Attendances...

[Deleted]

Oct 2, 2015 19:48:59 GMT 1 Captainslapper said:

Theres some good intentioned ideas and comments on this thread, but the big stumbling block is that it would only work if ALL clubs do it.
otherwise all you're achieving is to reduce HTFCs income, which means we can't afford the better players like Huws, which in turn means the team struggles, which in turn means none of these floating pay on the day fans turn up, even at the cheap prices.

It needs to be a measure across the board and properly enforced otherwise it just puts you at a big disadvantage- as our old friends the chickens are finding out.

What you say would be true, if you ignored the backdrop of attendance's that have been on steady decline for some time already.

If they do nothing, then Towns incone will reduce.

If they do something a bit adventurous, the might have a chance of slowing and halting that decline, and maybe even increasing income.

My worry is that as a club we are too conservative (with a small c)...we won't take the decisive action that's required, or luck will run out eventually, and we'll be a league 1 club carrying the same problem but with another couple of thousand less people bothered about it.

[Chips Longhorn]

Oct 2, 2015 19:55:55 GMT 1 iangreaves said:

Oct 2, 2015 19:48:59 GMT 1 Captainslapper said:

Theres some good intentioned ideas and comments on this thread, but the big stumbling block is that it would only work if ALL clubs do it.
otherwise all you're achieving is to reduce HTFCs income, which means we can't afford the better players like Huws, which in turn means the team struggles, which in turn means none of these floating pay on the day fans turn up, even at the cheap prices.

It needs to be a measure across the board and properly enforced otherwise it just puts you at a big disadvantage- as our old friends the chickens are finding out.

Town's income is reducing now because increasing gate prices have driven people away.

The only way you can guarantee that our gates will not diminish is if you can guarantee a winning team... Which of course no one can guarantee... I'm not having this " style of football " nonsense... Both Buxton and Warnocks teams played " longer ball " football yet gates increased .... 28901 vs Barnsley in 81.. We got that in the equivalent of league one ...because we were on a roll ( so were they ) we were near the top ( so were they) we were winning most weeks ( ditto) and there was a massive buzz for weeks around the game..... If we had met them 3 years later in the equivalent of the championships... Man for man both teams might have been better, the styles of play might have been more progressive...the pies might have not gone up commensurate with inflation... The price of admission could have been frozen... But if it was a mid season game between two teams who had been sitting in the middle of that division for a couple of seasons the attendance wouldn't have been half that of 81.. People like to see teams that win .... But you can't guarantee that at our level

[Mecha Corte]

Oct 2, 2015 16:19:51 GMT 1 softboy said:

There seems to be a feeling on this thread that if walk up prices were around £20 we would see a reasonable increase in attendances.
Well - Forest was £15 (and we didn't) and MK Dons is £10 (and we won't).
If people really do feel that low prices are the way forward then I suggest they vote with their feet, turn up to the MK Dons game in numbers and then DH might just think "do you know what - if we do reduce prices then people will turn up" - over to us I would say.

We don't get a big take up on the odd discounted game, however look at the small chickens, how many years have they had their cheap tickets in place? 6 or 7 and during that time they've had a Wembley promotion, an FA Cup win at Chelsea and a major Cup Final appearance at Wembley ( something I've not had in 40'years and not expecting anytime soon).
The end result is they have slowly built up a crowd base, that fits with Deans model for Town and while I accept that £100 x 18,000 doesn't fund a championship challenge, there must be a happy medium say £200 or £250 season tickets x 12,000 with £20 pay on the day, no categories, no surcharges etc.

With a little bit of success and some attractive, winning football floating fans will come back, plus less empty seats = better match day atmosphere, more programmes, more half time draw tickets etc etc in addition although losing out on the 4 or 5 away teams that already fill the south stand it will get the others, Bolton, Blackburn and the like bringing more in much the same way we do at Wigan or Charlton when it's cheap.

It might not work but it's got more chance than £30.50 for Blackburn and £15 for Forest, by no means do all Town fans spend hours on Social media and websites so people hear it now costs £28 with a £3 on the day surcharge and dismiss it as too expensive, however a couple of years of cheap season tickets and £20 across the board regardless of the oppo and im convinced we will benefit.

