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Post by overtonterrierspirit on Oct 29, 2023 22:07:07 GMT 1
Surely one realistic goal has to be to once again watch HTAFC playing exciting and winning football. Is that not achievable and measurable? Without knowing the financial aspects (and that is just one of many factors) it isn’t easy to set goals that are realistic because I wouldn’t know the limits or restrictions, but at the very least I want to enjoy watching HTAFC. You tell me if that’s realistic, or not. Sure. My point is- everyone has that goal. You: we want better football Me: me too You: here’s how we should do it Others: actually we should do this I’m all for open lines of communications and KN has done nothing but show he is extremely communicative and open to hearing any and all. I’m just saying “we want better football” is a universal statement. And to be honest- 95% of what i see here and elsewhere is: Sack this guy buy this guy run this formation etc I mean this with all sincerely and humility- do you think someone with the club would say “oh yeah”? It ain’t a perfect science, and if it was we all here would be paid a ton more to be football savants. But again, I’ve been here on this board since June. You all are incredibly informative and passionate. Very educating. But it’s also a toxic environment right now for reasons easy to understand. I give it a 2-1 shot that by morning I’ll be out of this thread for abuse reasons- certainly Twitter is 10 times worse. It’s a shame that you feel like this but I understand why. It only serves to prove my point though that opening a line of communication with positive, even minded , experienced people could help on a consistent basis. |
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Post by royrace on Oct 29, 2023 22:08:31 GMT 1
The club were well aware of the need for additions in the summer. Unfortunately we had players who declined the opportunity to join us. Players that the then manager wanted, let’s just say there may well have been a slight conflict of interests that made the club feel very uneasy. I'm guessing from your post you may be suggesting Warnock wanted certain players that his son may have had connections to, forgive me if I'm way off the mark here? Surely, he would not be bringing players in that he felt wouldn't help the squad? Even then, hasn't Cartwright done that with the FB Edwards & DM? Sounds more like a conflict of egos between Warnock and Cartwright. Whatever the reasons were they failed miserably to bring in any of the players that were desperately needed. Sorry but saying the players we wanted didn't want to come is laughable. Of course you're not going to get every player you want! Everyone knows this, it's not easy! |
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Post by Justasmithers on Oct 29, 2023 22:09:03 GMT 1
Sure. My point is- everyone has that goal. You: we want better football Me: me too You: here’s how we should do it Others: actually we should do this I’m all for open lines of communications and KN has done nothing but show he is extremely communicative and open to hearing any and all. I’m just saying “we want better football” is a universal statement. And to be honest- 95% of what i see here and elsewhere is: Sack this guy buy this guy run this formation etc I mean this with all sincerely and humility- do you think someone with the club would say “oh yeah”? It ain’t a perfect science, and if it was we all here would be paid a ton more to be football savants. But again, I’ve been here on this board since June. You all are incredibly informative and passionate. Very educating. But it’s also a toxic environment right now for reasons easy to understand. I give it a 2-1 shot that by morning I’ll be out of this thread for abuse reasons- certainly Twitter is 10 times worse. It’s a shame that you feel like this but I understand why. It only serves to prove my point though that opening a line of communication with positive, even minded , experienced people could help on a consistent basis. And I will 100% engage in thoughtful, constructive conversation. Absolutely. But dive into his twitter mentions. It’s fine, it’s twitter, but my goodness- not a lot of “constructive” in there. |
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Post by space hardware on Oct 29, 2023 22:18:17 GMT 1
You could be mistaken for thinking us fans are spoilt brats and moan all the time. However, we are really tolerant compared to a lot of other fans. Nearly every manager including the 2 disasters last year were given a fair chance but ultimately both proved to be shocking appointments. The fans have already turned against Moore. We aren't stupid, we can see its a disastrous appointment. It's not the norm for 75%+ of the fan base to have this opinion so early on. If Warnock had to go for reasons we aren't party to then fair enough. However the board put huge pressure on themselves by sacking him. They had to get the next appointment right and they haven't. All the hard work Neil, Ronnie and the team put in has been dismantled inside a month. We are arguably as bad as when they took over in Feb and already at the point where there is a huge divide between the fans and the manager as seen yesterday. This is not the man to keep us up or take us forward. We need an experienced championship manager. Otherwise increasing revenues will be pie in the sky and season ticket numbers will halve. Schofield is the exception, of course. He was never given a chance. People were screaming for him to be sacked at half-time of his first match. Because he was visibly the cheap option. A very decent lower league player for us, to be fair, but he's a nobody, a never has been and never will be, in managerial terms. Another Hoyle fuck up. Imagine giving him the reigns at Championship level, for fuck's sake. No other club would have been considered it, like Fotheringham getting the job here. Madness. |
