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Post by markelt on May 1, 2011 8:04:31 GMT 1
Leaving aside the fact the FA have already fucked things up by leaving a decision so late, how are they going to mess things up with this whole Faurlin thing?
My guess is they will deduct just enough points to make sure QPR are still promoted but don't get the title. Fudge.
Hoopy? GroveR? What's the word?
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daleylama
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Post by daleylama on May 1, 2011 9:00:26 GMT 1
That's known as the Cheaterfield solution.
It works so well that nobody ends up happy.
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Post by markelt on May 1, 2011 10:38:31 GMT 1
That's why it seems to be favourite . Actually enforcing their own rules or not having them in the first place seem to be the difficult options to them.
Of course they could just fine the richest man in the world who owns a club that's just achieved promotion worth whatever it is this year (£40m?) £50,000. That will send a clear message, but probably not the one the FA thinks and they have form with that as well.
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Bernie
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Post by Bernie on May 1, 2011 11:50:41 GMT 1
it's a fucking conspiracy is what it is, isn't it? See also norwich being given as much extra time as they need to score. There's a reason we're playing before them
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Post by markelt on May 1, 2011 20:04:28 GMT 1
Is it to give you enough time for your lap of honour?
Obviously there is no conspiracy. Just a cock up the the FA is likely to make worse.
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Bernie
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Post by Bernie on May 2, 2011 10:13:25 GMT 1
Of course it's a conspiracy. The fact that they've got to you too is compelling evidence.
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daleylama
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Post by daleylama on May 2, 2011 21:42:20 GMT 1
From what I saw, your lot didn't play at all before Norwich today.
Bottle? Severe lack of diagnosed in the Cardiff area.
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Bernie
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Post by Bernie on May 3, 2011 7:33:48 GMT 1
You're fucking not fucking wrong fucking there, Daley. Three fucking years in a fucking row now. I'm on the verge of really not fucking caring any more. Especially seeing as Swansea can manage equally good results with a 100th of the money.
JONES IS A c***.
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Post by e17hoop on May 3, 2011 9:36:55 GMT 1
Word on the street here is that they'll drop 6 of the 7 charges. Whether the club will accept that 1 charge is another matter.
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Post by markelt on May 3, 2011 9:49:51 GMT 1
Seriously Hoopy, it amazes me how this has unfolded. Why take what would have been a tricky and contentious issue anyway, arse about with it for months then try to make a decision just as the season is ending with the club involved already promoted. Whatever they do now it is going to kick off with somebody.
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Post by GroveR on May 3, 2011 11:31:33 GMT 1
Not much surprises me with the FA mark - this is the organisation that hasn't been able to hire a decent manager since Bobby Robson.
S'far as I understand it we're facing 4 charges under the 3rd party ownership rules that were brought in after the Tevez situation. These apparently came into effect in July 2009 - around the same time we signed Faurlin. It's not a rule that can be applied retrospectively and apparently we alerted the Foootball League to the fact we were now in breach of the rule (who wisely swerved it off to the FA as they deal with player registrations). I think we have a decent chance of fighting this.
We've been futher changed with using an unauthorised agent (allegedly named as Peppino Tirri). This charge appears to have been brought as Tirri was registered with FIFA but not the FA at the time (although is now). As Hoopy says, this is probably the one of the seven we'll appeal, negotiate a fine for and eventually cop to.
The last 2 charges relate to QPR & Paladini submitting false documentation regarding the extension of Faurlin's contract in October 2010 - these charges scare me more than any other as our defence for them appears to be based on a combination of ignorance and stupidity. What makes me even doubly angrier is we sacked a club secretary in 2008 "with immediate effect" who'd been at the club dealing with exactly this type of paperwork for over 20 years.
At this point I'd take a 5 point deduction, a £5m fine or both on Friday. As you've said, the points put us up in 2nd at worst (which my mate equated to being he and I winning a million quid on the lottery each and him being given it in a leather attaché case and me in a Tesco bag - I'm hardly gonna moan am I?) and the cash is pocket-change compared to the sums involved in promotion.
Seeing Swansea finish above Cardiff would be hella-funny though...
