prepare
Darren Bullock Terrier
Posts: 952
|
Post by prepare on Mar 20, 2023 14:37:02 GMT 1
Of the two sets of bidders being talked about, only one appears to have the financial resources to take on the stadium and developing the surrounding land, as well as the football club and training ground. On the face of it the Dutch bid may need help with the stadium and the American bid may need help on the football side. Maybe they should get together 🤷♂️ the surround land is owned by Kirklees and is not in any plans that the club may have |
|
|
|
Post by bells ringing :) on Mar 20, 2023 14:42:48 GMT 1
The Dutch fella, has less net wealth than Hoyle himself. Therefore how can we expect a bloke who isn't even a town fan, to invest and run it any better than DH. Over the last year Hoyle who is a town fan has struggled with his wealth, to run it correctly. Therefore we may well have "stability" or is that a version of watching the club be run down to nothing by a group of people, who don't care if we are sucessful or not bit like the Charlton Atheltic fella is currently doing.
The Amercians have tried to buy a few clubs in England far bigger named than ourselves, they seem very keen to own an English club. The Dutch plan from what i read is scary as Hoyle himself has tried that and look whats happened this year? Buy young players develop them then move them on, Peterbrough do that and remind me how they are doing ?
I want an owner who owns one football club, where whatever they are trying to do , concerns only one football club.
|
|
|
|
Post by VLP Fan Club on Mar 20, 2023 15:02:27 GMT 1
It’ll be the Dutch.
As it suits ‘all’ parties.
|
|
|
|
Post by bells ringing :) on Mar 20, 2023 15:13:06 GMT 1
It’ll be the Dutch. As it suits ‘all’ parties. The reasons why it suits Hoyle boggle the mind, spesh if he is keeping a stake. This smacks of PH mark 2 to me. |
|
|
|
Post by dezzly on Mar 20, 2023 15:15:20 GMT 1
It’ll be the Dutch. As it suits ‘all’ parties. The reasons why it suits Hoyle boggle the mind, spesh if he is keeping a stake. This smacks of PH mark 2 to me. [br The only difference would be that the Dutch have run/are running a top level football club already.That’s about it. |
|
|
|
Post by Teddington Ted on Mar 20, 2023 15:16:24 GMT 1
‘FFP says we can only lose so much’
Have we actually lost money over the last few years? I know DH & PH have but is that in the accounts? If DH were to transfer his debt into shares would that count as losing money?
Finance is a genuine mystery to me.
|
|
|
|
Post by tepidterrier on Mar 20, 2023 15:17:12 GMT 1
It’ll be the Dutch. As it suits ‘all’ parties. The reasons why it suits Hoyle boggle the mind, spesh if he is keeping a stake. This smacks of PH mark 2 to me. In the rumoured structure of the deal it's a fair comparison, but the bloke's track record with AZ suggests he knows how to run a football club. All the noise from Southport regarding Phil didn't suggest the same at all when he joined. |
|
|
|
Post by Sio on Mar 20, 2023 15:19:01 GMT 1
If the Dutch get the takeover DH could still potentially have a minority stake in the club until everything is paid. If the Americans take over DH won't be around. Decision on administration is upon us Ooooo I wonder who will win! |
|
|
|
Post by rothwellterrier on Mar 20, 2023 15:25:29 GMT 1
‘FFP says we can only lose so much’ Have we actually lost money over the last few years? I know DH & PH have but is that in the accounts? If DH were to transfer his debt into shares would that count as losing money? Finance is a genuine mystery to me. I don’t think clearing debt via share issues has any bearing on FFP. It isn’t taken into account, just clears an amount of overall debt. |
|
|
|
Post by detox on Mar 20, 2023 15:27:24 GMT 1
Surely DH can't hang on to any shares, he's said he's quit, he has ill health, he needs to let it go now. As for new owners, don't know enough about their plans for us although some on here seem to have some 'knowledge'..from somewhere...