[Captainslapper]

Oct 2, 2015 20:58:52 GMT 1 @nt said:

Oct 2, 2015 19:48:59 GMT 1 Captainslapper said:

Theres some good intentioned ideas and comments on this thread, but the big stumbling block is that it would only work if ALL clubs do it.
otherwise all you're achieving is to reduce HTFCs income, which means we can't afford the better players like Huws, which in turn means the team struggles, which in turn means none of these floating pay on the day fans turn up, even at the cheap prices.

It needs to be a measure across the board and properly enforced otherwise it just puts you at a big disadvantage- as our old friends the chickens are finding out.

What you say would be true, if you ignored the backdrop of attendance's that have been on steady decline for some time already.

If they do nothing, then Towns incone will reduce.

If they do something a bit adventurous, the might have a chance of slowing and halting that decline, and maybe even increasing income.

My worry is that as a club we are too conservative (with a small c)...we won't take the decisive action that's required, or luck will run out eventually, and we'll be a league 1 club carrying the same problem but with another couple of thousand less people bothered about it.

Its a vicious circle isn't it.
We want more fans so we reduce prices- reducing prices makes us uncompetitive- losing football means less fans...

Bradford have tried something more adventurous but are finding that their team isn't competitive even in league 1 and with many more SC holders.

There is no easy solution to the issue, but like I say, IMO it requires EVERY club to reduce prices simultaneously. Im pretty sure all the owners would rather pay their ( bang average) players far less and see their stadiums much fuller- it just needs someone to actually organise them and oversee it .

To be fair to Town ( and the other clubs id imagine) fans have the option to buy a season card which makes the cost of each game far less than this £20, and they can pay interest free over most of a year to spread the cost. Other options like the 10 game thing are available too. So 'cost' isn't a viable reason to stop going for many who have decided to not renew. They must have other reasons which have been debated many times on here such as the perception ( wrongly IMO ) that the football is duller now, or , and I suspect this is true for many of them- that Town just don't win as often now we;re not in league 1 anymore.
Not sure what the club can do about that , other than get relegated back down to a level they feel comfortable at!

So to me anyway, Town are in a very difficult position. Reducing prices won't get the crowds back if it means the team is losing. And evidence shows, winning football doesn't get the crowds back either unless I'd imagine, its so 'winning' we'd actually get up into the Prem.
Do that and stadiums full every week and we can grow the core fanbase. Maybe thats the biggest problem this club has- we've just been too long without top flight football, or even a noteworthy cup run to speak of.

[Melc]

Don't want to piss on anyone's chips but the simple fact is the season ticket holders come first,after all it is guaranteed income to the club and lets face it the fans that are doing the most moaning wont turn up if it was even a fiver!
Yes having a decent price looks good but does the club no favours if they want to try and even survive in this division let alone compete. I say get down and give the club some backing and see where we end up instead of pulling it to bits saying it is to expensive.

[Deleted]

ask not what our club can do for you, ask what you can do for our club.     UTT    HTID

[Deleted]

"I say get down and give the club some backing and see where we end up instead of pulling it to bits saying it is to expensive."

"ask not what our club can do for you, ask what you can do for our club"

Here lies the problem among those who don't recognise the problem - there is more to life than football and Huddersfield Town. People can and will choose to spend their money and time elsewhere if they feel that what they pay for doesn't represent value for money. Is paying £30+ on the gate value for money? No.

[brighousebandbred]

Melc your saying fans won't turn up if it was £5 look after us season ticket holders don't worry about losing the others, the pay on the dayers are decreasing that's why attendances are dropping. The major reason they are staying away is the price, it is not a competition on who are the best fans , season ticket holders or others. If pay on the dayers stop coming because many think it's too expensive, the club loses out on essential revenue. Don't attack the pay on the dayers for not coming, when we are on here telling u one of the main reasons why we are not coming ITS TOO MUCH MONEY. The club needs to attract its supporters simples, not put them off from turning up.

