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Post by Million Dollar Babies on Jan 25, 2023 17:57:13 GMT 1
Even last season he didn't have many games where his open play performance was good. But he would pop up with a dead ball assist and you forget how many crosses he scuffed or the silly amount of times he tridd to flick it around a defender instead of just controlling it His demeanor on the pitch leaves a lot to be desired too. Good move this if we have a decent replacement lined up I think the replacements are already here, plus we have jones and Koroma - Koroma might well have got his hunger back . Koroma isn't good enough
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Post by Junior & Onuora on Jan 25, 2023 17:57:15 GMT 1
As I've said before, the lad has been on a hell of a ride. 2 years ago this month he was playing non-league. Then he moves up several divisions to fully pro football at the other end of the country. He has a superb season in his first full season, gets called up by his country and ends up at Wembley, before heading to the World cup. In between, he has 3 managers in 6 months. That his form has gone is gutting. That his head has gone is not hugely surprising. If you don't think the coaching staff have a duty to work with him on that there is something very wrong with your thought process. The decline is huge, and worrying. And it's a trend. See also John Russell, albeit to a lesser extent. If this isn't a huge part of MF's job, what is? Putting out the cones, giving the lads basic tactical guidance (and our tactics are pretty fucking basic) and telling stories of his dad's scaffolding exploits? This is a failure of our system. Simple. The same way that spotting him and turning him from a non-league player to a world cup player in 18 months is not all down to Sorba, but is in huge part a success of it. So any young player who loses form for a long period of time should carry on being paid, handsomely, by the club, any club, and partake in therapy carried out by the manager? Depends on how you define therapy. Clough's genius was knowing which player reacted best to a verbal bollocking and which responded best to a thumbs up. If you only do one or the other, then you're not very good at your job.
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Post by joeyjoneslocker on Jan 25, 2023 18:01:29 GMT 1
So any young player who loses form for a long period of time should carry on being paid, handsomely, by the club, any club, and partake in therapy carried out by the manager? Depends on how you define therapy. Clough's genius was knowing which player reacted best to a verbal bollocking and which responded best to a thumbs up. If you only do one or the other, then you're not very good at your job. Brian Clough was a rare genius. You can’t compare managers like that.
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Post by tepidterrier on Jan 25, 2023 18:01:31 GMT 1
Even last season he didn't have many games where his open play performance was good. But he would pop up with a dead ball assist and you forget how many crosses he scuffed or the silly amount of times he tridd to flick it around a defender instead of just controlling it His demeanor on the pitch leaves a lot to be desired too. Good move this if we have a decent replacement lined up I know I'm in the minority here but I love his demeanour on the pitch. You can tell how competitive, cocky, impulsive, and petulant he is just by watching him for a half. It's nothing if not entertaining. He's unpredictable but he's never got sent off (miraculously) or started on a team mate, so it's not a big deal. Just part of the wider entertainment value for me. Much better than having 11 robots.
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Post by terriersyndrome on Jan 25, 2023 18:07:07 GMT 1
Depends on how you define therapy. Clough's genius was knowing which player reacted best to a verbal bollocking and which responded best to a thumbs up. If you only do one or the other, then you're not very good at your job. Brian Clough was a rare genius. You can’t compare managers like that. You don't even need to look at Clough to see a manager keep squad unity, fighting for the same cause & keeping their levels high. Carlos was brilliant at it last season, Wagner also had excellent man management skills. This rookie walks in, declares he's not here to make friends & we're now 'reaping the benefits' of his lack of man management skills.
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Post by bluebell on Jan 25, 2023 18:09:57 GMT 1
Brian Clough was a rare genius. You can’t compare managers like that. You don't even need to look at Clough to see a manager keep squad unity, fighting for the same cause & keeping their levels high. Carlos was brilliant at it last season, Wagner also had excellent man management skills. This rookie walks in, declares he's not here to make friends & we're now 'reaping the benefits' of his lack of man management skills. Blame MF its the easy thing to do, Thomas , Russell and others were having trouble well before MF. It is very easy to blame MF we do not know what goes on behind the scenes and we never will know 100%.
