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Post by detox on May 15, 2024 23:12:59 GMT 1
Alternatively, scrap the offside rule...
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Post by Walton-on-the-Hill Terrier on May 15, 2024 23:13:00 GMT 1
On a side note - goal line technology, I think we’d all agree, has been a good addition, despite the Nakayama non-goal a couple of seasons ago against Blackpool. However, I hadn’t realised it wasn’t operational in L1 and L2 until I was at a game this last season where Sutton scored a clear “goal” that wasn’t given in a game (can’t remember who against).
What will happen now at the JSS next season with Town in L1? The technology is in place, but will it be used?
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Post by londoncowling on May 15, 2024 23:18:55 GMT 1
will be very interesting to see which way each club votes
top eight unanimous to keep it
rest to consign it to history ?
reckon there’s a chance it could go
is it a two thirds majority required ?
cats among the pigeons though
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Post by Walton-on-the-Hill Terrier on May 15, 2024 23:20:11 GMT 1
will be very interesting to see which way each club votes top eight unanimous to keep it rest to consign it to history ? reckon there’s a chance it could go is it a two thirds majority required ? cats among the pigeons though 14/20 need to vote in favour I think. |
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Post by 28901 on May 15, 2024 23:21:06 GMT 1
We could go back to the days where MOTD spend the whole program slagging officials for not spotting the infringements, and managers moaning ' we must be able to do better than this'.. Let's hope so. Its better than them moaning about var and its ridiculous decisions that have killed the drama, the joy out of tge game. The reason why most got into the game in the first place. |
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Post by londoncowling on May 15, 2024 23:22:03 GMT 1
Alternatively, scrap the offside rule... liner one job you’ve only got one job |
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Post by townarentbest on May 15, 2024 23:54:18 GMT 1
Someone on here posted a while ago that if they can't make a decision in 30 seconds there is no clear and obvious error so they should stay with the on-field decision. Referees need to stop hiding behind the technology and make a decision based on what they see. And everyone to accept they might not be right in real time ? The referees decision is final. Even if he gets it wrong. That’s football. |
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Post by impact on May 16, 2024 0:08:44 GMT 1
I was a big advocate of it when it came in. I thought it would even the playing field and stop the big clubs benefitting from dodgy decisions by getting rid of the howlers.
It hasn't done that. It's been far too slow, too forensic and worst of all, there are still howlers after seeing 10 replays. How anyone could see that Onana challenge at the start of the season and think it isn't a penalty is baffling. It's pure incompetence.
The only way I see to fix it would be to make it a challenge system, 1 per team, which is what I'd have done to start with. Put the discussion over the tannoy like rugby so everyone knows what's happening. If it's not conclusive within 15 seconds you lose your review as it should be for howlers not subjective calls. It doesn't get rid of the incompetence issue, but it does get rid of the contstant stoppages.
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Post by themanfromatlantis on May 16, 2024 0:09:47 GMT 1
Was OK with VAR had it been applied objectively, with people manning the tech being non football but rules aware. Hasn’t happened, still an old boys club with PGMOL, corrupt bastards who I’m sure will be exposed in due course.
As for the linesmen/women. I’ve posted before that I think they do a really good job. I’d love to know the percentages of how many they get wrong, because I think it would surprise a few people. And if it does back up something like a 5% human error rate, why aren’t they up in arms about AI? They’re head and shoulders more competent than the bloke/woman with the whistle, but somehow they remain silent?
As for it being cancelled, not a chance. The PL will fanny around with this for yrs because it drives the brand. Why would they want to lose one of their best marketing tools?