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Post by Big Ern on Oct 29, 2023 22:18:55 GMT 1
It’s a shame that you feel like this but I understand why. It only serves to prove my point though that opening a line of communication with positive, even minded , experienced people could help on a consistent basis. And I will 100% engage in thoughtful, constructive conversation. Absolutely. But dive into his twitter mentions. It’s fine, it’s twitter, but my goodness- not a lot of “constructive” in there. We got absolutely battered by our closest rivals and a few days before got absolutely battered at home by a club who aren't really that good. We have the weakest squad I have ever seen us have at this level and we aren't seeing any silver linings at all. Fans will react to what they see. Improve the quality of the side and give the fans some excitement back and the fans will be back on board. That summer transfer window was an absolute disaster, the fans saw it coming. |
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Post by Walton-on-the-Hill Terrier on Oct 29, 2023 22:19:22 GMT 1
Surely one realistic goal has to be to once again watch HTAFC playing exciting and winning football. Is that not achievable and measurable? Without knowing the financial aspects (and that is just one of many factors) it isn’t easy to set goals that are realistic because I wouldn’t know the limits or restrictions, but at the very least I want to enjoy watching HTAFC. You tell me if that’s realistic, or not. Sure. My point is- everyone has that goal. You: we want better football Me: me too You: here’s how we should do it Others: actually we should do this I’m all for open lines of communications and KN has done nothing but show he is extremely communicative and open to hearing any and all. I’m just saying “we want better football” is a universal statement. And to be honest- 95% of what i see here and elsewhere is: Sack this guy buy this guy run this formation etc I mean this with all sincerely and humility- do you think someone with the club would say “oh yeah”? It ain’t a perfect science, and if it was we all here would be paid a ton more to be football savants. But again, I’ve been here on this board since June. You all are incredibly informative and passionate. Very educating. But it’s also a toxic environment right now for reasons easy to understand. I give it a 2-1 shot that by morning I’ll be out of this thread for abuse reasons- certainly Twitter is 10 times worse. I made my original suggestion on page 3 and have tried to answer your posts about what a realistic goal might be. I’m not on Twitter. I don’t know if my suggestion about some form of supporter advisory group is a good or workable proposal or not, but please don’t ever take fans for fools or take fans for granted. In and amongst the frustration and anger there’s a lot of goodwill towards HTAFC and all that it entails, including the current ownership. Please don’t waste that resource. |
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Post by royrace on Oct 29, 2023 22:20:04 GMT 1
It’s a shame that you feel like this but I understand why. It only serves to prove my point though that opening a line of communication with positive, even minded , experienced people could help on a consistent basis. And I will 100% engage in thoughtful, constructive conversation. Absolutely. But dive into his twitter mentions. It’s fine, it’s twitter, but my goodness- not a lot of “constructive” in there. The abuse on Twitter is completely out of order but unfortunately that's Twitter for you. It's a miniscule proportion of the fan base and the worst of the abuse will be from kids. I hope he realises this, I'm sure he does! My feeling is that Kevin hasn't been advised very well on footballing matters. The decision making to date looks naive at best. I'm also concerned that he perhaps wasn't made aware of the levels of investment needed to keep a championship club in the league. I use the word investment loosely because football clubs at this level are basically a money pit. Relegation would be a disaster, as fans we can see very clearly that there is a big risk of this. We knew this the day Warnock left, we knew the risk was a lot greater when DM was announced. This is simple fact, why didn't the footballing people paid to make these decisions know the same?? At the moment it looks like from a football perspective the leadership team have no idea what they're doing. |
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Maynardblue
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Post by Maynardblue on Oct 29, 2023 22:20:22 GMT 1
If you need a constructive comment, Kevin made a big mistake in appointing Mark Cartwright to an absolutely vital role within the new regime.
