ambryboy
Jimmy Glazzard Terrier
Posts: 4,843
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Post by ambryboy on Feb 7, 2024 13:34:26 GMT 1
How did Carlos leave on a low note, of his making anyway? That's a different debate for another thread I suppose. Had both Carlos and Wagner had better support and/or a better overall plan things could have been different. And that is why a plan is really important, a plan that is understood, bought into, under constant review (as things change) and supported. NB: A plan doesn't mean a massive budget it means a strategy to use the money available wisely and pivot as needed. He left after losing a play-off final. Which in all honesty was something of a relief as we would have been bummed every week if we'd gone up.
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Post by kennyk2 on Feb 7, 2024 13:35:05 GMT 1
This guy's as much ITK as everyone else!
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ldotm
David Wagner Terrier
Posts: 2,879
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Post by ldotm on Feb 7, 2024 13:35:08 GMT 1
If Carlos and Wagner were deemed failures for us, then people will never be happy as a Town fan. No-one said they were failures. But their times didn't come to an end on a high note, did they? That’s football though, the majority end up being sacked or moving to a bigger club. “You either die a hero or live long enough to become the villain”.
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goodbet
Jimmy Glazzard Terrier
Posts: 4,487
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Post by goodbet on Feb 7, 2024 13:36:46 GMT 1
If one of the frustrations of Warnocks time with us, was him doing it kind of part time. Then what is the point in even talking to Duff, he lives in Cheltenham Kev and he will NOT move . Therefore you are appointing if you do someone you will have the same issue with ! If you read this forum or your advisor does, then don't put yourself in situations that you will only have to undo by sackings etc. Duf will NOT move to be part of the community if that is a big deal to you, then it is a NON starter with Duff. If he won't move that it is a non starter for me. It is not that long ago we had a manager that could not be bothered to come up to Huddersfield on the train from London, we don't want to go back to that.
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Post by detox on Feb 7, 2024 13:36:50 GMT 1
If one of the frustrations of Warnocks time with us, was him doing it kind of part time. Then what is the point in even talking to Duff, he lives in Cheltenham Kev and he will NOT move . Therefore you are appointing if you do someone you will have the same issue with ! If you read this forum or your advisor does, then don't put yourself in situations that you will only have to undo by sackings etc. Duf will NOT move to be part of the community if that is a big deal to you, then it is a NON starter with Duff. I don't see this....A good manager lays out his plans, sets his staff the targets and lets them get on with it. He doesn't do all this stuff himself, he doesn't have to be there and watch his staff are doing it correctly either. So not 'living nearby' doesn't matter. There are phones, video links etc nowadays where people around the world link together. Our owner hasn't moved to Huddersfield, and he seems to be doing ok, keeps in touch by videolink to his his execs etc..
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Post by LukeBeckettsBanjoString on Feb 7, 2024 13:39:13 GMT 1
Just seen Worthington having a mosey ‘round Holmfirth. Day off, or new manager taking training??👀
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Post by tepidterrier on Feb 7, 2024 13:39:49 GMT 1
Lost a coin flip after an outstanding 50+ game season. I know what you’re saying, that losing a play off final isn’t a success… but it’s extremely harsh to say he failed here after taking us levels above our norm. Probably best not to open the Carlos can of worms AGAIN though. The only managers to ever leave on a high were Herbert Chapman, Cecil Potter and Neil Warnock. Wasn't Cecil Potter forced out after some kind of scandal involving a Welsh team and some illegal payments? I have a very vague memory of reading about it.
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Post by bells ringing :) on Feb 7, 2024 13:40:09 GMT 1
If one of the frustrations of Warnocks time with us, was him doing it kind of part time. Then what is the point in even talking to Duff, he lives in Cheltenham Kev and he will NOT move . Therefore you are appointing if you do someone you will have the same issue with ! If you read this forum or your advisor does, then don't put yourself in situations that you will only have to undo by sackings etc. Duf will NOT move to be part of the community if that is a big deal to you, then it is a NON starter with Duff. I don't see this....A good manager lays out his plans, sets his staff the targets and lets them get on with it. He doesn't do all this stuff himself, he doesn't have to be there and watch his staff are doing it correctly either. So not 'living nearby' doesn't matter. There are phones, video links etc nowadays where people around the world link together. Our owner hasn't moved to Huddersfield, and he seems to be doing ok, keeps in touch by videolink to his his execs etc.. What am saying was it was rumoured at the time of Warnock's depature, that time off for the players and his "par time" role was a problem for Nagle etc. Therefore Duff , who has and probs will never have the rep that Warnock carries , will not get the same level of respect afforded to Warnock for his/ this method of management. It is just something that If Nagle was annoyed by Warnock doing it, then Duff will do the same and it will only annoy him again.
