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Post by blanquiazules on Oct 29, 2022 12:17:28 GMT 1
Feel the levels of hypocrisy in our society hilarious, could Saudi owners be dodgy? Absolutely. Could British owners be dodgy? Absolutely. People forget the close links that our government has to the Saudi regime, we’ve taken billions from them and in return shipped them weapons of all descriptions for decades. In the world of business there’s so many connections that it’s hard to know who truly is ‘clean’. The other thing I find amusing is the notion that a foreign owner wouldn’t ‘care’ about the club, well from what I’ve seen in clubs like Blackpool, Leeds, Ipswich etc is that British owners can destroy a club equally But yes in fairness, I do understand the concerns. Imagine we have a foreign owner who comes in and invests a load… but the sting in the tail Could be that it was all just a ‘loan’!!! what happens if they then want it back? Still own the training ground and haven’t secured the stadium with the PL money. On top of that they may then sell to a contact of theirs with little capital and want to take the parachute payments to repay their loans. Little investment would follow leaving us cash strapped and potentially bottom of the league with an inadequate squad and management team. On top of that In nearly 50m of debt… Foreign owner, like most of the other top championship teams and near enough all the premier league teams? No thanks! Practically every person who wants to buy a football club must realise it's not a profitable business...so it's either an ego trip and you're happy to spaff away £m's , or you're bored and happy to spaff away £m's. When you look at Town, where the club doesn't own the training ground or the Stadium then the potential is even less..there's nothing to buy and nothing to sell. Add in the fact we have £30m in debts to the owner who despite 2 years in the PL, couldn't make the club solvent.. i was reading about Coventry City this morning..left Highfield RD for the Ricoh but then got scuppered and ended up playing their games at Northampton and Birmingham..now the lease holders and City's landlords, Wasps, have defaulted leaving the football club in dire straits and having to confirm to fans yesterday that todays game was on. City's owners, venture capitalists, are wanting rid now... Meanwhile Coventry are sounding out clubs to see if they can have an option to play their home games there.. Yoiu can see how so much can go wrong ..the ramifications for the club and the fans of bad deision making...manfully Mark Robins and his players are staying focused..for now.
DH is going to have to write off at least some of those debts surely, there is no way anyone is going to pay £40m+ for a club with very few assets and no parachute money which loses £10m pa (even if we manage to avoid relegation). |
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crux
Jimmy Glazzard Terrier
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Post by crux on Oct 29, 2022 12:42:10 GMT 1
I keep wondering about the TV ad for Pure Cremations.  Came home from holiday in Spain yesterday and went to father-in-laws this morning. In today's post addressed to him was a pack from Pure Cremations ...... he died in July 😗. |
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goodbet
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Post by goodbet on Oct 29, 2022 12:52:20 GMT 1
Practically every person who wants to buy a football club must realise it's not a profitable business...so it's either an ego trip and you're happy to spaff away £m's , or you're bored and happy to spaff away £m's. When you look at Town, where the club doesn't own the training ground or the Stadium then the potential is even less..there's nothing to buy and nothing to sell. Add in the fact we have £30m in debts to the owner who despite 2 years in the PL, couldn't make the club solvent.. i was reading about Coventry City this morning..left Highfield RD for the Ricoh but then got scuppered and ended up playing their games at Northampton and Birmingham..now the lease holders and City's landlords, Wasps, have defaulted leaving the football club in dire straits and having to confirm to fans yesterday that todays game was on. City's owners, venture capitalists, are wanting rid now... Meanwhile Coventry are sounding out clubs to see if they can have an option to play their home games there.. Yoiu can see how so much can go wrong ..the ramifications for the club and the fans of bad deision making...manfully Mark Robins and his players are staying focused..for now.
DH is going to have to write off at least some of those debts surely, there is no way anyone is going to pay £40m+ for a club with very few assets and no parachute money which loses £10m pa (even if we manage to avoid relegation). I think that you are right. Anyone know what previous Championship or League 1 teams were sold for, and did they buy the ground and training area as well? |
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Post by Richard1986 on Oct 29, 2022 13:14:56 GMT 1
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goodbet
Jimmy Glazzard Terrier
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Post by goodbet on Oct 29, 2022 13:59:49 GMT 1
An old piece on buying a football club, I don't think anything will have changed much.
