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Post by dugnet on Oct 8, 2023 11:22:40 GMT 1
7 days ago Town set a benchmark of what they were, clearly, capable of against Ipswich. The two performances since have fallen below that benchmark. It's too early to panic but it's not an unreasonable question to ask, why, things dropped off so quickly? Fairly or not DM hasn't got much leeway, so I hope we see much better in a fortnight. Why did he change the team and approach like he did at Birmingham. Then again today.. that might be your answer Dugnet It's a fair question, even allowing for injury (Hogg on Tuesday) why move away from a structure and style that worked so well (and it did) against Ipswich? That question is nothing to do with squad strength or investment that's about simple playing strategy and tactics. I do think it is too early to be harshly critical but fans will expect and demand better against QPR. We know our squad depth is shallow so DM has to get the best from them. Ipswich was massively encouraging, what has followed has been all the more baffling after that performance. I hope it's a blip and we can pick up.
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Post by bleaklow on Oct 8, 2023 12:32:26 GMT 1
The point is that Warnock is a hard act to follow. Many posters on here conveniently forget that no team in the Championship has ever survived from the position we were in last season. But Nagle and Cartwright probably couldn't cope with 1. someone whose ability to motivate is far ahead of their own competence in this field and 2. someone who is his own man and whose ideas would probably clash with theirs.
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Post by htafcokay on Oct 8, 2023 12:33:32 GMT 1
The point is that Warnock is a hard act to follow. Many posters on here conveniently forget that no team in the Championship has ever survived from the position we were in last season. But Nagle and Cartwright probably couldn't cope with 1. someone whose ability to motivate is far ahead of their own competence in this field and 2. someone who is his own man and whose ideas would probably clash with theirs. Are you sure?
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Post by benhomly on Oct 8, 2023 12:39:47 GMT 1
The point is that Warnock is a hard act to follow. Many posters on here conveniently forget that no team in the Championship has ever survived from the position we were in last season. But Nagle and Cartwright probably couldn't cope with 1. someone whose ability to motivate is far ahead of their own competence in this field and 2. someone who is his own man and whose ideas would probably clash with theirs. Bonkers thing to say; makes no sense whatsoever.
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Post by 28901 on Oct 8, 2023 13:01:21 GMT 1
Borderline racist attitude. Full on snowflake... only person been racist is you for suggesting it. Consider yourself educated. Consider yourself a full on dickhead
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terrierbite
Iain Dunn Terrier
[M0:2]I played footy with Alf Young
Posts: 440
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Post by terrierbite on Oct 8, 2023 14:26:31 GMT 1
Just been speaking with a neighbour who is a Donny Rovers fan ,he says as a club we are stuffed as Darren Moore filled the Doncaster side with poor players and then left the club in a poor state,I did ask if they were near top when he left and he said yes but no substance or shape to the team which led the club to collapse like a deck of cards ,he seems absolutely convinced we are screwed . I really hope that he is wrong
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mallyb
Darren Bullock Terrier
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Post by mallyb on Oct 8, 2023 17:13:51 GMT 1
To question Darren Moore’s intelligence is valid. Wagner corberan and Warnock demonstrated football intelligence in interviews and Warnocks team was motivated. Moore’s teams have demonstrated neither motivation or a plan and interviews are rather Forgeringham Esque. Seems his main quality is he put up with Chansiri without speaking out so Kev is safe if he wants to not spend any money then criticize the performance! If Moore is their man pointless appointing him now when we can’t affect the squad at all. This week has shown how tragic the summer window was and how good a job Warnock was doing. Even when we were getting beat at the start of the season we were creating chances and getting shots on goals against much better opposition. It was fun to watch. That motivation has gone. And you could see Tuesday the players questioning what this guy was doing. Instead of building on Saturday he destroyed the momentum and confidence. He might be able to get a team winning where you have more resources than your rivals but that is not a position we will ever be in in this division and this is my worry. We saw Kev taking the club on whatever division we are in as a good thing, maybe his budget is more suited to league 1 and won’t mind getting there this season.
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Post by Captainslapper on Oct 8, 2023 19:22:04 GMT 1
The point is that Warnock is a hard act to follow. Many posters on here conveniently forget that no team in the Championship has ever survived from the position we were in last season. But Nagle and Cartwright probably couldn't cope with 1. someone whose ability to motivate is far ahead of their own competence in this field and 2. someone who is his own man and whose ideas would probably clash with theirs. 3, Someone who didnt want to be here much longer because hes 74 and lives in Cornwall. I wouldn't be surprised if he did have a few 'ideas' that clashed with theirs though!
