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Post by Chips Longhorn on Jun 5, 2012 17:37:50 GMT 1
with Ched Evans sheff utd wouldn't have been in the playoffs to start with.. It is likely we would have been facing wednesday at wembley who might have been a bit less forgiving in front of goal.. But such is life ... We are up now it's what Grayson does now which will define him, not the last three months in my opinion
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Post by seanyd1brit on Jun 5, 2012 17:38:05 GMT 1
I thought we were unlucky not to win the game in normal time, then even more unlucky not to win it in injury time. The width of a post got us some luck in the pens, but not before it had got them some luck in the 2nd half. Ched Evans getting sent down and Johnson getting fit were 2 strokes of luck. The biggest stroke of luck though IMO was having an owner brave enough to change managers at such a late stage, as I don't think we'd have got past MK Dons if he hadn't. Spot on Captain. I said this on another thread but for me the key moment in the playoffs was bringing on Higgy for Arfield away at MK. Highly doubt we'd have won 2-0 had that not happened. That plus the general tactics Grayson employed that day got us through the semi final, earning us the right to play a depleted Sheffield United.
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Post by Doc Halladay 32 on Jun 5, 2012 17:50:11 GMT 1
I thought we were unlucky not to win the game in normal time, then even more unlucky not to win it in injury time. The width of a post got us some luck in the pens, but not before it had got them some luck in the 2nd half. Ched Evans getting sent down and Johnson getting fit were 2 strokes of luck. The biggest stroke of luck though IMO was having an owner brave enough to change managers at such a late stage, as I don't think we'd have got past MK Dons if he hadn't. Spot on Captain. I said this on another thread but for me the key moment in the playoffs was bringing on Higgy for Arfield away at MK. Highly doubt we'd have won 2-0 had that not happened. That plus the general tactics Grayson employed that day got us through the semi final, earning us the right to play a depleted Sheffield United. I still think we would have been playing and probably losing to Wednesday in the playoff final had Evans not been sent down. So in that respect I feel the change of our manager, whilst obviously giving us a better chance of getting to the final wouldn't have made a difference against Wednesday. And to be fair LC had a great record against Karl Robinson and the MK Dons. But we are reaching the hypotheticals now.
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Post by 3Pipe on Jun 5, 2012 18:14:51 GMT 1
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Post by Scissett Terrier! on Jun 5, 2012 18:21:37 GMT 1
so why was he interviewed and everyone at leicester thinking it was a done deal expect sorting his release from town? So much so that one journo put it out in public and william hill had stopped taking bets!
As for the leeds job, just what was he doing at thorpe arch then?
you really dont think we were going backwards under clark?
Graysons still new to the role you cant say we are forward or backward under him yet, well actually you can where one massive step forward as we're out of league one!
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towny4ever
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Post by towny4ever on Jun 5, 2012 18:23:41 GMT 1
Ha wondered if this wud cum back to haunt me.....ok I hold my hands up he got us up although a bit hairy. I APOLOGISE : : Things were said in the heat of the moment-I still can't pretend I like Grayson as our manager and even tho all the players were LCs he did bring an air of calmness and experience. His tactics away at MK won us the semi. On to next season lets hope he doesn't make wholesale changes and can bring in some quality. : :
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Post by artysid on Jun 5, 2012 18:24:23 GMT 1
I wonder whether deep down Clark is pleased or a bit miffed that we got promoted?
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Post by 3Pipe on Jun 5, 2012 18:24:32 GMT 1
I thought we were unlucky not to win the game in normal time, then even more unlucky not to win it in injury time. The width of a post got us some luck in the pens, but not before it had got them some luck in the 2nd half. Ched Evans getting sent down and Johnson getting fit were 2 strokes of luck. The biggest stroke of luck though IMO was having an owner brave enough to change managers at such a late stage, as I don't think we'd have got past MK Dons if he hadn't. Can't argue with any of that, except the last bit is down to speculation and opinion. We'll never know.
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Post by Scissett Terrier! on Jun 5, 2012 18:25:49 GMT 1
Ha wondered if this wud cum back to haunt me.....ok I hold my hands up he got us up although a bit hairy. I APOLOGISE Things were said in the heat of the moment-I still can't pretend I like Grayson as our manager and even tho all the players were LCs he did bring an air of calmness and experience. His tactics away at MK won us the semi. On to next season lets hope he doesn't make wholesale changes and can bring in some quality. lets hope he does both or we'll get relegated!
