alex
Steve Kindon Terrier
[M0:14]
Posts: 1,719
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Post by alex on Mar 4, 2023 22:02:15 GMT 1
I have been following Town since '82. There has been a lot of ups and downs. I remember dirty Leeds winning the Title and I was telling my match buddy that I would die happy if we could spend just one season in the Top Flight. Well, we got two of those. The second one was a disaster but the first one was unforgettable.
It looks like we are going back to where we started. I was wondering how it went from that to this and what was the single definitive factor? For me, it was not letting Wagner go mid point of our second term in the Prem. He was knackered and wanted to leave. We should have brought in a top quality experienced manager and backed him in the transfer window. We have gone backwards since that point.
Hindsight is a wonderful thing, but I hope our new generation of fans don't have to wait another 40 years like I, and many of us did.
Town are not a crappy third tier club we can do better.
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goodbet
Jimmy Glazzard Terrier
Posts: 4,464
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Post by goodbet on Mar 4, 2023 22:15:15 GMT 1
For me it started to go wrong after promotion, but in a small way. It started to go badly wrong after we stayed up, poor spending got a lot worse and then Dean got ill and we started to slide.
After relegation we needed to get rid of the high wage players but brought in old so-so players and the message was just cut the budget.
The transfer of ownership has caused issues but we stopped the rot and ended up third and were in the playoff final. What followed was a comedy farce, we lost a manager some Dean supporter's say that he wanted out, but looking at what we brought in who could blame him.
We went out and spent a little more when everyone saw what a poor side we were before thew window closed, but we never seemed to look at what was needed. Maybe this was because it would have cost too much.
Come January and the message appeared to be that we needed numbers nonmatter if they were injured or had not played for some time. We did not target positions where we were weak like left back and we ended with another poor window.
This is the short version!
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Post by malcolmbrown on Mar 4, 2023 22:25:39 GMT 1
Jon Moss, Wembley May 2022
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goodbet
Jimmy Glazzard Terrier
Posts: 4,464
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Post by goodbet on Mar 4, 2023 22:28:12 GMT 1
Jon Moss, Wembley May 2022 It did not help but we had been peddling backwards at some pace before that.
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Post by hg1terrier on Mar 4, 2023 22:29:50 GMT 1
Steve Mounie’s unjust red card against Brighton.
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Post by Ginger Ogre on Mar 4, 2023 22:38:04 GMT 1
Steve Mounie’s unjust red card against Brighton. I still look back to that day vs Brighton and wonder what might have been if we'd have won that match. Not only the red card for Mounie, but there was a blatant penalty on Pritchard not given too when we were 1-0 up. We get and score that and its 2-0 and we probably go on to win. We didn't, and everything after that seems to have been one disaster rolled into another which has left us where we are today.
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Post by yorkterrier on Mar 4, 2023 22:41:20 GMT 1
Steve Mounie’s unjust red card against Brighton. My physio was a guest of the 4th official that day and said at the time that he (the 4th official) described the red card as "a shocker". And the Pritchard incident defined the basis of a penalty kick. That said, what a journey, and one that I never thought I'd see. UTT
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Post by bells ringing :) on Mar 4, 2023 22:47:46 GMT 1
We were very competive against Brighton, it all seemd to drop off from that point. Wagner walking away i thought was a huge turning point, if he thought the club could bounce back or keep going why walk away from a 3 year deal ? remember everyone he is walking away from the guy, who gave him his break in first team managerment.
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Post by jesusbantam on Mar 4, 2023 22:49:11 GMT 1
It's that fkn god damn awful Premier League my friends that fks you up for sure. Not exactly sure what goes on once you drop out but it sure as hell puts you way further back then where you were before your PL charge.
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Post by Terriersmad on Mar 4, 2023 22:53:32 GMT 1
Several:
1. The sale and failure to replace Lewis O'Brien. Our midfield is frankly appalling. A geriatric Hogg and a bunch of kids who haven't got any presence. We need to bring in a whole new midfield next season.
2. Corberan walking out. I don't actually blame the club for that one. He knew what budgets we were looking at. He chose to stick around until he was tapped up. Either way, he may have not found it ideal, but we could easily have sacked him at the end of 20/21 and didn't, showing loyalty he'd hardly earned.