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Post by 28901 on Oct 8, 2023 21:40:03 GMT 1
Just been speaking with a neighbour who is a Donny Rovers fan ,he says as a club we are stuffed as Darren Moore filled the Doncaster side with poor players and then left the club in a poor state,I did ask if they were near top when he left and he said yes but no substance or shape to the team which led the club to collapse like a deck of cards ,he seems absolutely convinced we are screwed . I really hope that he is wrong I see. Its all starting to make sense. He filled the Donny side with cheap rubbish and got them near the top. When he'd gone the same squad collapsed. Looks like he's got something after all.
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Post by softboy on Oct 8, 2023 21:53:57 GMT 1
When DM was appointed I was a bit surprised things had moved on so quickly but if the CEO thinks he is the right guy let’s give some time to see whether it all works out. On his first 4 games, 3 away from home, we have got 3 points which I agree is below par, but is 1 home game against a team that had won 7 out of 8 this season we were unlucky not to win. He lost Kasumu and Hogg last week. Now is not the time to start being negative, let’s give the guy until at least January. 11 points from 11 games is not great but 7 of those were under NW anyway.
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Post by townrwe on Oct 9, 2023 7:55:28 GMT 1
²Saturday was the perfect chance to show some attacking intent. Instead we ended up with every defensive player in the ranks playing leaving sorba, burgzorg and Thomas isolated against lets be honest the worst opposition we will ever play in the championship.
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Post by benhomly on Oct 9, 2023 9:07:58 GMT 1
²Saturday was the perfect chance to show some attacking intent. Instead we ended up with every defensive player in the ranks playing leaving sorba, burgzorg and Thomas isolated against lets be honest the worst opposition we will ever play in the championship. First time I've heard Rudoni described as a defensive player but what do I know. The only strange decision on Saturday was bringing Edwards back in, otherwise he picked pretty much any team Warnock would have picked. Everyone seems to be clamouring for Harratt to be included but he's shown nothing so far to suggest he isn't just a younger version of Danny Ward running around aimlessly on his own. Apart from that goal against Watford last season which apparently no-one else in the squad could have ever scored. Don't get all the anti-Moore stuff. He got 96 points last season with a very poor squad (as we saw on Saturday when the caretaker brought all last seasons side back in bar one). And when that bizarrely didn't get them automatic promotion he motivated a bang average side to turn round a 4 goal deficit in the play-offs to get them through to the final. Or was that just a fluke?
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Post by thomo on Oct 9, 2023 9:44:16 GMT 1
²Saturday was the perfect chance to show some attacking intent. Instead we ended up with every defensive player in the ranks playing leaving sorba, burgzorg and Thomas isolated against lets be honest the worst opposition we will ever play in the championship. First time I've heard Rudoni described as a defensive player but what do I know. The only strange decision on Saturday was bringing Edwards back in, otherwise he picked pretty much any team Warnock would have picked. Everyone seems to be clamouring for Harratt to be included but he's shown nothing so far to suggest he isn't just a younger version of Danny Ward running around aimlessly on his own. Apart from that goal against Watford last season which apparently no-one else in the squad could have ever scored. Don't get all the anti-Moore stuff. He got 96 points last season with a very poor squad (as we saw on Saturday when the caretaker brought all last seasons side back in bar one). And when that bizarrely didn't get them automatic promotion he motivated a bang average side to turn round a 4 goal deficit in the play-offs to get them through to the final. Or was that just a fluke? It's true i thought team selection was ok. Tactically we looked awful - I couldn't see what our plan was. With Koroma, Burgzorg and Thomas surely we needed to play on the counter and get behind them not launch long balls up to them. I'd say it was an incredibly worrying display tactically. I've not seen enough of Harratt to make a fair judgement. Certainly took his 'goal' well against Wednesday. It's a travesty that we don't have another senior striker though. Would strongly disagree Moore had a poor squad at league one level. Bannan and Windass are capable at championship level. Patterson, Smith, Johnson, flint and several more were all very decent at league 1. They had a wage bill of £11 million which is huge for that division. I don't think it was such a great achievement getting them up nor was getting the West Brom team he had to 4th in this division.