Cartwright may have a decent reputation in the US but he was found out long ago in this country as a chancer who who deals mainly within his agent 'affiliations' shall we say. He is the root cause of this rapid decline on the football side of things.
We needed a 'best in class' in this role, not unrealistic, instead we got a second hand car salesman with egg on his shirt. Kevin needs to be very careful about the advice he's getting from him.
You may question what is constructive about this ...its obvious- we need a new Sporting Director ASAP before we even talk about Darren Moore (his no1 pick)
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Post by Justasmithers on Oct 29, 2023 22:21:56 GMT 1
Sure. My point is- everyone has that goal. You: we want better football Me: me too You: here’s how we should do it Others: actually we should do this I’m all for open lines of communications and KN has done nothing but show he is extremely communicative and open to hearing any and all. I’m just saying “we want better football” is a universal statement. And to be honest- 95% of what i see here and elsewhere is: Sack this guy buy this guy run this formation etc I mean this with all sincerely and humility- do you think someone with the club would say “oh yeah”? It ain’t a perfect science, and if it was we all here would be paid a ton more to be football savants. But again, I’ve been here on this board since June. You all are incredibly informative and passionate. Very educating. But it’s also a toxic environment right now for reasons easy to understand. I give it a 2-1 shot that by morning I’ll be out of this thread for abuse reasons- certainly Twitter is 10 times worse. I made my original suggestion on page 3 and have tried to answer your posts about why a realistic goal might be. I’m not on Twitter. I don’t know if my suggestion about some form of supporter advisory group is a good or workable proposal or not, but please don’t ever take fans for fools or take fans for granted. In and amongst the frustration and anger there’s a lot of goodwill towards HTAFC and all that it entails, including the current ownership. Please don’t waste that resource. I’ve said I’m here every day. I read everything I’m here right now engaging and have said I’m happy to pass up a DATM group meeting/convo. I’m just a guy, but what about my engagement has given you any idea other than I have a deep DEEP respect for the supporters here and their thoughts? |
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duncfost01
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Post by duncfost01 on Oct 29, 2023 22:23:02 GMT 1
I keep asking the same question.
Why is Nagle doing this ?
He is billionaire. He is clearly knows what he is doing ? Forget all the flannel he might as well be Boris or Rishi ?
Sell 24 sign 4.
Sack the championship’s most successful manager.
Why ?
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duncfost01
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Post by duncfost01 on Oct 29, 2023 22:23:48 GMT 1
And I will 100% engage in thoughtful, constructive conversation. Absolutely. But dive into his twitter mentions. It’s fine, it’s twitter, but my goodness- not a lot of “constructive” in there. The abuse on Twitter is completely out of order but unfortunately that's Twitter for you. It's a miniscule proportion of the fan base and the worst of the abuse will be from kids. I hope he realises this, I'm sure he does! My feeling is that Kevin hasn't been advised very well on footballing matters. The decision making to date looks naive at best. I'm also concerned that he perhaps wasn't made aware of the levels of investment needed to keep a championship club in the league. I use the word investment loosely because football clubs at this level are basically a money pit. Relegation would be a disaster, as fans we can see very clearly that there is a big risk of this. We knew this the day Warnock left, we knew the risk was a lot greater when DM was announced. This is simple fact, why didn't the footballing people paid to make these decisions know the same?? At the moment it looks like from a football perspective the leadership team have no idea what they're doing. He brought twitter into the game. Why ? |
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Post by Justasmithers on Oct 29, 2023 22:24:15 GMT 1
I keep asking the same question. Why is Nagle doing this ? He is billionaire. He is clearly knows what he is doing ? Forget all the flannel he might as well be Boris or Rishi ? Sell 24 sign 4. Sack the championship’s most successful manager. Why ? He’s literally making a doc to address your exact question. Happy to provide a link. |
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Post by Walton-on-the-Hill Terrier on Oct 29, 2023 22:25:12 GMT 1
