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Post by araucaria on Dec 19, 2023 10:58:12 GMT 1
Why did DM feel the need to reverse the end we play towards when we win the toss? Haven't we chosen to play towards the 'away' end for the first 29 years? The opposition have almost always chosen to play towards their own fans in the second half. Anyway, five home games Darren's way, three draws, two defeats; two games the traditional way, one win, one draw. I know it doesn't make any difference, just like Tom Johnston's predilection for all blue shirts, or the blue shorts for all bar the play-off games in 1994-95, but I'll be glad when normal service is resumed. Might be wrong but I thought Warnock had a similar view and wanted to play towards South Stand in the 2nd half? Couldn’t give a toss, personally, as I’m on the half way line but I’m always irritated when Town play towards us first when away. He might have thought about it, but I think we played all 8 of his home games the traditional ways and he's the one who started it in 1994, of course. |
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Post by belizian on Dec 19, 2023 10:59:55 GMT 1
Average Championship managers salary was 870,000 p.a. however that probably includes some very high earners who've dropped down from PL. Div 1 salaries, where Moore and his entourage came from, are much less at around 180,000. So, somewhere between those two figures will be Moore's salary.
At a pure guess 425,000 plus bonuses.
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Post by araucaria on Dec 19, 2023 11:02:38 GMT 1
Comfortably mid table with an eye on a play off push in the NY would be my guess, even with the injuries. The trajectory and form was clear at the end of last season as was the start of the improvement this season. Certainly a million times better than the dross that's been served up since he left. Well done Town  Not so sure about that.....Warnock has the energy and passion and skill to ignite the team at the right time when needed - like in a siege mentality. Fighting for survival on limited time he is perfect. Over an entire season, not so sure....you can't really have a trajectory that crosses end of one season and into the next (well, nice if you do....) but reality is change in squad etc this season was looking bang average from NW........it has continued under Moore.........he - and the club on all levels - need January to get the players needed and get an improvement on the grass that lifts us at least to safe and clear from the bottom three.......you can go on and on and on with all the reasons you don't think that is a good idea, but it is really clear from the owner that is likely to happen......it will take a massive change to change their mind and I don't see it happening as it's too late in the day with January so close Time and again Warnock avoided relegation and improved the team's league position throughout the following season, Cardiff and Middlesbrough within the last 5 or 6 seasons being the most recent examples. He was set to do it again here. In fact, I'll be surprised if you can find anything in his record where the team went the other way (apart from every top division team he's managed). |
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Post by irverino on Dec 19, 2023 11:03:25 GMT 1
Comfortably mid table with an eye on a play off push in the NY would be my guess, even with the injuries. The trajectory and form was clear at the end of last season as was the start of the improvement this season. Certainly a million times better than the dross that's been served up since he left. Well done Town Not so sure about that.....Warnock has the energy and passion and skill to ignite the team at the right time when needed - like in a siege mentality. Fighting for survival on limited time he is perfect. Over an entire season, not so sure....you can't really have a trajectory that crosses end of one season and into the next (well, nice if you do....) but reality is change in squad etc this season was looking bang average from NW........it has continued under Moore.........he - and the club on all levels - need January to get the players needed and get an improvement on the grass that lifts us at least to safe and clear from the bottom three.......you can go on and on and on with all the reasons you don't think that is a good idea, but it is really clear from the owner that is likely to happen......it will take a massive change to change their mind and I don't see it happening as it's too late in the day with January so close None visible at present under DM......And extremely unlikely in the future. |
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Post by araucaria on Dec 19, 2023 11:03:50 GMT 1
We’re surely looking at millions in compensation on 3+ year deals for Moore and his staff. Personally I’d give the recruitment team a chance with a half decent budget, even if it’s under Moore. Otherwise we will end up in the same old cycle of shopping in the bargain basement, same shit squad, likely another shit manager. Granted, this is assuming we will spend. If not then get him gone tomorrow to give us a chance. But I do think making the squad better is a priority, even Warnock would be in a similar spot with us right now. I strongly disagree with that last sentence.. Did he write the same last season as well? |