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Post by royrace on Oct 9, 2023 9:45:26 GMT 1
²Saturday was the perfect chance to show some attacking intent. Instead we ended up with every defensive player in the ranks playing leaving sorba, burgzorg and Thomas isolated against lets be honest the worst opposition we will ever play in the championship. First time I've heard Rudoni described as a defensive player but what do I know. The only strange decision on Saturday was bringing Edwards back in, otherwise he picked pretty much any team Warnock would have picked. Everyone seems to be clamouring for Harratt to be included but he's shown nothing so far to suggest he isn't just a younger version of Danny Ward running around aimlessly on his own. Apart from that goal against Watford last season which apparently no-one else in the squad could have ever scored. Don't get all the anti-Moore stuff. He got 96 points last season with a very poor squad (as we saw on Saturday when the caretaker brought all last seasons side back in bar one). And when that bizarrely didn't get them automatic promotion he motivated a bang average side to turn round a 4 goal deficit in the play-offs to get them through to the final. Or was that just a fluke? Looking to be the flop we all expected based on his recent career, not a great endorsement for our DoF.
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Post by oneneilwarnock on Oct 9, 2023 10:08:08 GMT 1
Think QPR will be a fair judgement, Moore eluded to in his Post Match conference multiple times he now gets his chance to put his ideas and work into the players. Fingers crossed they still have Ainsworth, if so anything less than 3 points wouldn't be a good look.
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Post by royrace on Oct 9, 2023 10:59:39 GMT 1
Think QPR will be a fair judgement, Moore eluded to in his Post Match conference multiple times he now gets his chance to put his ideas and work into the players. Fingers crossed they still have Ainsworth, if so anything less than 3 points wouldn't be a good look. Will certainly be a good barometer. Based on Saturday I don't think we can take anything for granted.
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Post by castlehillterrier on Oct 9, 2023 11:29:23 GMT 1
The next 3 home games are massive for DM this will really show if we have made a good appointment or not, QPR, Cardiff and Watford I think we need to get between 5-9points anyhting less would be a disspointment in my eyes, this is with a prediction of us losing against L**DS.
This is now not about would keeping Neil have been a better option as it honestly was not even an option, this is about if we have replaced him correctly or not.
I like DM as a person and so far the players seem to be enjoying the training, but I do have series doubts about his playing style and abilty to get some wins, I admit is not easy he doesnt have a experienced championship striker avaialble I believe we win at Sheff Weds with Ward in the team, I dont feel DW is the answer however but he is the best option currently when fit.
October and early November are massive on the pitch and without some performances in the next 4 games I can see Darren under pressure already and not just from us fans.
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iangreaves
Jimmy Glazzard Terrier
[M0:0]
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Post by iangreaves on Oct 9, 2023 11:33:56 GMT 1
The next 3 home games are massive for DM this will really show if we have made a good appointment or not, QPR, Cardiff and Watford I think we need to get between 5-9points anyhting less would be a disspointment in my eyes, this is with a prediction of us losing against L**DS. This is now not about would keeping Neil have been a better option as it honestly was not even an option, this is about if we have replaced him correctly or not. I like DM as a person and so far the players seem to be enjoying the training, but I do have series doubts about his playing style and abilty to get some wins, I admit is not easy he doesnt have a experienced championship striker avaialble I believe we win at Sheff Weds with Ward in the team, I dont feel DW is the answer however but he is the best option currently when fit. October and early November are massive on the pitch and without some performances in the next 4 games I can see Darren under pressure already and not just from us fans. If DM goes, where does that leave Cartwright? He made clear at the press conference that DM was his pick.
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Post by runner76 on Oct 9, 2023 11:40:07 GMT 1
International break has come at the perfect time. He will have plenty of time to get to know the players better and to get his philosophy across to them.....agree that the next batch of games are massive; we need to see some cohesive performances and more of a clear style of play and a plan....and, of course, some results!......massive period for the management team followed by a massive January for the owner and board to invest.....
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mallyb
Darren Bullock Terrier
Posts: 925
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Post by mallyb on Oct 9, 2023 12:25:10 GMT 1
International break has come at the perfect time. He will have plenty of time to get to know the players better and to get his philosophy across to them.....agree that the next batch of games are massive; we need to see some cohesive performances and more of a clear style of play and a plan....and, of course, some results!......massive period for the management team followed by a massive January for the owner and board to invest..... Im sure we were here last year with our Scottish friend. He needs the international break, then no change, he needs a transfer window, then no change. Certainly he has taken this squad backwards so far in terms of competing in games, creating chances and scoring. I hope it works out because we need stability but he certainly doesn't seem to be able to get what Neil and Ronnie got from this squad.
