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Post by blackmoreisgod on Apr 18, 2024 22:12:18 GMT 1
The PGMOL seems to be all about acknowledging/apologising for mistakes rather than improving the quality of officials. They even now have a t v programme to criticise referees who work for them. it's only a matter of time given the money at stake these days and the amount of mega rich foreign owners new to football before the PGMOL finds itself on the wrong end of a writ |
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Post by workshyfop on Apr 18, 2024 22:17:36 GMT 1
I still find it weird/suspicious that Town never kicked up a fuss after the Forest playoff final. With the amount of money at stake and VAR being available.
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Post by themanfromatlantis on Apr 18, 2024 22:45:00 GMT 1
I think the issue is not whether she is female, whether she had played too much added time but why she decided to give a penalty for no apparent reason. She couldn’t have seen a penalty as there wasn’t one to see. Basically the Bristol player screamed in her face, waved his arms about. She was intimidated (like Hull did) to give the decision The only person who can explain unequivocally is RW herself. Given the acknowledgement from PGMOL, it was either a case of her admitting to her bosses she made a mistake, or they’ve put her right on this (or thrown her under the bus). She must have had a thought that it was a penalty, because the BC player running up to her confirmed that bias (bias as in it reinforced her thoughts it was a penalty, not a bias against HTFC). When I see these things, the only thing I would like to see in football, that the authorities won’t do, is to tell players that remonstrating with the Ref like this will result in an immediate yellow card. It’s down to the Ref to make their own decision, not have to deal with pressure from the actors on the pitch. They should respect the Ref as they do in both codes of Rugby. One things for sure, this will only be debated heavily on here, particularly if we get relegated by a single point. If it were one of the big PL clubs it would be debated for days… |
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Post by melbourneterrier on Apr 19, 2024 2:34:53 GMT 1
That Bristol player running up to her face with his arms open, screaming should also be addressed.
We all know the season is 46 games, and if we get relegated then the counter argument can be made that we lost/drew too many games and weren't good enough. To me, if we get relegated by a point, or on GD then yes, this is certainly the call that relegated us.
At what point, do Town have a leg to stand on.an incorrect penalty call, over the allotted ET (I get that Helik was down, a Sub was made etc, my point here is Town didn't even stand a chance at reacting) (and Town have received confirmation that it should not have been awarded).
Should we go down, the ramifications for us could be massive. There's no guarantee we'd get back UP out of League one. It could be that we stay there for seasons on end, we could free fall into non league. Who knows. Either way, the financial ramifications, as well as the knock on affect on our playing roster and transfers are huge, and we just have to shut up and accept it? Look, I get people make mistakes, I get there is always going to be an element of human error. It happens everywhere, however theres always, or rather should be a case of ownership and resolution. Especially when so much is at stake.
I hope Town are looking into their options
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Post by brighousebandbred on Apr 19, 2024 6:29:48 GMT 1
This is what happens when you fast track refs to suit your agenda . The standard is simply not even close to acceptable, and the punishment for her mistake will be brushed under the carpet, not acceptable in the slightest.
