Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 30, 2019 13:15:15 GMT 1
Here's A thought, perhaps Sievert and Winkler are pretty much the same character. Maybe the players will relate better to Bell, Sievert intimates as much when he said he will be great around the players.
|
|
|
|
Post by Chips Longhorn on Jun 30, 2019 13:21:51 GMT 1
Here's A thought, perhaps Sievert and Winkler are pretty much the same character. Maybe the players will relate better to Bell, Sievert intimates as much when he said he will be great around the players. Here's a thought... how come you can never conceive of anything other than everything is just going along just swimmingly? Siewert knew Winkler prior to him coming here .. he waxed lyrical about him then a few months later he's out the door.. if this was a one off then fine , it's football shit happens. But it's not its one after another after another. I'm all for positivity but now and again it pays to remove the blinkers.. what will you be saying in another six months if this guy has gone ? There is nothing wrong with saying "actually it's not gone great has it " .. I'd rather hear that from the club rather than some spin bollocks as the latest intern exits stage left. |
|
|
|
Post by Chips Longhorn on Jun 30, 2019 13:23:44 GMT 1
Ps I know you are a great poster codd and I agree with most stuff you say . I just think sometimes those protesting about the protesters protesteth too much
|
|
|
|
Post by scrotesbridge on Jun 30, 2019 13:29:36 GMT 1
Here's A thought, perhaps Sievert and Winkler are pretty much the same character. Maybe the players will relate better to Bell, Sievert intimates as much when he said he will be great around the players. Here's a thought... how come you can never conceive of anything other than everything is just going along just swimmingly? Siewert knew Winkler prior to him coming here .. he waxed lyrical about him then a few months later he's out the door.. if this was a one off then fine , it's football shit happens. But it's not its one after another after another. I'm all for positivity but now and again it pays to remove the blinkers.. what will you be saying in another six months if this guy has gone ? There is nothing wrong with saying "actually it's not gone great has it " .. I'd rather hear that from the club rather than some spin bollocks as the latest intern exits stage left. |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 30, 2019 13:32:24 GMT 1
Ps I know you are a great poster codd and I agree with most stuff you say . I just think sometimes those protesting about the protesters protesteth too much Just a theory Ted. Obviously things aren't going swimmingly, i don't have to emphasize that. |
|
|
|
Post by Nickhudds.UTT on Jun 30, 2019 13:36:41 GMT 1
Ps I know you are a great poster codd and I agree with most stuff you say . I just think sometimes those protesting about the protesters protesteth too much Dickens ? |
|
|
|
Post by Chips Longhorn on Jun 30, 2019 13:37:41 GMT 1
Ps I know you are a great poster codd and I agree with most stuff you say . I just think sometimes those protesting about the protesters protesteth too much Just a theory Ted. Obviously things aren't going swimmingly, i don't have to emphasize that. My theory, which may be total hogwash, is that our young inexperienced manager, who was thrown in at the deep end, has so far demonstrated that he struggles to work collaboratively with others |
|
|
|
Post by scrotesbridge on Jun 30, 2019 13:40:31 GMT 1
I’m not being sexist or chauvinistic (we’ll not much anyway) but how on earth will a man who has coached women for the last few years demand respect in the dressing room. This is the strangest appointment I ever known not just for us but for any club! We should be bringing in the best staff in the business not scraping the barrel. I know the board like to think they do things against the grain in running the football club but this is taking the piss this is fast becoming a circus laughing stock !!