If you need a constructive comment, Kevin made a big mistake in appointing Mark Cartwright to an absolutely vital role within the new regime. Cartwright may have a decent reputation in the US but he was found out long ago in this country as a chancer who who deals mainly within his agent 'affiliations' shall we say. He is the root cause of this rapid decline on the football side of things. We needed a 'best in class' in this role, not unrealistic, instead we got a second hand car salesman with egg on his shirt. Kevin needs to be very careful about the advice he's getting from him. You may question what is constructive about this ...its obvious- we need a new Sporting Director ASAP before we even talk about Darren Moore (his no1 pick) Wow. Take note everyone. Thanks MB |
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duncfost01
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Post by duncfost01 on Oct 29, 2023 22:27:32 GMT 1
If you need a constructive comment, Kevin made a big mistake in appointing Mark Cartwright to an absolutely vital role within the new regime. Cartwright may have a decent reputation in the US but he was found out long ago in this country as a chancer who who deals mainly within his agent 'affiliations' shall we say. He is the root cause of this rapid decline on the football side of things. We needed a 'best in class' in this role, not unrealistic, instead we got a second hand car salesman with egg on his shirt. Kevin needs to be very careful about the advice he's getting from him. You may question what is constructive about this ...its obvious- we need a new Sporting Director ASAP before we even talk about Darren Moore (his no1 pick) Wow. Take note everyone. Thanks MB Wow. |
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Post by Carlito Brigante on Oct 29, 2023 22:27:41 GMT 1
If you need a constructive comment, Kevin made a big mistake in appointing Mark Cartwright to an absolutely vital role within the new regime. Cartwright may have a decent reputation in the US but he was found out long ago in this country as a chancer who who deals mainly within his agent 'affiliations' shall we say. He is the root cause of this rapid decline on the football side of things. We needed a 'best in class' in this role, not unrealistic, instead we got a second hand car salesman with egg on his shirt. Kevin needs to be very careful about the advice he's getting from him. You may question what is constructive about this ...its obvious- we need a new Sporting Director ASAP before we even talk about Darren Moore (his no1 pick) As soon as he was appointed the alarm bells were ringing loud and clear He will only take us one way. And it sure isn’t up. |
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Post by Terrier Ramone on Oct 29, 2023 22:30:20 GMT 1
Let us see if justaguy reaches out on here and then see where that may lead. Be happy to pass along. Please list for me realistically what you would want to accomplish. Thank you. I feel very sorry for all the flack KN is getting right now, I reckon he'll be feeling very disappointed about the team, too. I think he has been let down by Edwards &, especially,the Director of Football - there is no way he could know what Warnock meant to our club & his amazing ability to rescue clubs time & time again. Now, if he has done something very wrong behind the scenes, then fair enough. However, while Kev couldn't be expected to know NW's track record & how he has such an un-rivalled record, his DoF should know. A couple of people have explained on this board why our fan base is so pissed off, far better than I ever could, yet it's not pissed off fans that the club should really be worried about, it's the growing number of fans who are losing interest, becoming apathetic & not angry about losing in such a manner to our biggest rivals. I appreciate Kev can't be held responsible for all the crap that the fans have been through in the last dozen years, with a couple of miraculous exceptions, but this is why people are just not caring about the club so much now, we're getting too used to losing & are finding other things to do. In the 1970s, when we slipped down the divisions, my Dad got fed up when we reached Div 4 & said we couldn't go any more cos it broke his heart to see how far we'd dropped. Instead, he took us to watch Burnley, who were in Div 1 at the time. This only lasted about 4 games before he said we had to go back to Town because it just wasn't the same. Now I have kids, I would never go & watch another team but I'm now on the verge of just not renewing our season cards. By the way, the dropping down the divisions had a happy ending, apart from David Wagner's promotion winning team, my favourite season was 1979/80, when we were Div 4 Champions & scored 101 goals. I don't think it matters what division we're in, from a fans' point of view, if we're playing good, attacking football. I wish Kev all the best & hope he makes us a successful club again but could you please ask him to tell Cartwright that we're not fools, as soon as anyone tries to tell us Moore is known as an attacking manager, we can spot a bullshitter? |