|
|
|
|
Post by bells ringing :) on Mar 20, 2023 15:32:27 GMT 1
The reasons why it suits Hoyle boggle the mind, spesh if he is keeping a stake. This smacks of PH mark 2 to me. [br The only difference would be that the Dutch have run/are running a top level football club already.That’s about it. Mate it costs a dam sight less money to run a Dutch club come onnnnnnn |
|
|
|
Post by Waterloo Terrier on Mar 20, 2023 15:38:18 GMT 1
If the Dutch get the takeover DH could still potentially have a minority stake in the club until everything is paid. If the Americans take over DH won't be around. Decision on administration is upon us Baffling to me that DH would still want to be involved. He’s been dragged back into this by PH going bust and seemingly hasn’t enjoyed it. |
|
|
|
Post by bells ringing :) on Mar 20, 2023 15:41:28 GMT 1
The guy who runs the Dutch club, has a net worth of less than Hoyle. The fact i have stated, he also will be running two clubs. Now which one do we think will get the raw deal on this?  o i don't know the club he has jsut bought maybe? he will run the club as cheapley as he possibly can, he will probs put even less money in than Hoyle did/does, as long as the club is running it wont matter what league we are in for this chap. I can see us going through the leagues , we could end up where Bradford are ..... |
|
|
|
Post by dezzly on Mar 20, 2023 15:48:47 GMT 1
[br The only difference would be that the Dutch have run/are running a top level football club already.That’s about it. Mate it costs a dam sight less money to run a Dutch club come onnnnnnn Oh that I know.I personally (with the very limited insight to what each group want to do) don’t see how the Dutch model works,even before the Brexit rules/points system for signing overseas players it would have been difficult but with it in place and a “sustainable” model as previously said I’m not sure what kind of squad we can keep/assemble. I hope I can be proved wrong. |
|
|
|
Post by bells ringing :) on Mar 20, 2023 15:54:49 GMT 1
Mate it costs a dam sight less money to run a Dutch club come onnnnnnn Oh that I know.I personally (with the very limited insight to what each group want to do) don’t see how the Dutch model works,even before the Brexit rules/points system for signing overseas players it would have been difficult but with it in place and a “sustainable” model as previously said I’m not sure what kind of squad we can keep/assemble. I hope I can be proved wrong. underneath my as it stands opinnion of this, i hope they prove me wrong if it is the dutch grup don't get me wrong. |
|
Tinpot
Mental Health Support Group
I'm really tinpot
Posts: 24,110 
|
Post by Tinpot on Mar 20, 2023 16:03:58 GMT 1
The guy who runs the Dutch club, has a net worth of less than Hoyle. The fact i have stated, he also will be running two clubs. Now which one do we think will get the raw deal on this? o i don't know the club he has jsut bought maybe? he will run the club as cheapley as he possibly can, he will probs put even less money in than Hoyle did/does, as long as the club is running it wont matter what league we are in for this chap. I can see us going through the leagues , we could end up where Bradford are ..... Why would they buy a club with the intention of failure? Why would *either* club get a raw deal? Surely it would be in the owner's interests to have success with both. |
|
|
|
Post by bells ringing :) on Mar 20, 2023 16:05:08 GMT 1
The guy who runs the Dutch club, has a net worth of less than Hoyle. The fact i have stated, he also will be running two clubs. Now which one do we think will get the raw deal on this? o i don't know the club he has jsut bought maybe? he will run the club as cheapley as he possibly can, he will probs put even less money in than Hoyle did/does, as long as the club is running it wont matter what league we are in for this chap. I can see us going through the leagues , we could end up where Bradford are ..... Why would they buy a club with the intention of failure? Why would *either* club get a raw deal? Surely it would be in the owner's interests to have success with both. Its my fear we are going to get scaled down, to basically sell players to help fund his dutch club. |
|
|
|
Post by reverendstarbuck on Mar 20, 2023 16:19:52 GMT 1
Why would they buy a club with the intention of failure? Why would *either* club get a raw deal? Surely it would be in the owner's interests to have success with both. Its my fear we are going to get scaled down, to basically sell players to help fund his dutch club. To be able to sell players (at a profit), you need to have good players. Embarking on a fire sale with the current lot wouldn't get anyone very far beyond next season. So even if the buy and sell model was the one favoured, it would only work by producing players who are good enough to push the team forwards. You would think. |
|
|
|
Post by hoggy1975 on Mar 20, 2023 16:30:17 GMT 1
Its my fear we are going to get scaled down, to basically sell players to help fund his dutch club. To be able to sell players (at a profit), you need to have good players. Embarking on a fire sale with the current lot wouldn't get anyone very far beyond next season. So even if the buy and sell model was the one favoured, it would only work by producing players who are good enough to push the team forwards. You would think. Good post. I’ve said this a couple of times on here and got ignored. They will have a good model already in place for identifying players, which would create a bigger profit if we were buying and selling in the championship as potential in this league goes for a lot larger £ |
|
|
|
Post by themanfromatlantis on Mar 20, 2023 16:39:05 GMT 1
Why would they buy a club with the intention of failure? Why would *either* club get a raw deal? Surely it would be in the owner's interests to have success with both. Its my fear we are going to get scaled down, to basically sell players to help fund his dutch club. How big is ‘the asset’ that you’re suggesting the new owner would sweat? |
|
|
|
Post by bells ringing :) on Mar 20, 2023 16:52:32 GMT 1
Its my fear we are going to get scaled down, to basically sell players to help fund his dutch club. How big is ‘the asset’ that you’re suggesting the new owner would sweat? The fact they own 2 clubs, the majority owner has a net worth less than Hoyle. Hoyle said it was costing him 5 mil a year , does anyone see this bloke putting that kind of cash in ? he has two clubs and AZ are quite obvs his number 1.
