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Post by Sugy , Paignton Devon Terrier on Apr 2, 2019 13:40:08 GMT 1
So your saying Wagner was deluded --- oh dear Only an utter cretin could read that into what I said. So your now calling yourself an utter cretin -- its getting worse
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Post by Porrohman on Apr 2, 2019 16:41:06 GMT 1
Last seasons statistics also show that Tom Ince — sold in the summer to Stoke City — had been a key man last season, playing 2274 minutes and creating 17 chances (second behind Mooy) and also having 17 shots on target, the joint most with striker Mounié. Read more: downatthemac.proboards.com/thread/111966/rubbish-exactly-huddersfield-town-went#ixzz5jvaQUFiFBut I thought Tom Ince was shit, didnt score or create Good analysis and some interesting stats, says what most of us knew. At the end of the day the transfer dealings killed us and lead to Wagner jumping ship. It wasn't the sum of money spent but the way it was spent, we've bought some absolute pups and sold a few players we shouldn't have, Ince being the main one. I knew you'd break out the Kleenex on reading that 😂
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Post by Christ in Shades (art) on Apr 2, 2019 16:43:49 GMT 1
Spend some more brass Town.
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Post by Porrohman on Apr 2, 2019 16:48:34 GMT 1
A great piece from a journalist that has clearly spent a bit of time analysing us, which is now being derailed by another Tom Ince debate from the usual suspects. I have to disagree , Ince is mentioned in the article hence the discussion about him leaving. The main point of the article seems to be , we are not as bad as the table shows and with Ince and a decent striker we were much more likely to stay up ...... I couldn’t agree more . So we'd have been more likely to stop up with a decent striker and a winger who barely scored and didn't provide one assist and who has shown, consistently, through his career he's not PL quality ?
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digs
Jimmy Glazzard Terrier
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Post by digs on Apr 2, 2019 17:10:19 GMT 1
A quality striker and we'd have had 20+ points by Xmas and a real chance of staying up. That was the downfall. Which quality striker,and how much would that cost? dont forget Datm dont like Town spending money
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Post by bluestripe on Apr 2, 2019 17:17:32 GMT 1
With a conversation of 2 goals & ZERO assists would suggest just that. The point many fail to realise is that goals and assists aren't the be all and end all, however those 2 this season would have come in handy wouldn't they. The main point is if Ince had been retained Wagner would have been able to play the system he wanted to on realising the 3 new lads weren't ready/able to. 1st goal against man u was an example where Ince did some leg work but got no credit in terms of assists etc. I was not disappointed with Ince being sold, but as you indicate, the guys replacing him have yet to have any more impact
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Post by impact on Apr 2, 2019 17:20:31 GMT 1
The point many fail to realise is that goals and assists aren't the be all and end all, however those 2 this season would have come in handy wouldn't they. The main point is if Ince had been retained Wagner would have been able to play the system he wanted to on realising the 3 new lads weren't ready/able to. 1st goal against man u was an example where Ince did some leg work but got no credit in terms of assists etc. I was not disappointed with Ince being sold, but as you indicate, the guys replacing him have yet to have any more impact He did, but it was another example of him taking the wrong option. When he cut back in he should have buried it with his right. As it was he went back on his left and put it straight at de Gea from a tight angle. Thankfully it fell back to Mooy. He did some good stuff but missed some glorious chances when teed up, even better than what we have this year. He never really looked that threatening.
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Post by bluestripe on Apr 2, 2019 17:21:58 GMT 1
1st goal against man u was an example where Ince did some leg work but got no credit in terms of assists etc. I was not disappointed with Ince being sold, but as you indicate, the guys replacing him have yet to have any more impact He did, but it was another example of him taking the wrong option. When he cut back in he should have buried it with his right. As it was he went back on his left and put it straight at de Gea from a tight angle. Thankfully it fell back to Mooy. He did some good stuff but missed some glorious chances when teed up, even better than what we have this year. He never really looked that threatening. 100%
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Post by overtonterrierspirit on Apr 2, 2019 17:39:37 GMT 1
Ince sale was a mistake, plain and simple. I know a couple of ex pros that said to me last autumn; if you judge players by skys statistics you'll be looking in the wrong place. Players do things that aren't measurable by statistics, like drag 2 or 3 othes towards them, which of course creates space. That sale on it's own probably led to the situation we are in. Doesn't the fact that Ince has been less than impressive at Stoke this season back up the fact the end product is the missing element to his game? For the money they paid I am sure they were expecting a better return No. I don’t think Ince’s Stoke performances have anything to do with it at all. Stoke have struggled to adapt to the Championship as a team and as such Ince has suffered. I’ll totally agree that he was half a second too slow in the Premier League but at least he was a constant threat to the opposition and I admired his work rate. In the right team, playing an attacking system he is a massive asset.
