crux
Andy Booth Terrier
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Post by crux on Aug 17, 2017 23:37:13 GMT 1
I agree, but he needs to choose between being the best he can at the highest level, and going for those big championship oligarch money signing on fees - that literally piss away your career at graveyards like Aston Villa. A lot of our signings under Wagner so far, don't seem that type of player yet, thank goodness. Thought his over riding ambition was to play in PL. He has got it. He will get some game time this season unless DH actually prohibits him from playing / being available for selection. He has to make the squad of 25 otherwise he can't play in the PL. At the moment he may make it as we don't have the biggest squad. However if we sign another attacking player, plus a centre half and a right back he may miss out. Obviously we don't know all the details behind this, but if he was offered a reasonable new contract after promotion I'm not sure why he was advised against signing or agreeing an extra year at least. He would get paid more and have a chance to play in the PL, even if he was 3rd or 4th choice in the first instance. His agent could still work on getting him transferred to someone else in the background. Wells and his agent must know that if he plans to sit out his contract to the end, he won't get any match time unless we are really stuck. The reality is that he could play no meaningful football for a whole season, at which point he would be a real gamble even as a 'free' transfer.
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Post by royrace on Aug 17, 2017 23:58:53 GMT 1
Seems clear he's not going to get his cake and eat it. The club stands to lose millions if he goes on a free so why make it easy for him. If Wells and his agent want the free transfer he'll have to accept a year of not playing. If he wants to play he signs or leaves for a fee, simple.
Sent from my SM-G920F using proboards
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Post by Jack on Aug 18, 2017 0:05:28 GMT 1
Also mentioned that Wells was aware he was now 4th choice striker, not sure I'd have signed this summer knowing I'd suddenly dropped three rungs down the pecking order Nahki's not the only one unhappy at being priority 4 after dropping 3 rungs down the pecking order 😩 One of us won't be walking out on our club though.
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Post by savilerowtownfan on Aug 18, 2017 0:21:31 GMT 1
Logic tells me that Nhaki has been offered a new contract but on the same or similar terms to those offered 12 months ago. He sees this and DH maybe intends this as punishment for delaying a year.Nhaki sees others around him being offered much improved terms for their loyalty. His agent is saying don't sign the Club are undervaluing you and I will secure you a better deal elsewhere. Difficult for Nhaki if 4th choice striker to sign on these terms when not gauranteed game time. And higher wages most probably available elsewhere. Sad as I do think at stages this season if say we are 1-0 down against the big boys with 15mins to go we may need to play two up top and Wells remains our best option as support striker. A nice lad who on my viewing has always put in the effort and I for one will be disappointed to see him deprived of game time on a point of principle.
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Post by Captainslapper on Aug 18, 2017 0:21:52 GMT 1
Let's not forget how calm Nahki was taking and scoring the third pen. He misses, Reading just have to score one more and it's game over. That was the real stress penalty and there was no-one better to take it than Wells with his temperament. Forever a Town legend whatever happens next. He was calm in that moment and took a great pen ( as the others did barring heff ), but his track record on pens whilst at Town isn't great at all, and neither is his one-on-one with the keeper scoring rate ( ie when hes got time to think about it he tends to fail) So id disagree with the claim his temperament meant there was 'no one better'. Id say he was the one most likely to miss. The team that took us up is collectively legendary IMO as is the manager and a few of the players could well go onto be Town legends individually , but wells isn;t one of them. His area of the team was the one bit that failed consistently throughout the season. We got promoted despite our striker, not because of him IMO. Im not too bothered to hear what DH has had to say on the matter tonight. Hes a bottom half championship striker at best. At £1.3m thats what we paid for and it was a good fit, as thats what we were. But we're not anymore and sell or don't sell, its time to move on from playing a striker of wells ability.
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Post by tockyterrier on Aug 18, 2017 0:52:06 GMT 1
Whether Wells plays for us again if he stays well depend on who makes up our 25man squad.
Surely a year left on a contract is not much less committed than a 12month loan is it?
