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Hoggy
Apr 29, 2024 17:13:29 GMT 1
Post by bluebell on Apr 29, 2024 17:13:29 GMT 1
Do you know if AB has had input into that decision? No idea. I imagine not, as it seems that Hogg just has a rolling contract that is extended automatically. I think hogg decides weather he stays or not, he probs tells the club what games he will play or not and also what wages he will deem acceptable or not. It will probs be a 3 year deal aswell .
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Hoggy
Apr 29, 2024 17:14:04 GMT 1
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Post by Spike24 on Apr 29, 2024 17:14:04 GMT 1
Do you know if AB has had input into that decision? He ain't got a clue, just like the rest of us.
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Post by bluestripe on Apr 29, 2024 17:20:47 GMT 1
Well if this thread is anything to go by, I might need to get the ladders, brush and whitewash at the ready. 🤪
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htafcokay
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Hoggy
Apr 29, 2024 17:21:19 GMT 1
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Post by htafcokay on Apr 29, 2024 17:21:19 GMT 1
Do you know if AB has had input into that decision? He ain't got a clue, just like the rest of us. Okay 👍
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Hoggy
Apr 29, 2024 17:21:38 GMT 1
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Post by royalflush on Apr 29, 2024 17:21:38 GMT 1
Time to move on. Hoggy has always been at his best against superior sides who have the majority of the ball and there's less demand on creativity. I'd like to think we'll be looking to not cede 75% possession to Shrewsbury, Stevenage & Burton.
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Hoggy
Apr 29, 2024 17:24:13 GMT 1
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Post by runner76 on Apr 29, 2024 17:24:13 GMT 1
Hear today he’d downed tools and walked out after a bust up…. Hogg has had a bust up? Who with and why? We are nosy buggers, aren’t we? No idea just heard rumour !
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Post by impact on Apr 29, 2024 17:24:25 GMT 1
Time to move on. Hoggy has always been at his best against superior sides who have the majority of the ball and there's less demand on creativity. I'd like to think we'll be looking to not cede 75% possession to Shrewsbury, Stevenage & Burton. His best season for us was the year we had the most possession.
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Ross83
Jimmy Nicholson Terrier
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Post by Ross83 on Apr 29, 2024 17:24:33 GMT 1
Well.. it would cost a bit to remove the mural now, so probably for the best.
Joking aside, I think some have short memories and maybe it's not sunk in yet that we'll be in L1 next season. Who knows what the dynamic is behind the scenes, I just think every manager can't have been wrong to rely on him so much. Wagner & Corberan, the most successful two of recent times, both put their trust in him and other favourites, such as Schindler and Hefele spoke so highly of him as a captain. Whitehead, mentioned above.. another one and a leader himself.
Hope he is staying.
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Hoggy
Apr 29, 2024 17:52:36 GMT 1
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Post by turbo2 on Apr 29, 2024 17:52:36 GMT 1
Time to move on. Hoggy has always been at his best against superior sides who have the majority of the ball and there's less demand on creativity. I'd like to think we'll be looking to not cede 75% possession to Shrewsbury, Stevenage & Burton. Unless our passing improves then looking at anything I’ve seen this season possession in our games will be 50/50. We try a pass, give it away, the opponents try a pass and give it us back. Eat sleep drink repeat
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crux
Andy Booth Terrier
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Post by crux on Apr 29, 2024 18:03:29 GMT 1
I don't see the point in offering Hogg another contract, unless it's something outside the first team squad such as B team player coach or mentor. Although if rumours of his recent bust up/hissy fit are true, then he can do one for me!
Midfield need a complete rebuild this summer and that includes some decent experience that should replace any need for Hogg to remain.
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Ross83
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Post by Ross83 on Apr 29, 2024 18:09:04 GMT 1
I don't see the point in offering Hogg another contract, unless it's something outside the first team squad such as B team player coach or mentor. Although if rumours of his recent bust up/hissy fit are true, then he can do one for me! Midfield need a complete rebuild this summer and that includes some decent experience that should replace any need for Hogg to remain. IF there has been a bust up, I'd bet my money on it being with the likes of Burgzorg or one of the other primadonna "footballers" we have plying their shit with us. If so, would you still want him to do one? If I worked by bollocks off every week whilst they posted on Insta and left early, I'd have felt like going in this morning and kicking off too!
