Town v Blackburn match thread

[28901]

Dec 27, 2023 11:29:51 GMT 1 ram said:

I am pleased the players took charge of the game and played to their potential.I watched the Sky highlights and thought their keeper should have saved at least 2 of the goals.After Stoke,s win last evening we are still 4th from the bottom,but have improved out GD and the gap.The players should carry on ignoring Moore,s instructions and play like that again on Friday.It shows that they have ability if let loose from his usual nonsense.3/4 players in and a new manager with experience and we will climb the league in no time. Well done the lads!

I find Mooreball as soul destroying and negative as anyone, but there is nothing to suggest the players took it on themselves to ignore him and play different tactics, or that that ever happens apart from on fan message boards.
 

[turbo2]

Dec 27, 2023 11:29:51 GMT 1 ram said:

I am pleased the players took charge of the game and played to their potential.I watched the Sky highlights and thought their keeper should have saved at least 2 of the goals.After Stoke,s win last evening we are still 4th from the bottom,but have improved out GD and the gap.The players should carry on ignoring Moore,s instructions and play like that again on Friday.It shows that they have ability if let loose from his usual nonsense.3/4 players in and a new manager with experience and we will climb the league in no time. Well done the lads!

So in your world it’s all DMs fault when we’re crap and nothing to do with him when we play well.

😂😂

[ACW]

Dec 27, 2023 9:39:31 GMT 1 Essex Terrier said:

Dec 26, 2023 23:14:31 GMT 1 gledholt terrier said:

It is correct that Rudoni didn’t have an assist. On the other hand, neither of the second half goals would’ve happened without his essential involvement.

Rudoni may not have had an assist, but his tenacious closing down and winning of the ball ahead of iur third goal was arguably better than an assist.

Great game for him again - he is a player!

I know there were good performances all over the pitch, but Rudoni was my MOM. Worked his arse off and showed lots of quality on the ball. The catalyst for so much of our forward play.

He's becoming a real quality player at this level. We may struggle to keep him.

[goodbet]

Dec 27, 2023 11:55:40 GMT 1 ACW said:

Dec 27, 2023 9:39:31 GMT 1 Essex Terrier said:

Rudoni may not have had an assist, but his tenacious closing down and winning of the ball ahead of iur third goal was arguably better than an assist.

Great game for him again - he is a player!

I know there were good performances all over the pitch, but Rudoni was my MOM. Worked his arse off and showed lots of quality on the ball. The catalyst for so much of our forward play.

He's becoming a real quality player at this level. We may struggle to keep him.

In the long term we will probably struggle to hold on to good players, but in the present circumstances I can see him leaving in January when we need more quality not less.

[bogart]

Dec 27, 2023 7:23:04 GMT 1 Sio said:

I really hope that Moore has learned a thing or two from yesterday. Not just about the performance, but how the fans will respond to some intent and be very forgiving when it's shown.

This backs to the wall, everyone behind the ball stuff was never, ever going to go down well and unfortunately he has made his own bed in his first 10+ games, and he now has an uphill battle to win over the majority of our fanbase. But, as mentioned above, we are a very amenable and forgiving bunch - another 5-10 performances like that and he'll be on the right track.

I have serious doubts over his charisma and intelligence to be a successful Town manager but let's hope that his tactical game can improve from here.

Doubts over his charisma, god he hasn't got any! One only needs to have watched yesterdays post match interview.

[ACW]

Dec 27, 2023 10:32:07 GMT 1 boooothy said:

Dec 27, 2023 3:21:45 GMT 1 Oblong of Dreams said:

I agree that one swallow doesn't make a summer (and one shit doesn't make a shitstorm) but on the off chance that Big Dave has a look on here to see the fan reaction like Sir Neil did, I hope he sees that the way we approached the game today is a far better way to go about things than the negative shite of recent weeks. As fans we don't have particularly high expectations but we do expect a bit of effort from the team, and for them to at least try to win even when the odds are against us. Blackburn were absolute garbage but you can only beat what's in front of you. Friday won't be as easy but if we approach the game in the same manner I'll applaud the team off regardless of the final score.