We will be run yes, but its quite obvs he is going to down scale the club and run it, to every so often sell players for huge profit. Dreams of the prem or even regular champ will go up in smoke . If i am wrong then i will be pleanstly suprised, but i don't think i will be.
|
|
|
|
Post by rockwall on Mar 20, 2023 17:00:49 GMT 1
How big is ‘the asset’ that you’re suggesting the new owner would sweat? The fact they own 2 clubs, the majority owner has a net worth less than Hoyle. Hoyle said it was costing him 5 mil a year , does anyone see this bloke putting that kind of cash in ? he has two clubs and AZ are quite obvs his number 1.
We will be run yes, but its quite obvs he is going to down scale the club and run it, to every so often sell players for huge profit. Dreams of the prem or even regular champ will go up in smoke . If i am wrong then i will be pleanstly suprised, but i don't think i will be.
What if his worth isn't as high because he has money in assets ie; AZ. If they were to be sold, how much would they be worth? How much would his worth go up? I doubt they are in debt to him like we are with DH. You also mentioned about selling players to fund them? Spin it around... what if we go down the route of then sending players our way via loan deals? That was he wouldn't need to spend money on transfers if deals are done between clubs. Udinese/Watford type model. |
|
|
|
Post by bells ringing :) on Mar 20, 2023 17:04:20 GMT 1
The fact they own 2 clubs, the majority owner has a net worth less than Hoyle. Hoyle said it was costing him 5 mil a year , does anyone see this bloke putting that kind of cash in ? he has two clubs and AZ are quite obvs his number 1.
We will be run yes, but its quite obvs he is going to down scale the club and run it, to every so often sell players for huge profit. Dreams of the prem or even regular champ will go up in smoke . If i am wrong then i will be pleanstly suprised, but i don't think i will be.
What if his worth isn't as high because he has money in assets ie; AZ. If they were to be sold, how much would they be worth? How much would his worth go up? I doubt they are in debt to him like we are with DH. You also mentioned about selling players to fund them? Spin it around... what if we go down the route of then sending players our way via loan deals? That was he wouldn't need to spend money on transfers if deals are done between clubs. Udinese/Watford type model. We are going to find it so hard to get loans from them, its been covered due to brexit. |
|
|
|
Post by bells ringing :) on Mar 20, 2023 17:04:49 GMT 1
What if his worth isn't as high because he has money in assets ie; AZ. If they were to be sold, how much would they be worth? How much would his worth go up? I doubt they are in debt to him like we are with DH. You also mentioned about selling players to fund them? Spin it around... what if we go down the route of then sending players our way via loan deals? That was he wouldn't need to spend money on transfers if deals are done between clubs. Udinese/Watford type model. We are going to find it so hard to get loans from them, its been covered due to brexit. We are going to find it incredibley hard to get loans from them, due to brexit. |
|
|
|
Post by Moooooy on Mar 20, 2023 17:19:43 GMT 1
Its my fear we are going to get scaled down, to basically sell players to help fund his dutch club. To be able to sell players (at a profit), you need to have good players. Embarking on a fire sale with the current lot wouldn't get anyone very far beyond next season. So even if the buy and sell model was the one favoured, it would only work by producing players who are good enough to push the team forwards. You would think. This is what Dean did with us at the start, he invested in young players who were good at the level we were at and could be sold on for a profit. It’s a system that works well if it’s done right. Pilkington, Rhodes, Clayton, Norwood, Coady, Butterfield, etc were all brought in cheaply, were some of our best players, and we sold them for profit. The difference then was we reinvested the money in bringing new young players in, so you have to maintain a good level of investment to reap the rewards of the big transfer fees. Where we’ve gone wrong is we’ve sold all our assets and not reinvested nearly enough in replacing them. |
|
|
|
Post by mosher on Mar 20, 2023 17:22:23 GMT 1
We are going to find it incredibley hard to get loans from them, due to brexit. Are you sure it's the same for loans? I'm sure I read somewhere that teams could still purchase players and then loan them out to someone to get the required points for a work permit. Would we be the beneficiaries of some such arrangement, or has Brexit stopped us being the kind of club that gets sent these players to work up to their visa? Edit: Actually reading that back yes, we wouldn't be able to do that as the points system covers that, d'oh. Maybe we should all write to parliament to get them to change the rules for football. Football seems to live by their own rules on plenty of other things, why not that  |