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Post by Chips Longhorn on Jun 5, 2012 18:28:31 GMT 1
Ha wondered if this wud cum back to haunt me.....ok I hold my hands up he got us up although a bit hairy. I APOLOGISE Things were said in the heat of the moment-I still can't pretend I like Grayson as our manager and even tho all the players were LCs he did bring an air of calmness and experience. His tactics away at MK won us the semi. On to next season lets hope he doesn't make wholesale changes and can bring in some quality. Go on pretend... Just for a minute.. Pretend you like a manager who got us promoted.. It's cleansing... Just ask malv
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Post by BoltonTerrier on Jun 5, 2012 18:28:48 GMT 1
No need to drag up old threads like this. Its all hindsight and fine margins between those who were right and wrong. ( having said that, Hoyles decision was justified when we got past MKDons IMO ) Pretty sure this thread would have cropped up in one of the many 'told you so' threads had we not gone up though! Malvern was asking who had slated hoyle about the grayson signing so I brought the thread up to show him there had been numerous posters... Nothing sinister
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Post by 3Pipe on Jun 5, 2012 18:31:39 GMT 1
I wonder whether deep down Clark is pleased or a bit miffed that we got promoted? He's had nothing but good to say about the club since he left. Probably pleased for the club and for the players he signed but miffed he's not still in charge.
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Post by Headless Chicken on Jun 5, 2012 18:44:33 GMT 1
with Ched Evans sheff utd wouldn't have been in the playoffs to start with.. It is likely we would have been facing wednesday at wembley who might have been a bit less forgiving in front of goal.. But such is life ... We are up now it's what Grayson does now which will define him, not the last three months in my opinion If only Pilks didn't break his leg and Posh be given a dodgy pen the year before...... Let's not go there........ ooops, looks like I have :fish:
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Post by Deleted on Jun 5, 2012 18:53:27 GMT 1
so why was he interviewed and everyone at leicester thinking it was a done deal expect sorting his release from town? So much so that one journo put it out in public and william hill had stopped taking bets! As for the leeds job, just what was he doing at thorpe arch then? you really dont think we were going backwards under clark? Graysons still new to the role you cant say we are forward or backward under him yet, well actually you can where one massive step forward as we're out of league one! If all that happened, then why did Dean Hoyle sit there at Canalside post the Clark sacking, look every Huddersfield fan in the eye and say that there had been no approach from any club for Clark and that Lee Clark had NOT been for any interview?
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Post by Scissett Terrier! on Jun 5, 2012 19:06:56 GMT 1
so why was he interviewed and everyone at leicester thinking it was a done deal expect sorting his release from town? So much so that one journo put it out in public and william hill had stopped taking bets! As for the leeds job, just what was he doing at thorpe arch then? you really dont think we were going backwards under clark? Graysons still new to the role you cant say we are forward or backward under him yet, well actually you can where one massive step forward as we're out of league one! If all that happened, then why did Dean Hoyle sit there at Canalside post the Clark sacking, look every Huddersfield fan in the eye and say that there had been no approach from any club for Clark and that Lee Clark had NOT been for any interview? I believe dean has only ever said there was no approach thats the first time ive heard of him saying no interview. A respected journo does not go public like he did without having credible sources from inside the club! unfortunately it was that tweet that unravelled everything that day and probably stopped us getting rid sooner on the other hand we wouldnt have got grayson had that happened. William Hill knew about the interview and pending offer and suspended betting (they also knew mark hughes had also been interviewed for the job). i get good info here as my cousin is well positioned in the company to provide that sort of info and is very very rarely wrong. if people want to not think he was ever one step from walking out for that job thats their choice but i know what i believe. what i do know is we're well shot and we now have a manager who can take us forward.
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Post by onekennyirons on Jun 5, 2012 19:19:40 GMT 1
At the end of the day, we were probably gonna end up in the play offs whether Hoyle got rid or not so i guess the only way to assess the decision is to reflect on the play offs and especially the final. I think the differences in the two managers are very apparent from that game. Firstly, the way Grayson got his message across at half time was impressive, lets be honest, we were poor in the first half. He was positive and wanted to win, a fact highlighted by taking Ward off for an extra forward in extra time. Thirdly, he oozes calmness, a quality so desperately needed towards the end of that game.
Now, im no Clark hater, he brought some good players to the club but to be fair he lost his way during his tenure. Even lost sight of what was good about the team in the first place.
So in the end, Hoyle was right. He was quoted as saying the play offs looked inevitable and he didnt think Clark would cope with a third campaign. Can anyone, in all honesty, really disagree with this? Just maybe flashback to that play off final, would Clark really have been so positive during the latter stages of the final or would we have succombed to the inevitable concession a la Peterborough and all gone home disappointed once again?
