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Post by Deleted on Mar 23, 2009 13:32:25 GMT 1
Certainly agree with you with regards to Ternent, by not getting in a right back he's cost Holdsworth a chance in centre midfield.
I'd be dissapointed if he's allowed to go on a free, but on the other hand Lee Clark can only go off what he see's in training and on the pitch. I don't think Clark can be blamed for playing him at right back, when he's our only right back (as Tom Clarke proved on Saturday). Hopefully Holdsworth will do enough in the last few games to get a contract, its up to him to buckle down and show his worth. Then if he does re-sign, we can see how the squad shapes up in the summer, and then decide where he'd be best utilised for the good of the team.
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Post by ksne on Mar 23, 2009 16:13:44 GMT 1
Holdsworth playing in his correct position is without doubt worthy of a new contract.The lad has been asked to play full back and his performances have shown that he just is not one.
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Post by iangreaves on Mar 23, 2009 18:19:49 GMT 1
He didn't even consider him in centre midfield BECAUSE HE WAS AN ACADEMY BOY though It has absolutely nothing to do with him being an academy boy. Holdsworth has been playing full back as long as he's been in the first team. Did the two managers before Ternent play him there because he was an academy boy. Ternent started the season with him in the team in a position he has been playing for some four seasons or so under previous managers. He persevered with him even though he was playing poorly and finally dropped him after a particularly crap performance. It's simple. |
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Post by Captainslapper on Mar 23, 2009 18:57:16 GMT 1
He didn't even consider him in centre midfield BECAUSE HE WAS AN ACADEMY BOY though It has absolutely nothing to do with him being an academy boy. Holdsworth has been playing full back as long as he's been in the first team. Did the two managers before Ternent play him there because he was an academy boy. Ternent started the season with him in the team in a position he has been playing for some four seasons or so under previous managers. He persevered with him even though he was playing poorly and finally dropped him after a particularly crap performance. It's simple. Don't think so. Turnip had clearly decided for whatever reason that he didn't want any of GMs players in the team. So Clarke, Collins ,Skarz, Worthy, Berrett were all immediately out of the picture. The only reason Holdsworth wasn't was because Turnip hadn't brought in a right back . If he had AH would have been out from the start aswell. I doubt Turnip ever even considered playing Holdsworth in midfield, even though he was our best player the season before. AH didn't play that poorly at right back at all. Thats just not true. He was ok, not great but ok, which made him better than most at the time. Look back to the post-match chat on here from that time and you won't find many, if any at all, threads slating Holdsworth. In nearly all the games he was one of the few to escape the critisism. Consistantly average perhaps, but like I say, that was better than most. Turnip still grasped the chance to drop him and stuck with Goodwin at RB, who really was poor by the way! The likes of Clarke ,Skarz and Worthy only got back in the team when it became clear ,even to Turnip, that the signings hed made to replace them were inferior. Collins and Berrett had to wait for Murphy to take over. When a lion takes over another lion's pride, the first thing he does is kill all the previous lions cubs. Its all about his dominance being unchallenged then and in the future. Turnip has the same phylosophy in management.  |
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Post by terrierng on Mar 23, 2009 19:08:24 GMT 1
before i start i want holdswort.h to stay as cover for a rb and a place in the middle,buts thats me,captain you say holdsworth has been treated bad by clark??  ? he is clarks captain,played him every game he could of.ok at rb but unless you havnt noticed we havnt another,no fault of clarks,he must think he didnt need one in jan,thus showing confidence in him,if he is the best midfielder at town why didnt murphy play him there?maybe because we havnt anyone else or maybe god forbid murphy prefered others there?either way you surley cant think hes been treated bad by clark?jeez the guy is getting way too much stick on here,no way has he treated holdsworth badly,you have a downer on him cos he loaned worthy out. |
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Post by Floyds on Mar 23, 2009 19:10:12 GMT 1
He has been average all this season, and his game has gone backwards. For this reason i think it would be better for him and us if he went.
If Craney/Flynn/whoever else you want to name's contract was up this summer i would be saying release them as well. Nothing to do with him being an academy lad or not. If they are consistently not performing then i dont think they should be in the team.
And i dont get the argument that all our signings have not improved the team - therefore keep the existing lot and accept that we are going to be mediocre/poor and finish 14th again
We may as well try and get better players in and get out of this league?