The more I read this sort of shite, it softens the blow of L1. At the absolute top top very best, we’re a minimum of 2y from rejoining that shitshow…
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Post by markthehorn on May 16, 2024 0:12:26 GMT 1
I was a big advocate of it when it came in. I thought it would even the playing field and stop the big clubs benefitting from dodgy decisions by getting rid of the howlers. It hasn't done that. It's been far too slow, too forensic and worst of all, there are still howlers after seeing 10 replays. How anyone could see that Onana challenge at the start of the season and think it isn't a penalty is baffling. It's pure incompetence. The only way I see to fix it would be to make it a challenge system, 1 per team, which is what I'd have done to start with. Put the discussion over the tannoy like rugby so everyone knows what's happening. If it's not conclusive within 15 seconds you lose your review as it should be for howlers not subjective calls. It doesn't get rid of the incompetence issue, but it does get rid of the contstant stoppages. I’d agree but clubs would still complain the ref got it wrong and/or want more appeals though |
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Post by isitjustme on May 16, 2024 7:57:59 GMT 1
And everyone to accept they might not be right in real time ? The referees decision is final. Even if he gets it wrong. That’s football. Rebecca Welch........!!! |
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k1man999
Andy Booth Terrier
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Post by k1man999 on May 16, 2024 8:14:56 GMT 1
It's not going, teams will need to be familiar with it as it will still be operational in Europe/World football.
When it first came in in the world Cup it looked like it had potential to work but it's become clunky, too subjective but the fiddling with the rules has not helped ie handball certain tackles offsides.
It should be used if the ref thinks I didn't see that clearly can u have a look I'm not too sure rather than someone saying to refs your wrong.
Let the ref referee and var can be an assistance tool if ref needs it.
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Post by Captainslapper on May 16, 2024 8:29:44 GMT 1
It's not going, teams will need to be familiar with it as it will still be operational in Europe/World football. When it first came in in the world Cup it looked like it had potential to work but it's become clunky, too subjective but the fiddling with the rules has not helped ie handball certain tackles offsides. It should be used if the ref thinks I didn't see that clearly can u have a look I'm not too sure rather than someone saying to refs your wrong. Let the ref referee and var can be an assistance tool if ref needs it. I think if the PL ditched it, a few other leagues would follow suit. This country cant be the only one where it is mostly hated. At the moment only the Swedish league has said they dont want it from the top divisions around europe I think. getting decisions right or wrong or even the time taken isnt the big issue with VAR...though they are big issues! The most crap thing about it is that it kills that moment of joy when your team has scored a goal. That ecstasy as you take a cursory glance at the Lino to make sure he hasnt got his flag up , in the knowledge that if he hasnt its a goal and no matter how much moaning the other side do, it will be a goal. Its such a major part of the whole point of being a fan. With VAR, for most goals that isnt there...scoring a goal is effectively like being awarded a penalty. Its probably a goal, but might not be and you'll have a wait a while to find out whilst someone somewhere scrutinises play going back a few passes to find some minuscule infringement that wasnt visible to the naked eye. The moment is ruined. |
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Post by rockwall on May 16, 2024 8:32:12 GMT 1
If used correctly, it would work.
Few examples of when it's used and shouldn't.
Are the below clear and obvious?
1. Offside decisions by a toe or shoulder?
2. Set piece goes into the box, in and amongst a melee, a player gets knocked over or tripped?
3. A ball is hit into a crowd of players and nicks a finger of a player who can't do anything about it?
There will be dozens more examples of things that VAR has stepped in to sort when noone actually notices.
If noone notices, where is the clear and obvious error?
I don't know why we can just have a review system. Each captain gets 2 reviews and VAR is only used in these occasions.
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Post by runner76 on May 16, 2024 8:44:53 GMT 1
And everyone to accept they might not be right in real time ? The referees decision is final. Even if he gets it wrong. That’s football. Or ‘she’…..  |
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Post by Sio on May 16, 2024 8:52:42 GMT 1
We could go back to the days where MOTD spend the whole program slagging officials for not spotting the infringements, and managers moaning ' we must be able to do better than this'.. Thing is, we probably spend more time now discussing VAR failures! |
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Post by Henry Mcgee on May 16, 2024 8:56:32 GMT 1
Keep it but simplify it.
No stills, no slow-mos, no lines drawn. Time limit of 30 seconds to decide. If it isn't clear that the ref/lino has definitely made a mistake then go with the original decision.
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Post by Sio on May 16, 2024 8:58:48 GMT 1
If used correctly, it would work. Few examples of when it's used and shouldn't. Are the below clear and obvious? 1. Offside decisions by a toe or shoulder?