I agree however we still had 32 per cent possession (not a stat that bothers me in the slightest but it is often thrown at Moore), i also agree that every game is full of what ifs. However is their keeper doesn’t make a hash of the first goal, was the approach to the game actually any different to all the others? It turned into a great game for us but i’m not sure we started with anything different to what we’ve seen before.

Blackburn started the match well. At the time we scored the first goal, I thought Town were just starting to get a foothold in the game and were trying to attack the Rovers goal whenever we could.

Much of Blackburn's possession was in their own half, slowly building from the back. Town, in contrast, were pressing high and attacking from much further up the pitch. Whereas it took Blackburn half a dozen passes to get out of their own half, it took Town 2-3 to get to their box. That might explain the skewed possession stats.

Town were certainly looking to get forward whenever they could. Blackburn, despite their poor performance on the day, still have better technical players than we do, so it was inevitable they would dominate the ball. However, I thought Town looked to be far more progressive when they did get on the ball, passing and moving and supporting the ball carrier better. Obviously, the first goal gave Town the confidence to attack more, but I saw signs of a more positive approach before Headley's opener.

[araucaria]

Minor point I know, but Blackburn won the toss and did what 90+% teams have done here in the last 30 seasons - chose to play towards their own fans in the second half. QPR and Southampton did the same. Two wins, one draw for us. Town have won the toss (or the opposition chose to play the other way) 5 times and we have three draws and two (abject) defeats. Hope Boro win the toss.

Even more minor; my mate pointed out that we haven't lost to a team beginning with Q to W (W4, D5) and yesterday was the first win against any team beginning with B to P - at the 15th attempt. Quite extraordinary.

[ACW]

Dec 27, 2023 11:29:51 GMT 1 ram said:

I am pleased the players took charge of the game and played to their potential.I watched the Sky highlights and thought their keeper should have saved at least 2 of the goals.After Stoke,s win last evening we are still 4th from the bottom,but have improved out GD and the gap.The players should carry on ignoring Moore,s instructions and play like that again on Friday.It shows that they have ability if let loose from his usual nonsense.3/4 players in and a new manager with experience and we will climb the league in no time. Well done the lads!

Sorry, but to suggest that performance was due to players ignoring Moore's instructions is just utter bollocks.

I know some have entrenched views about Moore, and won't budge from them, but that comment is taking it to a new level.

Criticise the manager when he deserves it by all means, but FFS give him some credit when he earns it too!

[ACW]

Dec 27, 2023 12:07:27 GMT 1 araucaria said:

Minor point I know, but Blackburn won the toss and did what 90+% teams have done here in the last 30 seasons - chose to play towards their own fans in the second half. QPR and Southampton did the same. Two wins, one draw for us. Town have won the toss (or the opposition chose to play the other way) 5 times and we have three draws and two (abject) defeats. Hope Boro win the toss.

Even more minor; my mate pointed out that we haven't lost to a team beginning with Q to W (W4, D5) and yesterday was the first win against any team beginning with B to P - at the 15th attempt. Quite extraordinary.

Your mate has too much time on their hands! 😁

[turbo2]

Dec 27, 2023 12:09:29 GMT 1 ACW said:

Dec 27, 2023 11:29:51 GMT 1 ram said:

I am pleased the players took charge of the game and played to their potential.I watched the Sky highlights and thought their keeper should have saved at least 2 of the goals.After Stoke,s win last evening we are still 4th from the bottom,but have improved out GD and the gap.The players should carry on ignoring Moore,s instructions and play like that again on Friday.It shows that they have ability if let loose from his usual nonsense.3/4 players in and a new manager with experience and we will climb the league in no time. Well done the lads!

Sorry, but to suggest that performance was due to players ignoring Moore's instructions is just utter bollocks.

I know some have entrenched views about Moore, and won't budge from them, but that comment is taking it to a new level.

Criticise the manager when he deserves it by all means, but FFS give him some credit when he earns it too!

I’m not defending DM as there has been some utter dross to watch. But when you analyse some of the teamsheets it little wonder.

I remember well the grief Carlos was getting in a very similar situation. Let’s keep our fingers crossed that we go in a similar direction.

I just get the feeling that too many of our fan base has made their mind up.