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Post by pozza on Mar 23, 2009 19:15:36 GMT 1
Holdsworth playing in his correct position is without doubt worthy of a new contract.The lad has been asked to play full back and his performances have shown that he just is not one. Bollocks. Holdsworth has been more than capable of playing at right back for the 3 previous seasons, so why all of a sudden is not good enough to play there? He's had a quiet season thats all, and thats going by his own high standards. He's done no worse than anyone else this time round. |
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Post by C.H on Mar 23, 2009 19:27:20 GMT 1
rubbish the people that want him out on here one bad season not evan that a few bad games we are in the bottom half playing bad when ternant was here why shift it all onto holdsworth
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Post by panasonicgeese on Mar 23, 2009 19:35:29 GMT 1
I know everyone is entitled to there opinion and that I respect to all posters on here.
In my opinion Andy H is an excellent player who Town would be wrong to lose. Everyone has peaks and troughs no matter what job you do. He has shown passion and commitment even more so when he had the captains armband. Body language speaks loud and his is of a passion towards our great club!
It's when the chips are down that colleagues etc rally round and offer support and that is what we should be doing to ALL Town players.
Andy H will discover his excellent form again that is without doubt and with blue and white running through his veins it will be to benefit of Huddersfield Town!
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Post by C.H on Mar 23, 2009 19:37:51 GMT 1
I know everyone is entitled to there opinion and that I respect to all posters on here. In my opinion Andy H is an excellent player who Town would be wrong to lose. Everyone has peaks and troughs no matter what job you do. He has shown passion and commitment even more so when he had the captains armband. Body language speaks loud and his is of a passion towards our great club! It's when the chips are down that colleagues etc rally round and offer support and that is what we should be doing to ALL Town players. Andy H will discover his excellent form again that is without doubt and with blue and white running through his veins it will be to benefit of Huddersfield Town! spot on |
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Post by ksne on Mar 23, 2009 20:31:10 GMT 1
Holdsworth playing in his correct position is without doubt worthy of a new contract.The lad has been asked to play full back and his performances have shown that he just is not one. Bollocks. Holdsworth has been more than capable of playing at right back for the 3 previous seasons, so why all of a sudden is not good enough to play there? He's had a quiet season thats all, and thats going by his own high standards. He's done no worse than anyone else this time round. Pozza I do not want AH to go  but for me he is a better midfielder than a RB. |
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Post by ksne on Mar 23, 2009 20:32:12 GMT 1
I know everyone is entitled to there opinion and that I respect to all posters on here. In my opinion Andy H is an excellent player who Town would be wrong to lose. Everyone has peaks and troughs no matter what job you do. He has shown passion and commitment even more so when he had the captains armband. Body language speaks loud and his is of a passion towards our great club! It's when the chips are down that colleagues etc rally round and offer support and that is what we should be doing to ALL Town players. Andy H will discover his excellent form again that is without doubt and with blue and white running through his veins it will be to benefit of Huddersfield Town! Absolutely chuffin right he will ;D |
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Post by pozza on Mar 23, 2009 20:40:48 GMT 1
Bollocks. Holdsworth has been more than capable of playing at right back for the 3 previous seasons, so why all of a sudden is not good enough to play there? He's had a quiet season thats all, and thats going by his own high standards. He's done no worse than anyone else this time round. Pozza I do not want AH to go but for me he is a better midfielder than a RB. While that may be true, to suggest he isn't good to play at right back is a a bit daft seeing has he has played there consistently well for 3 seasons before this season. I hope he stays, even if its just becuase he can play in various places all over the field. Look at O'Shea at Man Utd, not the greatest of players but the fact he can play in 3/4 places means in times of need he invaluable to the team. |
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Post by ksne on Mar 23, 2009 20:49:22 GMT 1
He hasn`t though been as effective as RB this season.IMO.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 23, 2009 23:26:10 GMT 1
That's exactly my point Pozza. Some are suggesting Holdsworth poor form is because he's playing right back, and that if he played central midfield he'd be great again. But I don't think there's any truth in that, I think by his high standards he's just having a poor season, he'd probably have had a poor season wherever he played.
I'm sure he'll bounce back given the chance, and I really hope he gets a new contract (or signs the one he's already been offered). The trouble is Lee Clark can only judge him on what he's seen so far, both on the pitch and on the training field.
