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Post by Hammy (still in Golcar) on Dec 31, 2013 17:17:48 GMT 1
>Gerrard is better in the air but apart from that Lynch is better in every department - pace, tackling, passing, running with the ball and reading of the game< You have to mention all departments for a proper comparison - what about the barmy spell department? Gerard is better concentration wise.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 31, 2013 17:24:14 GMT 1
The only person to blame for the Yeovil goal was Smithies. Poor distance on initial punch and then nowhere to be seen when he should have been claiming the ball the second time
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Post by Deleted on Dec 31, 2013 17:25:48 GMT 1
What I DO like about the Lynch/Gerrard debate is that only a couple of weeks ago most we're saying we were short in this department and yet currently central defence would appear to be our strongest area of the field.
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Post by Captainslapper on Dec 31, 2013 17:42:11 GMT 1
Pot and kettle mate. Micro analysing is that tenuous attempt to blame gerrard for that Blackpool goal. I don't think the same applies to the Yeovil goal, its hardly micro analysing it to spot the poor defending. Titus bramble could be a great defender- thats why he played at such a high level for years under so many different managers. But he was prone to lapses in concentration just like Lynch and lacked consistency, just like Lynch. Not a lack of consistency in runs of games but in individual games. Just his last 3 appearances for us illustrate it well. We've had near own goals, clumsy fouls giving away pens, silly red cards and half asleep defending whilst we concede but OVERALL hes played well and done some great things. At his best hes better then gerrard. He has more pace ( which is vital) and is more 'spectacular' if you like. But gerrard is more consistent, better in the air ( which is also vital) and makes FAR FEWER errors. Depends what you look for most in a player I suppose to who you prefer. So let me get this straight, a defender dives in, barely touches the ball and the opposition run though as score but it's not the defender's fault, yet when a defender marks his man but loses out aerially because the other player is a lot taller than him and uses him to get up it's a bad mistake from the defender? For every 'mistake' Lynch has made, Gerrard has made similar ones. The difference is Lynch has made up for other people's mistakes by covering over, whereas Gerrard very rarely does. For example, with Beckford's miss at Bolton, both Smith and Lynch were back to put pressure on him and immediately after he shot both turned around and blasted Gerrard for losing him. Gerrard is better in the air but apart from that Lynch is better in every department - pace, tackling, passing, running with the ball and reading of the game. dives in and barely touches the ball? Seriously, the double standards are laughable. That would be a great tackle by Lynch that unluckily went straight to another opponent!! They do both make mistakes ( it would be ridiculous to expect a player not to at any level, never mind this). But Lynch makes FAR MORE than gerrard. Thats my only issue with him. If people want to pretend otherwise, then thats fine ,though it will nark me if ( or in reality- when) they fall over themselves to dig Gerrard out the next time he makes anything resembling a mistake. Pace-Lynch, running with the ball- Lynch, Goal threat- Lynch Tackling-about the same, reading of the game- about the same, aerial- gerrard. Lack of mistakes-Gerrard consistency- Gerrard Gerrard is a good solid , middle of the road Championship standard centre back. Unspectacular but very consistent. Brave , strong and vocal. the stick ( abuse even) hes had off some Town fans is bewildering to say the least. Lynch could be more than that. He has pace, is decent in the air and reads the game well so if he can reduce the all too frequent lapses in concentration there's no reason why he couldn't be a premier division defender. One thing that will help him is that the crowd are certainly on his side and willing to brush under the carpet any issues on or off the pitch without getting on his back like they aren't with so many other players, so that should help him reach his potential.
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Post by Captainslapper on Dec 31, 2013 17:43:38 GMT 1
What I DO like about the Lynch/Gerrard debate is that only a couple of weeks ago most we're saying we were short in this department and yet currently central defence would appear to be our strongest area of the field. Thew defence has been the strongest part of the team ALL season. By a long way too.
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Post by 3Pipe on Dec 31, 2013 17:44:45 GMT 1
That much better than midfield?
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Post by Captainslapper on Dec 31, 2013 17:48:02 GMT 1
The only person to blame for the Yeovil goal was Smithies. Poor distance on initial punch and then nowhere to be seen when he should have been claiming the ball the second time So keeper punches clear ( not the best punch but not terrible either) then gets back on his line as he should do. Ball gets hooked back into the area, where the defenders ( one in particular who must remain nameless) put in no challenge at all as their striker gets the ball , takes aim and fires it into the net. And thats obviously the keepers fault?