[Deleted]

Oct 2, 2015 23:41:37 GMT 1 Captainslapper said:

Oct 2, 2015 20:58:52 GMT 1 @nt said:

What you say would be true, if you ignored the backdrop of attendance's that have been on steady decline for some time already.

If they do nothing, then Towns incone will reduce.

If they do something a bit adventurous, the might have a chance of slowing and halting that decline, and maybe even increasing income.

My worry is that as a club we are too conservative (with a small c)...we won't take the decisive action that's required, or luck will run out eventually, and we'll be a league 1 club carrying the same problem but with another couple of thousand less people bothered about it.

Its a vicious circle isn't it.
We want more fans so we reduce prices- reducing prices makes us uncompetitive- losing football means less fans...

Bradford have tried something more adventurous but are finding that their team isn't competitive even in league 1 and with many more SC holders.

There is no easy solution to the issue, but like I say, IMO it requires EVERY club to reduce prices simultaneously. Im pretty sure all the owners would rather pay their ( bang average) players far less and see their stadiums much fuller- it just needs someone to actually organise them and oversee it .

To be fair to Town ( and the other clubs id imagine) fans have the option to buy a season card which makes the cost of each game far less than this £20, and they can pay interest free over most of a year to spread the cost. Other options like the 10 game thing are available too. So 'cost' isn't a viable reason to stop going for many who have decided to not renew. They must have other reasons which have been debated many times on here such as the perception ( wrongly IMO ) that the football is duller now, or , and I suspect this is true for many of them- that Town just don't win as often now we;re not in league 1 anymore.
Not sure what the club can do about that , other than get relegated back down to a level they feel comfortable at!

So to me anyway, Town are in a very difficult position. Reducing prices won't get the crowds back if it means the team is losing. And evidence shows, winning football doesn't get the crowds back either unless I'd imagine, its so 'winning' we'd actually get up into the Prem.
Do that and stadiums full every week and we can grow the core fanbase. Maybe thats the biggest problem this club has- we've just been too long without top flight football, or even a noteworthy cup run to speak of.

It is indeed a vicious circle.

But the important point is that attendance's are ALREADY falling and have been since we joined the Championship.

Reducing prices may not "get the crowds back". But what will " doing nothing " (slight trickle rise on the gate and £25 off the price of a season ticket) do?

Where the club is now it's not really about increasing revenue or increasing crowds, its about halting a dangerous decline.

Men like Dean Hoyle don't stand by and watch their customer base shrink and do nothing about it.

[colnevalleyblue]

Oct 3, 2015 8:14:00 GMT 1 brighousebandbred said:

Melc your saying fans won't turn up if it was £5 look after us season ticket holders don't worry about losing the others, the pay on the dayers are decreasing that's why attendances are dropping. The major reason they are staying away is the price, it is not a competition on who are the best fans , season ticket holders or others. If pay on the dayers stop coming because many think it's too expensive, the club loses out on essential revenue. Don't attack the pay on the dayers for not coming, when we are on here telling u one of the main reasons why we are not coming ITS TOO MUCH MONEY. The club needs to attract its supporters simples, not put them off from turning up.

Out of interest and please don't take this the wrong and, honest answers only are you going down to the MK game at £10 entry? If you are, are you going with other POTD people? How often have they been this season?
If you aren't going could you say why?

[iangreaves]

Oct 3, 2015 1:14:38 GMT 1 @t26 said:

"I say get down and give the club some backing and see where we end up instead of pulling it to bits saying it is to expensive."

"ask not what our club can do for you, ask what you can do for our club"

Here lies the problem among those who don't recognise the problem - there is more to life than football and Huddersfield Town. People can and will choose to spend their money and time elsewhere if they feel that what they pay for doesn't represent value for money. Is paying £30+ on the gate value for money? No.

The big worry ought to be that once someone has broken the habit of going they won't go back. Any sales/marketing type will tell you it's much easier to keep an existing customer than to try to get them back once they have gone. The club is now probably looking at damage limitation. 'How do we stop even more walking away?"