[alfredsterrier]

Decent win and good performance from everyone.
Yes, Blackburn were rubbish on the day but they have won a lot more than town this season so it can’t just be that we beat a bad team.
Good counter attacking football and better decision making when playing people in led to the goals.
Rudoni great player who loves to get stuck in.
Sorba becoming invaluable and really don’t know where we would be without him, challenging Helick as player of season now.
Go for it again on Friday.
I would rather lose having gone for it than the long painful defeats recently.

[Deleted]

Sorba Thomas is doing well this season but was clumsy as fuck for most of the first half,couldn't seem to control or keep the ball.He improved and I was pleased for him to score,long may it continue.

[ageingterrier]

Well said Turbo2. There are several whose views appear to be informed by how much personality the team manager shows, how much he waves to the crowd or his charisma at interviews, none of which influence performance on the field but accord with the modern infantile mindset where cuddly toys are given exalted status.
Further up the board we even have someone suggesting if Moore sends us out to draw, we lose, but demands we win and, hey presto!

For what it’s worth I’m not absolutely taken with Darren Moore though much of my frustration lies with football generally. It seems all British coaches under a certain age have been schooled with the same cautious, sanitised mindset and taking risks to create goalmouth incident is scorned. When you set that against Town’s position of having a limited number of talented players and a thin squad it’s hardly surprising Darren Moore sets out his team to avoid defeat and only considers attempting victory much later in the match. In this respect I don’t think he differs significantly from the deified (by some!) Mr Warnock last season. Even under NW we endured some woeful performances. Nor is this myopia restricted to Town fans. Ask any Blackburn supporter yesterday what he thinks and you’ll hear similar, yet they, like many at this level, kept the ball and played it around in very pretty triangles…..in areas which did us little damage. On another day it would have been Town making the mistakes leading to the mood setting opening goal, with a different outcome. That’s Championship level football encapsulated. If mistake ridden football and regular defeats spoil your Saturday evenings I would suggest watching Town isnt for you.

Perhaps advancing years, and the brief experience of Premier League football has coloured my view but all I ask of Town nowadays is an enjoyable spectacle with plenty of goalmouth incident. Yes, I like to see them win but the opponents want exactly the same so even best laid plans won’t work every time. Booing fans and those constantly wanting to change the manager seem to forget that at this level no one represents a panacea. 12 months ago many would have taken Chris Wilder but his star has faded and there are many similar examples. Very often, persistence wins through as players and coaches learn from mistakes and teamwork grows through repeated practice. We’ve burned our way through seven managers since Wagner’s departure 5 years ago next month and the most successful one of those lasted 2 years after a very indifferent first season, so rather than pursue the failed approach of regular changes, let’s persist even though Darren Moore may not be the favourite cuddly toy that his vociferous critics demand.

[overtonterrierspirit]

Dec 27, 2023 12:09:29 GMT 1 ACW said:

Dec 27, 2023 11:29:51 GMT 1 ram said:

I am pleased the players took charge of the game and played to their potential.I watched the Sky highlights and thought their keeper should have saved at least 2 of the goals.After Stoke,s win last evening we are still 4th from the bottom,but have improved out GD and the gap.The players should carry on ignoring Moore,s instructions and play like that again on Friday.It shows that they have ability if let loose from his usual nonsense.3/4 players in and a new manager with experience and we will climb the league in no time. Well done the lads!

Sorry, but to suggest that performance was due to players ignoring Moore's instructions is just utter bollocks.

I know some have entrenched views about Moore, and won't budge from them, but that comment is taking it to a new level.

Criticise the manager when he deserves it by all means, but FFS give him some credit when he earns it too!

Especially when the opinion is formed based on a 15 minute highlights show on Sky.

[rockwall]

Regardless of how anyone feels about Darren Moore, to suggest the players didn't follow his instructions is ridiculous.
Any grounded individual should accept that Moore got the plan, tactics and subs spot on yesterday.

The question is, can it be followed up against Middlesbrough?

Another win, with a performance to match and Moore could slowly gain a little bit more respect.

[boooothy]

Dec 27, 2023 12:39:38 GMT 1 @herefordaway said:

Sorba Thomas is doing well this season but was clumsy as fuck for most of the first half,couldn't seem to control or keep the ball.He improved and I was pleased for him to score,long may it continue.