|
|
|
|
Post by Chips Longhorn on Jun 30, 2019 13:48:09 GMT 1
Ps I know you are a great poster codd and I agree with most stuff you say . I just think sometimes those protesting about the protesters protesteth too much Dickens ? Ey up Yul. How's work been since "the king and I " ? |
|
|
|
Post by Million Dollar Babies on Jun 30, 2019 14:02:37 GMT 1
Just a theory Ted. Obviously things aren't going swimmingly, i don't have to emphasize that. My theory, which may be total hogwash, is that our young inexperienced manager, who was thrown in at the deep end, has so far demonstrated that he struggles to work collaboratively with others The only thing we know for certain though is that the board (whoever that might be at the moment) are backing him. They could have got rid of him when he lost a lot of the players, or when he showed no sign of improving things or now when his assistant hasn't returned and they're happy to let him pick another. Someone clearly sees something in him. Hopefully it's founded and not just blind faith that youth team managers from Dortmund always come good |
|
|
|
Post by Chips Longhorn on Jun 30, 2019 14:05:55 GMT 1
My theory, which may be total hogwash, is that our young inexperienced manager, who was thrown in at the deep end, has so far demonstrated that he struggles to work collaboratively with others The only thing we know for certain though is that the board (whoever that might be at the moment) are backing him. They could have got rid of him when he lost a lot of the players, or when he showed no sign of improving things or now when his assistant hasn't returned and they're happy to let him pick another. Someone clearly sees something in him. Hopefully it's founded and not just blind faith that youth team managers from Dortmund always come good That's right .. we don't know what's going on behind the scenes . Winkler might be a lazybones. All them players might have been bang out of order and jan might be the new Pep. Who knows |
|
|
|
Post by Baby-face Frankenstein on Jun 30, 2019 14:11:35 GMT 1
that we don't know butpeople can put what ever spin they want on it but the bottom line is the club and him have decided its best for both parties. we have moved to replace him and its history now. a lot of things will be going on and when they are done I'm sure the club will inform us. 5 months ago Siewart and the club decided he was worth paying money to Barnsley for. He thought we were worth giving up a possible promotion with Barnsley for. Fast forward 5 months and he can't face coming back to us from his summer break. I really hope it was us deciding he was shite rather than him thinking Siewart wasn't up to it or that he had no chance of doing anything with the current crop of players You'd surely have thought AW got his break this year, too. I say that because it is funny that almost exactly 2 years ago to the day he needed a court ruling to enforce a holiday in Italy at the beginning of July 2017 from his employers (Rot-weiss Essen) whilst Youth Chief there. I think it went something like his employers were supposedly wanting him to scrap an already-granted holiday, but as weeks went by they couldn't seem to fill the vacancy for an U-19 coach. The president deemed this as part of Winkler's tasks and wanted to put, so to say, an emergency stop to his holiday. Winkler's defence argued he'd only had one day off up til that point of the year and that even in an emergency situation, the Club still had folk who could find a new U-19 coach. Anyway, all's well that ends well, AW ended up winning and was allowed to go on a camping holiday in Italy with his family. In our case at Town, we'll never probably know the whole truth, but you can never rule out industrial disputes that's for sure. Maybe it was something as simple as Jan wanting to go to Austria for pre-season and Andreas to Italy. What started as a minor disagreement could have flared up into a major battle, with nasty words and spitefulness. It's often the little things that explode, even to such an extent that compromise became a no-no and someone had to go. |
|
|
|
Post by willo on Jun 30, 2019 14:19:18 GMT 1
Happy to give Siewart a chance but it was a ridiculous appointment. In the best position we've ever been to make a good appointment, from a financial standpoint and our reputation in the game, yet we gave it to a young bloke who had failed in the German equivalent of the conference. It's got all the makings of one of those times that people will look back on in 30 years and question what on earth were they thinking. The same way people do now about the early 70s or what could have been if we'd backed Shankley We laughed at Leeds when they appointed Hockaday but Siewert is shaping up to be our version. His hand picked assistant has now walked and been replaced by a bloke with, and I'm being diplomatic here, a fairly thin CV in the world of senior men's football. Since the start of the year it's been one "  ?" moment after another at the club. Siewert losing 12 out of 15 games and keeping his job, players openly scorning his methods and character, the assistant leaving and being replaced by another nobody, the saga of the takeover by a bloke who seemingly doesn't have the cash or the standing in the game to take us forward. We've just spent two years milking the richest league in the world yet it feels like we're scratting around at the bottom of League One again. The more negative side of me goes along with this view pretty much 100pc. However, and about the only thing I’m hanging my hopes on, is the fact it is very early in pre-season and once