So, you want to buy a football club
Charles Orton-Jones
April 26, 2011
Football clubs are a nightmare to run. In fact, almost two-thirds of League One clubs have been in receivership at some point. Remember Luton Town’s 30-point deduction” Portsmouth FC ploughed through four owners last season and landed itself a debt of ?60m and relegation to the Championship. Think of Leeds United’s tragicomic collapse; the balls-up at Cambridge United; Rotherham going into receivership in 2006 and 2008; Southampton’s sorry saga. And, of course, Crawley Town getting a winding up order last year…
From that, though, came a positive for Crawley. Their rescuer, Bruce Winfield, took them to Old Trafford in the FA Cup. And just look at John Ryan at Doncaster Rovers. He made his cash in cosmetic surgery, bought Rovers and took his side from non-league to the Championship. Ryan even picked himself to play in 2003, running on against Hereford aged 52.
So, what do we know” Don?t buy a football team for the glory. And before you join the Madejskis, Glazers and Al Fayeds, make sure you know your stuff:
How much do footie clubs cost?
Many clubs go for a quid. Swansea City, bought by investors for £100, sold four years later for a £1. But beware: underneath those figures lies a pile of debt.
So, do I just pay and play?
Not quite. You?ll need to pass the FA’s Fit and Proper Person test if you buy more than 30 per cent of a club. Introduced in 2003 to weed out shady sorts, if you’ve been disqualified as a director, convicted of a serious offence, are bankrupt, struck-off or are involved with another club, you?ll get barred. Case study: Stephen Vaughan of Chester City, who failed the test in 2009 after falling foul of HMRC.
If I’ve got the cash, can I do an Abramovich?
Not any more. New UEFA Club Licensing and Financial Fair Play Regulations require clubs to balance their income and expenses over four to six transfer windows. The rules are being phased in, starting next year.
Can I get PE backing?
Unlikely! As Isabel Unsworth of 3i will tell you: No private equity firm would get involved with a football club. They are not proper businesses. Too much politics, too many egos. And there’s no proper exit route the history of football clubs on the stock market is chequered, to say the least. They are rich men’s toys, great for entertaining your mates, and that’s about it.
If the boot doesn’t fit……
you could try a rugby club. In 2010, Bruce Craig sold his pharma firm, Marken, to Apax for ?975m and bought Bath for £5m. With a salary cap of £4m per club, there’s at least a limit to the cash you can pour down the gurgler.
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Post by Richard1986 on Oct 29, 2022 16:14:10 GMT 1
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paullow1
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Post by paullow1 on Oct 29, 2022 18:32:55 GMT 1
I would prefer fan ownership or any buyer who comes in and runs us as a break even business, regardless of what division this takes us to. Can't imagine anything worse than Saudis etc coming in and using us like their personal play thing. It's a viewpoint I really struggle to understand is this. I mean, at a guess, would you imagine your average Newcastle United supporter is happier or unhappier in their current predicament than they were under Mr Break Even himself, Mike Ashley? We're football fans first and foremost. We all want our teams to succeed, so why would any supporter rather settle for mediocrity? And where have these all these moral dilemmas over where a clubs owners come from all of a sudden? Find me a nation on earth that hasn't committed some seriously atrocious acts in either their present or their past, I would imagine it is a pretty tough ask. Half of the Premier League clubs are owned by Americans, and some of the shit the CIA alone has pulled in the past 50 years should be enough to trigger peoples' emotional reflexes. Yet all the ire only ever seems to fall on those from the Middle east. Why is that I wonder? I was just getting into football around 1994, can vividly remember that 12 point lead, the Champions League nights (Asprilla hattrick vs Barca), the Man Utd 5-0, the 4th, 3rd, and 5th finishes under Robson, constant European football, breaking world transfer records, season ticket waiting lists. No trophies of course, but still, some seriously good nights, but I can honestly say that my interest / investment in football has never been higher than it currently is. Obviously controversial circumstances, but the Saudi's are largely keeping themselves to themselves - have a UK front / presence in Amanda / husband, Reubens, investing in the playing field where required, doing it sensibly, making some great appointments off field, most notably Dan Ashworth, plus a new CEO, new CCO etc. rather than Lee Charnley doing about 9 different jobs himself, badly, investing in a fantastic young English manager, integrating the women's team into the wider club (doesn't really affect me personally, but nice to see, and the right thing to do), constant communication from the social media accounts, YouTube content flipping 180, improvements to the ground / training facilities, and as a result, the whole place is absolutely buzzing. It helps that my interest in Newcastle / football in general was pretty much at an all time low 13 months ago, so an enormous contrast, but it really has been a surreal past 12 months. The political landscape can obviously change at any moment, and you can't take anything for granted, but so far, they've barely put a foot wrong (in terms of Newcastle United). So yeah, I don't blame the 48% in the poll. |
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Post by robinvar on Oct 29, 2022 18:45:12 GMT 1
Someone with absolutely bucket loads of money who loves us and feels as much as the fans. We've had Mark 1 of that, I'd like Mark 2 please.