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Post by Captainslapper on Dec 31, 2013 17:49:15 GMT 1
That much better than midfield? Not recently maybe, but certainly over the course of the whole season especially the first couple of months. IMO
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Post by 3Pipe on Dec 31, 2013 17:54:29 GMT 1
That much better than midfield? Not recently maybe, but certainly over the course of the whole season especially the first couple of months. IMO I agree. It's just that you wrote 'By a long way too.'
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Post by AndySk on Dec 31, 2013 18:04:37 GMT 1
What I DO like about the Lynch/Gerrard debate is that only a couple of weeks ago most we're saying we were short in this department and yet currently central defence would appear to be our strongest area of the field. Aye, Largely down to Smith coming in and being so impressive. And Wallace. Really stepped up. Cant be splashing millions on players so hopefully Get one or Two of these young uns through a season, as is the plan i'm sure
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Post by impact on Dec 31, 2013 18:09:30 GMT 1
Not recently maybe, but certainly over the course of the whole season especially the first couple of months. IMO I agree. It's just that you wrote 'By a long way too.' He's prone to massively huge exaggeration.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 31, 2013 18:13:18 GMT 1
The only person to blame for the Yeovil goal was Smithies. Poor distance on initial punch and then nowhere to be seen when he should have been claiming the ball the second time Totally agree
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Post by Captainslapper on Dec 31, 2013 18:15:15 GMT 1
Don't think its an exaggeration , taking the whole season into account. Though I may over exaggerate a comment to get a point across. Its a good job Im alone in that eh?
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Post by Captainslapper on Dec 31, 2013 18:18:33 GMT 1
The only person to blame for the Yeovil goal was Smithies. Poor distance on initial punch and then nowhere to be seen when he should have been claiming the ball the second time Totally agree So no blame on Lynch at all then? It was all Smithies fault? Suggest you watch it again. www1.skysports.com/football/live/match/287936/video
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Post by Deleted on Dec 31, 2013 18:27:26 GMT 1
Watched it plenty of times mate, it was well within reach for Smithies to catch it which he should have done, or punch it towards the touchline/out for a throw, instead of straight back towards the Yeovil lads sat on the edge of our box. Absolutely Smithies fault and you could see that at the time on Sunday.
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Post by Captainslapper on Dec 31, 2013 18:35:28 GMT 1
Ok, Id accept he might have done better, but all the blame is his? No way mate.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 31, 2013 18:43:07 GMT 1
Ok, Id accept he might have done better, but all the blame is his? No way mate. The second ball, look at his hesitation. He thinks about coming, takes a step back and then when he does come for it he is half a second slow. Commits straight away and that ball is his. Fair play to him for coming to his penalty spot to punch the first one as the lack of him doing that has long been a bug bear of mine with Smithies. But that punch needs to be landing somewhere near the half way line. The equally frustrating thing was that he had just come to his penalty spot to punch one but was unsure about coming to his 6 yard box for the second ball
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Post by shawsie on Dec 31, 2013 18:49:36 GMT 1
Ok, Id accept he might have done better, but all the blame is his? No way mate. If he comes and collects it then the next phase simply doesnt happen! The ball was a high hopeful punt - a goalkeepers dream to collect rather than pacy dipping crosses/corners. I am a big smithies fan but the fault lay entirely with him for the yeovil goal.....
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Post by Captainslapper on Dec 31, 2013 18:53:04 GMT 1
Think the hesitation was when he presumed one the the 2 defenders either side of Miller might be about to put some sort of challenge in rather than just standing there watching him get the ball. Then he suddenly realises hes on his own in that respect. Lynch had switched off completely so think its very harsh on Smithies to lay ALL the blame at his door.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 31, 2013 19:01:28 GMT 1
My view of it. Smithies makes the decision to punch, don't think he had much option with player backing in, 12 yards off his line and not much wrong, would perhaps have wanted more distance but travels a couple of yards outside the box anyway, ball looped back in Smithies has a decision to make can I get there? Looking at it in freeze frame I reckon the goal scorer has a 60 / 40 advantage and Smithies decides to stay at home. Maybe he could have made that second ball, maybe not, one thing I do know his defenders should have been a lot more alert after he made the initial punch.
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Post by Captainslapper on Dec 31, 2013 19:06:20 GMT 1
Happy new year to you Cod !!