we are in through the next 2-3 weeks and have had a few more new bodies through the door and hopefully have moved out one or two of those who don’t want to be here, sorted out the kit sponsorship and the whole Chairman issue is finalised, etc, things will look better (and clearer). I remain far from convinced over the appointment of JS but feel we now have to at least start the season with him at the helm. But, if we are bottom 5 come the end of October, time to cut our losses. If he was genuinely brought in with the Championship in mind, we need to hit the ground running, no more excuses! We messed up big-time with our transfer policy last summer and essentially threw away our chance to stay in the PL. This summer, it has been widely reported a lot of Championship clubs are skint and whilst I would be ok(ish) with a mid-table finish currently, we could steal a march on our rivals with some positive business in this transfer window and perhaps not miss out on another very good opportunity. |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 30, 2019 14:20:35 GMT 1
Just a theory Ted. Obviously things aren't going swimmingly, i don't have to emphasize that. My theory, which may be total hogwash, is that our young inexperienced manager, who was thrown in at the deep end, has so far demonstrated that he struggles to work collaboratively with others And I respect your opinion, not that I necessarily agree with it mind. |
|
|
|
Post by yellowbelly on Jun 30, 2019 14:50:26 GMT 1
Why wasn't he coming back though? That's what is most concerning. that we don't know butpeople can put what ever spin they want on it but the bottom line is the club and him have decided its best for both parties. we have moved to replace him and its history now. a lot of things will be going on and when they are done I'm sure the club will inform us. You said earlier that the club don’t have to inform us about everything. What makes you think now they will tell us anything about this extraordinary event. I am a moderate on this board but I think we are entitled to an explanation. |
|
|
|
Post by doncasterterrier on Jun 30, 2019 16:03:38 GMT 1
How about a simpler version - Every time until now, Winkler was the senior (position wise}, here he was the no.2 & couldn't take it
|
|
|
|
Post by Clark W Griswald (CAS) on Jun 30, 2019 16:10:47 GMT 1
Just googled TuS Koblenz - were Siewart and bell met - they’re in the German fifth tier and play here, en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stadion_OberwerthIt’s being watched by one man and his dog territory Bell hasn’t managed a men’s team since 2005 and that was another semi pro side - SC Preußen Münster ... never heard of them either! Clearly his talents have slipped under the radar of all the great (and not so great) clubs for decades as he’s not been involved with a senior professional men’s set up since Aaron Rowe was in nappies My fear is that siewart already struggles to command respect from the players because frankly he’s done nowt as a player or first team manager and then got off to uninspiring start. Bell is another with hardly any pedigree - especially at this level Also what is our sales pitch to potential players; a young lad doing the scouting, a youth team coach unfamiliar to English football who has drowned to date managing a first team side and now Ireland’s women’s manager as the assistant If this were Leeds making sieward and bell as their coaching team most would be laughing. We’ve just come off the back of earning nearly a quarter of a billion in the PL - bielsa showed what a good manager can do in terms of improving existing players - yet we’re taking massive punts on inexperienced hopefuls No one has a scooby about what will or won't happen this season. What I cannot understand is folk being negative before a balls been kicked |
|
|
|
Post by Million Dollar Babies on Jun 30, 2019 16:34:45 GMT 1
How about a simpler version - Every time until now, Winkler was the senior (position wise}, here he was the no.2 & couldn't take it He was number 2 at Barnsley |
|
crux
Jimmy Glazzard Terrier
[M0:0]
Posts: 4,118
|
Post by crux on Jun 30, 2019 16:49:58 GMT 1
How about a simpler version - Every time until now, Winkler was the senior (position wise}, here he was the no.2 & couldn't take it He was number 2 at Barnsley From July 2018, for the first time in his career. Maybe he just didn't like the number 2 role, he moved from Barnsley very quickly. I realise we will have offered him more money, but I suspect it wasn't a massive amount more. If he goes back to Barnsley, then there were differences of opinion between him and Siewert. However, if Siewert was a crap at everything that some posters on here are trying to intemate, then Dean Hoyle would have already got rid of him. The same goes for Winter. |
|
|
|
Post by jlmarshall55 on Jun 30, 2019 17:50:40 GMT 1
FFS people, I rarely post but there’s nothing like going overboard is there... At the end of the day JS didn’t have the players for the system he came in to play and then a portion of the squad through their toys out fo the pram because there egos were getting ahead of them. Just look back at Norwich, there fans were bitching this time last year seen they nose dived to the end of that prior season. They then brought in players for the system there manager wanted to play and they won the league. Give the club time to bring players and staff in to play the system JS wants, at the end of the day Dean brought him in for the system he plays... get behind the club, and stop bitching or at least hold off until we have kicked a ball in earnest.