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Post by runner76 on Oct 29, 2022 18:46:12 GMT 1
Someone with absolutely bucket loads of money who loves us and feels as much as the fans. We've had Mark 1 of that, I'd like Mark 2 please. And after today, Mark F  |
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Tinpot
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Post by Tinpot on Oct 29, 2022 19:02:25 GMT 1
After listening to Mr Baldwin's interview, whoever comes in I'm confident that whoever he chooses they'll be the right person/consortium for the job.
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Post by Wagner Uber Alles on Oct 29, 2022 19:42:50 GMT 1
Potless Phil...after he's won the Euromillions.
Best owner we've had in decades. Stopped the rot and sorted out Hoyle's post-Premier League disaster, and then against all the odds he stuck with Carlos and they almost got us back into the PL.
Although I appreciate greatly what's Hoyle's done for the club, IMO he's a bit of a wheeler dealer and got very lucky with Wagner, thanks to Webber. Everything else as been mostly questionable, until recently.
That said, he's realised his own limitations and put a very good structure and people in place to take the club forward, hopefully. We really should be very grateful to him, given our history and looking at other clubs.
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goodbet
Jimmy Glazzard Terrier
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Post by goodbet on Oct 29, 2022 20:11:04 GMT 1
Potless Phil...after he's won the Euromillions.
Best owner we've had in decades. Stopped the rot and sorted out Hoyle's post-Premier League disaster, and then against all the odds he stuck with Carlos and they almost got us back into the PL. Although I appreciate greatly what's Hoyle's done for the club, IMO he's a bit of a wheeler dealer and got very lucky with Wagner, thanks to Webber. Everything else as been mostly questionable, until recently.
That said, he's realised his own limitations and put a very good structure and people in place to take the club forward, hopefully. We really should be very grateful to him, given our history and looking at other clubs.
He did well selected a good coach and we bought some good players who blended well in to the team. He did have an unfortunate ability to put his foot in his mouth. From struggling to stay in this division we were almost promoted and to think that we threw it all away and we are having to rebuild once again. |
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Post by 66738 on Oct 30, 2022 10:13:21 GMT 1
We need to consider who is there out there that would be interested in buying us. They are not queuing up that is for sure. Huddersfield is not awash with money. There isn’t many Town through and through fans with the amount of money it requires to take us on. And I can’t see anyone that’s not from these parts looking at us, a town in the cold, dull Yorkshire Pennines that is unfashionable, run down, and financially struggling. With a relatively small catchment area, sandwiched between the bright lights of two cities that have three teams between them that entertain tens of thousands in the Premier League, and thinking ‘Yes, that’s who I need to invest in. A mediocre Championship team that’s gonna make me no money whatsoever, in fact, it’s going to drain my hard earned bank balance just to keep the thing ticking over.’
It’s going to be a hard sell.
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ram
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Post by ram on Oct 30, 2022 10:30:37 GMT 1
Reading this thread,I am starting to worry about the club.The picture painted by some on here makes us sound a very unattractive proposition indeed. We might as well fold for some folk.