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Post by tockyterrier on Dec 19, 2023 11:04:25 GMT 1
A particular highlight for me has been watching Koroma, our natural LW play RW and our natural RW play LW. Sorba can't shoot for shit or cross with his left and Koroma is a one trick pony, we all know what he's gonna do but occasionally it comes off.. so why change it to have zero effect? Baffling. Under Warnock last season we saw Koroma take his man on, get to the dead ball line and get crosses over so he's far from a one trick pony. Unfortunately he's a confidence player who needs the right coaching, something we're sadly lacking at the moment and have been most of the time that Koroma's been here. His utter greed/stupidity/selfishness in not passing to Bergzorg v Preston in 1st half was nothing to do with confidence though.thebirony being if had of passed, we'd likey have equalised and his confidence improved. |
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Post by runner76 on Dec 19, 2023 11:05:23 GMT 1
Not so sure about that.....Warnock has the energy and passion and skill to ignite the team at the right time when needed - like in a siege mentality. Fighting for survival on limited time he is perfect. Over an entire season, not so sure....you can't really have a trajectory that crosses end of one season and into the next (well, nice if you do....) but reality is change in squad etc this season was looking bang average from NW........it has continued under Moore.........he - and the club on all levels - need January to get the players needed and get an improvement on the grass that lifts us at least to safe and clear from the bottom three.......you can go on and on and on with all the reasons you don't think that is a good idea, but it is really clear from the owner that is likely to happen......it will take a massive change to change their mind and I don't see it happening as it's too late in the day with January so close Time and again Warnock avoided relegation and improved the team's league position throughout the following season, Cardiff and Middlesbrough within the last 5 or 6 seasons being the most recent example. He was set to do it again here. In fact, I'll be surprised if you can find anything in his record where the team went the other way (apart from every top division team he's managed). Oh yeah, surely we were on for the playoffs under Neil........ |
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Post by tockyterrier on Dec 19, 2023 11:11:17 GMT 1
Not so sure about that.....Warnock has the energy and passion and skill to ignite the team at the right time when needed - like in a siege mentality. Fighting for survival on limited time he is perfect. Over an entire season, not so sure....you can't really have a trajectory that crosses end of one season and into the next (well, nice if you do....) but reality is change in squad etc this season was looking bang average from NW........it has continued under Moore.........he - and the club on all levels - need January to get the players needed and get an improvement on the grass that lifts us at least to safe and clear from the bottom three.......you can go on and on and on with all the reasons you don't think that is a good idea, but it is really clear from the owner that is likely to happen......it will take a massive change to change their mind and I don't see it happening as it's too late in the day with January so close Time and again Warnock avoided relegation and improved the team's league position throughout the following season, Cardiff and Middlesbrough within the last 5 or 6 seasons being the most recent examples. He was set to do it again here. In fact, I'll be surprised if you can find anything in his record where the team went the other way (apart from every top division team he's managed). They had SIGNIFICANTLY better and larger squads though. And most Boro fans reckon he'd been "found out" by the time he left them and were advising against keeping him. |
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Dan
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Post by Dan on Dec 19, 2023 11:21:23 GMT 1
You can’t legally give someone a 3 year contract with a three month notice clause, it says 3 years for a reason , it’s 3 years, unless the incumbent breaks a contract condition, ie theft, corruption, illegality etc. How about fraud....  Certain managers can still get a full year pay off even in those circumstances it would seem... |
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Post by royrace on Dec 19, 2023 11:40:55 GMT 1