|
|
|
|
Post by aksaiblue on Jun 30, 2019 17:56:07 GMT 1
Here's my take on it for what it's worth. I knew nothing about JS or Winkler before they joined the club, I still know now't . However for what ever reason Winkler has left the club doesn't bother me. Bell and JS might be the next Clough and Taylor,,they could be the next Laurel & Hardy, whatever I am Town through and through and will go with the flow in whatever direction.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 30, 2019 18:52:30 GMT 1
Here's my take on it for what it's worth. I knew nothing about JS or Winkler before they joined the club, I still know now't . However for what ever reason Winkler has left the club doesn't bother me. Bell and JS might be the next Clough and Taylor,,they could be the next Laurel & Hardy, whatever I am Town through and through and will go with the flow in whatever direction. If it's Laurel & Hardy, at least the negative ****s on here might raise a smile.  |
|
acky
Chris Hay Terrier
Posts: 50
|
Post by acky on Jun 30, 2019 19:06:04 GMT 1
Might be another fine mess!
|
|
|
|
Post by HuddsTerrier on Jun 30, 2019 19:11:29 GMT 1
Just googled TuS Koblenz - were Siewart and bell met - they’re in the German fifth tier and play here, en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stadion_OberwerthIt’s being watched by one man and his dog territory Bell hasn’t managed a men’s team since 2005 and that was another semi pro side - SC Preußen Münster ... never heard of them either! Clearly his talents have slipped under the radar of all the great (and not so great) clubs for decades as he’s not been involved with a senior professional men’s set up since Aaron Rowe was in nappies My fear is that siewart already struggles to command respect from the players because frankly he’s done nowt as a player or first team manager and then got off to uninspiring start. Bell is another with hardly any pedigree - especially at this level Also what is our sales pitch to potential players; a young lad doing the scouting, a youth team coach unfamiliar to English football who has drowned to date managing a first team side and now Ireland’s women’s manager as the assistant If this were Leeds making sieward and bell as their coaching team most would be laughing. We’ve just come off the back of earning nearly a quarter of a billion in the PL - bielsa showed what a good manager can do in terms of improving existing players - yet we’re taking massive punts on inexperienced hopefuls No one has a scooby about what will or won't happen this season. What I cannot understand is folk being negative before a balls been kicked Without having a scooby you have to give yourself the best platform for success - and town look at sea I also have seen JS and yes he was given a tough hand but he never helped himself. His subs were often questionable (Everton, West Ham), his tactics gun ho and left us open at the back (or at Liverpool resulted in our kick off going back to the goalie and us gifting the most shambolic goal in a long time) and his man management skills a worry (changing captains) I simply don’t see a bloke capable of leading a promotion winning side and I’m often quite defensive of managers. I obviously hope JS proves me wrong but nothing to date suggests that this doesn’t end in tears |
|
|
|
Post by yappledapple on Jun 30, 2019 19:46:37 GMT 1
No one has a scooby about what will or won't happen this season. What I cannot understand is folk being negative before a balls been kicked Without having a scooby you have to give yourself the best platform for success - and town look at sea I also have seen JS and yes he was given a tough hand but he never helped himself. His subs were often questionable (Everton, West Ham), his tactics gun ho and left us open at the back (or at Liverpool resulted in our kick off going back to the goalie and use gifting the most shambolic goal in a long time) and his man management skills a worry (changing captains) I simply don’t see a bloke capable of leading a promotion winning side and I’m often quite defensive of managers. I obviously hope JS proves me wrong but nothing to date suggests that this doesn’t end in tears This has been posted before (on a previous tactics thread and not by me) but is well worth a read regarding that first Liverpool goal as it’s not quite the debacle it may first appear... www.irishtimes.com/sport/soccer/english-soccer/ken-early-football-s-new-age-neutralises-philosophies-of-the-past-1.3874358?mode=amp |
|
|
|
Post by space hardware on Jun 30, 2019 20:07:33 GMT 1