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Post by Captainslapper on Oct 30, 2022 10:39:38 GMT 1
Feel the levels of hypocrisy in our society hilarious, could Saudi owners be dodgy? Absolutely. Could British owners be dodgy? Absolutely. People forget the close links that our government has to the Saudi regime, we’ve taken billions from them and in return shipped them weapons of all descriptions for decades. In the world of business there’s so many connections that it’s hard to know who truly is ‘clean’. The other thing I find amusing is the notion that a foreign owner wouldn’t ‘care’ about the club, well from what I’ve seen in clubs like Blackpool, Leeds, Ipswich etc is that British owners can destroy a club equally But yes in fairness, I do understand the concerns. Imagine we have a foreign owner who comes in and invests a load… but the sting in the tail
Could be that it was all just a ‘loan’!!! what happens if they then want it back? Still own the training ground and haven’t secured the stadium with the PL money. On top of that they may then sell to a contact of theirs with little capital and want to take the parachute payments to repay their loans. Little investment would follow leaving us cash strapped and potentially bottom of the league with an inadequate squad and management team. On top of that In nearly 50m of debt…Foreign owner, like most of the other top championship teams and near enough all the premier league teams? No thanks! Lets have some facts right. havent secured the stadium with PL money?? Weve gone from owning 0% of the stadium ( KSDL) to owning 40% of it again. That is secure. We used the PL money to make the stadium PL approved ( cost about £5m ) and we';re currently working towards a deal to take full ownership of the stadium. The club owns the training ground. the owner only owns the land its on. The 'contact' the club was sold to had no capital to put in due to unprecedented unforeseen circumstances. Its hard to legislate for bad luck. Thankfully we had someone willing to step in and stop the club going into administration when that became a huge issue , from having a firesale of ALL saleable players, being relegated with a huge points deduction and possibly folding altogether. The alternative deal was to sell the club to a buyer who would pay for it IN FULL..ie give Hoyle ALL his money back in one go..by putting that debt on the club in the way of a bank loan... How the glaziers bought Man Utd and burnley was sold. So instead of owing DH £35m that he wasnt charging interest on and if the club couldn't pay would write off.. whats basically happened.....we would owe a bank it, who IS charging interest and isn't going to write anything off. Brilliant for Dean Hoyle.. potentially disastrous for HTFC.. so it didnt happen. The sort of owner who will do that is what we want IMO |
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Post by overtonterrierspirit on Oct 30, 2022 11:27:27 GMT 1
Reading this thread,I am starting to worry about the club.The picture painted by some on here makes us sound a very unattractive proposition indeed. We might as well fold for some folk. Yet if any perspective new owners were present yesterday, they would have seen what this club is all about. Team and fans working together, both absorbed in the game together and not something that you can see at every club. |
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Post by 66738 on Oct 30, 2022 12:29:10 GMT 1
Reading this thread,I am starting to worry about the club.The picture painted by some on here makes us sound a very unattractive proposition indeed. We might as well fold for some folk. We are just managing our expectations and being realistic about where we are and what we are. Folk sat near me yesterday were wanting an oil tycoon, or a Saudi Prince to come in for us. Yes it would be lovely but it ain’t gonna happen. If it isn’t a local businessman done good, looking at us from a perspective buyer that has no connection to the club or area whatsoever’s point of view, are we a viable business proposition? |
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Dan
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Post by Dan on Oct 30, 2022 12:43:30 GMT 1
Reading this thread,I am starting to worry about the club.The picture painted by some on here makes us sound a very unattractive proposition indeed. We might as well fold for some folk. We are just managing our expectations and being realistic about where we are and what we are. Folk sat near me yesterday were wanting an oil tycoon, or a Saudi Prince to come in for us. Yes it would be lovely but it ain’t gonna happen. If it isn’t a local businessman done good, looking at us from a perspective buyer that has no connection to the club or area whatsoever’s point of view, are we a viable business proposition? A well run club with relatively small debts (in comparison to the rest of the league), that will soon own 100% of the stadium as well as the training ground, and are one promotion away from the richest league in the world. |
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Post by Mastercracker on Oct 30, 2022 12:59:55 GMT 1
Reading this thread,I am starting to worry about the club.The picture painted by some on here makes us sound a very unattractive proposition indeed. We might as well fold for some folk. We are just managing our expectations and being realistic about where we are and what we are. Folk sat near me yesterday were wanting an oil tycoon, or a Saudi Prince to come in for us. Yes it would be lovely but it ain’t gonna happen. If it isn’t a local businessman done good, looking at us from a perspective buyer that has no connection to the club or area whatsoever’s point of view, are we a viable business proposition? Why did American/Indian billionaires buy Barnsley? Granted they’ve not exactly done a good job of it it but they still bought them. Majority of the championship owned by foreign investors but little Huddersfield are fucked unless some local factory owner comes in? I don’t think anyone is buying a football club as a business proposition, unless it’s a tax write off. It’s for ego, glory and a plaything, and English football is the biggest lure of all. |
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Post by El Mel on Oct 30, 2022 13:17:29 GMT 1
Surprised there's so many votes for Saudi money.
The Saudi's are getting absolutely hammered in the world of golf by many right now, for investing in the LIV series, well known and respected journailiusts doing their utmost, and overstepping the mark at times in order to try and preserve the status of PGA Tour.
BBC won 't even report the results fron the tournaments on the golf page of their website.