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Post by detox on Apr 19, 2024 7:20:14 GMT 1
....hmmm
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Post by durhamterrier on Apr 19, 2024 7:49:34 GMT 1
That Bristol player running up to her face with his arms open, screaming should also be addressed. We all know the season is 46 games, and if we get relegated then the counter argument can be made that we lost/drew too many games and weren't good enough. To me, if we get relegated by a point, or on GD then yes, this is certainly the call that relegated us. At what point, do Town have a leg to stand on.an incorrect penalty call, over the allotted ET (I get that Helik was down, a Sub was made etc, my point here is Town didn't even stand a chance at reacting) (and Town have received confirmation that it should not have been awarded). Should we go down, the ramifications for us could be massive. There's no guarantee we'd get back UP out of League one. It could be that we stay there for seasons on end, we could free fall into non league. Who knows. Either way, the financial ramifications, as well as the knock on affect on our playing roster and transfers are huge, and we just have to shut up and accept it? Look, I get people make mistakes, I get there is always going to be an element of human error. It happens everywhere, however theres always, or rather should be a case of ownership and resolution. Especially when so much is at stake. I hope Town are looking into their options It’s the same the other way round though . Every club chase refs down to influence decisions . It’s not right and it should be cut out but we can’t plead victims when we do the same |
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Post by Terriersmad on Apr 19, 2024 8:01:59 GMT 1
That Bristol player running up to her face with his arms open, screaming should also be addressed. We all know the season is 46 games, and if we get relegated then the counter argument can be made that we lost/drew too many games and weren't good enough. To me, if we get relegated by a point, or on GD then yes, this is certainly the call that relegated us. At what point, do Town have a leg to stand on.an incorrect penalty call, over the allotted ET (I get that Helik was down, a Sub was made etc, my point here is Town didn't even stand a chance at reacting) (and Town have received confirmation that it should not have been awarded). Should we go down, the ramifications for us could be massive. There's no guarantee we'd get back UP out of League one. It could be that we stay there for seasons on end, we could free fall into non league. Who knows. Either way, the financial ramifications, as well as the knock on affect on our playing roster and transfers are huge, and we just have to shut up and accept it? Look, I get people make mistakes, I get there is always going to be an element of human error. It happens everywhere, however theres always, or rather should be a case of ownership and resolution. Especially when so much is at stake. I hope Town are looking into their options The issue I have is that nothing has gone our way this season. During a season you’re always getting decisions one way or the other. This season we’ve had nothing to our way. We took the lead through a marginally offside goal at QPR, but other than that absolutely nothing. Compare that to what has gone against us. On a balance sheet, the decisions against are in the red by a considerable margin - 10-12 match-changing decisions against that were incorrect. We’re not very good. But more importantly we’re not lucky. Not being very good has cost us plenty of points. But luck has also cost us 10 points since Christmas. |
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Post by isitjustme on Apr 19, 2024 8:20:47 GMT 1
That Bristol player running up to her face with his arms open, screaming should also be addressed. We all know the season is 46 games, and if we get relegated then the counter argument can be made that we lost/drew too many games and weren't good enough. To me, if we get relegated by a point, or on GD then yes, this is certainly the call that relegated us. At what point, do Town have a leg to stand on.an incorrect penalty call, over the allotted ET (I get that Helik was down, a Sub was made etc, my point here is Town didn't even stand a chance at reacting) (and Town have received confirmation that it should not have been awarded). Should we go down, the ramifications for us could be massive. There's no guarantee we'd get back UP out of League one. It could be that we stay there for seasons on end, we could free fall into non league. Who knows. Either way, the financial ramifications, as well as the knock on affect on our playing roster and transfers are huge, and we just have to shut up and accept it? Look, I get people make mistakes, I get there is always going to be an element of human error. It happens everywhere, however theres always, or rather should be a case of ownership and resolution. Especially when so much is at stake. I hope Town are looking into their options The issue I have is that nothing has gone our way this season. During a season you’re always getting decisions one way or the other. This season we’ve had nothing to our way. We took the lead through a marginally offside goal at QPR, but other than that absolutely nothing. Compare that to what has gone against us. On a balance sheet, the decisions against are in the red by a considerable margin - 10-12 match-changing decisions against that were incorrect. We’re not very good. But more importantly we’re not lucky. Not being very good has cost us plenty of points. But luck has also cost us 10 points since Christmas. Not even close to offside either !!! |
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Post by Terriersmad on Apr 19, 2024 8:21:32 GMT 1
The issue I have is that nothing has gone our way this season. During a season you’re always getting decisions one way or the other. This season we’ve had nothing to our way. We took the lead through a marginally offside goal at QPR, but other than that absolutely nothing. Compare that to what has gone against us. On a balance sheet, the decisions against are in the red by a considerable margin - 10-12 match-changing decisions against that were incorrect. We’re not very good. But more importantly we’re not lucky. Not being very good has cost us plenty of points. But luck has also cost us 10 points since Christmas. Not even close to offside either !!! It was. Lees was half a yard beyond the last defender when the initial free-kick came in. |
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Post by themanfromatlantis on Apr 19, 2024 8:27:33 GMT 1
A bit like the no goal vs Blackpool last season (another apology), let’s hope this spurs the players on to make sure this one doesn’t have any material effect after 46 games. A slight difference with this one, but the principle is the same, an acknowledged error, with no recourse.