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Post by otium (EPBS) on Apr 2, 2019 20:34:45 GMT 1
So they dont want to spend money but spend £63 million on wages. Would they have got the same points had they spent £20 million on wages? I assert they likely would. Instead of saying we wont sign players for £20 million how about saying to all the global players "come to Huddersfield and play in the Prem and we will give you £10k a week. Get yourself in the shop window". £63 mill for the worst Prem season ever....heads need to roll.
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Post by dugnet on Apr 2, 2019 21:08:24 GMT 1
So they dont want to spend money but spend £63 million on wages. Would they have got the same points had they spent £20 million on wages? I assert they likely would. Instead of saying we wont sign players for £20 million how about saying to all the global players "come to Huddersfield and play in the Prem and we will give you £10k a week. Get yourself in the shop window". £63 mill for the worst Prem season ever....heads need to roll. You make a fair point here, I'm not sure your £10k a week would fly but it shows that if you aren't completely on the ball you over pay for mediocrity. The fact is that our recruitment in the Championship was excellent, in the first season of the Premier League adequate/fortunate in this season sadly lacking. You could argue heads have rolled already, where they the right ones? Now that is an interesting question.
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Post by hypotenuse on Apr 2, 2019 21:54:07 GMT 1
A great piece from a journalist that has clearly spent a bit of time analysing us, which is now being derailed by another Tom Ince debate from the usual suspects. TBF the content of the article has highlighted some facts/stats that have not been used previously in the great Ince debate. Me - I would prefer to have kept him, but was ok with it trusting we'd be getting an upgrade on the lad, given his lack of goals/assists. Oh, how wrong I was ! Yes, you’ve hit the nail on the head. Ince was a terrific bloke who came across really well but lacked the physicality required in the prem. he is, however, way better than any of the players bought to replace him.
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Post by benhomly on Apr 2, 2019 22:11:08 GMT 1
So they dont want to spend money but spend £63 million on wages. Would they have got the same points had they spent £20 million on wages? I assert they likely would. Instead of saying we wont sign players for £20 million how about saying to all the global players "come to Huddersfield and play in the Prem and we will give you £10k a week. Get yourself in the shop window". £63 mill for the worst Prem season ever....heads need to roll. Why do you say the worst Prem season ever when you clearly know it isn’t?
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Post by Captainslapper on Apr 2, 2019 22:16:08 GMT 1
The most frustrating (but also encouraging) thing about this season is that we have been competitive in the vast majority of games, and fine margins have done for us. Yes, the fact that it happened so often shows that we weren't good enough, but that those margins existed so often suggests we were not far away and if we continue to build sensibly we can be in the running next year. We have 6 matches now to use as a preseason. I wouldn't give the team ages off this summer, get them all (along with early signings )off to another proper bonding camp and hit the ground running. I'm mourning our relegation but excited for next season. Think thats right. Bizarrely i do think we have been more generally competitive this season. We haven't had as many thumpings at all. Weve had chances to get a result in the large majority of games. I make it 11 defeats by a single goal, and in many of those we were the dominant side . It is fine lines, and for us that fine line has been mainly our strikers. I genuinely certain that with a half decent striker up front all season we'd still be at least competing to stay up now. Remember thinking back in October/November how our performances had been better in almost every corresponding game than the season before, yet we were really struggling in the table. Thats when the quality of our striker options killed us- that first third of the season. We were in the drop zone but should have been securely mid table IMO. Grant looks very promising but think by the time hes arrived and been worked into the side, we were already a busted flush. The spirit in the side had been broken, along with the manager.
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Post by otium (EPBS) on Apr 2, 2019 22:25:42 GMT 1
So they dont want to spend money but spend £63 million on wages. Would they have got the same points had they spent £20 million on wages? I assert they likely would. Instead of saying we wont sign players for £20 million how about saying to all the global players "come to Huddersfield and play in the Prem and we will give you £10k a week. Get yourself in the shop window". £63 mill for the worst Prem season ever....heads need to roll. Why do you say the worst Prem season ever when you clearly know it isn’t? Subjective...presume you mean Derby? They went down when there were only a couple of other really weak teams...we have gone down when there are 6 or 7. Derby capitulated....read the history of the season. OK, i just about give it you...the second worst team of nearly 400 in the history of the Prem...is that OK?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 2, 2019 22:25:42 GMT 1
Spend some more brass Town. Ah so simple a solution - following the Fulham example!