Comfortably mid table with an eye on a play off push in the NY would be my guess, even with the injuries. The trajectory and form was clear at the end of last season as was the start of the improvement this season. Certainly a million times better than the dross that's been served up since he left. Well done Town Not so sure about that.....Warnock has the energy and passion and skill to ignite the team at the right time when needed - like in a siege mentality. Fighting for survival on limited time he is perfect. Over an entire season, not so sure....you can't really have a trajectory that crosses end of one season and into the next (well, nice if you do....) but reality is change in squad etc this season was looking bang average from NW........it has continued under Moore.........he - and the club on all levels - need January to get the players needed and get an improvement on the grass that lifts us at least to safe and clear from the bottom three.......you can go on and on and on with all the reasons you don't think that is a good idea, but it is really clear from the owner that is likely to happen......it will take a massive change to change their mind and I don't see it happening as it's too late in the day with January so close Nothing continued under Moore imo, he inherited a team that were starting to play well after an iffy start, coming off the back of very successful end to the season. There were some really good performances, they even gave Leicester a really good game. The performances after Moore have dropped off a cliff. I know there are a few on here who won't hear a bad word against the club and think NW was a very naughty boy and just can't bring themselves to be objective but it's clear to see the impact that replacing a brilliant manager with a poor one has had. The only surprise for me is just how bad it's been, I thought we'd be in trouble but didn't expect to be in the relegation zone so early (I know we aren't yet but only a matter of time). The only positive is that the club can hopefully make the change quickly. |
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Post by Waterloo Terrier on Dec 19, 2023 11:44:02 GMT 1
A particular highlight for me has been watching Koroma, our natural LW play RW and our natural RW play LW. Sorba can't shoot for shit or cross with his left and Koroma is a one trick pony, we all know what he's gonna do but occasionally it comes off.. so why change it to have zero effect? Baffling. It’s been quite something to see him play our few attacking players so deep that they do nothing but track back. Hopefully Rudoni can help the midfield actually keep the ball a bit, but we are so poor in possession now. Unless there is a big upturn in form those PNE attendance will become the norm. |
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Post by runner76 on Dec 19, 2023 11:49:14 GMT 1
Not so sure about that.....Warnock has the energy and passion and skill to ignite the team at the right time when needed - like in a siege mentality. Fighting for survival on limited time he is perfect. Over an entire season, not so sure....you can't really have a trajectory that crosses end of one season and into the next (well, nice if you do....) but reality is change in squad etc this season was looking bang average from NW........it has continued under Moore.........he - and the club on all levels - need January to get the players needed and get an improvement on the grass that lifts us at least to safe and clear from the bottom three.......you can go on and on and on with all the reasons you don't think that is a good idea, but it is really clear from the owner that is likely to happen......it will take a massive change to change their mind and I don't see it happening as it's too late in the day with January so close Nothing continued under Moore imo, he inherited a team that were starting to play well after an iffy start, coming off the back of very successful end to the season. There were some really good performances, they even gave Leicester a really good game. The performances after Moore have dropped off a cliff. I know there are a few on here who won't hear a bad word against the club and think NW was a very naughty boy and just can't bring themselves to be objective but it's clear to see the impact that replacing a brilliant manager with a poor one has had. The only surprise for me is just how bad it's been, I thought we'd be in trouble but didn't expect to be in the relegation zone so early (I know we aren't yet but only a matter of time). The only positive is that the club can hopefully make the change quickly. Well, you could argue we nearly / could have beaten high flying Ipswich as well under Moore!!.......I think under Neil it is likely we would be a little better off now, but in reality a win or draw, maybe, not up in the top half.....!! Neil is gone, and he would always have been going, so it's pretty much a waste of time comparing Neil and Darren......even if he stayed and we had finished safely mid table, Moore could still have come in and we would be exactly where we are now....... |
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Post by royrace on Dec 19, 2023 11:53:25 GMT 1