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Post by overtonterrierspirit on Oct 29, 2023 22:32:09 GMT 1
If you need a constructive comment, Kevin made a big mistake in appointing Mark Cartwright to an absolutely vital role within the new regime. Cartwright may have a decent reputation in the US but he was found out long ago in this country as a chancer who who deals mainly within his agent 'affiliations' shall we say. He is the root cause of this rapid decline on the football side of things. We needed a 'best in class' in this role, not unrealistic, instead we got a second hand car salesman with egg on his shirt. Kevin needs to be very careful about the advice he's getting from him. You may question what is constructive about this ...its obvious- we need a new Sporting Director ASAP before we even talk about Darren Moore (his no1 pick) Wow. Take note everyone. Thanks MB Dear me! |
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horler1
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Post by horler1 on Oct 29, 2023 22:37:32 GMT 1
If you need a constructive comment, Kevin made a big mistake in appointing Mark Cartwright to an absolutely vital role within the new regime. Cartwright may have a decent reputation in the US but he was found out long ago in this country as a chancer who who deals mainly within his agent 'affiliations' shall we say. He is the root cause of this rapid decline on the football side of things. We needed a 'best in class' in this role, not unrealistic, instead we got a second hand car salesman with egg on his shirt. Kevin needs to be very careful about the advice he's getting from him. You may question what is constructive about this ...its obvious- we need a new Sporting Director ASAP before we even talk about Darren Moore (his no1 pick) Is there a chance of this happening anytime soon? Any idea if Kev is cottoning on to this? |
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Post by Ibiza Town on Oct 29, 2023 22:39:31 GMT 1
We have one hope this season, that Sheff Wed, Rotherham and QPR don’t get 40 points. QPR will be fine now, they have a decent squad, Ainsworth was holding them back Its not looking good |
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Post by bells ringing :) on Oct 29, 2023 22:40:32 GMT 1
Wouldn't Jake Edwards be aware of Cartwrights faillings? its not just down to Nagle is it not ?
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Maynardblue
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Post by Maynardblue on Oct 29, 2023 22:40:39 GMT 1
If you need a constructive comment, Kevin made a big mistake in appointing Mark Cartwright to an absolutely vital role within the new regime. Cartwright may have a decent reputation in the US but he was found out long ago in this country as a chancer who who deals mainly within his agent 'affiliations' shall we say. He is the root cause of this rapid decline on the football side of things. We needed a 'best in class' in this role, not unrealistic, instead we got a second hand car salesman with egg on his shirt. Kevin needs to be very careful about the advice he's getting from him. You may question what is constructive about this ...its obvious- we need a new Sporting Director ASAP before we even talk about Darren Moore (his no1 pick) Is there a chance of this happening anytime soon? Any idea if Kev is cottoning on to this? You'll have to ask Justaguy. Turkeys don't usually vote for xmas though |
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Post by alfredsterrier on Oct 29, 2023 22:41:04 GMT 1
I agree that it seems Kevin has been let down by the people he has put in place.
It really can’t be as extreme as he is either a disaster and ruining the club or he is a saviour and can’t do any wrong.
It should be possible to point out mistakes while accepting that he is trying his best and some things are happening behind the scenes which may improve the situation in a longer term.
The situation at the club is a culmination of so many mistakes from a whole host of people - Warnock included- that at some point we end up where we are today.
It’s such a fine margin of relative success- avoiding relegation basically and failure that town have been working on for the past few seasons that even one poor decision can result in disaster.
That is not the way to operate and hopefully Kevin is going to rectify this problem.