We need to put our big boy pants on though, there is no recourse for this. Other teams have had apologies, but I think I’ve only ever seen one game replayed in the past (Arsenal v Sheff Utd). Thankfully that didn’t set a precedent, because we don’t really want the game mired in litigation. It’s bad enough with the money influencing things.
Imagine if we were relegated and we put in some sort of challenge to this. You know there would be a counter challenge from the other club.
It’s absolutely shite for Town is this, but the players have hopefully moved on from feeling sorry for themselves and are working on the things that should have won them that game, and hopefully honing their shooting boots, which have been woeful again this season.
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Post by isitjustme on Apr 19, 2024 8:28:42 GMT 1
Not even close to offside either !!! It was. Lees was half a yard beyond the last defender when the initial free-kick came in. Ok. We are looking at different aspects of the goal. Was thinking you was saying Rudoni was offside, which he wasn't. Just tried to see the goal on sky again, but it's not available. |
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Post by Farsley Terrier (UK product) on Apr 19, 2024 8:37:30 GMT 1
It's just one instance of ineptitude by officials who know that when push comes to shove their errors will be backed up by an organisation that is ultimately not fit for purpose.
Not so long ago a certain referee cheated us out of two cast iron penalties at wembley and was backed all the way by those behind the scenes.
It would be easy to look at the whole thing and think this was a conspiracy against the club for daring to dream and reach the premier league. Ever since we have seen disgraceful decision after decision go against us.
Welch should be demoted to refereeing kids football after her error but nothing will happen because it's Huddersfield Town.
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Post by Terriersmad on Apr 19, 2024 8:40:12 GMT 1
It was. Lees was half a yard beyond the last defender when the initial free-kick came in. Ok. We are looking at different aspects of the goal. Was thinking you was saying Rudoni was offside, which he wasn't. Just tried to see the goal on sky again, but it's not available. Rudoni certainly wasn’t! |
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Post by isitjustme on Apr 19, 2024 8:53:29 GMT 1
Ok. We are looking at different aspects of the goal. Was thinking you was saying Rudoni was offside, which he wasn't. Just tried to see the goal on sky again, but it's not available. Rudoni certainly wasn’t! Wish I knew how to add a screen shot here. Just managed to see the goal again and Lees on side for me. He might have been a gnats off regarding the fullback closest to him. But their CB is slightly further back when cross comes in. Infact, I think 4 of their defenders centrally could be playing him on ! No matter now anyway, but if that one had gone against us too we'd be as good as down now.....  |
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Post by stinkypete on Apr 19, 2024 9:12:21 GMT 1
Wish I knew how to add a screen shot here. Just managed to see the goal again and Lees on side for me. He might have been a gnats off regarding the fullback closest to him. But their CB is slightly further back when cross comes in. Infact, I think 4 of their defenders centrally could be playing him on ! No matter now anyway, but if that one had gone against us too we'd be as good as down now..... The QPR equaliser was incredibly lucky also though, just hit the lad on the knee and flew perfectly into the top corner!! A 1 in 100 goal!! |
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Post by htafcokay on Apr 19, 2024 9:19:34 GMT 1
I still find it weird/suspicious that Town never kicked up a fuss after the Forest playoff final. With the amount of money at stake and VAR being available. What would it have achieved? |
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Post by rothwellterrier on Apr 19, 2024 9:22:10 GMT 1
I still find it weird/suspicious that Town never kicked up a fuss after the Forest playoff final. With the amount of money at stake and VAR being available. What would it have achieved? It may have meant we kept hold of our most successful manager in the club’s history  |
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Post by htafcokay on Apr 19, 2024 9:25:43 GMT 1
What would it have achieved? It may have meant we kept hold of our most successful manager in the club’s history Didn't realise Herbert Chapman had been dug up. Seriously though, what would it have achieved? They'll never replay the game, they'll never admit they got decisions wrong, so I don't understand what Town were supposed to have done. No-one ever talks about the Peterborough final in 2011 where their first goal came from a free-kick where there was an offside. We benefitted from a questionable decision in the 2004 final where no-one on this planet knows if the ball was out before Colin Larkin scored. There's been hundreds of decisions go against us over the years, just as there's been hundreds go for us. It's football, decisions go for you, they go against you. Get on with it. |
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Post by themanfromatlantis on Apr 19, 2024 9:36:16 GMT 1
I don’t think anyone is disputing the fact we’ve had stuff go for us, just as much as it goes against us.