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Post by VLP Fan Club on Feb 7, 2024 13:42:12 GMT 1
This guy's as much ITK as everyone else! He hasn’t the foggiest.
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Post by detox on Feb 7, 2024 13:42:55 GMT 1
How did Carlos leave on a low note, of his making anyway? That's a different debate for another thread I suppose. Had both Carlos and Wagner had better support and/or a better overall plan things could have been different. And that is why a plan is really important, a plan that is understood, bought into, under constant review (as things change) and supported. NB: A plan doesn't mean a massive budget it means a strategy to use the money available wisely and pivot as needed. He left after losing a play-off final. Some fans might say he left because the owner of our opponents in that play off final had made him an offer he couldn't refuse....
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Post by Next Manager coming soon on Feb 7, 2024 13:44:05 GMT 1
If as we are led to believe Carmichael Dave reads this forum and is an advisor to KN you’d think Duff would be not the first choice. If they are going to rule out any manager not liked on DATM then it's going to be a difficult process. What DATM are saying shouldn't be any consideration for them, and I'm sure it won't be. That isn't to say they shouldn't be considering how the fans will take to a manager in terms of personality and style of football etc. But they are the people doing the interviews, and they have to trust their own judgement, because it's them who will be held accountable if it doesn't work. Can you imagine Nagle blaming the fans when we get relegated because they decided to appoint a manager based on what this forum was saying. I mean…that’s exactly what I said.
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Dan
Andy Booth Terrier
Posts: 3,785
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Post by Dan on Feb 7, 2024 13:45:29 GMT 1
This guy's as much ITK as everyone else! He hasn’t the foggiest. He has connections with certain agents and not others. Definitely gets some bits from Beswicks
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Post by theterrier42 on Feb 7, 2024 13:48:06 GMT 1
This guy's as much ITK as everyone else! He hasn’t the foggiest. Really annoys me how he answers everything so cryptically. Just say if you know or not. I ain’t a clue but I could tell you the one with the best interview will get it 😂
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Post by htafcokay on Feb 7, 2024 13:48:43 GMT 1
The only managers to ever leave on a high were Herbert Chapman, Cecil Potter and Neil Warnock. Wasn't Cecil Potter forced out after some kind of scandal involving a Welsh team and some illegal payments? I have a very vague memory of reading about it. No-one really knows, but that was mentioned in the board meeting immediately afterwards.
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Post by htafcokay on Feb 7, 2024 13:49:18 GMT 1
He left after losing a play-off final. Some fans might say he left because the owner of our opponents in that play off final had made him an offer he couldn't refuse.... Are you suggesting that Carlos Corberan took a bung?
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Post by willo on Feb 7, 2024 13:52:35 GMT 1
If one of the frustrations of Warnocks time with us, was him doing it kind of part time. Then what is the point in even talking to Duff, he lives in Cheltenham Kev and he will NOT move . Therefore you are appointing if you do someone you will have the same issue with ! If you read this forum or your advisor does, then don't put yourself in situations that you will only have to undo by sackings etc. Duf will NOT move to be part of the community if that is a big deal to you, then it is a NON starter with Duff. If he won't move that it is a non starter for me. It is not that long ago we had a manager that could not be bothered to come up to Huddersfield on the train from London, we don't want to go back to that. Exactly. Nice as he was, I never saw Chris Powell as being fully committed when he was our manager, he just seemed to be passing through. Surely as a sign of commitment, you’d want your manager living within a 20 mile radius of the club. If nothing else, what message does it send to the players? I wouldn’t entertain anybody not willing to relocate (Warnock aside because of his short time in the role).
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Post by rockwall on Feb 7, 2024 13:55:01 GMT 1
If he won't move that it is a non starter for me. It is not that long ago we had a manager that could not be bothered to come up to Huddersfield on the train from London, we don't want to go back to that. Exactly. Nice as he was, I never saw Chris Powell as being fully committed when he was our manager, he just seemed to be passing through. Surely as a sign of commitment, you’d want your manager living within a 20 mile radius of the club. If nothing else, what message does it send to the players? I wouldn’t entertain anybody not willing to relocate (Warnock aside because of his short time in the role). I know they put their careers on the line, but they know that they can get around 6 months of fantastic pay, get sacked, and recieve a pay off of some sort. That's the risk with people like Duff. Will he be fully committed? Or is he happy to see how it goes and if he fails, not be too bothered and take a pay off when sacked. Got the feeling DM wasn't bothered at all.