[Deleted]

Oct 3, 2015 0:36:01 GMT 1 Melc said:

Don't want to piss on anyone's chips but the simple fact is the season ticket holders come first,after all it is guaranteed income to the club and lets face it the fans that are doing the most moaning wont turn up if it was even a fiver!
Yes having a decent price looks good but does the club no favours if they want to try and even survive in this division let alone compete. I say get down and give the club some backing and see where we end up instead of pulling it to bits saying it is to expensive.

What you're missing is that season ticket holders are declining and how do you create new season ticket holders?

Either they're completely new, or, they're occasional fans that you make code through the gate regularly enough that they have a reason to become one.

Bear in mind that those paying on the gate are typically paying double what a season ticket holder does, assuming we get 8000 season ticket holders next season, ignoring or disenfranchising the 3000 (equivalent to 6000 season ticket holders in revenue terms) walk up for each game would be a huge mistake.

The season ticket holders are already in. When they don't renew its largely for reasons the club can't influence. "New kid / new wife / new job / no job / lost interest / moved house / friends stopped going / kids grew up "

[Deleted]

Oct 3, 2015 8:18:18 GMT 1 colnevalleyblue said:

Oct 3, 2015 8:14:00 GMT 1 brighousebandbred said:

Melc your saying fans won't turn up if it was £5 look after us season ticket holders don't worry about losing the others, the pay on the dayers are decreasing that's why attendances are dropping. The major reason they are staying away is the price, it is not a competition on who are the best fans , season ticket holders or others. If pay on the dayers stop coming because many think it's too expensive, the club loses out on essential revenue. Don't attack the pay on the dayers for not coming, when we are on here telling u one of the main reasons why we are not coming ITS TOO MUCH MONEY. The club needs to attract its supporters simples, not put them off from turning up.

Out of interest and please don't take this the wrong and, honest answers only are you going down to the MK game at £10 entry? If you are, are you going with other POTD people? How often have they been this season?
If you aren't going could you say why?

I'll answer for me.

I don't do Tuesday games as I have one kid in gymnastics and one kid in athletics, both finishing at 8pm, and 15 miles apart. Not going to MK for that reason.

They come ahead of Town.

I've been to two home games this season (of the three I could have gone to).

I'll be at Derby game (the next Sat home game) but probably not again until Preston (and that's a doubt depending on where we end up over Christmas).

I'll prob do similar number after Christmas through to end of season.

I usually bring one other pay on day with me, and meet up with 2 or 3 season ticket holders.

[rocky]

Oct 2, 2015 19:40:01 GMT 1 artysid said:

This may not be a good analogy (or maybe it is) but I like to eat fish and chips everytime I come back up home,
but if I went into a fish shop and the owner said

“Sorry but you’re not a regular like that bloke over there who comes in every week, so the cost will be double to you, and by the way if you didn’t ring up to pre-order that's an extra couple of quid on top too.”

I‘d walk out.

It's not always double though is it? For both the last game & the next one, the POTD price is cheaper than the price paid for the same games by SC holders.

[rocky]

Oct 2, 2015 20:51:15 GMT 1 @t26 said:

Oct 2, 2015 17:07:26 GMT 1 rocky said:

Maybe, but if enough people took advantage of what offers are actually available, it might encourage the club to do what you suggest. Why can't sufficient people turn up v MK on a Tuesday night for the offer a success? (There will obviously be some who can't do a night match, but the majority will be able to).

It's like some fans are trying to lay down conditions to the club. 'Nah, I can't be arsed if it's a tenner on a Tuesday night, but I might consider it on a Saturday & oh, make sure it's against good opposition'!

Everyone knows how hard it is for club's like Town in the Championship & some fans need to get back to actually supporting the club, rather than thinking of reasons not to.

And here lies the problem, the floating fans aren't being listened to.

I, like many, can't dedicate every Saturday to watching the football team I support. I choose to play cricket and my career path means that Saturday's aren't necessarily free, in fact many people don't work 9-5 mon-fri anymore. These are genuine reasons - many will have them. I as a floating fan have to pay double what the ST pays, is that fair? No. Will I pay it? No.