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goodbet
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Post by goodbet on Jan 25, 2023 18:14:07 GMT 1
We are not coping Brentford are we!
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Post by Gag_N_Bone_Man on Jan 25, 2023 18:15:03 GMT 1
As I've said before, the lad has been on a hell of a ride. 2 years ago this month he was playing non-league. Then he moves up several divisions to fully pro football at the other end of the country. He has a superb season in his first full season, gets called up by his country and ends up at Wembley, before heading to the World cup. In between, he has 3 managers in 6 months. That his form has gone is gutting. That his head has gone is not hugely surprising. If you don't think the coaching staff have a duty to work with him on that there is something very wrong with your thought process. The decline is huge, and worrying. And it's a trend. See also John Russell, albeit to a lesser extent. If this isn't a huge part of MF's job, what is? Putting out the cones, giving the lads basic tactical guidance (and our tactics are pretty fucking basic) and telling stories of his dad's scaffolding exploits? This is a failure of our system. Simple. The same way that spotting him and turning him from a non-league player to a world cup player in 18 months is not all down to Sorba, but is in huge part a success of it. So any young player who loses form for a long period of time should carry on being paid, handsomely, by the club, any club, and partake in therapy carried out by the manager? Any young player who loses form as dramatically as Sorba has should carry on beiing paid, and be managed by the manager. The clue is in the job title, and the contract.
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Post by bluebell on Jan 25, 2023 18:21:49 GMT 1
So any young player who loses form for a long period of time should carry on being paid, handsomely, by the club, any club, and partake in therapy carried out by the manager? Any young player who loses form as dramatically as Sorba has should carry on beiing paid, and be managed by the manager. The clue is in the job title, and the contract. Who says MF has or isn't ? Wagner at Norwich has jsut sold Cantwell? a very talented footballer, is Wagner to blame for not man manging him? Wagner got rid of Vaughan and Lynch, because they couldn't "handle" his training. Is this bad man mangement . Do not forget in the second season he totally disrgarded with Dikabhy & Mbenza - Bad management , of course it wasn't as it is Wagner and he can walk on water you know. MF is the reason why Town are where they are simple as that and suits people's naratives down to the ground. MF is far from the problem , he has his flaws but is far from the main reason .
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Post by Captainslapper on Jan 25, 2023 18:29:47 GMT 1
You don't even need to look at Clough to see a manager keep squad unity, fighting for the same cause & keeping their levels high. Carlos was brilliant at it last season, Wagner also had excellent man management skills. This rookie walks in, declares he's not here to make friends & we're now 'reaping the benefits' of his lack of man management skills. Blame MF its the easy thing to do, Thomas , Russell and others were having trouble well before MF. It is very easy to blame MF we do not know what goes on behind the scenes and we never will know 100%. If the weathers crap some on here would want to blame Fotheringham. Thomas was absolute gash at the start of this season. Maybe Fotheringham snuck in ages before he got the job and started teaching him how to cock a cross up, miscontrol the ball and amble aimlessly about? If anything hes improved from that early season form under Fotheringham but is still nothing like the player he was for the first half of last season. Even the great Carlos 'Pepferginho' Corboran couldn't keep Sorba playing as well in the 2nd half of the season as he did in the 1st.
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Tiro
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Post by Tiro on Jan 25, 2023 18:30:14 GMT 1
Depends on how you define therapy. Clough's genius was knowing which player reacted best to a verbal bollocking and which responded best to a thumbs up. If you only do one or the other, then you're not very good at your job. Brian Clough was a rare genius. You can’t compare managers like that. Genius? I can’t vouch for that. Rare? Not one bit. I could give you a comprehensive list of examples of managers who were superb at getting the most out of a limited squad at a given time. And two on that list were at Town very recently. Arguably, when it mattered most, he couldn’t win around the players (we all know who that was….).