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Post by Deleted on Dec 31, 2013 19:07:58 GMT 1
And to you Captain.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 31, 2013 19:41:10 GMT 1
My view of it. Smithies makes the decision to punch, don't think he had much option with player backing in, 12 yards off his line and not much wrong, would perhaps have wanted more distance but travels a couple of yards outside the box anyway, ball looped back in Smithies has a decision to make can I get there? Looking at it in freeze frame I reckon the goal scorer has a 60 / 40 advantage and Smithies decides to stay at home. Maybe he could have made that second ball, maybe not, one thing I do know his defenders should have been a lot more alert after he made the initial punch. There is no maybe about it. He ends up being second to the ball by a fraction of a second. He lost that fraction of a second by dithering. He doesn't dither and he beats Miller to the ball Anyway, we won 5-1 so it doesn't matter But i'll keep arguing anyway
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Post by Giggity on Dec 31, 2013 19:53:14 GMT 1
I'm surprised Vaughan is only in 4th place given his start to the season and the furore on here when he got suspended.
For me, it is a close vote between Vaughan (early season form), Clayton (recent form), Lynch and Hammill. Hammill edges it IMO due to his consistent form, high assist count and the unique flair/skill that he provides to the team.
I would vote in this order: Hammill, Vaughan, Lynch, Clayton, Smithies.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 31, 2013 19:53:27 GMT 1
My view of it. Smithies makes the decision to punch, don't think he had much option with player backing in, 12 yards off his line and not much wrong, would perhaps have wanted more distance but travels a couple of yards outside the box anyway, ball looped back in Smithies has a decision to make can I get there? Looking at it in freeze frame I reckon the goal scorer has a 60 / 40 advantage and Smithies decides to stay at home. Maybe he could have made that second ball, maybe not, one thing I do know his defenders should have been a lot more alert after he made the initial punch. There is no maybe about it. He ends up being second to the ball by a fraction of a second. He lost that fraction of a second by dithering. He doesn't dither and he beats Miller to the ball Anyway, we won 5-1 so it doesn't matter But i'll keep arguing anywayFine lines, fractions of seconds. As I said, maybe he'd have got there, maybe not. Wouldn't perfection be brilliant? Edit....But...Hang on he'd be off in January then , wouldn't he?
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Post by Deleted on Dec 31, 2013 19:57:42 GMT 1
There is no maybe about it. He ends up being second to the ball by a fraction of a second. He lost that fraction of a second by dithering. He doesn't dither and he beats Miller to the ball Anyway, we won 5-1 so it doesn't matter But i'll keep arguing anywayFine lines, fractions of seconds. As I said, maybe he'd have got there, maybe not. Wouldn't perfection be brilliant? Edit....But...Hang on he'd be off in January then , wouldn't he? Yeah and then we could put Bennett in and use the money to sign Wells. Perfection!
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Post by Deleted on Dec 31, 2013 20:02:19 GMT 1
Fine lines, fractions of seconds. As I said, maybe he'd have got there, maybe not. Wouldn't perfection be brilliant? Edit....But...Hang on he'd be off in January then , wouldn't he? Yeah and then we could put Bennett in and use the money to sign Wells. Perfection! He wouldn't have won the punch!! suicide
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Post by ACW on Jan 1, 2014 2:01:34 GMT 1
Its great that there are so many differing opinions on player of the season so far. It means that lots of players are contributing and its a team effort that we are putting in. All too often in the past there has been one or two stand out players amongst a team of mediocrity, but this time we have loads of players playing well and contributing every week. Robbins has us playing as a team and that, for me, is his greatest achievement up to now - very little one-man play.
It is a really hard decision on the half-time player of the year. Without Vaughan's goals earlier in the season we would be struggling, but he hasn't hit that form since his return from injury. Clayton has been absolutely superb since his return to the team - we all know he has the ability, but sometimes his attitude and work rate aren't the best. Over the past few weeks you couldn't fault these and as a result his performances have been great.
I agree with those above that say Lynch is inconsistent - even within games - so I would have to give my vote to Hamill - he can be frustrating at times, but he has played well for most of the season, and he has produced an end product to his fancy footwork and skills. Smithies has been very consistent (although I think he needs to come off his line a bit more often), and his distribution is a key part of our improved displayed, but Hamill shades it for me.
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Post by Hammy (still in Golcar) on Jan 1, 2014 11:32:08 GMT 1
Hammil clearly out in front. Surprised Vaughan not got more votes though.
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Post by Horney Barry on Jan 1, 2014 13:58:37 GMT 1
Clayton for me the Vaughan then Smithies who appears to have learned to come off his line.
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