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Post by specialun on Mar 23, 2009 23:36:18 GMT 1
Its quite clear what I think!
But I have to say, I think there's been a lot of good posts in this thread.
I don't think clark can be blamed for playing his right back given ternent created a squad with 7 centre mids, 4 left backs and 0 right backs - but the letter he is getting in the post will suggest it would be remiss of him not to even give him a go in midfield!
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Post by Captainslapper on Mar 24, 2009 1:47:52 GMT 1
3 left backs. Clark signed the vital 4th
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Post by Yorkie on Mar 24, 2009 6:56:49 GMT 1
At the end of the day if Lee Clark lets him go then I'll fully support the decision. He knows more than anyone on here about what he needs and if he feels he can go out and get a better right back and for that matter midfielder then fair enough. And as for your comment earlier, yes I am judging him mainly on playing at right back because that's where he's played 90% of the time, it's his own fault for not persuading the manager to give him a go in centre mid. And even in centre mid his not that bloody special.
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Post by Captainslapper on Mar 24, 2009 10:37:45 GMT 1
How can Lee Clark know he can go out and get a better midfielder when he hasn't seen Holdsworth play midfield  Not that bloody special is your opinion, which is fair enough, but you have to admit he was 'special' enough to sweep the board in POTS awards in a team that finished higher than this one probably will. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 24, 2009 10:39:17 GMT 1
3 left backs. Clark signed the vital 4th It took a 4th left back to get Williams playing well. Brilliant management from Clarky  |
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Post by C.H on Mar 24, 2009 10:54:22 GMT 1
holdsworth will not go in the summer end of
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Post by Yorkie on Mar 24, 2009 11:04:27 GMT 1
Was league 1 as strong last year as it is this year?
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Post by Captainslapper on Mar 24, 2009 12:05:07 GMT 1
Baring in mind we were, until very recently, in with an excellent chance of a play-off place despite playing with no strikers all season
(NINE goals from open-play from our strikers all season, league and cup!) and being as poor as we were under Turnip for 3 months, then Id say, yes, it was.
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Post by shawsie on Mar 24, 2009 12:15:31 GMT 1
How can Lee Clark know he can go out and get a better midfielder when he hasn't seen Holdsworth play midfield Not that bloody special is your opinion, which is fair enough, but you have to admit he was 'special' enough to sweep the board in POTS awards in a team that finished higher than this one probably will. I think you will find slapps that he has watched him in training countless times and maybe he just doesnt think he is the right player for him - also he has had an issue in terms of cover for right back (as was evident with t clarke) and so maybe holdsworth has been a victim of his versatility. As for getting better midfielders, that is a pretty easy question to answer - of course we can bring in a better player providing we have the cash to lure him here. Unfortunately, our mediocrity for several seasons means players arent attracted by the stadium/fan base etc anymore and they wont be until we get some sustained consistency - i know for a fact that some players wouldnt come in jan because we werent close enough to the play offs for them to consider dropping division(s). That may of course change in the summer. |
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Post by Captainslapper on Mar 24, 2009 12:27:41 GMT 1
Ok, Ill accept that, but seeing someone in training is a long way short of seeing them in a match situation. The right back situation point you make is a sound one, but it begs the question of why we haven't brought in a right back, permanant or loan, as back up or to replace Holdsworth if LC doesn't rate him in that position, but have signed a 4th left back in Werling! Odd one that by Clark.
Think you're right about attracting players in January from higher divisions. It must be very hard. Im sure it will change in the summer and I think the first signing will be a 'big' one that will help to attract others to come as it will show a real level of ambition we haven't seen for a long time.
