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Post by galpharm2400 on Mar 14, 2015 21:05:28 GMT 1
deepspace..
I will have to bend to your informed opinion on mentally ill people..
I just faced a few armed to the teeth and with very bad personalities.. we didn't talk much about their 'problems'...or their lack of access to assistance...
some were 'freedom fighters' or 'patriots' or just mad blokes given access to firearms and explosives.. it was difficult to work out who needed 'help'... a large number were off their heads on all sorts of drugs mind you...
I was genuinely surprised how many very 'normal' people became totally tonto once they were given carte blanche to be so???
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Post by DeepSpace on Mar 14, 2015 21:11:24 GMT 1
deepspace.. I will have to bend to your informed opinion on mentally ill people.. I just faced a few armed to the teeth and with very bad personalities.. we didn't talk much about their 'problems'...or their lack of access to assistance... some were 'freedom fighters' or 'patriots' or just mad blokes given access to firearms and explosives.. it was difficult to work out who needed 'help'... a large number were off their heads on all sorts of drugs mind you... I was genuinely surprised how many very 'normal' people became totally tonto once they were given carte blanche to be so??? Yes I don't doubt that. We probably are both dealing with similar consequences of local, national & global failure to address things that are wrong wit the world. Which really is where I stand on this. If you dehumanise people or apply different standards to how we expect them to think or behave, or misunderstand either deliberately or through ignorance, why do we then feign surprise when fringe elements head off and stop acting like humans? |
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Post by Captainslapper on Mar 14, 2015 21:22:09 GMT 1
deepspace.. I will have to bend to your informed opinion on mentally ill people.. I just faced a few armed to the teeth and with very bad personalities.. we didn't talk much about their 'problems'...or their lack of access to assistance... some were 'freedom fighters' or 'patriots' or just mad blokes given access to firearms and explosives.. it was difficult to work out who needed 'help'... a large number were off their heads on all sorts of drugs mind you... I was genuinely surprised how many very 'normal' people became totally tonto once they were given carte blanche to be so??? Yes I don't doubt that. We probably are both dealing with similar consequences of local, national & global failure to address things that are wrong wit the world. Which really is where I stand on this. If you dehumanise people or apply different standards to how we expect them to think or behave, or misunderstand either deliberately or through ignorance, why do we then feign surprise when fringe elements head off and stop acting like humans? Presuming you're talking about british muslims there. How has this country 'dehumanised' them, or applied different standards to them, or misunderstood them? All i see is a country bending over backwards on their every whim and giving them freedoms, benefits and services that they wouldn't have imagined possible in the societies their families originated from. Think thats why I find the fringe elements that 'head off and stop acting like humans' so inexplicable and irrational. And also the support / understanding, ( or lack of condemnation) , that they get from so many in their wider community. |
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Post by DeepSpace on Mar 14, 2015 21:44:12 GMT 1
Yes I don't doubt that. We probably are both dealing with similar consequences of local, national & global failure to address things that are wrong wit the world. Which really is where I stand on this. If you dehumanise people or apply different standards to how we expect them to think or behave, or misunderstand either deliberately or through ignorance, why do we then feign surprise when fringe elements head off and stop acting like humans? Presuming you're talking about british muslims there. How has this country 'dehumanised' them, or applied different standards to them, or misunderstood them? All i see is a country bending over backwards on their every whim and giving them freedoms, benefits and services that they wouldn't have imagined possible in the societies their families originated from. Think thats why I find the fringe elements that 'head off and stop acting like humans' so inexplicable and irrational. And also the support / understanding, ( or lack of condemnation) , that they get from so many in their wider community. Not just British, no; we live in a small world these days & people see actions perpetuated (sometimes in 'our' name or with 'our' active participation or tacit approval) from their perspectives. That includes what is happening in Palestine, Iraq, Afghanistan, etc, etc. Applied different standards? I think a re-read of this thread can answer that. Numerous biases & presumptions that have been proven factually incorrect & expectations that they "should" behave in certain ways & application of standards that don't apply to the rest of us. It happens. Most people just get on with life though, but that doesn't mean they don't get p1ssed off at things. As do we all, & as is the case in any community young, vulnerable or hotheaded people might be prone to take inappropriate actions especially if they get a cause celebre to tag onto. It's not hard to persuade impressionable people to head off to fight for someone else's values or more likely power/money. If it was, half the wars in history would never have happened. |
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Post by Captainslapper on Mar 14, 2015 22:41:17 GMT 1
In terms of going off and joining some barbaric bunch of religious murderers, Im not getting how our expectations of behaviour and the standards we set don't apply to every group in society.
Thats if youre trying to suggest we react differently somehow to muslims who do that.
Im also not getting how 'its not hard' to get people who enjoy all the advantages and freedoms our society lays out for them, to go off and join such groups as they busily get on with their oppressively barbaric treatment of people.
It should be impossible, never mind 'not hard'!!
The problem youre argument has, is that the presumptions and biases you claim are incorrect, actually aren't in the main, and are often just telling an unpalatable truth.
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