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Bernie
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Post by Bernie on May 3, 2011 11:41:32 GMT 1
It would, but it would also be well deserved, and would hopefully finally puncture our balloon of insane self delusion (though at the risk of bankrupting us into the Welsh "Premier" League). And shut Ali-the-over-excitable Tannoy operator up as well.
JONES IS A c***.
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Post by fgrfc_dan on May 3, 2011 11:44:17 GMT 1
I do quite like the idea of Colin being stung once by the rules not being enforced and once by them being strictly enforced. He'll probably explode.
I also quite like the idea of Cardiff finally going tits up. Surely it'll happen if they don't go up this season.
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Post by JohnnyNeptune on May 3, 2011 11:53:31 GMT 1
what they should do is deduct enough points to stop sheff utd being relegated. 2 wrongs righted and all that.
amusing though cardiff's failure to go up has been none of it is as funny as leeds' capitulation. is bates still going to sue the fan that knacked becchio?
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Post by markelt on May 3, 2011 12:34:41 GMT 1
I'm trying to understand what the fuck is going on but it's impossible. I understand there were weird things going on with who may or may not have owned the registration of Ramires when he transferred to Chelsea and that Cardiff had some dealings with Ray Ranson's management company even though he was involved with Coventry. The only conclusion I've come to is either that the FA don't know what to do with their own rules or they can't be bothered with the trouble of enforcing them and that they apply differently to different clubs. Situation normal.
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Post by GlasgowTangerine on May 3, 2011 17:12:57 GMT 1
From an outside point of view the FA are screwed. If they deduct points QPR will appeal - potentially mucking up the play offs. If they don't deduct points Cardiff etc will surely look at whether THEY have a right to appeal.
What really needs to happen is that everyone needs to recognise that QPR have won the league fairly and squarely - punish accordingly (i.e. fine) and other teams need to accept it
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Post by markelt on May 3, 2011 17:26:24 GMT 1
But that's not right is it? The FA introduced rules to stop third party ownership which the League adopted, so if they find QPR guilty of breaking those rules either they enforce the stated punishment - a points deduction - which makes the whole season a farce or impose a huge fine and compensation like the one faced by West Ham. Or they don't do anything or impose a pointless fine, in which case clubs may as well just go ahead and ignore the rules, especially as Faurlin looks a really good player. They may also face a legal challenge from other clubs if they don't deduct points. It's unbelieveable they've put themselves in this position which is why I think they'll try to fudge it and piss everybody off.
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daleylama
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Post by daleylama on May 3, 2011 19:01:37 GMT 1
The Football League also introduced rules about foreign ownership and team budgets in relation to turnover League 2 but Notts County fecked all over that last seasonm while the FL stood idly by.
In other words, the FL are a bunch of thick, idiotic dithering pillocks, hav been for years.
It's only getting so much attention because it's all about promotion to the Premiership.
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plumbs
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Post by plumbs on May 3, 2011 22:04:55 GMT 1
though cardiff's failure to go up has been none of it is as funny as leeds' capitulation.ff utd being relegated. 2 wrongs righted and all that. is bates still going to sue the fan that knacked becchio? Ha! the football gods will punish you in the playoffs for that one sith,as they did when Boro gave Cardiff a good stuffing.Can you imagine anything worse than seeing the many faces of Tony Mowbray that night? ;D Anyway yes KB is intending sueing him although in his proggy notes he mentioned that the guys absence would mean a reduction in pie sales-I kid you not
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Post by e17hoop on May 3, 2011 22:14:18 GMT 1
But when Faurlin signed it wasn't an issue; the FL rule was applied retrospectively after he was signed, after the FA approved the deal, after the FA had the money paid to them who then paid it to the agent who they approved payment to and only later queried his licence. It's on that basis that QPR have decided to defend it; we didn't do anything wrong until the FL changed the rules retrospectively. It'd be like doing 70 on a motorway and then finding out that they reduced the speed limit two weeks later to 60 and applied it retrospectively to when you did 70.
The FA only got interested in January when they realised QPR announced Faurlin's deal was £3.5m - all the paperwork said £600k. They want to know where the other £2.9m is. Fact is, it never existed and is the total value of the deal if he wins the world cup for Argentina with a hat-trick in the final after having played 1000 games for QPR or something. It was a piss up the wall contest by GP to prove Flabio et al's investment and attract sponsorship, ostensibly from Asia.