He’s playing in the wrong position. He does seem to be putting more effort in than i’ve previously thought but down the middle is not his thing.

[28901]

Dec 27, 2023 12:07:27 GMT 1 araucaria said:

Minor point I know, but Blackburn won the toss and did what 90+% teams have done here in the last 30 seasons - chose to play towards their own fans in the second half. QPR and Southampton did the same. Two wins, one draw for us. Town have won the toss (or the opposition chose to play the other way) 5 times and we have three draws and two (abject) defeats. Hope Boro win the toss.

Even more minor; my mate pointed out that we haven't lost to a team beginning with Q to W (W4, D5) and yesterday was the first win against any team beginning with B to P - at the 15th attempt. Quite extraordinary.

That first one isn't a minor point in my book I hate playing the other way and we always seem to lose doing it.

[Christ in Shades (art)]

Dec 27, 2023 12:39:38 GMT 1 @herefordaway said:

Sorba Thomas is doing well this season but was clumsy as fuck for most of the first half,couldn't seem to control or keep the ball.He improved and I was pleased for him to score,long may it continue.

This seem to afflict a few players yesterday, we usually are clumsy in possession at the best of times, but yesterday the ball was flying all over ghe place when certain players had it, Thomas being one, Wiles too and Headley with Rudoni and Burgzog not immune either.

[Porrohman]

Dec 27, 2023 11:32:44 GMT 1 overtonterrierspirit said:

Dec 27, 2023 11:29:51 GMT 1 ram said:

I am pleased the players took charge of the game and played to their potential.I watched the Sky highlights and thought their keeper should have saved at least 2 of the goals.After Stoke,s win last evening we are still 4th from the bottom,but have improved out GD and the gap.The players should carry on ignoring Moore,s instructions and play like that again on Friday.It shows that they have ability if let loose from his usual nonsense.3/4 players in and a new manager with experience and we will climb the league in no time. Well done the lads!

You think that the players ignored Moore yesterday?
This is not what I saw.
For example, Yuta ran to speak with the manager at almost every break in play yesterday to receive instructions.

Or it took 90 mins for him to get a coherent message to him 🤔😉😁. I did wonder why when Sorba scored and was coming back to halfway, Yuta went to have a conversation with him and then went and spoke to Hoggy. I mentioned it to my daughter and she'd seen Yuta go to the bench while the rest were celebrating.

[Porrohman]

Dec 27, 2023 12:07:27 GMT 1 araucaria said:

Minor point I know, but Blackburn won the toss and did what 90+% teams have done here in the last 30 seasons - chose to play towards their own fans in the second half. QPR and Southampton did the same. Two wins, one draw for us. Town have won the toss (or the opposition chose to play the other way) 5 times and we have three draws and two (abject) defeats. Hope Boro win the toss.

Even more minor; my mate pointed out that we haven't lost to a team beginning with Q to W (W4, D5) and yesterday was the first win against any team beginning with B to P - at the 15th attempt. Quite extraordinary.

I was just glad we finally played the right way round again

[Porrohman]

Dec 27, 2023 13:06:41 GMT 1 boooothy said:

Dec 27, 2023 12:39:38 GMT 1 @herefordaway said:

Sorba Thomas is doing well this season but was clumsy as fuck for most of the first half,couldn't seem to control or keep the ball.He improved and I was pleased for him to score,long may it continue.

He’s playing in the wrong position. He does seem to be putting more effort in than i’ve previously thought but down the middle is not his thing.

I said yesterday, the only other bloke that plays Sorba in positions that don't suit him is Rob Page.

[kennyk2]

Just watched the game again on ifollow. A few points.

1. It's not just Delano Bergzorg, Headley and Rudoni, Thomas and Kasumu... they all are confident enough to take on a man in one-to-ones. It doesn't always come off, but it's so different to the pass-pass-pass style of most teams in this division.

2. Sorba Thomas made a very important contribution to the team yesterday and was somewhat overlooked.

3. Their CB Carthorse or was it Carter, could have been sent off for that tackle from behind on Burgzorg. He would have been in the PL.