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midlander
David Wagner Terrier
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Post by midlander on Aug 18, 2017 1:01:00 GMT 1
If Dean doesn't do another Q&A it will be because some posters failed to honour the two requests made not to post his comments on social media. It's disloyal after all he's done for the club. Not aimed at you mate, but effectively you are relaying that if you work on Thursday night, have family commitments or live in a completely different part of the country then you are not allowed to hear what he has to say to fans who live closer? Judging by the scarcity of information coming out of tonight's meeting, I would say he has had his wishes upheld but surely all information that he divulges to fans at these meetings should be available for all Town fans to hear?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 18, 2017 3:04:49 GMT 1
If Dean doesn't do another Q&A it will be because some posters failed to honour the two requests made not to post his comments on social media. It's disloyal after all he's done for the club. Not aimed at you mate, but effectively you are relaying that if you work on Thursday night, have family commitments or live in a completely different part of the country then you are not allowed to hear what he has to say to fans who live closer? Judging by the scarcity of information coming out of tonight's meeting, I would say he has had his wishes upheld but surely all information that he divulges to fans at these meetings should be available for all Town fans to hear? Agree with that. If it's not suitable for public consumption then it should not be discussed in public.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 18, 2017 4:46:54 GMT 1
If Dean doesn't do another Q&A it will be because some posters failed to honour the two requests made not to post his comments on social media. It's disloyal after all he's done for the club. Mr Hoyle knows exactly what he is doing, he's far from naive. He has made public the fact that we hold all the aces. Wells either signs or doesn't play for us again. He also knows that this will become public knowledge, will unify those 100% behind us and maybe ratchet up the chatter that 'wells is available at Huddersfield'. As for Nakhi, he has 1 year left until he can choose his own destiny. If he leaves it will be as a striker who fired his side to promotion to the PL and will be a huge payday for him. It's been obvious through all their body language that DH really likes NW. Neither chap is dicking the other over.
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Post by teddytheterrier on Aug 18, 2017 5:22:52 GMT 1
His dad will be on here soon to tell you naughty town fans off.
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Post by Tanzanian Terrier on Aug 18, 2017 6:32:41 GMT 1
Mounié, Depoitre and Kachunga are the only ones that can be picked ahead of him. Since we only play 1 up front, Nakhi's chances as 4th option means he wouldn't even get a look in at any Cup game. Massive Faux Pas by NW. If the contract is still there he should sign it but would it make any differences to his chances of first team game time? Unless he can adapt to a right back/centre back role
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 18, 2017 6:58:00 GMT 1
It’s ridiculous how many people expect footballers to show loyalty, when clubs themselves show little.
Lee Clark was sacked shortly after 43 games unbeaten. Grayson not long after getting us promoted. Powell when most others thought we were doing okay. All three of these decisions, IMO, were the correct ones to make - all free of any “loyalty” nonsense.
The only real loyalty in football is that from the fans to the club they support, and even that increases/decreases with how well the club is doing on the pitch.
The Wells situation is a bit unfortunate for everyone, but maybe its for the best. Had he signed, he could be stuck at Town as fourth striker getting no game time. We’d also be paying a high wage, something that might be spent elsewere now we have other striking options. When the original offer was made, we had absolutely nothing up top other than Wells.
I’m sure we’ll get the money back we paid for him, even though Bradford will be probably due another 12mil or something just as silly.
I’ve nothing against Wells. If he hadn’t had a 1 goal every 3 games, we wouldn’t have cared whether he wanted to stay or not anyway. He signed a contract and has (or intends to) seen it out. He did the job we signed him to do. We’ve now just outgrown him, although had we stayed in the Championship and lost Wagner, maybe it would have been more him outgrown us. Either way, it’s time for both parties to move on.
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Post by Doc Halladay 32 on Aug 18, 2017 7:10:56 GMT 1
Mounié, Depoitre and Kachunga are the only ones that can be picked ahead of him. Since we only play 1 up front, Nakhi's chances as 4th option means he wouldn't even get a look in at any Cup game. Massive Faux Pas by NW. If the contract is still there he should sign it but would it make any differences to his chances of first team game time? Unless he can adapt to a right back/centre back role Why is it a faux pas by Nahki. You're looking at it from Towns point of view - why would a player sign an extended contract to be 4th choice? When he can walk in a year and select the offer which is best for himself and his chances of playing. From his point of view waiting a year seems to be the best option when he is so far down the pecking order at Town.