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Post by Captainslapper on Apr 2, 2019 22:37:06 GMT 1
Why do you say the worst Prem season ever when you clearly know it isn’t? Subjective...presume you mean Derby? They went down when there were only a couple of other really weak teams...we have gone down when there are 6 or 7. Derby capitulated....read the history of the season. OK, i just about give it you...the second worst team of nearly 400 in the history of the Prem...is that OK? Seasons not over yet. 1 win and we'll be the 4th worse. A couple of wins and we'll be the 6th worse But Im sure there'll be some tenuous reasons why ours is still worse.
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Post by drfootball on Apr 2, 2019 22:50:19 GMT 1
I have to disagree , Ince is mentioned in the article hence the discussion about him leaving. The main point of the article seems to be , we are not as bad as the table shows and with Ince and a decent striker we were much more likely to stay up ...... I couldn’t agree more . So we'd have been more likely to stop up with a decent striker and a winger who barely scored and didn't provide one assist and who has shown, consistently, through his career he's not PL quality ? Yes
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Post by otium (EPBS) on Apr 2, 2019 22:56:21 GMT 1
Subjective...presume you mean Derby? They went down when there were only a couple of other really weak teams...we have gone down when there are 6 or 7. Derby capitulated....read the history of the season. OK, i just about give it you...the second worst team of nearly 400 in the history of the Prem...is that OK? Seasons not over yet. 1 win and we'll be the 4th worse. A couple of wins and we'll be the 6th worse But Im sure there'll be some tenuous reasons why ours is still worse. That would be fourth "worst" Slapps. I judge it just as much on the lack of goals as the total of wins. When Derby went down with 6 to go (like us) they lost the last 6. We might get a win...but i doubt it. By the way...do you recall my thread in October telling you to get rich by backing Town not to score every game? No, but the Olympics one where i lost pips will raise its head weekly.
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Post by themanfromatlantis on Apr 2, 2019 23:00:35 GMT 1
Why do you say the worst Prem season ever when you clearly know it isn’t? Subjective...presume you mean Derby? They went down when there were only a couple of other really weak teams...we have gone down when there are 6 or 7. Derby capitulated....read the history of the season. OK, i just about give it you...the second worst team of nearly 400 in the history of the Prem...is that OK? Second worst team of nearly 400. Yep, the stats will not lie, however... Is that 400 teams who have collectively set out at the start of each season since 1992, or is it 49 teams who have plied their trade in the 26/27 yrs of the competition? Not forgetting the standing start & spending power of some of those 49 teams. Spare us the bollocks Oti - for a so-called prof odds man, citing 400 teams to exaggerate your point doesn't do you any favours...
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Post by themanfromatlantis on Apr 2, 2019 23:04:17 GMT 1
Seasons not over yet. 1 win and we'll be the 4th worse. A couple of wins and we'll be the 6th worse But Im sure there'll be some tenuous reasons why ours is still worse. That would be fourth "worst" Slapps. I judge it just as much on the lack of goals as the total of wins. When Derby went down with 6 to go (like us) they lost the last 6. We might get a win...but i doubt it. By the way...do you recall my thread in October telling you to get rich by backing Town not to score every game? No, but the Olympics one where i lost pips will raise its head weekly. Did you get rich?
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Post by otium (EPBS) on Apr 2, 2019 23:05:28 GMT 1
That would be fourth "worst" Slapps. I judge it just as much on the lack of goals as the total of wins. When Derby went down with 6 to go (like us) they lost the last 6. We might get a win...but i doubt it. By the way...do you recall my thread in October telling you to get rich by backing Town not to score every game? No, but the Olympics one where i lost pips will raise its head weekly. Did you get rich? It is relative....it depends on the bent African games for me.
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Post by otium (EPBS) on Apr 2, 2019 23:07:22 GMT 1
Subjective...presume you mean Derby? They went down when there were only a couple of other really weak teams...we have gone down when there are 6 or 7. Derby capitulated....read the history of the season. OK, i just about give it you...the second worst team of nearly 400 in the history of the Prem...is that OK? Second worst team of nearly 400. Yep, the stats will not lie, however... Is that 400 teams who have collectively set out at the start of each season since 1992, or is it 49 teams who have plied their trade in the 26/27 yrs of the competition? Not forgetting the standing start & spending power of some of those 49 teams. Spare us the bollocks Oti - for a so-called prof odds man, citing 400 teams to exaggerate your point doesn't do you any favours... 450 plus performances/completed seasons. 2nd worst as it stands.