Nothing continued under Moore imo, he inherited a team that were starting to play well after an iffy start, coming off the back of very successful end to the season. There were some really good performances, they even gave Leicester a really good game. The performances after Moore have dropped off a cliff. I know there are a few on here who won't hear a bad word against the club and think NW was a very naughty boy and just can't bring themselves to be objective but it's clear to see the impact that replacing a brilliant manager with a poor one has had. The only surprise for me is just how bad it's been, I thought we'd be in trouble but didn't expect to be in the relegation zone so early (I know we aren't yet but only a matter of time). The only positive is that the club can hopefully make the change quickly. Well, you could argue we nearly / could have beaten high flying Ipswich as well under Moore!!.......I think under Neil it is likely we would be a little better off now, but in reality a win or draw, maybe, not up in the top half.....!! Neil is gone, and he would always have been going, so it's pretty much a waste of time comparing Neil and Darren......even if he stayed and we had finished safely mid table, Moore could still have come in and we would be exactly where we are now....... It is a waste of time I agree, unfortunately we'll never know how things might have panned out. I was just responding to a post saying basically that NW wouldn't have done any better, which is clearly complete nonsense. |
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Post by townarentbest on Dec 19, 2023 12:18:32 GMT 1
Unlikely… they’ll have 3 month notice clauses at max unless we are completely incompetent (which we presumably aren’t). You can’t legally give someone a 3 year contract with a three month notice clause, it says 3 years for a reason , it’s 3 years, unless the incumbent breaks a contract condition, ie theft, corruption, illegality etc. Its not a fixed term contract, its a maximum term contract, and of course its possible to have termination clauses that don't result in the full 3 year term having to be paid out. Look up "T for C". |
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Post by mosher on Dec 19, 2023 12:28:38 GMT 1
Not so sure about that.....Warnock has the energy and passion and skill to ignite the team at the right time when needed - like in a siege mentality. Fighting for survival on limited time he is perfect. Over an entire season, not so sure....you can't really have a trajectory that crosses end of one season and into the next (well, nice if you do....) but reality is change in squad etc this season was looking bang average from NW........it has continued under Moore.........he - and the club on all levels - need January to get the players needed and get an improvement on the grass that lifts us at least to safe and clear from the bottom three.......you can go on and on and on with all the reasons you don't think that is a good idea, but it is really clear from the owner that is likely to happen......it will take a massive change to change their mind and I don't see it happening as it's too late in the day with January so close Nothing continued under Moore imo, he inherited a team that were starting to play well after an iffy start, coming off the back of very successful end to the season. There were some really good performances, they even gave Leicester a really good game. The performances after Moore have dropped off a cliff. I know there are a few on here who won't hear a bad word against the club and think NW was a very naughty boy and just can't bring themselves to be objective but it's clear to see the impact that replacing a brilliant manager with a poor one has had. The only surprise for me is just how bad it's been, I thought we'd be in trouble but didn't expect to be in the relegation zone so early (I know we aren't yet but only a matter of time). The only positive is that the club can hopefully make the change quickly. He's not the messiah |
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Post by waggers on Dec 19, 2023 12:44:29 GMT 1
I saw a post from someone the other day stating that if sacked now Moore and his team won't have their entire 3 year contracts paid off in full. There will be pay offs but nowhere near the full contact of each. I think Moore will be given a few games post January, I think we'll still be as bad as we are now and he'll be gone. Be too late for anyone to save us by then. I tend to agree, but I think this will be Nagle's plan. Give Moore until the start of January. You never know, if they are actively looking for a proper manager we might see the switch made after the next horrendous outing. |
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Post by waggers on Dec 19, 2023 12:58:02 GMT 1