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Post by Baby-face Frankenstein on Aug 18, 2017 7:14:21 GMT 1
Mounié, Depoitre and Kachunga are the only ones that can be picked ahead of him. Since we only play 1 up front, Nakhi's chances as 4th option means he wouldn't even get a look in at any Cup game. Massive Faux Pas by NW. If the contract is still there he should sign it but would it make any differences to his chances of first team game time? Unless he can adapt to a right back/centre back roleNot entirely unthinkable. At Dortmund II, Wagner converted Erik Durm from a forward to a right back and he ended up in Germany's 2014 world cup winning squad!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 18, 2017 7:26:59 GMT 1
Warnock did similar with Chris Billy.
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Post by Tanzanian Terrier on Aug 18, 2017 7:28:16 GMT 1
Why is it a faux pas by Nahki. You're looking at it from Towns point of view - why would a player sign an extended contract to be 4th choice? When he can walk in a year and select the offer which is best for himself and his chances of playing. From his point of view waiting a year seems to be the best option when he is so far down the pecking order at Town. I was thinking more in terms of when he was originally offered a contract and turned it down.
I know it is all about risk and the risk was, would we get promoted. It seems he considered that the risk of that happening was not much. The rest is history.
In my mind DH recognised what NW's refusal to sign was, it was an attempt to move at minimal cost, should we not get promoted. We did and other more potent strikers have come in.
If NW had signed another contract when asked I am sure that following promotion he would have received improved terms again for his loyalty but unfortunately he did not and it appears from what has been said, he realises that the advice he has been given was not good. If NW does leave it is unlikely to be within this current window unless a club are prepared to take a risk on him while injured (it happened when Norwich took Pilkington) or wait until January, when the cost might be lower with only 6 months left on his contract but between now and then he is not getting first team game time and no matter how many U23 games he might play it is not likely to be the same as 1st team playing time. Even then, we could quite easily recoup £1.3 million for him, which in todays market would be seen as a steal for a proven striker at a certain level.
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Post by Baby-face Frankenstein on Aug 18, 2017 7:30:00 GMT 1
Since we only play 1 up front, Nakhi's chances as 4th option means he wouldn't even get a look in at any Cup game. Massive Faux Pas by NW. If the contract is still there he should sign it but would it make any differences to his chances of first team game time? Unless he can adapt to a right back/centre back role Why is it a faux pas by Nahki. You're looking at it from Towns point of view - why would a player sign an extended contract to be 4th choice? When he can walk in a year and select the offer which is best for himself and his chances of playing. From his point of view waiting a year seems to be the best option when he is so far down the pecking order at Town. Not often I disagree with you, Doc, but surely any footballer worth his salt would be champing on the bit at being sidelined for a year. Would imagine he'd go very quickly if the right offer came along now.
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Post by Baby-face Frankenstein on Aug 18, 2017 7:33:35 GMT 1
Warnock did similar with Chris Billy. I'd forgotten that. But yes, at a similar level, too (Dortmund II also Div 3 at the time).
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Post by Tanzanian Terrier on Aug 18, 2017 7:37:17 GMT 1
Since we only play 1 up front, Nakhi's chances as 4th option means he wouldn't even get a look in at any Cup game. Massive Faux Pas by NW. If the contract is still there he should sign it but would it make any differences to his chances of first team game time? Unless he can adapt to a right back/centre back roleNot entirely unthinkable. At Dortmund II, Wagner converted Erik Durm from a forward to a right back and he ended up in Germany's 2014 world cup winning squad! Correct and Klopp was originally a striker but had to move because Wagner was better than Klopp
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 18, 2017 7:38:12 GMT 1
Spoke to Nahki before the game at Bury in preseason. Told us that he planned to sign a new deal. Had spoken to him before end of last season and he claimed that a new deal wasn't on the table, but his dream since being a kid was to play in the Premier League and he wanted to do that with Town. All a bit strange to me, think there's been a bit of a breakdown from both sides. I like Nahki, he's a nice lad with a lot of time for fans, but if true and he's put the club in a difficult position then he has to go. i tell people in the street im a RAF Fighter pilot,,truth is i wear orange pants and tarmac roads,so dont belive someone if your not paying his wages
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 18, 2017 7:39:27 GMT 1
Maybe I'm a bit naïve but why shouldn't things that are said at a public Q and A be repeated on social media? Once you go public, you have very little control over how that information is then conveyed, disseminated or spun. You might not like that, but it is the simple truth.