4. They really didn't know what to do with Bergzorg did they?

[johncoddington5]

Dec 27, 2023 14:16:23 GMT 1 kennyk2 said:

Just watched the game again on ifollow. A few points.

1. It's not just Delano Bergzorg, Headley and Rudoni, Thomas and Kasumu... they all are confident enough to take on a man in one-to-ones. It doesn't always come off, but it's so different to the pass-pass-pass style of most teams in this division.

2. Sorba Thomas made a very important contribution to the team yesterday and was somewhat overlooked.

3. Their CB Carthorse or was it Carter, could have been sent off for that tackle from behind on Burgzorg. He would have been in the PL.

4. They really didn't know what to do with Bergzorg did they?

How can they? He doesn’t know what he’s doing at times!

[goodbet]

Dec 27, 2023 12:41:58 GMT 1 ageingterrier said:

Well said Turbo2. There are several whose views appear to be informed by how much personality the team manager shows, how much he waves to the crowd or his charisma at interviews, none of which influence performance on the field but accord with the modern infantile mindset where cuddly toys are given exalted status.
Further up the board we even have someone suggesting if Moore sends us out to draw, we lose, but demands we win and, hey presto!

For what it’s worth I’m not absolutely taken with Darren Moore though much of my frustration lies with football generally. It seems all British coaches under a certain age have been schooled with the same cautious, sanitised mindset and taking risks to create goalmouth incident is scorned. When you set that against Town’s position of having a limited number of talented players and a thin squad it’s hardly surprising Darren Moore sets out his team to avoid defeat and only considers attempting victory much later in the match. In this respect I don’t think he differs significantly from the deified (by some!) Mr Warnock last season. Even under NW we endured some woeful performances. Nor is this myopia restricted to Town fans. Ask any Blackburn supporter yesterday what he thinks and you’ll hear similar, yet they, like many at this level, kept the ball and played it around in very pretty triangles…..in areas which did us little damage. On another day it would have been Town making the mistakes leading to the mood setting opening goal, with a different outcome. That’s Championship level football encapsulated. If mistake ridden football and regular defeats spoil your Saturday evenings I would suggest watching Town isnt for you.

Perhaps advancing years, and the brief experience of Premier League football has coloured my view but all I ask of Town nowadays is an enjoyable spectacle with plenty of goalmouth incident. Yes, I like to see them win but the opponents want exactly the same so even best laid plans won’t work every time. Booing fans and those constantly wanting to change the manager seem to forget that at this level no one represents a panacea. 12 months ago many would have taken Chris Wilder but his star has faded and there are many similar examples. Very often, persistence wins through as players and coaches learn from mistakes and teamwork grows through repeated practice. We’ve burned our way through seven managers since Wagner’s departure 5 years ago next month and the most successful one of those lasted 2 years after a very indifferent first season, so rather than pursue the failed approach of regular changes, let’s persist even though Darren Moore may not be the favourite cuddly toy that his vociferous critics demand.

I can see where you are comming from, but we live in the real world.

If we had kept hold of Schofield or Buzz we would have been in League 1 now.

Apart from yesterday's performance we have been very poor and driving fans away and there has to be a point where we get rid of poorly performing managers.

As always it is the fine line as to where you draw the line. I would have got rid of Schofield and Buzz a lot quicker than we did and I think we have kept DM too long, but this latest result may have given him more time.

I still feel that giving such a poor performing manager the January window is a big risk. We don't know who was responsible for the rubbish we brought in last January, but it was probably a joint failure of Buzz and Dean's penny pinching.

We need to do a lot better this January.

[kennyk2]

Dec 27, 2023 14:18:44 GMT 1 johncoddington5 said:

Dec 27, 2023 14:16:23 GMT 1 kennyk2 said:

Just watched the game again on ifollow. A few points.

1. It's not just Delano Bergzorg, Headley and Rudoni, Thomas and Kasumu... they all are confident enough to take on a man in one-to-ones. It doesn't always come off, but it's so different to the pass-pass-pass style of most teams in this division.

2. Sorba Thomas made a very important contribution to the team yesterday and was somewhat overlooked.

3. Their CB Carthorse or was it Carter, could have been sent off for that tackle from behind on Burgzorg. He would have been in the PL.