Without having a scooby you have to give yourself the best platform for success - and town look at sea I also have seen JS and yes he was given a tough hand but he never helped himself. His subs were often questionable (Everton, West Ham), his tactics gun ho and left us open at the back (or at Liverpool resulted in our kick off going back to the goalie and use gifting the most shambolic goal in a long time) and his man management skills a worry (changing captains) I simply don’t see a bloke capable of leading a promotion winning side and I’m often quite defensive of managers. I obviously hope JS proves me wrong but nothing to date suggests that this doesn’t end in tears This has been posted before (on a previous tactics thread and not by me) but is well worth a read regarding that first Liverpool goal as it’s not quite the debacle it may first appear... www.irishtimes.com/sport/soccer/english-soccer/ken-early-football-s-new-age-neutralises-philosophies-of-the-past-1.3874358?mode=ampI read that when it was first posted. It's all very worthy and analytical but the fact is the game was 15 seconds old, we were playing a team that was bang in contention for the title and were always going to look to make a fast start. Don't fuck about playing passes into the zone just in front of your 18 yard box. |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 30, 2019 21:17:57 GMT 1
He was number 2 at Barnsley From July 2018, for the first time in his career. Maybe he just didn't like the number 2 role, he moved from Barnsley very quickly. I realise we will have offered him more money, but I suspect it wasn't a massive amount more. If he goes back to Barnsley, then there were differences of opinion between him and Siewert. However, if Siewert was a crap at everything that some posters on here are trying to intemate, then Dean Hoyle would have already got rid of him. The same goes for Winter. He's never been slow previously, if the Sievert signing is anything to go by his successor is waiting in the wings.....If needed. |
|
|
|
Post by Chips Longhorn on Jun 30, 2019 21:35:29 GMT 1
From July 2018, for the first time in his career. Maybe he just didn't like the number 2 role, he moved from Barnsley very quickly. I realise we will have offered him more money, but I suspect it wasn't a massive amount more. If he goes back to Barnsley, then there were differences of opinion between him and Siewert. However, if Siewert was a crap at everything that some posters on here are trying to intemate, then Dean Hoyle would have already got rid of him. The same goes for Winter. He's never been slow previously, if the Sievert signing is anything to go by his successor is waiting in the wings.....If needed. Apart from the fact that Dean has been seriously ill. We've gone months again without a DOF (because we didn't need one ) and Winter n co have been busy with a takeover that may or may not happen. Apart from that I'm sure we will have all the jigsaw pieces in place for when Siewert leaves;-) .. the simple fact codd is that we haven't been the same since our leader got ill |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 30, 2019 21:50:19 GMT 1
He's never been slow previously, if the Sievert signing is anything to go by his successor is waiting in the wings.....If needed. Apart from the fact that Dean has been seriously ill. We've gone months again without a DOF (because we didn't need one ) and Winter n co have been busy with a takeover that may or may not happen. Apart from that I'm sure we will have all the jigsaw pieces in place for when Siewert leaves;-) .. the simple fact codd is that we haven't been the same since our leader got ill Yes I know Dean has been seriously ill and I get it, however i'd be surprised if he wasn't sufficiently fit enough to pull the plug on Sievert in the last couple of months.  |
|
|
|
Post by Chips Longhorn on Jun 30, 2019 21:51:40 GMT 1
Apart from the fact that Dean has been seriously ill. We've gone months again without a DOF (because we didn't need one ) and Winter n co have been busy with a takeover that may or may not happen. Apart from that I'm sure we will have all the jigsaw pieces in place for when Siewert leaves;-) .. the simple fact codd is that we haven't been the same since our leader got ill Yes I know Dean has been seriously ill and I get it, however i'd be surprised if he wasn't sufficiently fit enough to pull the plug on Sievert in the last couple of months. He quit in April ;-) |
|
?" moment after another at the club.