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kindo
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Post by kindo on Jan 25, 2023 18:31:10 GMT 1
Even last season he didn't have many games where his open play performance was good. But he would pop up with a dead ball assist and you forget how many crosses he scuffed or the silly amount of times he tridd to flick it around a defender instead of just controlling it His demeanor on the pitch leaves a lot to be desired too. Good move this if we have a decent replacement lined up Look at his face on the Maureen Proctor photo
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Post by Million Dollar Babies on Jan 25, 2023 18:35:05 GMT 1
Even last season he didn't have many games where his open play performance was good. But he would pop up with a dead ball assist and you forget how many crosses he scuffed or the silly amount of times he tridd to flick it around a defender instead of just controlling it His demeanor on the pitch leaves a lot to be desired too. Good move this if we have a decent replacement lined up Look at his face on the Maureen Proctor photo She had just bollocked him and told him to f off to Blackburn. I'm not surprised he looked like that
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Post by Gag_N_Bone_Man on Jan 25, 2023 18:38:27 GMT 1
For the record, I haven't singled out MF, I've said this a failure of the system and coaching staff as a whole. And it is, in part. If performance levels were solely down to players, there would be no coaching staff. Effective man management is an art, and in football a vital one. Being tactically astute but a shit man manager will get you nowhere in football. Being a good man manager with tactical limitations will always get you better results. Being good at both will elevate you into the realms of the greats.
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Post by Junior & Onuora on Jan 25, 2023 18:42:33 GMT 1
Depends on how you define therapy. Clough's genius was knowing which player reacted best to a verbal bollocking and which responded best to a thumbs up. If you only do one or the other, then you're not very good at your job. Brian Clough was a rare genius. You can’t compare managers like that. He was. But not only because of that. I think Warnock knew how to do it. I think Jackson knew how to do it. I think Wagner knew how to do it.
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Post by Captainslapper on Jan 25, 2023 18:45:38 GMT 1
For the record, I haven't singled out MF, I've said this a failure of the system and coaching staff as a whole. And it is, in part. If performance levels were solely down to players, there would be no coaching staff. Effective man management is an art, and in football a vital one. Being tactically astute but a shit man manager will get you nowhere in football. Being a good man manager with tactical limitations will always get you better results. Being good at both will elevate you into the realms of the greats. Sorbas inability to cross a ball very well this season, or the way he struggles to control the ball or dribble with it,.. none of that is anything to do with tactics or systems. Its just a player losing his form badly and struggling to get it back. All a manager can do is encourage him and give him as many opportunities to play his way back into form as he can,, and Thomas has had loads of those chances. Sooner or later you have to look elsewhere and weve just signed Knockaert, Waghorn and Hungbo who all play a wide attacking role. Time will tell if any or all of them are better options that Thomas has been this season. He hasnt exactly set a high bar for them to aim at.
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Post by nicovaesen on Jan 25, 2023 18:56:25 GMT 1
He will turn into giggs as soon as he pulls on a Blackburn shirt we all know it
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Post by Million Dollar Babies on Jan 25, 2023 18:57:31 GMT 1
He will turn into giggs as soon as he pulls on a Blackburn shirt we all know it Start nobbing his brothers wife?
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Post by Porrohman on Jan 25, 2023 19:46:14 GMT 1
I’m ok with it. He’s clearly lost his mojo and doesn’t look like he’s finding it again anytime soon, a temporary move away allows both HTFC and the player to press the reset button. We do need to get Knockeart fit though now and quickly. Exactly. I am looking forward to see if AK has anything left in his bag of tricks. If its another half dozen games before we see that, then that is going to be a total pisser. Has he even started training yet 🤷
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Post by duncfost01 on Jan 25, 2023 19:52:05 GMT 1
Feels like a risk to me. For sure Thomas hasn’t been the same season - but surely he can find it again.
The alternatives
Knockart - we don’t know but hasn’t played that much. Jones - young, hamstrings ? The lad from Watford - none of us know. Koroma - failed loan in the league below. Rowe - disappointing disappeared from the B team Anyone else ?
MF hasn’t really shown us a plan yet - other than to sit back. We need a goalkeeper and a left back.
All a bit worrying for me.