4. They really didn't know what to do with Bergzorg did they?

How can they? He doesn’t know what he’s doing at times!

Yep! I think I said that before... how can the opposition guess what he's going to do when he doesn't even know himself.

[gledholt terrier]

Dec 27, 2023 13:54:27 GMT 1 Porrohman said:

Dec 27, 2023 11:32:44 GMT 1 overtonterrierspirit said:

You think that the players ignored Moore yesterday?
This is not what I saw.
For example, Yuta ran to speak with the manager at almost every break in play yesterday to receive instructions.

Or it took 90 mins for him to get a coherent message to him 🤔😉😁. I did wonder why when Sorba scored and was coming back to halfway, Yuta went to have a conversation with him and then went and spoke to Hoggy. I mentioned it to my daughter and she'd seen Yuta go to the bench while the rest were celebrating.

I sit behind DM, all be it high up, and he was communicating a lot yesterday and was very vocal at times. Still far from convinced as the previous negatives were not cancelled out by yesterday’s positives and Friday is a test he needs to pass with at least 1 point (probably with some injury problems - I can’t see Kasumu making it and Burgzorg must be a doubt, too).

[Porrohman]

Dec 27, 2023 14:49:09 GMT 1 gledholt terrier said:

Dec 27, 2023 13:54:27 GMT 1 Porrohman said:

Or it took 90 mins for him to get a coherent message to him 🤔😉😁. I did wonder why when Sorba scored and was coming back to halfway, Yuta went to have a conversation with him and then went and spoke to Hoggy. I mentioned it to my daughter and she'd seen Yuta go to the bench while the rest were celebrating.

I sit behind DM, all be it high up, and he was communicating a lot yesterday and was very vocal at times. Still far from convinced as the previous negatives were not cancelled out by yesterday’s positives and Friday is a test he needs to pass with at least 1 point (probably with some injury problems - I can’t see Kasumu making it and Burgzorg must be a doubt, too).

I hope, if Burgzorg is out, they announce it in time cos I don't want to trail down there to find out Hudlin's starting 😖🫣

[ilsonterrier]

Dec 27, 2023 11:55:40 GMT 1 ACW said:

Dec 27, 2023 9:39:31 GMT 1 Essex Terrier said:

Rudoni may not have had an assist, but his tenacious closing down and winning of the ball ahead of iur third goal was arguably better than an assist.

Great game for him again - he is a player!

I know there were good performances all over the pitch, but Rudoni was my MOM. Worked his arse off and showed lots of quality on the ball. The catalyst for so much of our forward play.

He's becoming a real quality player at this level. We may struggle to keep him.

Rudoni was my MOM as well. He always seemed to want to get involved. No assists - but 2 "assists to the assist" in that he played the penultimate pass, something that O'Brien was very good at. He's only getting better, and yesterday showed just how much we missed him whilst he was injured.

[galpharm2400]

Dec 27, 2023 14:20:31 GMT 1 kennyk2 said:

Dec 27, 2023 14:18:44 GMT 1 johncoddington5 said:

How can they? He doesn’t know what he’s doing at times!

Yep! I think I said that before... how can the opposition guess what he's going to do when he doesn't even know himself.

I may have mentioned a bit ago about having a front 3 made up of a combination of burgzog, thomas,koroma headley and rudoni.
Running with the ball from somewhat higher up the pitch with 2 players supporting the bloke on the ball and getting in front of the man on the ball. First thought being to run with it, then pass forward and continue the run to support again.
Happened numerous times yesterday and
Proved that we can do it, we can run with it, we can play shorter forward passes to men into their stride and we can outnumber the last defender and make good choices.
Its just having the right players in better starting positions for a break. Ward isnt one of those players. We pose the threat of running with the ball and supporting the ball if Ward isnt playing. Its playing to a forward who may or may not control it, may or may not bring another player into the break, far easier to have a runner with the ball and some others busting a gut to support the run, at least we have possession. We did manage, even when losing the ball, to move it further up the pitch and release pressure on us.
It may appear to be a small thing but the possession stats for Blackburn in our last third and touches in our box were hugely smaller than in the last few games, ie the shots on our goal were negligible and dangerous balls into or across our box were very few.

[ibby]

Good win.