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Maynardblue
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Post by Maynardblue on Oct 29, 2023 22:42:10 GMT 1
Wouldn't Jake Edwards be aware of Cartwrights faillings? its not just down to Nagle is it not ? Correct. If he isn't aware then he's part of the problem. |
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Post by andyeastleake on Oct 29, 2023 22:42:42 GMT 1
If you need a constructive comment, Kevin made a big mistake in appointing Mark Cartwright to an absolutely vital role within the new regime. Cartwright may have a decent reputation in the US but he was found out long ago in this country as a chancer who who deals mainly within his agent 'affiliations' shall we say. He is the root cause of this rapid decline on the football side of things. We needed a 'best in class' in this role, not unrealistic, instead we got a second hand car salesman with egg on his shirt. Kevin needs to be very careful about the advice he's getting from him. You may question what is constructive about this ...its obvious- we need a new Sporting Director ASAP before we even talk about Darren Moore (his no1 pick) That fence must be hurting your arse Maynard.  What do you think is role entailed at Stoke? Technical director sounds different to Sporting director (although I accept job titles mean little - hence the question I suppose). |
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Post by Million Dollar Babies on Oct 29, 2023 22:45:15 GMT 1
If you need a constructive comment, Kevin made a big mistake in appointing Mark Cartwright to an absolutely vital role within the new regime. Cartwright may have a decent reputation in the US but he was found out long ago in this country as a chancer who who deals mainly within his agent 'affiliations' shall we say. He is the root cause of this rapid decline on the football side of things. We needed a 'best in class' in this role, not unrealistic, instead we got a second hand car salesman with egg on his shirt. Kevin needs to be very careful about the advice he's getting from him. You may question what is constructive about this ...its obvious- we need a new Sporting Director ASAP before we even talk about Darren Moore (his no1 pick) The problem for me is that football is littered with these type of people and they seem to be able to continually bullshit their way in to new roles. We seem to be particularly blind when appointing for this position. I'm not sure how many we've had since promotion to the Premier League but it feels like a lot, with a few of them seeming to be out of the door before they've even got the seat warm |
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k1man999
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Post by k1man999 on Oct 29, 2023 22:48:50 GMT 1
If you need a constructive comment, Kevin made a big mistake in appointing Mark Cartwright to an absolutely vital role within the new regime. Cartwright may have a decent reputation in the US but he was found out long ago in this country as a chancer who who deals mainly within his agent 'affiliations' shall we say. He is the root cause of this rapid decline on the football side of things. We needed a 'best in class' in this role, not unrealistic, instead we got a second hand car salesman with egg on his shirt. Kevin needs to be very careful about the advice he's getting from him. You may question what is constructive about this ...its obvious- we need a new Sporting Director ASAP before we even talk about Darren Moore (his no1 pick) This is not the first time I've heard rumblings of this. some of NW pressers etc he hinted cartwright was the issue. Also we were warned by chadders. |
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Post by bells ringing :) on Oct 29, 2023 22:50:10 GMT 1
Wouldn't Jake Edwards be aware of Cartwrights faillings? its not just down to Nagle is it not ? Correct. If he isn't aware then he's part of the problem. Well you would hope Edwards wants to make a good impression , to keep his own job , therefore if anyone around him that isn't good for the club would be rooted out ? Still Hoyle had his fair share of fools and hangers on in his time as owner. In terms of people in and around him , that were not fit for the role. |
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horler1
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Post by horler1 on Oct 29, 2023 22:54:27 GMT 1
Is there a chance of this happening anytime soon? Any idea if Kev is cottoning on to this? You'll have to ask Justaguy. Turkeys don't usually vote for xmas though I doubt he'd be able to answer that |
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ben1987
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Post by ben1987 on Oct 29, 2023 23:02:46 GMT 1
Take note. A lot of Town fans are very intelligent, understand English football and deeply love their football club. Supporters are currently feeling very down and demoralised, we have been browbeaten by years of perceived gross mismanagement and lack of ambition by the club. Bad decision after bad decision. The club could do a lot worse than tap into that knowledge and set up an advisory supporters panel. They have the ATT panel but it's generally full of arselickers who are in it for their own status. There's one or two exceptions, but not enough. At least the HTSA take the panel seriously. It’s more than just HTSA who take it seriously. |
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duncfost01
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Post by duncfost01 on Oct 29, 2023 23:07:50 GMT 1
The buck stops with Cartwright and jake Edwards.
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