Nothing continued under Moore imo, he inherited a team that were starting to play well after an iffy start, coming off the back of very successful end to the season. There were some really good performances, they even gave Leicester a really good game. The performances after Moore have dropped off a cliff. I know there are a few on here who won't hear a bad word against the club and think NW was a very naughty boy and just can't bring themselves to be objective but it's clear to see the impact that replacing a brilliant manager with a poor one has had. The only surprise for me is just how bad it's been, I thought we'd be in trouble but didn't expect to be in the relegation zone so early (I know we aren't yet but only a matter of time). The only positive is that the club can hopefully make the change quickly. Well, you could argue we nearly / could have beaten high flying Ipswich as well under Moore!!.......I think under Neil it is likely we would be a little better off now, but in reality a win or draw, maybe, not up in the top half.....!! Neil is gone, and he would always have been going, so it's pretty much a waste of time comparing Neil and Darren......even if he stayed and we had finished safely mid table, Moore could still have come in and we would be exactly where we are now....... I don't think there will ever be an agreement between those who think we'd have been comfortably safe by Christmas under Warnock, and those that think we'd be in the same position as we are now. I personally think we'd have been safe under Warnock. He was likely upto Warnock type behind the scenes antics but safety this season should have been the primary objective. Nagle likely very much regrets the switch. |
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Post by runner76 on Dec 19, 2023 12:58:37 GMT 1
Well, you could argue we nearly / could have beaten high flying Ipswich as well under Moore!!.......I think under Neil it is likely we would be a little better off now, but in reality a win or draw, maybe, not up in the top half.....!! Neil is gone, and he would always have been going, so it's pretty much a waste of time comparing Neil and Darren......even if he stayed and we had finished safely mid table, Moore could still have come in and we would be exactly where we are now....... It is a waste of time I agree, unfortunately we'll never know how things might have panned out. I was just responding to a post saying basically that NW wouldn't have done any better, which is clearly complete nonsense. Fair point. Neil would have done better. But we’d still be a shit squad achieving nothing but safety at best…. |
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Post by aideybabes on Dec 19, 2023 12:59:21 GMT 1
Nothing continued under Moore imo, he inherited a team that were starting to play well after an iffy start, coming off the back of very successful end to the season. There were some really good performances, they even gave Leicester a really good game. The performances after Moore have dropped off a cliff. I know there are a few on here who won't hear a bad word against the club and think NW was a very naughty boy and just can't bring themselves to be objective but it's clear to see the impact that replacing a brilliant manager with a poor one has had. The only surprise for me is just how bad it's been, I thought we'd be in trouble but didn't expect to be in the relegation zone so early (I know we aren't yet but only a matter of time). The only positive is that the club can hopefully make the change quickly. He's not the messiah I’ve seen this before that NW had been doing something he shouldn’t have been however nobody seems to know what? Anybody know or is it a load of tosh? |
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Maynardblue
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Post by Maynardblue on Dec 19, 2023 13:15:22 GMT 1
You can't fool players that have been in the game as long as some of ours have. They saw straight through MF and they see straight through this guy and his crayon eatingly primitive methods.
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Post by irverino on Dec 19, 2023 13:20:18 GMT 1
You can't fool players that have been in the game as long as some of ours have. They saw straight through MF and they see straight through this guy and his crayon eatingly primitive methods. Ouch....explains a lot though. |
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Post by Porrohman on Dec 19, 2023 13:20:35 GMT 1
Time and again Warnock avoided relegation and improved the team's league position throughout the following season, Cardiff and Middlesbrough within the last 5 or 6 seasons being the most recent example. He was set to do it again here. In fact, I'll be surprised if you can find anything in his record where the team went the other way (apart from every top division team he's managed). Oh yeah, surely we were on for the playoffs under Neil........ And on for League 1 under Moore |
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Post by Wingman on Dec 19, 2023 13:22:49 GMT 1
You can't fool players that have been in the game as long as some of ours have. They saw straight through MF and they see straight through this guy and his crayon eatingly primitive methods. Ouch! 🫢 |
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Post by desertstorm on Dec 19, 2023 13:25:11 GMT 1
You can't fool players that have been in the game as long as some of ours have. They saw straight through MF and they see straight through this guy and his crayon eatingly primitive methods. Times running out. |