But this is just timing, had this happened to one of our relegation rivals we’d have been agreeing with them it was a crap decision, but thankful it had been given.
The only thing I would have added to my comments about PGMOL further above, are why did they send a note to the Town Mgr? How it’s phrased doesn’t sound like it was an apology, just an acknowledgement that it was the wrong decision. In some respects it would have been better all round if they had kept schtum. If you were really cynical you could say it was done purposely to stir the shit pot that little bit more? (I don’t BTW, I just think there are lots of stupid people in positions they shouldn’t be in across this land, PGMOL obviously have at least one)
Take a positive view, the fact they have acknowledged this might mean we get away with a couple ourselves in these last 3 games.
The key thing there of course, is that the players have to do their bit as well…
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Post by htafcokay on Apr 19, 2024 9:45:36 GMT 1
I don’t think anyone is disputing the fact we’ve had stuff go for us, just as much as it goes against us. But this is just timing, had this happened to one of our relegation rivals we’d have been agreeing with them it was a crap decision, but thankful it had been given. The only thing I would have added to my comments about PGMOL further above, are why did they send a note to the Town Mgr? How it’s phrased doesn’t sound like it was an apology, just an acknowledgement that it was the wrong decision. In some respects it would have been better all round if they had kept schtum. If you were really cynical you could say it was done purposely to stir the shit pot that little bit more? (I don’t BTW, I just think there are lots of stupid people in positions they shouldn’t be in across this land, PGMOL obviously have at least one) Take a positive view, the fact they have acknowledged this might mean we get away with a couple ourselves in these last 3 games. The key thing there of course, is that the players have to do their bit as well…Agreed, and in reality this is why we are in this position. The players HAVEN'T done their bit across the season. |
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Post by royrace on Apr 19, 2024 9:46:39 GMT 1
That Bristol player running up to her face with his arms open, screaming should also be addressed. We all know the season is 46 games, and if we get relegated then the counter argument can be made that we lost/drew too many games and weren't good enough. To me, if we get relegated by a point, or on GD then yes, this is certainly the call that relegated us. At what point, do Town have a leg to stand on.an incorrect penalty call, over the allotted ET (I get that Helik was down, a Sub was made etc, my point here is Town didn't even stand a chance at reacting) (and Town have received confirmation that it should not have been awarded). Should we go down, the ramifications for us could be massive. There's no guarantee we'd get back UP out of League one. It could be that we stay there for seasons on end, we could free fall into non league. Who knows. Either way, the financial ramifications, as well as the knock on affect on our playing roster and transfers are huge, and we just have to shut up and accept it? Look, I get people make mistakes, I get there is always going to be an element of human error. It happens everywhere, however theres always, or rather should be a case of ownership and resolution. Especially when so much is at stake. I hope Town are looking into their options It’s the same the other way round though . Every club chase refs down to influence decisions . It’s not right and it should be cut out but we can’t plead victims when we do the same We don't though do we. All the top teams do it, we just meekly accept our fate. She was massively influenced by the Hull players in the home game. Just comes from inexperience and a lack of confidence due to being promoted above her ability. |
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Post by araucaria on Apr 19, 2024 9:52:18 GMT 1
Has there been an instance of the opposition receiving an apology when we have been the beneficiaries? Dave used to get them quite often, Danny will have choked on the Blackpool one, now AB and we're still waiting for the play-off one. Can't think of one, but it wouldn't stick in the mind like the injustices done to us.