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Hoggy
Apr 29, 2024 18:14:01 GMT 1
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Post by bluestripe on Apr 29, 2024 18:14:01 GMT 1
Can anyone imply which players have been part of the group downing tools / not wanting to leave training early?
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Post by impact on Apr 29, 2024 18:49:40 GMT 1
Everyone is up in arms about a lack of effort, a lack of professionalism, a lack of caring etc from the players, yet they're also happy to let one of the most loyal, most hard-working, most professional players I've ever seen pull on the blue & white stripes leave.
If this year has shown us anything it's that we're in short supply of leaders.
You hope he isn't having to be first choice next year, but there's no way I'm letting him leave.
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Post by garyroberts'leftfoot on Apr 29, 2024 19:04:54 GMT 1
Why do people think that long serving players have:
A) any intention of being a coach/mentor B) the relevant skills to be a coach/mentor?
If he isn’t playing then he can walk off into the sunset. We don’t need him around the club and I can’t see what he would offer.
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Hoggy
Apr 29, 2024 19:41:13 GMT 1
Post by araucaria on Apr 29, 2024 19:41:13 GMT 1
Everyone is up in arms about a lack of effort, a lack of professionalism, a lack of caring etc from the players, yet they're also happy to let one of the most loyal, most hard-working, most professional players I've ever seen pull on the blue & white stripes leave. If this year has shown us anything it's that we're in short supply of leaders. You hope he isn't having to be first choice next year, but there's no way I'm letting him leave. And quite right too. Hogg’s Town career (league only) - 345 appearances (including 15 as sub) - points per game 1.25 When he’s missing, 144 matches, fractionally less than a point per game. This season - 37 points from the 32 (I believe) he’s played (including 2 as sub). Missed 13 so far, 8 points. To be fair, if he’d played in any of the 5 four or five goal beatings away, we would have struggled to pick up any points and more pertinent, I think, is that he’s never played more than 37 league games in any season, (or less than 22), so it’s not a tenable argument to say if he’d played every game we’d have got x more points. Yet every season when he’s missed between 9 and 24 games, we’ve struggled to replace him, the exceptions being 2014-15, when Chris Powell had Coady and Butterfield and 2021-22 when Carlos had Lewis and, er, Scott High. We clearly haven’t done very well in replacing him this season. His detractors will win the argument sometime soon as age catches up with him; but they cannot deny his influence over 11 years and even on this appalling season. I wouldn’t let him go before we’ve found a replacement, unless Scotty is going to step up again. One final anecdote. 2-0 down at home to Preston, some little scrote behind me was bad-mouthing Hoggy. I pointed out that there were others he could have a go at. At the beginning of the second half, Hogg rolled back the years, winning the ball perhaps half a dozen times in quick time as we got one back and had Preston on the ropes. There was a chant of ‘he’s here, he’s there…’ and I dared to turn round and raise an eyebrow at his now sheepish-looking first-half critic. Then Moore took off the goalscorer, Maxwell let in another and the game petered out. I’ve only bothered to do the same analysis for one other player - James Vaughan, another who missed a lot of matches; we got 0.18 of a point per game more when he played than when he didn’t.
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Hoggy
Apr 29, 2024 19:50:06 GMT 1
Post by bierleyterrier on Apr 29, 2024 19:50:06 GMT 1
Good in his day, but well past his best. Almost guaranteed to miss large parts of the season through injury. We need a creative midfielder, someone with "vision".
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Post by specialun on Apr 29, 2024 20:00:23 GMT 1
I keep reading we need to replace Hogg / improve midfield
Great idea
Who? How?
We have failed to do that aside Mooy / O’Brien & Billing in 10 years
Hogg still remains our best centre mid
What makes anyone thinks we manage to do that now?