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Post by irverino on Dec 19, 2023 13:27:37 GMT 1
You can't fool players that have been in the game as long as some of ours have. They saw straight through MF and they see straight through this guy and his crayon eatingly primitive methods. Ouch! 🫢 Thumps down from the players......Only a matter of 'when' & not 'if' surely. |
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Post by Mastercracker on Dec 19, 2023 13:28:03 GMT 1
You can't fool players that have been in the game as long as some of ours have. They saw straight through MF and they see straight through this guy and his crayon eatingly primitive methods. Not saying you are wrong, Moore has done absolutely nothing to impress me. But how do "crayon eatingly primitive methods" get 96 points in L1? How do they get Donny in the hunt for the championship? West Brom at least punching their weight. I'm fairly convinced he's crap tbh, but Fotheringham isn't doing any of the above. It doesn't quite add up. |
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Maynardblue
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Post by Maynardblue on Dec 19, 2023 13:32:28 GMT 1
You can't fool players that have been in the game as long as some of ours have. They saw straight through MF and they see straight through this guy and his crayon eatingly primitive methods. Not saying you are wrong, Moore has done absolutely nothing to impress me. But how do "crayon eatingly primitive methods" get 96 points in L1? How do they get Donny in the hunt for the championship? West Brom at least punching their weight. I'm fairly convinced he's crap tbh, but Fotheringham isn't doing any of the above. It doesn't quite add up. He's a manager that relies on building a team spirit...and having a bigger budget and better players than the opposition. Tactically he's always been hopeless and anyone who's played under him will tell you that. |
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Wingman
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Post by Wingman on Dec 19, 2023 13:32:40 GMT 1
You can't fool players that have been in the game as long as some of ours have. They saw straight through MF and they see straight through this guy and his crayon eatingly primitive methods. Not saying you are wrong, Moore has done absolutely nothing to impress me. But how do "crayon eatingly primitive methods" get 96 points in L1? How do they get Donny in the hunt for the championship? West Brom at least punching their weight. I'm fairly convinced he's crap tbh, but Fotheringham isn't doing any of the above. It doesn't quite add up. I’m in agreement here, avoiding the sack or support poll for the reasons you state. You could argue the West Brom squad were underachieving, Weds had a good budget and Donny, maybe it just clicked? I think he must have something about him, but maybe it’s just not going to work with us, or maybe this group of players aren’t willing and able to adapt to his methods? We’ve all seen before managerial appointments or player signings sometimes just don’t work out, then fire elsewhere. It’s becoming more regular that they never work out at Town! |
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Post by Big Ern on Dec 19, 2023 13:43:54 GMT 1
Not saying you are wrong, Moore has done absolutely nothing to impress me. But how do "crayon eatingly primitive methods" get 96 points in L1? How do they get Donny in the hunt for the championship? West Brom at least punching their weight. I'm fairly convinced he's crap tbh, but Fotheringham isn't doing any of the above. It doesn't quite add up. He's a manager that relies on building a team spirit...and having a bigger budget and better players than the opposition. Tactically he's always been hopeless and anyone who's played under him will tell you that. Any chance of him going then? |
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Post by oneneilwarnock on Dec 19, 2023 13:44:18 GMT 1
Not saying you are wrong, Moore has done absolutely nothing to impress me. But how do "crayon eatingly primitive methods" get 96 points in L1? How do they get Donny in the hunt for the championship? West Brom at least punching their weight. I'm fairly convinced he's crap tbh, but Fotheringham isn't doing any of the above. It doesn't quite add up. He's a manager that relies on building a team spirit...and having a bigger budget and better players than the opposition. Tactically he's always been hopeless and anyone who's played under him will tell you that. Yep this is correct, Wednesday budget was 15x bigger than Forest Green's in League one last year. He got 96 points with the highest wage bill in the league. Bannan was on 21k a week which is higher or as high as anybody we have currently. Bannan who also made a speech about him after the playoff semi final and how he 'motivated' the team has also gone on record recently and said Danny Rohl is the best tactical coach he has ever had by a distance. |
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