Some people commute to work to, some Town fans even live in other cities. Tuesday nights are a pain in the arse compared to Saturday's when you're replying on trains etc to get you home. I said this earlier in the thread - imagine getting back from Manchester or wherever at 7pm after a long day - do you go watch football eating a rancid pie and drinking overpriced piss or go home for a home cooked tea? 

When will I part with my money to watch my football club? When it's cheaper and represents value for money. So on the 20th when my freinds are watching Town I'm going to do something else with the £33.50 the club think it's ok to charge. And criticising fans who chose not to pay their hard earned cash for their own reasons isn't the way to encourage them to return.

Oh and I support the club, just not the way it's currently being run in regards to pricing.

This is exactly what I mean when I say people are laying down their own conditions to the club. I don't see how you can claim to support the club, then chose not to go.

So you can't go to every game. Fair enough, that's what Take 10 was designed for. Why can't you get one of those?

Citing shit quality catering in the stadium is nothing to do with it. I've had a SC for donkey's years, but I haven't spent a cent in the ground on catering for more than a decade.

On the 20th, it's not £33.50 as you said, it's only £10. That's more than 40% less than I've paid for the same game as a SC holder! Anybody complaining about ticket prices who choses not to go against MK loses all credibility in my book (that excludes of course, anyone who has a genuine reason why they can't go).

As I said, I've had a SC for a long time, yet I never see every game. I miss 4 or 5 every season yet I buy a SC knowing that. Why? Because I support the club & SC sales are the life blood of it.

I accept individual ticket prices for some games are way too high, but there's any number of offers on which people seem happy to ignore. Too many people (this is not necessarily directed at you), seem to have the attitude 'fuck em, I'll only go on my terms'. If we all did that, the club would go out of existence.

[Deleted]

Oct 3, 2015 10:13:15 GMT 1 rocky said:

Oct 2, 2015 20:51:15 GMT 1 @t26 said:

And here lies the problem, the floating fans aren't being listened to.

I, like many, can't dedicate every Saturday to watching the football team I support. I choose to play cricket and my career path means that Saturday's aren't necessarily free, in fact many people don't work 9-5 mon-fri anymore. These are genuine reasons - many will have them. I as a floating fan have to pay double what the ST pays, is that fair? No. Will I pay it? No.

Some people commute to work to, some Town fans even live in other cities. Tuesday nights are a pain in the arse compared to Saturday's when you're replying on trains etc to get you home. I said this earlier in the thread - imagine getting back from Manchester or wherever at 7pm after a long day - do you go watch football eating a rancid pie and drinking overpriced piss or go home for a home cooked tea? 

When will I part with my money to watch my football club? When it's cheaper and represents value for money. So on the 20th when my freinds are watching Town I'm going to do something else with the £33.50 the club think it's ok to charge. And criticising fans who chose not to pay their hard earned cash for their own reasons isn't the way to encourage them to return.

Oh and I support the club, just not the way it's currently being run in regards to pricing.

This is exactly what I mean when I say people are laying down their own conditions to the club. I don't see how you can claim to support the club, then chose not to go.

So you can't go to every game. Fair enough, that's what Take 10 was designed for. Why can't you get one of those?

Citing shit quality catering in the stadium is nothing to do with it. I've had a SC for donkey's years, but I haven't spent a cent in the ground on catering for more than a decade.

On the 20th, it's not £33.50 as you said, it's only £10. That's more than 40% less than I've paid for the same game as a SC holder! Anybody complaining about ticket prices who choses not to go against MK loses all credibility in my book (that excludes of course, anyone who has a genuine reason why they can't go).

As I said, I've had a SC for a long time, yet I never see every game. I miss 4 or 5 every season yet I buy a SC knowing that. Why? Because I support the club & SC sales are the life blood of it.

I accept individual ticket prices for some games are way too high, but there's any number of offers on which people seem happy to ignore. Too many people (this is not necessarily directed at you), seem to have the attitude 'fuck em, I'll only go on my terms'. If we all did that, the club would go out of existence.