By comparison, the ownership of Newcastle is flying completely under the radar.
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Post by mids on Oct 30, 2022 13:36:03 GMT 1
Potless Phil...after he's won the Euromillions.
Best owner we've had in decades. Stopped the rot and sorted out Hoyle's post-Premier League disaster, and then against all the odds he stuck with Carlos and they almost got us back into the PL.
Although I appreciate greatly what's Hoyle's done for the club, IMO he's a bit of a wheeler dealer and got very lucky with Wagner, thanks to Webber. Everything else as been mostly questionable, until recently.
That said, he's realised his own limitations and put a very good structure and people in place to take the club forward, hopefully. We really should be very grateful to him, given our history and looking at other clubs.
But despite all of the last paragraph you think Phil Hodgkinson's short tenure was the best in decades  |
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Post by Captainslapper on Oct 30, 2022 16:11:46 GMT 1
Surprised there's so many votes for Saudi money. The Saudi's are getting absolutely hammered in the world of golf by many right now, for investing in the LIV series, well known and respected journailiusts doing their utmost, and overstepping the mark at times in order to try and preserve the status of PGA Tour. BBC won 't even report the results fron the tournaments on the golf page of their website. By comparison, the ownership of Newcastle is flying completely under the radar. Imagine its because despite the BBC telling people what they should think ( as usual ) most people dont give a flying f*ck that its Saudi money. |
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Post by saintlyterrier on Oct 30, 2022 17:03:06 GMT 1
Surprised there's so many votes for Saudi money. The Saudi's are getting absolutely hammered in the world of golf by many right now, for investing in the LIV series, well known and respected journailiusts doing their utmost, and overstepping the mark at times in order to try and preserve the status of PGA Tour. BBC won 't even report the results fron the tournaments on the golf page of their website. By comparison, the ownership of Newcastle is flying completely under the radar. Imagine its because despite the BBC telling people what they should think ( as usual ) most people dont give a flying f*ck that its Saudi money. And there was me thinking that the BBC was telling everybody what the Tory party wants the public to think. |
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Post by saintlyterrier on Oct 30, 2022 17:12:40 GMT 1
Moreover, I give more than a flying fuck that it's Saudi money.
I don't want Town to join Newcastle on the list of Kashoggi Killers.
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Post by Captainslapper on Oct 30, 2022 18:21:59 GMT 1
Well if we got billionaire Saudi owners then im sure there'd be plenty of people wanting to sit in your seat at the JSS if you dont want it anymore.
Locally you've got Bradford or Leeds to switch allegiance to, German or Italian/ US owners.. so 3 countries there with a pretty flawless history when it comes to mistreating people.
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Post by rockwall on Oct 30, 2022 18:25:00 GMT 1
Reading this thread,I am starting to worry about the club.The picture painted by some on here makes us sound a very unattractive proposition indeed. We might as well fold for some folk. We are just managing our expectations and being realistic about where we are and what we are. Folk sat near me yesterday were wanting an oil tycoon, or a Saudi Prince to come in for us. Yes it would be lovely but it ain’t gonna happen. If it isn’t a local businessman done good, looking at us from a perspective buyer that has no connection to the club or area whatsoever’s point of view, are we a viable business proposition? Why wouldn't they? Even though we may owe DH a few million it is still less of a debt than most football clubs. We have a great facilities and a good infrastructure in place. I would say we are an attractive proposition. |
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ram
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Post by ram on Oct 31, 2022 10:53:20 GMT 1
At last! a few folk talking us up...  |
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Post by mosher on Oct 31, 2022 11:22:07 GMT 1
At last! a few folk talking us up... To be fair Captainslapper ALWAYS talks the club up. And gets pelters and called DH's bum boy (paraphrasing)  |
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Post by Venezuelan Pete on Oct 31, 2022 11:37:40 GMT 1
Surprised there's so many votes for Saudi money. The Saudi's are getting absolutely hammered in the world of golf by many right now, for investing in the LIV series, well known and respected journailiusts doing their utmost, and overstepping the mark at times in order to try and preserve the status of PGA Tour. BBC won 't even report the results fron the tournaments on the golf page of their website. By comparison, the ownership of Newcastle is flying completely under the radar. To be fair the poll option is "Mega rich foreign owner" which could be one of many things. I expect the voting would look different if they were broken out as separate options |
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Post by Baby Ate My Eight Ball on Nov 9, 2022 7:53:08 GMT 1
Any update or rumours on the sale?
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