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Post by Deleted on Jun 5, 2012 19:31:08 GMT 1
If all that happened, then why did Dean Hoyle sit there at Canalside post the Clark sacking, look every Huddersfield fan in the eye and say that there had been no approach from any club for Clark and that Lee Clark had NOT been for any interview? I believe dean has only ever said there was no approach thats the first time ive heard of him saying no interview. A respected journo does not go public like he did without having credible sources from inside the club! unfortunately it was that tweet that unravelled everything that day and probably stopped us getting rid sooner on the other hand we wouldnt have got grayson had that happened. William Hill knew about the interview and pending offer and suspended betting (they also knew mark hughes had also been interviewed for the job). i get good info here as my cousin is well positioned in the company to provide that sort of info and is very very rarely wrong. if people want to not think he was ever one step from walking out for that job thats their choice but i know what i believe. what i do know is we're well shot and we now have a manager who can take us forward. It was in answer to a question from the crowd, in response to whether he'd been interviewed for the Wolves job. Another unfounded rumour... I do not believe for a second that he was at Thorpe Arch for anything other than a training match or to take in something or give a coaching seminar either. After all, Bates is never at Thorpe Arch. He's either in Monaco or at ER - that'd make no sense whatsoever. Clark though, being a UEFA A License coach, does give a lot of seminars and coaching sessions up, down and around the place. The Leicester thing was a funny one... I have a couple of sources inside the club and they've all said the same thing - no interview, no approach & no offer. But that's not to say that Clark's agent wasn't working overtime trying to engineer something. Then when it became apparent there was nothing doing, Clark committed to HTFC. There were some interesting comments from Dean, re Clark's agent at Canalside whereby Dean mentioned that Lee probably doesn't surround himself with the right people and right advice. Which came after questions on him going to sue the club for wrongful dismissal and questions re Terry Mac, Stephenson etc... The agent part is just my guess and interpretation BTW, it could be waaaay off.
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Post by noface on Jun 5, 2012 19:48:59 GMT 1
We beat mk dons away, lost to them at home and then drew 0-0 with sheff utd. Really don't see why any of those results were beyond Clark, not that it really matters now
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Post by Captainslapper on Jun 5, 2012 19:55:46 GMT 1
We beat mk dons away, lost to them at home and then drew 0-0 with sheff utd. Really don't see why any of those results were beyond Clark, not that it really matters now We'll never know. Everyone will have their own gut feeling about it I suppose.
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Post by rantinray on Jun 5, 2012 20:00:06 GMT 1
Arrogance in the extreme to sack a manager with Clark's passion for the club. The biggest bull shoiter we have had for a manager in a long time. The club will in the long run be far better off without Clark. I don't know if you have noticed or not but the guy has not walked into another job yet although I read that Gillingham are interested. Now that shows progress. Dean Hoyle gave Clark his biggest opportunity in management and he did not get with the program. Season after season we had the yo-yo team selection, myself I think he picked names out of a hat at random. Then he thinks he is the best thing since sliced bread and tries do jump ship.
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Post by rantinray on Jun 5, 2012 20:01:26 GMT 1
I thought we were unlucky not to win the game in normal time, then even more unlucky not to win it in injury time. The width of a post got us some luck in the pens, but not before it had got them some luck in the 2nd half. Ched Evans getting sent down and Johnson getting fit were 2 strokes of luck. The biggest stroke of luck though IMO was having an owner brave enough to change managers at such a late stage, as I don't think we'd have got past MK Dons if he hadn't. Not many chances on the day but Town had the best and at critical times of the game. So all in all the result was fair. Spot on Captain. I said this on another thread but for me the key moment in the playoffs was bringing on Higgy for Arfield away at MK. Highly doubt we'd have won 2-0 had that not happened. That plus the general tactics Grayson employed that day got us through the semi final, earning us the right to play a depleted Sheffield United.
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Dooky
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Post by Dooky on Jun 5, 2012 20:01:41 GMT 1
Points well made but I definately believe that something went on with Leicester but we will never know for certain. The majority of points on here are debatable but the one thing I strongly disagree with is about Clark not been a bottler. He clearly bottled in when it mattered twice - Millwall and Peterborough. The fact is, he couldn't get us over the finish line and Grayson could. Rather than raking over what could have beens and defending a man who is now confined to the HTFC history vault, why not embrace our new Manager? A already very succesful manager with a great reputation in the game. A manager who has got us up, given us what we have all wanted for the last 11 years!