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Post by htafcokay on Apr 19, 2024 9:52:29 GMT 1
In 1976, we played promotion rivals Tranmere Rovers at Prenton Park. Peter Willis awarded them three penalties, while they missed one, they still won 3-0. Those two points we missed out on would have seen us promoted. Instead Tranmere went up by two points.
The club actually requested that Willis was banned from ever refereeing us. Not that it mattered, as he was assigned to us again not long after and there was more controversy and more calls from the club for him to be banned.
For as long as there's been officials, there's been controversy. All 92 Football League clubs will insist that the refs are against them and that there's a conspiracy against them. That's just football.
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Post by themanfromatlantis on Apr 19, 2024 9:57:17 GMT 1
In 1976, we played promotion rivals Tranmere Rovers at Prenton Park. Peter Willis awarded them three penalties, while they missed one, they still won 3-0. Those two points we missed out on would have seen us promoted. Instead Tranmere went up by two points. The club actually requested that Willis was banned from ever refereeing us. Not that it mattered, as he was assigned to us again not long after and there was more controversy and more calls from the club for him to be banned. For as long as there's been officials, there's been controversy. All 92 Football League clubs will insist that the refs are against them and that there's a conspiracy against them. That's just football. I don’t think anyone (or many) are citing clear and obvious bias. But I’ll ask you this. Do you think PGMOL are fit for purpose? They strike me as puppets on a string given their funding model. |
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Post by htafcokay on Apr 19, 2024 10:06:51 GMT 1
In 1976, we played promotion rivals Tranmere Rovers at Prenton Park. Peter Willis awarded them three penalties, while they missed one, they still won 3-0. Those two points we missed out on would have seen us promoted. Instead Tranmere went up by two points. The club actually requested that Willis was banned from ever refereeing us. Not that it mattered, as he was assigned to us again not long after and there was more controversy and more calls from the club for him to be banned. For as long as there's been officials, there's been controversy. All 92 Football League clubs will insist that the refs are against them and that there's a conspiracy against them. That's just football. I don’t think anyone (or many) are citing clear and obvious bias. But I’ll ask you this. Do you think PGMOL are fit for purpose? They strike me as puppets on a string given their funding model. No. But having watched football at various levels for years, I think officiating is at an all-time low. They are absolutely fucking rubbish at all levels. I watch Golcar when I'm not watching Town, and the amount of basic errors during a game is staggering. Decisions that are right in front of a linesman given the wrong way, fouls that are given one way but are 'play on' the other way. It's not just the odd decision either. Funnily enough, there's a couple of female refs at that level and every time I've seen them ref Golcar, they've had good games. It's usually the blokes that are absolutely useless. They played at Pickering earlier this season and the referee sin-binned a load of players, one of the managers was booked was shouting abuse at the ref (despite it being a supporter that threw the abuse), they were trying to get the linesman's attention to bring a sub on but the linesman (who had a hearing aid in both ears) couldn't hear them and then somebody else was booked for trying to get his attention. It was hilarious but it's a common occurrence. You go up to the Football League and they're just as bad there. I was at Oldham in 2022 (the game where they got relegated) and Bobby Madley was reffing. Oldham had a blatant penalty turned down and then in the second half, an Oldham player got fouled pretty badly and I don't even think he gave a free-kick. That was the incident that prompted the pitch invasion, as a couple of blokes at the front of the stand had had enough and they came on the pitch. You watch football on TV, no matter who is playing, and there's mistakes galore. Clear goal-kicks given as corners, foul throws literally all the time, keepers holding on to the ball for more than six seconds. Some fouls are given, then the same challenges aren't given as fouls. Some get booked for kicking the ball away, others don't. The referees are so bad now, it's untrue. You don't even mind some of the complex decisions not going for you, but what chance have you got when a linesman can't even give a throw-in the right way when it's two yards in front of him. I remember an incident down at Town a couple of years ago. The ball went out for a corner in the corner of the Riverside, right in front of the linesman. Instead of flagging for a corner, the linesman looked at the referee who was about 30 yards away and waited for the referee to give a goal-kick and then he flagged for a goal-kick. What chance have you got with idiots like that? |