3. Not bringing in an experienced head to steady the ship as soon as Corberan turned his coat. Boring as it would have been in the summer, we'd not be in this mess had we brought in a Tony Mowbray figure.
Bad decision after bad decision has been made, but they have been compounded by things beyond control. We've had far more injuries than could be expected - Nicholls, Turton and Nakayama all being out for the season at the halfway point. Anjorin getting crocked straight away (and it not being possible to return him - poor negotiation it has to be said from Bromby). Long-term injuries to Pearson, Hogg, Ward, Kasumu at various points. Chuck in more knocks and niggles than I think I've ever seen in 30 years of watching Town, and it's been impossible to get a settled, balanced side.
It has been an annus horribilis. We've had the perfect storm of making (avoidable) mistakes combined with everything out of our control going wrong. You might survive one or the other, but not both.
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duncfost01
David Wagner Terrier
[M0:1]
Posts: 2,754
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Post by duncfost01 on Mar 4, 2023 22:55:50 GMT 1
Easy. Phil going bust and Dean coming back.
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Post by Terriersmad on Mar 4, 2023 23:10:00 GMT 1
Easy. Phil going bust and Dean coming back. I'm a bit fed up of owner/not-owner blaming. They provide the money, but in truth what happens on the football pitch is down to others. It's especially true as Dean Hoyle doesn't/didn't own the club and was still putting the money in to keep it afloat while trying to broker a sale. Although Hodgkinson is another one who always escapes very lightly. The man hid his financial state and risked the existence of the club.
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Post by space hardware on Mar 4, 2023 23:15:22 GMT 1
Easy. Phil going bust and Dean coming back. I'm a bit fed up of owner/not-owner blaming. They provide the money, but in truth what happens on the football pitch is down to others. It's especially true as Dean Hoyle doesn't/didn't own the club and was still putting the money in to keep it afloat while trying to broker a sale. Although Hodgkinson is another one who always escapes very lightly. The man hid his financial state and risked the existence of the club. Yeah but, according to Slapps his businesses were worth twelvlty billion quid until Covid wiped all the value out. Nothing to do with him being a complete shyster, robbing Peter to pay Paul, yet still somehow owning a Championship club that he couldn't afford.
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Post by jesusbantam on Mar 4, 2023 23:19:48 GMT 1
It's the Premier League that fks us mere mortal clubs, clubs like us are best hovering around Championship/L1 in the long term as otherwise once we step outside our comfort zone and grace the Premier League we then have to pay a massive return back in terms of many seasons of failure, putting us further back than where we set off from.
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Post by harrythedog on Mar 4, 2023 23:23:25 GMT 1
Steve Mounie’s unjust red card against Brighton. That old chestnut. Anybody who thinks we were going to stay up that second season is dilusional. Seven points from nine to start and the clean sheets were just enough in season one to keep us up. An inability to score goals and actually create is why we are were we are now and why we were always going to get relegated in season two from the prem. Two worldies against Birmingham papered over the cracks.
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irverino
Jimmy Glazzard Terrier
Posts: 4,672
Member is Online
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Post by irverino on Mar 4, 2023 23:26:29 GMT 1
Losing Stuart Webber was a huge blow.......His replacements were nowhere near good enough.
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Post by stinkypete on Mar 5, 2023 0:14:40 GMT 1
The week/2 weeks in PL 2
Just won at wolves after beating Fulham and drawing at home to West Ham:- Mounié red v Brighton coasting at 1-0 end up losing 2–1
Midweek absolutely batter Bournemouth but end up losing 2-1
On the Saturday at Arsenal lose 1-0 with an 83rd minute goal but more importantly lose Mooy for 10 games.
That was us finished and barring last season it’s been downhill ever since! Hello league one I’ve missed you!
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Post by southowram on Mar 5, 2023 0:25:53 GMT 1
I can scarcely believe we were in the play off final less than 12 months ago.
Look at us and Forest now.
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Post by Venezuelan Pete on Mar 5, 2023 0:25:53 GMT 1
Should never have sold Stewart
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Post by willo on Mar 5, 2023 2:27:35 GMT 1
There was no one defining point. A long list stretching back across several seasons of poor decisions, poor signings, poor managerial appointments and plain old bad luck has led us to this. If pushed, I’d probably say the trouble started the second summer in the PL around the time DH became ill and the crap signings we brought in during that window. If you’re a club our size forever on a limited budget in the PL, virtually all your signings have to be spot on, you can’t afford many/any screw ups. If you have a mare like we did that second summer, there’s only one outcome and the ripples are still being felt several years down the line.