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Post by Walton-on-the-Hill Terrier on Jun 5, 2012 20:04:43 GMT 1
This constant sniping and counter-sniping between pro-Clark, anti-Clark, pro-Grayson and anti-Grayson factions on this board is doing my head in! Here we are, just over a week since getting promoted at Wembley in a never-to-be-forgotten shootout, are there are still lots of you pointlessly going on about Lee Clark and Simon Grayson!
We will NEVER know where Town would have ended the season if Lee Clark had remained in charge! NEVER! It was Dean Hoyle's prerogative to make the managerial change that he did, and you have to say Dean Hoyle got it right, because Town are now in the Championship.
Just let it go will you! It's just pointless!
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Post by rantinray on Jun 5, 2012 20:10:01 GMT 1
This constant sniping and counter-sniping between pro-Clark, anti-Clark, pro-Grayson and anti-Grayson factions on this board is doing my head in! Here we are, just over a week since getting promoted at Wembley in a never-to-be-forgotten shootout, are there are still lots of you pointlessly going on about Lee Clark and Simon Grayson! We will NEVER know where Town would have ended the season if Lee Clark had remained in charge! NEVER! It was Dean Hoyle's prerogative to make the managerial change that he did, and you have to say Dean Hoyle got it right, because Town are now in the Championship. Just let it go will you! It's just pointless! I agree. We have all got an opinion about the manager change. That decision was Dean Hoyles, he writes the cheques. He has an inside track as to what did and didn't happen. What we need to do is get behind the present manger until he goes then we get behind the next manager. The King is dead long live the King.
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Post by Doc Halladay 32 on Jun 5, 2012 20:15:41 GMT 1
Points well made but I definately believe that something went on with Leicester but we will never know for certain. The majority of points on here are debatable but the one thing I strongly disagree with is about Clark not been a bottler. He clearly bottled in when it mattered twice - Millwall and Peterborough. The fact is, he couldn't get us over the finish line and Grayson could. Rather than raking over what could have beens and defending a man who is now confined to the HTFC history vault, why not embrace our new Manager? A already very succesful manager with a great reputation in the game. A manager who has got us up, given us what we have all wanted for the last 11 years! I think that defending a guy who IMO should be thanked for his efforts and wished luck for the future just as Dean did but some on here seem to have a personal vendetta against him which baffles me. I don't think (other than towny4ever) anyone has failed to embrace Grayson. But he is very early in his reign and he will be rightfully judged when he has assembled his own squad of players. The early signs are good and long may they continue. Don't fall into the trap that those who appreciated LC's efforts and endeavours are not fully behind Grayson.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 5, 2012 20:16:01 GMT 1
This constant sniping and counter-sniping between pro-Clark, anti-Clark, pro-Grayson and anti-Grayson factions on this board is doing my head in! Here we are, just over a week since getting promoted at Wembley in a never-to-be-forgotten shootout, are there are still lots of you pointlessly going on about Lee Clark and Simon Grayson! We will NEVER know where Town would have ended the season if Lee Clark had remained in charge! NEVER! It was Dean Hoyle's prerogative to make the managerial change that he did, and you have to say Dean Hoyle got it right, because Town are now in the Championship. Just let it go will you! It's just pointless! Fair point ;D
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Post by 3Pipe on Jun 5, 2012 21:24:25 GMT 1
The majority of points on here are debatable but the one thing I strongly disagree with is about Clark not been a bottler. He clearly bottled in when it mattered twice - Millwall and Peterborough. The fact is, he couldn't get us over the finish line and Grayson could. Rather than raking over what could have beens and defending a man who is now confined to the HTFC history vault, why not embrace our new Manager? A already very succesful manager with a great reputation in the game. A manager who has got us up, given us what we have all wanted for the last 11 years! So if Grayson had failed to win at Wembley in a game of tight margins, would he have been labelled a 'bottler' by you too ? Is that your definition ? Failed in the playoffs = bottler ? Millwall we just couldn't break them down. What Clark did after that was try (and succeed) to make us a team hard to beat, allbeit at the expense of good football. I've accepted our new manager, I rate him, he was my second choice behind Warnock. I agree with folks saying it's too early to judge him but he came through exactly when it mattered.
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Post by artysid on Jun 5, 2012 21:28:50 GMT 1
he was my second choice behind Grayson
ermm he is Grayson
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Post by artysid on Jun 5, 2012 21:29:42 GMT 1
well edited Mr Pipe
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Post by 3Pipe on Jun 5, 2012 21:30:00 GMT 1
Don't fall into the trap that those who appreciated LC's efforts and endeavours are not fully behind Grayson. :appl: :appl: Fully behind HTFC. : :
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