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Post by detox on Oct 9, 2023 12:32:00 GMT 1
Why did he change the team and approach like he did at Birmingham. Then again today.. that might be your answer Dugnet It's a fair question, even allowing for injury (Hogg on Tuesday) why move away from a structure and style that worked so well (and it did) against Ipswich? That question is nothing to do with squad strength or investment that's about simple playing strategy and tactics. I do think it is too early to be harshly critical but fans will expect and demand better against QPR. We know our squad depth is shallow so DM has to get the best from them. Ipswich was massively encouraging, what has followed has been all the more baffling after that performance. I hope it's a blip and we can pick up. The starting eleven for Wednesday game included 10 of the players that started the Ipswich game..the only change was Edwards for Wiles, but you're right..the 'game plan' and set up changed...I preferred the Warnock way where we played the same way every game,home and away...once he'd found the formula..
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Post by King Neil on Oct 9, 2023 12:52:12 GMT 1
The next 3 home games are massive for DM this will really show if we have made a good appointment or not, QPR, Cardiff and Watford I think we need to get between 5-9points anyhting less would be a disspointment in my eyes, this is with a prediction of us losing against L**DS. This is now not about would keeping Neil have been a better option as it honestly was not even an option, this is about if we have replaced him correctly or not. I like DM as a person and so far the players seem to be enjoying the training, but I do have series doubts about his playing style and abilty to get some wins, I admit is not easy he doesnt have a experienced championship striker avaialble I believe we win at Sheff Weds with Ward in the team, I dont feel DW is the answer however but he is the best option currently when fit. October and early November are massive on the pitch and without some performances in the next 4 games I can see Darren under pressure already and not just from us fans. Keeping Neil was the only decent decision that should have been done!!! All this talk of a 3 year plan....we could have had a 10 month plan with Neil in charge..and he hinted there was no reason why we couldn't be in or around the playoffs this season Ridiculous decision making the best manager this division has ever seen stand down! If it isn't broken don't fix it
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Post by willo on Oct 9, 2023 13:01:04 GMT 1
The next 3 home games are massive for DM this will really show if we have made a good appointment or not, QPR, Cardiff and Watford I think we need to get between 5-9points anyhting less would be a disspointment in my eyes, this is with a prediction of us losing against L**DS. This is now not about would keeping Neil have been a better option as it honestly was not even an option, this is about if we have replaced him correctly or not. I like DM as a person and so far the players seem to be enjoying the training, but I do have series doubts about his playing style and abilty to get some wins, I admit is not easy he doesnt have a experienced championship striker avaialble I believe we win at Sheff Weds with Ward in the team, I dont feel DW is the answer however but he is the best option currently when fit. October and early November are massive on the pitch and without some performances in the next 4 games I can see Darren under pressure already and not just from us fans. Keeping Neil was the only decent decision that should have been done!!! All this talk of a 3 year plan....we could have had a 10 month plan with Neil in charge..and he hinted there was no reason why we couldn't be in or around the playoffs this season Ridiculous decision making the best manager this division has ever seen stand down! If it isn't broken don't fix it The bit about the play-offs apart, I’d agree.
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Post by 28901 on Oct 9, 2023 13:07:32 GMT 1
The next 3 home games are massive for DM this will really show if we have made a good appointment or not, QPR, Cardiff and Watford I think we need to get between 5-9points anyhting less would be a disspointment in my eyes, this is with a prediction of us losing against L**DS. This is now not about would keeping Neil have been a better option as it honestly was not even an option, this is about if we have replaced him correctly or not. I like DM as a person and so far the players seem to be enjoying the training, but I do have series doubts about his playing style and abilty to get some wins, I admit is not easy he doesnt have a experienced championship striker avaialble I believe we win at Sheff Weds with Ward in the team, I dont feel DW is the answer however but he is the best option currently when fit. October and early November are massive on the pitch and without some performances in the next 4 games I can see Darren under pressure already and not just from us fans. Keeping Neil was the only decent decision that should have been done!!! All this talk of a 3 year plan....we could have had a 10 month plan with Neil in charge..and he hinted there was no reason why we couldn't be in or around the playoffs this season Ridiculous decision making the best manager this division has ever seen stand down! If it isn't broken don't fix it I agree, it's a ridiculous decision that doesn't stand up to any scrutiny whatever way you look at it. But just repeating it isn't going to bring him back. we have to move forward. hopefully Moore will have realised that players play where they do for a reason. To ask average players to play out of position or whatever is a recipe for disaster.
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Post by King Neil on Oct 9, 2023 13:18:49 GMT 1
I'm certainly not having a go at dm
However you look at the decision is total madness!!