We said 5 years in a row Hogg won’t start regularly and he does as every one of our last 10+ managers relied on him and our recruitment hasn’t bettered him
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townian
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Post by townian on Apr 29, 2024 20:35:23 GMT 1
Everyone is up in arms about a lack of effort, a lack of professionalism, a lack of caring etc from the players, yet they're also happy to let one of the most loyal, most hard-working, most professional players I've ever seen pull on the blue & white stripes leave. If this year has shown us anything it's that we're in short supply of leaders. You hope he isn't having to be first choice next year, but there's no way I'm letting him leave. And quite right too. Hogg’s Town career (league only) - 345 appearances (including 15 as sub) - points per game 1.25 When he’s missing, 144 matches, fractionally less than a point per game. This season - 37 points from the 32 (I believe) he’s played (including 2 as sub). Missed 13 so far, 8 points. To be fair, if he’d played in any of the 5 four or five goal beatings away, we would have struggled to pick up any points and more pertinent, I think, is that he’s never played more than 37 league games in any season, (or less than 22), so it’s not a tenable argument to say if he’d played every game we’d have got x more points. Yet every season when he’s missed between 9 and 24 games, we’ve struggled to replace him, the exceptions being 2014-15, when Chris Powell had Coady and Butterfield and 2021-22 when Carlos had Lewis and, er, Scott High. We clearly haven’t done very well in replacing him this season. His detractors will win the argument sometime soon as age catches up with him; but they cannot deny his influence over 11 years and even on this appalling season. I wouldn’t let him go before we’ve found a replacement, unless Scotty is going to step up again. One final anecdote. 2-0 down at home to Preston, some little scrote behind me was bad-mouthing Hoggy. I pointed out that there were others he could have a go at. At the beginning of the second half, Hogg rolled back the years, winning the ball perhaps half a dozen times in quick time as we got one back and had Preston on the ropes. There was a chant of ‘he’s here, he’s there…’ and I dared to turn round and raise an eyebrow at his now sheepish-looking first-half critic. Then Moore took off the goalscorer, Maxwell let in another and the game petered out. I’ve only bothered to do the same analysis for one other player - James Vaughan, another who missed a lot of matches; we got 0.18 of a point per game more when he played than when he didn’t. You’re absolutely right. I’d rather have 37 games from Hogg next season that 46 from anyone else we’ve seen in his position over the past few years.
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Post by H6dds on Apr 29, 2024 21:01:38 GMT 1
it's standard datm logic that if we have five players in a certain position and the best of them isn't "good enough" then we should start by getting rid of that player instead of the 4 that is even worse.
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Ross83
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Hoggy
Apr 29, 2024 22:52:02 GMT 1
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Post by Ross83 on Apr 29, 2024 22:52:02 GMT 1
Can anyone imply which players have been part of the group downing tools / not wanting to leave training early? I've no idea but I'd hazard a guess at Sorba, Burgzorg and Diarra after some comments and recent AB selections. Arguments for Headley and Wiles being amongst them too. When you think back some selections have been odd. Spencer playing out of position at LB to accommodate an out of position Pearson at RB, when we've had 2 LBs on the bench. Pat Jones, another who has floated in and out of the squad. Matos struggled to start when AB first arrived too, or I could be just reading too far into it after the recent comments.
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Post by Terriersmad on Apr 30, 2024 7:51:28 GMT 1
Everyone is up in arms about a lack of effort, a lack of professionalism, a lack of caring etc from the players, yet they're also happy to let one of the most loyal, most hard-working, most professional players I've ever seen pull on the blue & white stripes leave. If this year has shown us anything it's that we're in short supply of leaders. You hope he isn't having to be first choice next year, but there's no way I'm letting him leave. This is where I stand. Now I don't think Hogg is a saint - I think he's picked and chosen managers from time to time, and sometimes his own ego has got in the way - but he's the one player in the squad who can't be criticised for his competitive spirit and his vocal leadership. He's still our best midfielder, which is a reflection on the club and not him. We have to remodel the midfield. We need a Hogg mark 2. We need two midfielders who can play the possession game and who will always be available in possession - the big reason why so many look clumsy in possession is because our midfielders consistently stand behind opposition players and make themselves unavailable, whether intentionally or otherwise. Hogg doesn't hide. He might not have someone to pass to, and that exposes his limitations on the ball, but he's the one player who will make himself available. He's the one player who is an effective screen in front of the back four and who will engage the opposition when we're out of possession - given how deep he finds himself, it's remarkable how often this season he's led an effective press. I recall when he first arrived people weren't sold on him. It was when Wagner arrived and we went down the possession-based route that he really started to thrive at Town. When he was injured towards the end of 2015/16, people commented on how we missed him for the first time. Then Whitehead got his ban for stupidly kicking out at a Brentford player in the last match of that season, and it was the making of Hoggy at Town. He suddenly had THE partner in the middle, who was always available, and who allowed him to be the effective disruptor and where he could play entirely to his strengths. He was the steel fist in the velvet glove. We saw something similar under Corberan, who utilised O'Brien and Russell effectively, allowing Hogg to chaperone the midfield. But for all I say that those players allowed Hogg to play to his strengths, Hogg allowed those players the freedom to play to theirs. The test has to be whether we miss him when he isn't there. And we do. He gets a year, not from sentiment, but from footballing sense. But we have to move on from him at the same time, building for the future without him. But letting him go would significantly weaken us more than we can afford. He has qualities no other Town player has, and until we have someone (or several) proven with those qualities in the squad he has to be at the club.
