal these days. I have mellowed with age
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iangreaves
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Post by iangreaves on Mar 5, 2015 21:17:29 GMT 1
Didn't renew my season ticket for this season because I moved away. Bought one of the Top 10 cards or whatever they call 'em, but in all honesty I will not now manage to use all my 10 games. The performances I have seen have just been so bloody awful.
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Post by patfield on Mar 5, 2015 23:34:42 GMT 1
Also no hooligan, but being a young lad in the 70s. I'm 43 now, I loved the hatred being poured out of the cowshed. Walking up Leeds road with my tucked away as Leeds fans went by added to the fear/excitement. Problem is now a lot of aggro that guys took to the game has now been eroded by the high vis brigade.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 6, 2015 14:08:06 GMT 1
Erm, not true...the average attendance in 1969/70 when we won the league was 17,522 (1st half of season 12,441, second half 22,142) and our first season in league one ,as was, we averaged 23,227 ....... Plus that would have been mostly men, from what I recall even going into the 80s and 90s. Very few toddlers attending back then too.
Would be interesting to see a % breakdown of men/women/kids that attend now.
I'd hazard a guess that the numbers of adult male support, who earned this sport its "working mans game" label has likely decreased by a high relative amount over time, and in the same period, the number of women and kids below High School age has increased dramatically. Based on nothing more than pure observation, I reckon their are less male seniors attending now than their used to be (and probably similar female seniors)..... or it could be as a youngster I presumed more folk who are in their 40s and 50s were OAPs?!
In order to sustain and grow crowds then, the club needs to attract Junior School aged girls to football, who will support the club and go on to have a longer life than a typical man, and continue to actively support the club into their senior years.
I know there is an increasing commitment to get school girls into playing football as part of their PE curriculum, perhaps as football moved from a working man dominated game to a "family" supported game, it will become something driven by females over the next 30 years??
As such, (and obviously there are girls who like to stand), I think this is one reason why safe standing areas are unlikely to be brought back into higher level football, and there will be an increasing commitment to "looking after" female supporters, give them improved toilet facilities, food and drinks that aren't aimed at the old stereotype of pie and pint whilst you have a smoke out the back, comfy, warm, dry seated areas, no swearing, and polite applause replacing caveman ritualistic chanting??
Sepp Blatter obviously reads DATM! www1.skysports.com/football/news/11095/9746247/sepp-blatter-criticises-fifa-members-for-failing-to-elect-womenn
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COWSHEDPHIL
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Everybody In The Centre Circle!
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Post by COWSHEDPHIL on Mar 6, 2015 17:00:08 GMT 1
I've been a season ticket holder since I was 5, I'm 34 in May.
I won't be renewing.
Partly because I have a 6 month year old I want to spend time with.
Partly because my work means I have to stay away from Home on a Monday night, or being at Town on a Tuesday night isn't really viable.
But, mostly, I won't be renewing because the club still haven't provided a decent solution to a home end despite us being in the stadium for over 20 years.
It will be easier for me next year to pick and choose the big or better games.
p.s I disagree that the football is any less entertaining then it has been in any other years? The year we got promoted with Grayson I'm not sure I remember one good game? (apart from the playoffs)
We are a mid table / bottom half of the table side, therefore we will lose more than we win. Not sure what Town fans are expecting.
Pretty sure mid table / bottom half of the table sides don't produce fast entertaining attacking football very often in the history of football.
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Post by galpharm2400 on Mar 6, 2015 17:24:13 GMT 1
I will buy a season card.. usually get 5.. will be 3 next year.. two are dropping out because of travel and costs etc..
I buy them because I support town, I will be going and its cheaper.. fairly simple equation for me..
this will be my 48th season..
I love the club, the game, the praise and the moaning..its all a part of it..
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Post by Deleted on Mar 7, 2015 11:11:36 GMT 1
I thought I had read that season card renewal offers are out now but I haven't had a pack yet.
Have I dreamt this?
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Post by Deleted on Mar 7, 2015 11:21:34 GMT 1
I thought I had read that season card renewal offers are out now but I haven't had a pack yet. Have I dreamt this? Think there out today or possibly Monday
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Post by Sio on Mar 7, 2015 11:26:48 GMT 1
I thought I had read that season card renewal offers are out now but I haven't had a pack yet. Have I dreamt this? Packs will be delivered any time between now and next Tues/weds. Not everyone will receive them today, if any.
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Post by galpharm2400 on Mar 7, 2015 11:42:10 GMT 1
do they come with a health warning in brown covers??? 'supporting Town can seriously damage your wealth' Dean could sue himself?
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Post by Deleted on Mar 7, 2015 12:38:24 GMT 1
Ah reet thanks everyone
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