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Post by overtonterrierspirit on Jan 25, 2023 19:59:40 GMT 1
Reading through all of this and one thing occurs to me.
Why would a club pushing for promotion want to loan a player to assist their push to the Premier League if he has questionable ability and attitude?
I’d assume they have done their homework - otherwise why bother?
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Post by stinkypete on Jan 25, 2023 20:05:00 GMT 1
Blame MF its the easy thing to do, Thomas , Russell and others were having trouble well before MF. It is very easy to blame MF we do not know what goes on behind the scenes and we never will know 100%. If the weathers crap some on here would want to blame Fotheringham. Thomas was absolute gash at the start of this season. Maybe Fotheringham snuck in ages before he got the job and started teaching him how to cock a cross up, miscontrol the ball and amble aimlessly about? If anything hes improved from that early season form under Fotheringham but is still nothing like the player he was for the first half of last season. Even the great Carlos 'Pepferginho' Corboran couldn't keep Sorba playing as well in the 2nd half of the season as he did in the 1st. Well it has been bloody cold lately, has he brought the Scottish weather with him the bastard!!
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Post by duncfost01 on Jan 25, 2023 20:15:26 GMT 1
Reading through all of this and one thing occurs to me. Why would a club pushing for promotion want to loan a player to assist their push to the Premier League if he has questionable ability and attitude? I’d assume they have done their homework - otherwise why bother? They are probably looking at last seasons stats. Plus “his mind was in the world cup”… and he is probably cheap.
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Post by Million Dollar Babies on Jan 25, 2023 20:25:14 GMT 1
Reading through all of this and one thing occurs to me. Why would a club pushing for promotion want to loan a player to assist their push to the Premier League if he has questionable ability and attitude? I’d assume they have done their homework - otherwise why bother? Clubs always think they can sort a player. We've done it plenty of times, completely disregarding what's gone before. Look at Aarons, why did we sign him if we had done our homework on his injuries and fitness issues?
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Post by westislandterrier on Jan 25, 2023 20:30:10 GMT 1
If the weathers crap some on here would want to blame Fotheringham. Thomas was absolute gash at the start of this season. Maybe Fotheringham snuck in ages before he got the job and started teaching him how to cock a cross up, miscontrol the ball and amble aimlessly about? If anything hes improved from that early season form under Fotheringham but is still nothing like the player he was for the first half of last season. Even the great Carlos 'Pepferginho' Corboran couldn't keep Sorba playing as well in the 2nd half of the season as he did in the 1st. Well it has been bloody cold lately, has he brought the Scottish weather with him the bastard!! Nothing a good whisky won’t cure !!! 🥃 - Not too sure if they are plentiful around Dundee but they sure are at ma bit and there’s soon FOUR more to come (two biggies n’ two wee yin’s) !!! 👍
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Post by typical on Jan 25, 2023 20:33:33 GMT 1
I’m convinced the number 7 shirt is cursed. Everyone in recent memory has had attitude problems with this shirt!
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Post by 3Pipe on Jan 25, 2023 20:51:20 GMT 1
The only surprise for me is that he hasn't gone to Forest. Never the same player after we sold his best buddies.
Bloody shame, nonetheless.
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Post by Porrohman on Jan 25, 2023 22:39:02 GMT 1
Official now. Buzz said amongst other things “Given our focus of staying in the division, we need players who are ready to perform straightaway, so it is the best thing for both ourselves and Sorba that he goes out to try and find more regular minutes elsewhere.”
Has Knockaert trained at all yet 🤔
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leroy212
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Post by leroy212 on Jan 25, 2023 22:39:28 GMT 1
He's gone then
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Post by Million Dollar Babies on Jan 25, 2023 22:44:12 GMT 1
This reads like we're loaning him out to Bradford rather than Premier League chasing Blackburn
"Sorba is still a young player who is only in his second full season of professional football at this level, and adding consistency to his performances is something that will come with time. Given our focus of staying in the division, we need players who are ready to perform straightaway, so it is the best thing for both ourselves and Sorba that he goes out to try and find more regular minutes elsewhere"
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