|
|
|
Post by bells ringing :) on Mar 20, 2023 17:23:54 GMT 1
We are going to find it incredibley hard to get loans from them, due to brexit. Are you sure it's the same for loans? I'm sure I read somewhere that teams could still purchase players and then loan them out to someone to get the required points for a work permit. Would we be the beneficiaries of some such arrangement, or has Brexit stopped us being the kind of club that gets sent these players to work up to their visa? I think its still hard , unless they have the points required already. for example were already dutch under 21's for example . Non EU / americans seem to need less point, this is where Brighton are smashing it out of the park at the moment. |
|
|
|
Post by mosher on Mar 20, 2023 17:24:48 GMT 1
Are you sure it's the same for loans? I'm sure I read somewhere that teams could still purchase players and then loan them out to someone to get the required points for a work permit. Would we be the beneficiaries of some such arrangement, or has Brexit stopped us being the kind of club that gets sent these players to work up to their visa? I think its still hard , unless they have the points required already. for example were already dutch under 21's for example . Non EU / americans seem to need less point, this is where Brighton are smashing it out of the park at the moment. You must have answered just as I was editing |
|
|
|
Post by townarentbest on Mar 20, 2023 17:35:37 GMT 1
How big is ‘the asset’ that you’re suggesting the new owner would sweat? The fact they own 2 clubs, the majority owner has a net worth less than Hoyle. Hoyle said it was costing him 5 mil a year , does anyone see this bloke putting that kind of cash in ? he has two clubs and AZ are quite obvs his number 1.
We will be run yes, but its quite obvs he is going to down scale the club and run it, to every so often sell players for huge profit. Dreams of the prem or even regular champ will go up in smoke . If i am wrong then i will be pleanstly suprised, but i don't think i will be.
Where are you reading that the prospective Dutch owner has a net worth less than Hoyle? He oversaw the growth of atlasprofessionals.com/ from being a 5 person startup to being a player on the global stage, with the final 25% controlling share purchase as recently as 2020 valuing Atlas globally in the hundreds of millions. The family shoe stores ( www.nelson.nl/ ) he remains a director of, are exceeding the revenues that Card Factory was seeing when Dean sold out, in a sector that presumably has much bigger margins that putting pithy messages on bits of paper and selling them cheaper than anyone else does. He's wealthy, you can be sure of that. Can't wait to see an expert try and place him on a rich list! |
|
|
|
Post by Teddington Ted on Mar 20, 2023 17:46:12 GMT 1
The fact they own 2 clubs, the majority owner has a net worth less than Hoyle. Hoyle said it was costing him 5 mil a year , does anyone see this bloke putting that kind of cash in ? he has two clubs and AZ are quite obvs his number 1.
We will be run yes, but its quite obvs he is going to down scale the club and run it, to every so often sell players for huge profit. Dreams of the prem or even regular champ will go up in smoke . If i am wrong then i will be pleanstly suprised, but i don't think i will be.
Where are you reading that the prospective Dutch owner has a net worth less than Hoyle? He oversaw the growth of atlasprofessionals.com/ from being a 5 person startup to being a player on the global stage, with the final 25% controlling share purchase as recently as 2020 valuing Atlas globally in the hundreds of millions. The family shoe stores ( www.nelson.nl/ ) he remains a director of, are exceeding the revenues that Card Factory was seeing when Dean sold out, in a sector that presumably has much bigger margins that putting pithy messages on bits of paper and selling them cheaper than anyone else does. He's wealthy, you can be sure of that. Can't wait to see an expert try and place him on a rich list! Going by that second paragraph, he’s perfect for us. Half our squad look like try play in clogs. |
|
o i don't know the club he has jsut bought maybe? he will run the club as cheapley as he possibly can, he will probs put even less money in than Hoyle did/does, as long as the club is running it wont matter what league we are in for this chap. I can see us going through the leagues , we could end up where Bradford are .....