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Post by workshyfop on Apr 19, 2024 10:21:52 GMT 1
I still find it weird/suspicious that Town never kicked up a fuss after the Forest playoff final. With the amount of money at stake and VAR being available. What would it have achieved? Probably nothing. Maybe compensation. I think the fact VAR was there and not used to look at an appeal when in the build up players had been told there was no need to harangue the referee as VAR would be used to check everything, then a few difficult questions could have been asked. Forest players were openly taking the piss while we accepted it. Just seemed strange. As for Welch, another bad decision and not much we can do about it now. All football fans probably gloss over the ones that have gone for them and remember the ones that robbed them, but we do seem to have had a lot to against us in recent years. Is it the size of the club? The ones that went for us that I can think of were in L2. The Pav offside goal against Lincoln at home and Mansfield’s disallowed “winner” in Cardiff, both where we were the bigger club. |
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Post by King Neil on Apr 19, 2024 10:24:45 GMT 1
It may have meant we kept hold of our most successful manager in the club’s history Didn't realise Herbert Chapman had been dug up. Seriously though, what would it have achieved? They'll never replay the game, they'll never admit they got decisions wrong, so I don't understand what Town were supposed to have done. No-one ever talks about the Peterborough final in 2011 where their first goal came from a free-kick where there was an offside. We benefitted from a questionable decision in the 2004 final where no-one on this planet knows if the ball was out before Colin Larkin scored. There's been hundreds of decisions go against us over the years, just as there's been hundreds go for us. It's football, decisions go for you, they go against you. Get on with it. Yep the Mansfield goal was a goal And they won't listen and try to change any rules unless your man utd or Liverpool or top 6 |
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Post by htafcokay on Apr 19, 2024 10:24:57 GMT 1
What would it have achieved? Probably nothing. Maybe compensation. I think the fact VAR was there and not used to look at an appeal when in the build up players had been told there was no need to harangue the referee as VAR would be used to check everything, then a few difficult questions could have been asked. Forest players were openly taking the piss while we accepted it. Just seemed strange. As for Welch, another bad decision and not much we can do about it now. All football fans probably gloss over the ones that have gone for them and remember the ones that robbed them, but we do seem to have had a lot to against us in recent years. Is it the size of the club? The ones that went for us that I can think of were in L2. The Pav offside goal against Lincoln at home and Mansfield’s disallowed “winner” in Cardiff, both where we were the bigger club. Plus the penalty against Lincoln in the play-offs. Lincoln fans still moan about that one and it's 20 years ago. Though personally, I don't think Andy Booth would dive, and we'd been denied one earlier on for a blatant handball so we were due one. Has a team ever been given compensation due to a decision going against them? |
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Post by King Neil on Apr 19, 2024 10:38:50 GMT 1
Probably nothing. Maybe compensation. I think the fact VAR was there and not used to look at an appeal when in the build up players had been told there was no need to harangue the referee as VAR would be used to check everything, then a few difficult questions could have been asked. Forest players were openly taking the piss while we accepted it. Just seemed strange. As for Welch, another bad decision and not much we can do about it now. All football fans probably gloss over the ones that have gone for them and remember the ones that robbed them, but we do seem to have had a lot to against us in recent years. Is it the size of the club? The ones that went for us that I can think of were in L2. The Pav offside goal against Lincoln at home and Mansfield’s disallowed “winner” in Cardiff, both where we were the bigger club. Plus the penalty against Lincoln in the play-offs. Lincoln fans still moan about that one and it's 20 years ago. Though personally, I don't think Andy Booth would dive, and we'd been denied one earlier on for a blatant handball so we were due one. Has a team ever been given compensation due to a decision going against them? Sheffield United got 18 million off west ham regarding the teves goal that sent them down |
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