2. Set piece goes into the box, in and amongst a melee, a player gets knocked over or tripped? 3. A ball is hit into a crowd of players and nicks a finger of a player who can't do anything about it? There will be dozens more examples of things that VAR has stepped in to sort when noone actually notices. If noone notices, where is the clear and obvious error? I don't know why we can just have a review system. Each captain gets 2 reviews and VAR is only used in these occasions. I would even argue that I wouldn't mind VAR so much if they removed offsides from its remit. The way the game is played these days, players are almost offside for so many goals at some point in its build-up - you just can't analyse each of these without slowing down the game and sucking the fun out of the ground. For fouls and even handballs, which are rarer and aren't always directly involved in goals, I'd not mind the correct decision being assessed for a few moments. It's the immediate impact on goals that is just going to kill the game. |
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Post by kennyk2 on May 16, 2024 9:32:19 GMT 1
Call me a cynic, but because the PL is allowing the clubs to vote... they've probably sounded out those clubs already, so they already know what the answer is.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 16, 2024 9:43:20 GMT 1
We could go back to the days where MOTD spend the whole program slagging officials for not spotting the infringements, and managers moaning ' we must be able to do better than this'.. Itd be better than the shambles we have now |
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Post by Deleted on May 16, 2024 9:43:38 GMT 1
Remember when there needed to be ‘clear daylight’ between defenders and attackers for offside? Now it is down to someone’s subjective view of whether half a toe is further forward. Crazy.
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Post by Fish & Chips on May 16, 2024 10:10:33 GMT 1
Keep it but simplify it. No stills, no slow-mos, no lines drawn. Time limit of 30 seconds to decide. If it isn't clear that the ref/lino has definitely made a mistake then go with the original decision. For clear and obvious, 10-15 seconds is more than enough. Countdown timer, if no call made then original decision automatically stands. |
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Post by Mastercracker on May 16, 2024 10:12:15 GMT 1
I was all for it but in it's current state it's a disgrace. The whole purpose was to stop the absolute howler of a decision ie goals where people are 5 yards offside or to award stone wall penalties missed/vice versa. In that case it should make an appearance about once every 10 games but it's been used to re-referee games which is exactly what they said it wasn't for.
Drawing lines for offside but then using a 50 fps camera to decide when someone's played the ball. The frame they decide to use can make all the difference. Ludicrous.
Slowing tackles down and using stills. Everything looks horrendous when you do this, but football is played in real speed.
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ram
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Post by ram on May 16, 2024 10:57:53 GMT 1
If the vote result is to scrap it,They will take it "under consideration!" then ignore it.
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digs
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Post by digs on May 16, 2024 11:17:34 GMT 1
I hope they keep it,it adds to the entertainment and carnage of the Premier League circus,its not like its going to affect Huddersfield Town anytime soon.
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Post by rockwall on May 16, 2024 11:32:44 GMT 1
Can't we just keep it for Forest? They love it don't they?
'
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Dan
Andy Booth Terrier
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Post by Dan on May 16, 2024 11:34:15 GMT 1
Can't we just keep it for Forest? They love it don't they? ' They probably do!  |
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Post by Captainslapper on May 16, 2024 11:42:28 GMT 1
Remember when there needed to be ‘clear daylight’ between defenders and attackers for offside? Now it is down to someone’s subjective view of whether half a toe is further forward. Crazy. Even then it's a guess as you cant know the precise moment the pass was made. One frame of film can make a foot of difference to where that line goes. |
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Post by Mav on May 16, 2024 11:48:33 GMT 1
Just use it like Rugby Union.
If the ref isn’t sure ask for a check.
The reasoning should be relayed over the tannoy.
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Post by Gag_N_Bone_Man (Destabiliser) on May 16, 2024 12:02:00 GMT 1
VAR itself isn't the issue. It's the way it's applied in practice. Every stadium that uses VAR should have big screens at either end and the VAR replays should be shown live, as should the discussion be heard live. Keeps everyone engaged and honest.
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