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Post by themanfromatlantis on Feb 7, 2024 13:56:44 GMT 1
If he won't move that it is a non starter for me. It is not that long ago we had a manager that could not be bothered to come up to Huddersfield on the train from London, we don't want to go back to that. Exactly. Nice as he was, I never saw Chris Powell as being fully committed when he was our manager, he just seemed to be passing through. Surely as a sign of commitment, you’d want your manager living within a 20 mile radius of the club. If nothing else, what message does it send to the players? I wouldn’t entertain anybody not willing to relocate (Warnock aside because of his short time in the role). It was only on the highlights that prompted me to check out if CP was on the coaching staff at Wed.
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Post by Gag_N_Bone_Man on Feb 7, 2024 13:57:01 GMT 1
If Carlos and Wagner were deemed failures for us, then people will never be happy as a Town fan. No-one said they were failures. But their times didn't come to an end on a high note, did they? how many managerial reigns really end on a high? Very very few at our level or higher.
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Post by Gag_N_Bone_Man on Feb 7, 2024 14:01:21 GMT 1
Some fans might say he left because the owner of our opponents in that play off final had made him an offer he couldn't refuse.... Are you suggesting that Carlos Corberan took a bung? I didn't read this that way, I read this as "Come and manage one of my teams for a big fat payrise". I don't think CC would have left if we'd backed him properly in the summer window. Instead we sold our two best players and bought in fuck all in terms of quality.
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Post by willo on Feb 7, 2024 14:02:24 GMT 1
Exactly. Nice as he was, I never saw Chris Powell as being fully committed when he was our manager, he just seemed to be passing through. Surely as a sign of commitment, you’d want your manager living within a 20 mile radius of the club. If nothing else, what message does it send to the players? I wouldn’t entertain anybody not willing to relocate (Warnock aside because of his short time in the role). It was only on the highlights that prompted me to check out if CP was on the coaching staff at Wed. He is, clocked him on Saturday. Wasn’t aware he was there now.
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Tinpot
Mental Health Support Group
I'm really tinpot
Posts: 23,693
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Post by Tinpot on Feb 7, 2024 14:04:18 GMT 1
What is the absolute best we can hope for from Duff? I don't hate the appointment as think he has similar values to Dyche and that should fit well with us, but at the same time I see absolutely no chance we're in the Premier League in 3 years with him. Maybe 2/3 mid table finishes a bit of stability, it wouldn't harm. Not sure Nagle will be happy with that mind. Either way il be stunned if MC is still at this club in 12 months time as it really just shows how limited he is again. What was the best Coventry City could hope for when they re-appointed Mark Robins when they were in the 4th tier & playing their home games at Northampton? Duff isn't my first choice either but I can't get my head around people writing him off.
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Post by htafcokay on Feb 7, 2024 14:06:25 GMT 1
No-one said they were failures. But their times didn't come to an end on a high note, did they? how many managerial reigns really end on a high? Very very few at our level or higher. Just three in our history.
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Post by rockwall on Feb 7, 2024 14:11:21 GMT 1
What is the absolute best we can hope for from Duff? I don't hate the appointment as think he has similar values to Dyche and that should fit well with us, but at the same time I see absolutely no chance we're in the Premier League in 3 years with him. Maybe 2/3 mid table finishes a bit of stability, it wouldn't harm. Not sure Nagle will be happy with that mind. Either way il be stunned if MC is still at this club in 12 months time as it really just shows how limited he is again. What was the best Coventry City could hope for when they re-appointed Mark Robins when they were in the 4th tier & playing their home games at Northampton? Duff isn't my first choice either but I can't get my head around people writing him off. I believe the main reasons are that he doesn't fit in with our vision of 'attacking' football. He more than likely would be commuting from Cheltenham, so how dedicated is he actually to the role. Obviously nobody know how he would do. But gut feeling is, another underwhelming appointment that will be replaced within 12 months.
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Post by willo on Feb 7, 2024 14:13:17 GMT 1
No-one said they were failures. But their times didn't come to an end on a high note, did they? how many managerial reigns really end on a high? Very very few at our level or higher. Get your point but there’s the out and out dross (Ternent, Wadsworth, Supercrap, Fotheringham, Moore) and then there’s the ones who are largely not remembered for doing much at all but who did the job they were paid to do, Grayson finally got us out of League 1, the Cowley’s kept us up that season, even Chris Powell provided a little stability. Didn’t do a shit job but just steadied the ship. Reckon Duff would come in and be one of those, unremarkable really, and we have had a lot of those but then every club could say that. There’s only been Buxton, Warnock, Wagner and possibly Jacko who era’s I can look back on with any fondness. Maybe(?) the first Lee Clark season but I’m not well versed to comment on that as I’d “lapsed” somewhat through the noughties.