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Post by HuddsTerrier on Mar 24, 2009 13:14:50 GMT 1
It was pretty clear to me Ternent had it in for the academy lads. Here's some facts, you do the circumstancial... We finished last season starting the Luton game coming off something like 6 games unbeaten (inc. play off finalists L**ds and Donnie), about 4 hours without conceding and with NINE academy players involved against Luton ... Holdsworth, Skarz, Mirfin, Tom Clarke, Nathan Clarke, Collins, Worthy, Berrett and Booth (plus Schofield who came to the club very much as a kid) By the time we played MK Dons in mid August (fourth game of the season) we had ONE ex-academy starting in the side, Holdsworth. FACT Don't forget the MK Dons performance was a complete and utter shambles! I will never forget the 5 on 1 breakaway Also.. Ternent it would appear choose to snub Smithies completely (a now £4m rated keeper!). Not even a place on Ternent's bench with 5 outfield players prefferred yet we trialled Paul Gerrard (I suspect he would have been on the bench if signed) Ternent DID look to bring in a right back, I think his name was Jamie Smith from Stockport, he is now playing for ... Altringham. And Ternent also trialled Tony Grant (further packing our midfield, remember Collins and Berrett - both fresh from playing for RoI U21's in Malaysia (a tournament I think Pilks wasn't selected for) - hardly figured under Ternent) For the record Gerrard and Grant are still unattached, wonder why! Also IMO Holdsworth is being hard done to (like Worthy). He is most effective as a central midfielder (statisitically one of the best in League One in 07/08 - FACT), therefore that's where he should play. There's a lot of carp being talked about re: Holdsworth but at least Slaps, specialun and a few others are chipping in with some sense! |
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Post by thrice on Mar 24, 2009 13:23:13 GMT 1
Or did Stan simply see the deficiencies in the Academy lads that we are all now screaming out for Clark to address in the summer.
To be fair to him I thought Stan gave all the players (including the academy lads) a fair crack at the start of the season and they let him down in the same way that they have let Clark down at the back end of the season.
No way is playing Holdsworth in the middle (out of position!)the route to success in my eyes.
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Post by shawsie on Mar 24, 2009 13:36:54 GMT 1
Or did Stan simply see the deficiencies in the Academy lads that we are all now screaming out for Clark to address in the summer. To be fair to him I thought Stan gave all the players (including the academy lads) a fair crack at the start of the season and they let him down in the same way that they have let Clark down at the back end of the season. No way is playing Holdsworth in the middle (out of position!)the route to success in my eyes. Bit of both in answer to both yours and Hudds's previous point thrice. Yes, Ternent did a horrid job in trying to change things round - his man-management was non-existant and he alienated a number of players with his old fashioned "bully boy" style. He was however quite correct to break it up because most of them are simply not good enough - as the last four years have proved. Unfortunately alot of what he bought/trialled wasnt any better! IMO only Holdsworth and Clarke (at their best) from the academy have shown they can compete at the very top of this league on a regular (ish) level - berrett has potential and collins ability but no consistency. Worthy, t clarke, skarz, mirfin were/are all steady league 1 lads at best for me. |
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Post by bigdavek on Mar 24, 2009 14:53:08 GMT 1
I think its another Heart says no head says yes jobs, a bit like Worthy. If we are to mount a serious challenge for promotion next year unfortunately these guys aren't gonna cut it. Will never forget their commitment towards the club especially in the dark days and if they do return to the Galph' will give them the welcome they deserve.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 24, 2009 14:56:14 GMT 1
Or did Stan simply see the deficiencies in the Academy lads that we are all now screaming out for Clark to address in the summer. To be fair to him I thought Stan gave all the players (including the academy lads) a fair crack at the start of the season and they let him down in the same way that they have let Clark down at the back end of the season. No way is playing Holdsworth in the middle (out of position!)the route to success in my eyes. Bit of both in answer to both yours and Hudds's previous point thrice. Yes, Ternent did a horrid job in trying to change things round - his man-management was non-existant and he alienated a number of players with his old fashioned "bully boy" style. He was however quite correct to break it up because most of them are simply not good enough - as the last four years have proved. Unfortunately alot of what he bought/trialled wasnt any better! IMO only Holdsworth and Clarke (at their best) from the academy have shown they can compete at the very top of this league on a regular (ish) level - berrett has potential and collins ability but no consistency. Worthy, t clarke, skarz, mirfin were/are all steady league 1 lads at best for me. Exactly. I can't imagine Matty Young feeding Danny Racchi the ball and him whipping it in and Lucas Akins providing a textbook finish. |
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? he is clarks captain,played him every game he could of.ok at rb but unless you havnt noticed we havnt another,no fault of clarks,he must think he didnt need one in jan,thus showing confidence in him,if he is the best midfielder at town why didnt murphy play him there?maybe because we havnt anyone else or maybe god forbid murphy prefered others there?either way you surley cant think hes been treated bad by clark?jeez the guy is getting way too much stick on here,no way has he treated holdsworth badly,you have a downer on him cos he loaned worthy out.
but for me he is a better midfielder than a RB.