The delay appears to have been at QPR's request to allow us time to get out defence case together; the irony is that Ian Mill is representing QPR. He's the QC who represented Sheff Utd against West Ham for £26.5m. He's perceived as the 'go to guy' for this type of case and has been reported as being entirely comfortable with QPR's defence; obviously he hasn't got Fitz Hall in there as he'd only last 20 minutes before doing a hamstring.
The charges against GP are potentially more serious; did he try and fiddle the paperwork to make it look above board? If that's proven it could be the more serious charge and might finally get him out of QPR.
We do, however, have Simon Jordan in our corner too. He said today: "You can’t have an FA that leaks things," he added. "I know who leaked it. An FA councilor, a trusted individual, is leaking to The Sun that QPR have got a case to answer and the reasons why. "When the FA last chose an England manager they couldn’t keep their mouths shut. Dave Richards was running around like a good-un. There’s a responsibility to act with a little bit of dignity, try to keep your own counsel, and make decisions which doesn’t involve the rest of the world having an opinion on it before you’ve made your decision." There's a writ on the way to/already delivered to the Sun over it as Bernie was mightily pissed off by Friday's report.
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Post by markelt on May 4, 2011 5:39:01 GMT 1
So in effect they've added an extra layer to their twattery because they may not have had to take action in the first place?
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Post by e17hoop on May 4, 2011 7:14:20 GMT 1
Exactly.
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Post by fgrfc_dan on May 4, 2011 9:22:20 GMT 1
What really needs to happen is that everyone needs to recognise that QPR have won the league fairly and squarely - punish accordingly (i.e. fine) and other teams need to accept it So clubs with money can do what they like because they can afford to swallow the fines painlessly whilst those who abide by the rules suffer the consequences?
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Post by markelt on May 4, 2011 10:07:40 GMT 1
So, now I understand, I think. Having decided to take action that may not have been necessary and having left it until the final day of the season to make a decision on an issue that determines promotion their options are: 1. Do nothing, which makes them look like a bunch of ineffectual twats who can't enforce their own rules. 2. Heavy points deduction, which QPR will appeal thus throwing the playoffs into chaos and which they may lose, making them look like etc. 3. Minor points deduction which means QPR still go up, but which may hand the title to Norwich who probably don't want it on those terms and makes them look like etc 4. Impose a fine on the richest man in the world who co-owns a club that has jsut won promotion to the richest league in the world, latest prize for promotion standing at £90 million so I believe, making them look like.... and making everybody else think that it may well be a bargain ignoring the rules on signing players. 5. A combination of things that make them look like the fucking twats they so clearly are. Priceless. Dan That seems to be the modern way.
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Post by GlasgowTangerine on May 4, 2011 15:27:52 GMT 1
But Dan, as Hoopy has already pointed out - QPR abided by the rules as they existed (or didn't) at the time.
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Post by e17hoop on May 4, 2011 15:42:37 GMT 1
If we followed the rules there shouldn't even be a fine then GT.
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Post by fgrfc_dan on May 4, 2011 17:05:11 GMT 1
So why fine them then if they've done nothing wrong?
They've either broken the rules or they haven't and any fudging around with fines will just cause more trouble. Which is probably what'll happen.
What's needed is a Colin Peake to whinge about it until someone gets thrown out of the league.
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Post by markelt on May 4, 2011 17:47:50 GMT 1
Even if they've done nothing wrong, the FA have dug themselves into a hole. They might end up doing something to save face. Whatever happens I cannot believe they have left it till now to make a decision.
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Post by e17hoop on May 4, 2011 18:48:38 GMT 1
Even if they've done nothing wrong, the FA have dug themselves into a hole. They might end up doing something to save face. Whatever happens I cannot believe they have left it till now to make a decision. Unfortunately the FA, in their wisdom, don't have a penalty attached to the new rules - there is no clear sanction identified in the rules if they're broken and there is no precedent in respect of TPO. This is a test case and the FA have gloriously fucked it up. Ian Mill is apparently very very comfortable with the way things are going. The identity of some of the members of the panel has been established today: David Dein - had a stall in Shepherd's Bush when he was young. Alan Shearer - tosser.
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Post by supawooly on May 4, 2011 20:50:45 GMT 1
Oh who gives a fuck?
Bury are back in Division 3. That's what counts.
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