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Hoggy
Apr 30, 2024 8:11:35 GMT 1
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Post by daltonterrier44 on Apr 30, 2024 8:11:35 GMT 1
Do you know if AB has had input into that decision? dosent look like he’ll be making any decisions to do with town in the future 😬🙄
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Post by Kirchenglocken on Apr 30, 2024 8:25:34 GMT 1
Can anyone imply which players have been part of the group downing tools / not wanting to leave training early? I've no idea but I'd hazard a guess at Sorba, Burgzorg and Diarra after some comments and recent AB selections. Arguments for Headley and Wiles being amongst them too. When you think back some selections have been odd. Spencer playing out of position at LB to accommodate an out of position Pearson at RB, when we've had 2 LBs on the bench. Pat Jones, another who has floated in and out of the squad. Matos struggled to start when AB first arrived too, or I could be just reading too far into it after the recent comments. I thought Spencer was playing lb cause the other two are shite, maybe that was just the datm view idk
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Ross83
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Hoggy
Apr 30, 2024 8:48:41 GMT 1
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Post by Ross83 on Apr 30, 2024 8:48:41 GMT 1
I've no idea but I'd hazard a guess at Sorba, Burgzorg and Diarra after some comments and recent AB selections. Arguments for Headley and Wiles being amongst them too. When you think back some selections have been odd. Spencer playing out of position at LB to accommodate an out of position Pearson at RB, when we've had 2 LBs on the bench. Pat Jones, another who has floated in and out of the squad. Matos struggled to start when AB first arrived too, or I could be just reading too far into it after the recent comments. I thought Spencer was playing lb cause the other two are shite, maybe that was just the datm view idk Quite possibly. I thought Headley was really kicking on and the bright spark in some of the shit performances then just seemed to go to shit.
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Post by royrace on Apr 30, 2024 8:51:29 GMT 1
Still people writing off Hogg despite the fact we were basically relegated as soon as he got injured!
Unless he deteriorates massively in the summer he'll be a huge asset in L1.
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boooothy
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Post by boooothy on Apr 30, 2024 8:54:02 GMT 1
Still people writing off Hogg despite the fact we were basically relegated as soon as he got injured! Unless he deteriorates massively in the summer he'll be a huge asset in L1. His best games for Town have always been the ones he didn’t play in.
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Post by The King's Head 1230 on Apr 30, 2024 9:05:23 GMT 1
If the club's ethos was continuous improvement in the squad then he would have been long gone. But he will & rightly so be remembered as a loyal, hardworking solid player. Time to move on.
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Hoggy
Apr 30, 2024 12:11:17 GMT 1
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Post by Kirchenglocken on Apr 30, 2024 12:11:17 GMT 1
I thought Spencer was playing lb cause the other two are shite, maybe that was just the datm view idk Quite possibly. I thought Headley was really kicking on and the bright spark in some of the shit performances then just seemed to go to shit. Yeah I looked fotward to a back 4 of Headley, Helik, Balker and Spencer. Injuries and inconsistencies get in the way though of what often seems like it could be decent.
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Hoggy
Apr 30, 2024 12:15:10 GMT 1
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Post by Million Dollar Babies on Apr 30, 2024 12:15:10 GMT 1
Surprised how many want to pay out good wages for a player who will miss at least 1/3rd of the season, maybe even half. The older he gets the more injuries he picks up
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Post by Essex Terrier on Apr 30, 2024 12:17:39 GMT 1
Arguably one of the best players Town has had, we write him off at our peril.
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