If there hadn't been any falling out and you was happy with Neil being in charge then ANY decent management team would be talking to him...asking if he was happy and OK and is he OK for the season?....simple management skills
Now if the club had spoken to Neil and he wasn't OK then the club need to be honest and tell us this and some of us would be happier knowing we didn't have a choice in this matter but to find a replacement
I will currently stick with my original thoughts that it was all about the tweets
Neil is being paid for the season so he isn't currently going to say anything...then there's disclosure agreement
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Post by castlehillterrier on Oct 9, 2023 13:35:27 GMT 1
The next 3 home games are massive for DM this will really show if we have made a good appointment or not, QPR, Cardiff and Watford I think we need to get between 5-9points anyhting less would be a disspointment in my eyes, this is with a prediction of us losing against L**DS. This is now not about would keeping Neil have been a better option as it honestly was not even an option, this is about if we have replaced him correctly or not. I like DM as a person and so far the players seem to be enjoying the training, but I do have series doubts about his playing style and abilty to get some wins, I admit is not easy he doesnt have a experienced championship striker avaialble I believe we win at Sheff Weds with Ward in the team, I dont feel DW is the answer however but he is the best option currently when fit. October and early November are massive on the pitch and without some performances in the next 4 games I can see Darren under pressure already and not just from us fans. Keeping Neil was the only decent decision that should have been done!!! All this talk of a 3 year plan....we could have had a 10 month plan with Neil in charge..and he hinted there was no reason why we couldn't be in or around the playoffs this season Ridiculous decision making the best manager this division has ever seen stand down! If it isn't broken don't fix it Keeping Neil was not an option, NW made you think it was with all his PR spin but honestly NW had to go, there was not a choice in this at all we could have extended his stay by a few weeks but that is it.
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Post by benhomly on Oct 9, 2023 13:39:21 GMT 1
International break has come at the perfect time. He will have plenty of time to get to know the players better and to get his philosophy across to them.....agree that the next batch of games are massive; we need to see some cohesive performances and more of a clear style of play and a plan....and, of course, some results!......massive period for the management team followed by a massive January for the owner and board to invest..... Im sure we were here last year with our Scottish friend. He needs the international break, then no change, he needs a transfer window, then no change. Certainly he has taken this squad backwards so far in terms of competing in games, creating chances and scoring. I hope it works out because we need stability but he certainly doesn't seem to be able to get what Neil and Ronnie got from this squad. That there are so many Town fans comparing Moore to Fotheringham is madness. He's got 5 years experience as a manager with a promotion to his name. Give the man a chance.
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Post by King Neil on Oct 9, 2023 13:46:56 GMT 1
Keeping Neil was the only decent decision that should have been done!!! All this talk of a 3 year plan....we could have had a 10 month plan with Neil in charge..and he hinted there was no reason why we couldn't be in or around the playoffs this season Ridiculous decision making the best manager this division has ever seen stand down! If it isn't broken don't fix it Keeping Neil was not an option, NW made you think it was with all his PR spin but honestly NW had to go, there was not a choice in this at all we could have extended his stay by a few weeks but that is it. OK...if you are indeed the owner/connected to him then I will have to accept what has been done Dm gets my full support...I just wanted to know if all this could have been avoided
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Post by runner76 on Oct 9, 2023 14:25:42 GMT 1
International break has come at the perfect time. He will have plenty of time to get to know the players better and to get his philosophy across to them.....agree that the next batch of games are massive; we need to see some cohesive performances and more of a clear style of play and a plan....and, of course, some results!......massive period for the management team followed by a massive January for the owner and board to invest..... Im sure we were here last year with our Scottish friend. He needs the international break, then no change, he needs a transfer window, then no change. Certainly he has taken this squad backwards so far in terms of competing in games, creating chances and scoring. I hope it works out because we need stability but he certainly doesn't seem to be able to get what Neil and Ronnie got from this squad. Lucky we seem to have a CEO and Chairman who are talking investment in January…..so Moore won’t need to just get a tune out of this squad as he starts to build his own squad…
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Post by mosher on Oct 9, 2023 14:51:45 GMT 1
Im sure we were here last year with our Scottish friend. He needs the international break, then no change, he needs a transfer window, then no change. Certainly he has taken this squad backwards so far in terms of competing in games, creating chances and scoring. I hope it works out because we need stability but he certainly doesn't seem to be able to get what Neil and Ronnie got from this squad. Lucky we seem to have a CEO and Chairman who are talking investment in January…..so Moore won’t need to just get a tune out of this squad as he starts to build his own squad… I'm hoping that's the reason the squad got trimmed so much, so there was more leeway for THEIR man to build a decent squad, rather than having a whole load of players he doesn't want/rate. Conversely though, whose to say that DM wouldn't have wanted to keep some of those offloaded? Still trying to stay optimistic about the new regime, but it's getting harder to stay onboard as the results and performances deteriorate.
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