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Post by drbaldric on Mar 5, 2023 3:06:12 GMT 1
I'd add to that a man who was critically ill with pancreatitis and nearly dead trying to do his best, but ultimately, with differing priorities, perhaps being less in love with the club
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Post by BlueValour on Mar 5, 2023 3:27:49 GMT 1
I can scarcely believe we were in the play off final less than 12 months ago. Look at us and Forest now. I try not to. !!
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Post by Armchair Pundit on Mar 5, 2023 3:41:22 GMT 1
I have been following Town since '82. There has been a lot of ups and downs. I remember dirty Leeds winning the Title and I was telling my match buddy that I would die happy if we could spend just one season in the Top Flight. Well, we got two of those. The second one was a disaster but the first one was unforgettable. It looks like we are going back to where we started. I was wondering how it went from that to this and what was the single definitive factor? For me, it was not letting Wagner go mid point of our second term in the Prem. He was knackered and wanted to leave. We should have brought in a top quality experienced manager and backed him in the transfer window. We have gone backwards since that point. Hindsight is a wonderful thing, but I hope our new generation of fans don't have to wait another 40 years like I, and many of us did. Town are not a crappy third tier club we can do better. There was one appointment at Town when things started to go wrong… trainingground.guru/articles/bromby-appointed-academy-manager-by-huddersfield
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Post by terrierneil on Mar 5, 2023 4:08:48 GMT 1
The appointments of Jan siewert and Mark Fotheringham. Unforgivable.
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Post by rubicon on Mar 5, 2023 6:56:42 GMT 1
Wrongly or rightly, I simply can't blame Wagner as some seem to want to. I've seen both managers that took us to the top tier, Greaves and Wagner, and the collapse was to me, in no way either of them's fault. Watch Millwall v Norwich yesterday, and the two set piece goals.When do we see anything like as clever these days at Town? Never! Given the chance, I'd have kept him at our club for years. Greaves was a fitness fanatic, got the results with us and Bolton at the time, but in the modern day, Wagner was another level, both on man management and tactics. He "ups' the level at any club he's with, but even he can't rescue lost causes. Did a good job in many ways at Young Boys. Maybe I'm dreaming, but I'd rather have an honest, decent likeable manager with a groundwork of success any day. The only thing I continually disliked was "the little old Huddersfield" nonsense. It was overplayed and stupid.
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Post by Flowerdisco on Mar 5, 2023 7:13:27 GMT 1
Selling players who can play to a decent level and gambling by replacing them with lower league players who have potential, this mixed with players at the end of their career.
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Post by nuggett22 on Mar 5, 2023 7:37:21 GMT 1
The summer recruitment of 201819 season . We went into our second season in the PL with a worse squad that finished Season 1in the PL.
I thought players of PL experience and quality would be arriving instead we signed poor young foreign talent .
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ambryboy
Jimmy Glazzard Terrier
Posts: 4,830
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Post by ambryboy on Mar 5, 2023 9:55:40 GMT 1
I think it was selling Steve Jenkins.
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Post by dewsburyborn on Mar 5, 2023 10:25:12 GMT 1
The summer recruitment of 201819 season . We went into our second season in the PL with a worse squad that finished Season 1in the PL. I thought players of PL experience and quality would be arriving instead we signed poor young foreign talent . The bizarre failure to complete the signing of Adama Traore from Middlesbrough - the 'told' story is that Hoyle was away in US on holiday and got the time difference wrong so wasn't back at the hotel to sign the papers by the known deadline. Why the fuck did it need to be down to him to do that when he was away on holiday ? his fear of delegation ? So Traore got injured that night and was gonna be out till Oct; Wagner needed that kind of player .. so we signed The Speed Twins ... and we know how that ended ...
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Post by Will on Mar 5, 2023 10:25:58 GMT 1
It’s all about recruitment and timing of sales. To make losses on players and end up with a poor team = relegation.
Add to that appointing managers who can’t do their job, well that’s like kicking yourself in the bollocks and then throwing yourself under a train.
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