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Post by mids on Aug 18, 2017 7:40:16 GMT 1
Not entirely unthinkable. At Dortmund II, Wagner converted Erik Durm from a forward to a right back and he ended up in Germany's 2014 world cup winning squad! Correct and Klopp was originally a striker but had to move because Wagner was better than Klopp ....and he still is
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 18, 2017 7:41:52 GMT 1
Spoke to Nahki before the game at Bury in preseason. Told us that he planned to sign a new deal. Had spoken to him before end of last season and he claimed that a new deal wasn't on the table, but his dream since being a kid was to play in the Premier League and he wanted to do that with Town. All a bit strange to me, think there's been a bit of a breakdown from both sides. I like Nahki, he's a nice lad with a lot of time for fans, but if true and he's put the club in a difficult position then he has to go. i tell people in the street im a RAF Fighter pilot,,truth is i wear orange pants and tarmac roads,so dont belive someone if your not paying his wages Chocks away!
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Post by mids on Aug 18, 2017 7:44:01 GMT 1
They didn't want the event streaming as then the worldwide media have instant access to direct quotes - which is fair enough.
Dean knows how his Q&A's work as he's done plenty of them before and he thrives on it. As others have said it all helps to grease the wheels of players getting shifted about, and keeping the fans informed by word of mouth.
Nothing scurrilous has been revealed, and nor will it.
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Post by Tanzanian Terrier on Aug 18, 2017 7:44:13 GMT 1
i tell people in the street im a RAF Fighter pilot,,truth is i wear orange pants and tarmac roads,so dont belive someone if your not paying his wages Chocks away! Cabbage crates over the briny, Bandits 10 o'clock, Tally Ho Chaps
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Post by mids on Aug 18, 2017 7:48:45 GMT 1
I'm sure the Q&A wasn't just about players. Anything said about the changes to the academy, particularly the recent departures? David Moss? Marketing the club overseas? The academy is not fit for purpose currently, and nor has it been for a while. Unsure if it's the staff, the coaching, or the club's approach to it. Change is needed and everything is currently under review. It will either be downgraded or upgraded, but it will not remain the same. Maybe the same approach as when Dean threw a grenade in and got Wagner after Powell is needed. David Moss is the Head of Football Operations. Winter is the Head of everything non-football. David Moss brings with him a wealth of experience and he is starting to have an effect as he beds himself in. He'll also have a valuable input regarding the academy as he's previously headed an academy (Palace I think). No mention of marketing overseas specifically.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 18, 2017 7:56:08 GMT 1
Cabbage crates over the briny, Bandits 10 o'clock, Tally Ho Chaps no no no,,,I tell them it's a F35A stealth fighter,not a Sopwith Camel,my grandad used that when he used to be a coal miner when he shot the red Baron down
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Post by Headless Chicken on Aug 18, 2017 7:56:43 GMT 1
The chain is fine but this site is social media DH will probably have been careful with his choice of words. The exact phrase then isn't used and eventually we have something quite different to what was actually said......and some dick wanting a player to rot in the reserves.
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Post by terrierfortythree on Aug 18, 2017 8:08:00 GMT 1
Some comments related to players: Nanki Wells: available for sale. Wells decided to run down his contact, Hoyle feels he has been badly advised. Wells nice guy and no problems but if he won't commit to the club then he can ether find a new club or send the year not playing for Town. Hoyles view was with being in the premiership we can afford the one year cost effect, but we will not give him game time, when other players who have a long term future wish to play. Scannell is available from loan and is probably not par of the first team plans. Lolley available from loan again probably not part of 1st team plans. Yiadom deal fell through due to medical. He'll be fine longer term but wouldn't be available as cover for Tommy Smith initially. So it wasn't worth the preliminary price we were paying. We are still looking forward to cover at rightback, No10 and possibly centreback. Ideally looking at someone who could cover both rightback and centreback.
For me, and seen as how we have our other premier league loan to use, the name springing out is Callum Chambers. Can also play in centre midfield if needed
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Post by The King's Head 1230 on Aug 18, 2017 8:14:26 GMT 1
Think it will go to the wire on transfer deadline. Someone desperate like Derby, Norwich, Villa will come in for him. Personally hope he sign's & stays.
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