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Tiro
Jimmy Glazzard Terrier
Posts: 4,001
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Post by Tiro on Feb 7, 2024 14:16:13 GMT 1
This guy's as much ITK as everyone else! Thinking about becoming a football journo; You [sic] spout unsubstantiated bollocks and/or the bleeding obvious and yet none of it seems to matter / have an effect on your success and you get paid. It wouldn’t surprise me if that is what Townrwe et al do and are successful at. It’s that or I apply for the Tory party. Same same.
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Tinpot
Mental Health Support Group
I'm really tinpot
Posts: 23,693
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Post by Tinpot on Feb 7, 2024 14:16:56 GMT 1
If as we are led to believe Carmichael Dave reads this forum and is an advisor to KN you’d think Duff would be not the first choice. He is the name that more universally would be unpopular atm. Some against PH. Some against Rowett but a large amount against Duff. While I realise they shouldn’t be making a decision based on DATM I also think given the previous decision to remove NW and give it Moore they’d be sensible to take it into account. Appoint someone fans are on board with would give them more breathing space if it doesn’t initially go to plan. Just my thoughts. I’m sure someone on Dictatorship at the Max will be along to shoot me down and ask me to justify my opinion any minute…. If I was advising Kevin Nagle based on the responses of fans on social media, I'd tell him to wear a flak jacket regardless of who he appoints.
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Post by Baby Ate My Eight Ball on Feb 7, 2024 14:26:32 GMT 1
how many managerial reigns really end on a high? Very very few at our level or higher. Get your point but there’s the out and out dross (Ternent, Wadsworth, Supercrap, Fotheringham, Moore) and then there’s the ones who are largely not remembered for doing much at all but who did the job they were paid to do, Grayson finally got us out of League 1, the Cowley’s kept us up that season, even Chris Powell provided a little stability. Didn’t do a shit job but just steadied the ship. Reckon Duff would come in and be one of those, unremarkable really, and we have had a lot of those but then every club could say that. There’s only been Buxton, Warnock, Wagner and possibly Jacko who era’s I can look back on with any fondness. Maybe(?) the first Lee Clark season but I’m not well versed to comment on that as I’d “lapsed” somewhat through the noughties. Being a success and leaving on a high are two very different criteria. Grayson is a great example - he was a success even though it ended with the team looking hopeless. Brought in to achieve promotion and he did it - his goal will then have changed to establishing us in the Championship - because he couldn't do that doesn't make him a failure. To say Corberan wasn't a success is laughable. He left for a bigger job after leading us to Wembley, didn't lose for several months and troubled the two 2 for a brief spell. His goal won't have been promotion, it will have been get us in and around top 6. Mission accomplished, he went because his budget was being reduced, his best player not replaced and he had an offer from a Champions League club.
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Post by htafcokay on Feb 7, 2024 14:35:10 GMT 1
Get your point but there’s the out and out dross (Ternent, Wadsworth, Supercrap, Fotheringham, Moore) and then there’s the ones who are largely not remembered for doing much at all but who did the job they were paid to do, Grayson finally got us out of League 1, the Cowley’s kept us up that season, even Chris Powell provided a little stability. Didn’t do a shit job but just steadied the ship. Reckon Duff would come in and be one of those, unremarkable really, and we have had a lot of those but then every club could say that. There’s only been Buxton, Warnock, Wagner and possibly Jacko who era’s I can look back on with any fondness. Maybe(?) the first Lee Clark season but I’m not well versed to comment on that as I’d “lapsed” somewhat through the noughties. Being a success and leaving on a high are two very different criteria. Grayson is a great example - he was a success even though it ended with the team looking hopeless. Brought in to achieve promotion and he did it - his goal will then have changed to establishing us in the Championship - because he couldn't do that doesn't make him a failure. To say Corberan wasn't a success is laughable. He left for a bigger job after leading us to Wembley, didn't lose for several months and troubled the two 2 for a brief spell. His goal won't have been promotion, it will have been get us in and around top 6. Mission accomplished, he went because his budget was being reduced, his best player not replaced and he had an offer from a Champions League club. Corberan left before anybody had been sold.
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Post by kennyk2 on Feb 7, 2024 14:39:46 GMT 1
This guy's as much ITK as everyone else! Thinking about becoming a football journo; You [sic] spout unsubstantiated bollocks and/or the bleeding obvious and yet none of it seems to matter / have an effect on your success and you get paid. It wouldn’t surprise me if that is what Townrwe et al do and are successful at. It’s that or I apply for the Tory party. Same same. Somebody said that he has been struggling for any inside info on Town since Clibbens left.
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