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Post by Captainslapper on Apr 2, 2019 23:12:37 GMT 1
Why would you judge it on goals scored as much as points? What about goals conceded? Bad reffing decisions? Key injuries? Theres all sorts of factors ,so points accrued seems the overall best surely?.
Goals scored has been our downfall. Think thats obvious. That part of the team has been woeful. With a decent striker the rest of the team would quite possible stay up.
No i don;t recall that thread. I tend to skim past gambling ones.
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Post by themanfromatlantis on Apr 2, 2019 23:16:07 GMT 1
Second worst team of nearly 400. Yep, the stats will not lie, however... Is that 400 teams who have collectively set out at the start of each season since 1992, or is it 49 teams who have plied their trade in the 26/27 yrs of the competition? Not forgetting the standing start & spending power of some of those 49 teams. Spare us the bollocks Oti - for a so-called prof odds man, citing 400 teams to exaggerate your point doesn't do you any favours... 450 plus performances/completed seasons. 2nd worst as it stands. I get your approach & I don't deny your stats, I just think it's one of those bollocks type things that's trying to exaggerate the point by being sensationalist... 400 teams sounds far more impressive than the 49 that have actually taken part in the competition... Anyway, rather than try and fight what will ultimately be a losing battle with you, I'm just going to accept that you are a superior being and ask you for your autograph. Which, on evidence, will be worth a fecking small fortune in yrs to come. Can you sign Dig1's bowls as well - I'm sure he's a good egg & would happily relinquish his bowls bag if it were to result in a charity gaining thousands...
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Post by mrg on Apr 2, 2019 23:26:05 GMT 1
Why do you say the worst Prem season ever when you clearly know it isn’t? Subjective...presume you mean Derby? They went down when there were only a couple of other really weak teams...we have gone down when there are 6 or 7. Derby capitulated....read the history of the season. OK, i just about give it you...the second worst team of nearly 400 in the history of the Prem...is that OK? Are you serious mate? Sunderland have been total dogshit on at least 3 occasions I can remember.
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Post by terriertim on Apr 3, 2019 10:26:17 GMT 1
Some interesting reading here for all those that think throwing money at signing would have worked www.friendsoffulham.com/forum/index.php?PHPSESSID=4gq43bc3ebaaoumh2h78j53mg0&topic=70809.0100m did not keep this club up and now that will be in serious difficulty and desperate to offload in the summer or run the real risk of losing all thie parachute payments (whicj will be less than Towns as they only stayed for 1 year Dean is absolutely spoy on when he says that it has to be run with common sense.....we can all wish he had poured million s more in but thats easy for fans when its not their brass they are chucking away.
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Post by Torquayterrier on Apr 3, 2019 10:30:56 GMT 1
I think any comparison with Derby's season of 2007-8 is a bit wide of th emark. If anything the Prem is more polarised now with a less even share of the points across the table. The finishing totals above Derby from 16th to 19th were 37,36,36 and 35 points and then Derby bottom on 11 with a GD of -69. They were either second from bottom or bottom from their third league game until the end of the season.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 3, 2019 10:42:49 GMT 1
Statistically 2nd worst yes, but the fact that teams like Newcastle, Villa and Sunderland have gone down with the players they each had at their disposal at the times, are far far worse.
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Post by galpharm2400 on Apr 3, 2019 10:46:20 GMT 1
Why would you judge it on goals scored as much as points? What about goals conceded? Bad reffing decisions? Key injuries? Theres all sorts of factors ,so points accrued seems the overall best surely?. Goals scored has been our downfall. Think thats obvious. That part of the team has been woeful. With a decent striker the rest of the team would quite possible stay up. No i don;t recall that thread. I tend to skim past gambling ones. still firmly believe we may still be in with a chance, albeit a small one, of staying up had we managed to get the numbers of players we had back when we conceded to be actually pro actively defending.. the risk averse, fear filled playing tactics both going forward or defending killed us.. so full of fear we did not even rush to press around our own box.. as pointed out earlier the season is not over and whatever professionalism is left here needs galvanising into some performances of freedom and fight.. 2 or 3 clean sheets would be a bloody good start.. we do NOT have to be bottom and we could finish with a smile and some pride..
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