You don't get it, Do you ?

[Deleted]

Oct 3, 2015 8:23:29 GMT 1 iangreaves said:

Oct 3, 2015 1:14:38 GMT 1 @t26 said:

"I say get down and give the club some backing and see where we end up instead of pulling it to bits saying it is to expensive."

"ask not what our club can do for you, ask what you can do for our club"

Here lies the problem among those who don't recognise the problem - there is more to life than football and Huddersfield Town. People can and will choose to spend their money and time elsewhere if they feel that what they pay for doesn't represent value for money. Is paying £30+ on the gate value for money? No.

The big worry ought to be that once someone has broken the habit of going they won't go back. Any sales/marketing type will tell you it's much easier to keep an existing customer than to try to get them back once they have gone. The club is now probably looking at damage limitation. 'How do we stop even more walking away?"

It'll be interesting to know how many fans stop going at 18 for uni and then actually return. I'd suggest 5/6 years ago that number not coming back after uni would be lower than now because of the way Clibbens alienated that segment of fan base.

Equally, they should be ringing every single fan who doesn't renew and asking them why. I know they rang a few who didn't renew after the season before last but they may just get more of an insight if they regularly contact the fans.

[rocky]

Oct 3, 2015 10:22:36 GMT 1 @q8402984 said:

Oct 3, 2015 10:13:15 GMT 1 rocky said:

This is exactly what I mean when I say people are laying down their own conditions to the club. I don't see how you can claim to support the club, then chose not to go.

So you can't go to every game. Fair enough, that's what Take 10 was designed for. Why can't you get one of those?

Citing shit quality catering in the stadium is nothing to do with it. I've had a SC for donkey's years, but I haven't spent a cent in the ground on catering for more than a decade.

On the 20th, it's not £33.50 as you said, it's only £10. That's more than 40% less than I've paid for the same game as a SC holder! Anybody complaining about ticket prices who choses not to go against MK loses all credibility in my book (that excludes of course, anyone who has a genuine reason why they can't go).

As I said, I've had a SC for a long time, yet I never see every game. I miss 4 or 5 every season yet I buy a SC knowing that. Why? Because I support the club & SC sales are the life blood of it.

I accept individual ticket prices for some games are way too high, but there's any number of offers on which people seem happy to ignore. Too many people (this is not necessarily directed at you), seem to have the attitude 'fuck em, I'll only go on my terms'. If we all did that, the club would go out of existence.

You don't get it, Do you ?

Apparently not according to you, even though I've already said some ticket prices are way too high. 

Go on then, enlighten me.

[Deleted]

Oct 3, 2015 10:13:15 GMT 1 rocky said:

Oct 2, 2015 20:51:15 GMT 1 @t26 said:

And here lies the problem, the floating fans aren't being listened to.

I, like many, can't dedicate every Saturday to watching the football team I support. I choose to play cricket and my career path means that Saturday's aren't necessarily free, in fact many people don't work 9-5 mon-fri anymore. These are genuine reasons - many will have them. I as a floating fan have to pay double what the ST pays, is that fair? No. Will I pay it? No.

Some people commute to work to, some Town fans even live in other cities. Tuesday nights are a pain in the arse compared to Saturday's when you're replying on trains etc to get you home. I said this earlier in the thread - imagine getting back from Manchester or wherever at 7pm after a long day - do you go watch football eating a rancid pie and drinking overpriced piss or go home for a home cooked tea? 

When will I part with my money to watch my football club? When it's cheaper and represents value for money. So on the 20th when my freinds are watching Town I'm going to do something else with the £33.50 the club think it's ok to charge. And criticising fans who chose not to pay their hard earned cash for their own reasons isn't the way to encourage them to return.

Oh and I support the club, just not the way it's currently being run in regards to pricing.

This is exactly what I mean when I say people are laying down their own conditions to the club. I don't see how you can claim to support the club, then chose not to go.

So you can't go to every game. Fair enough, that's what Take 10 was designed for. Why can't you get one of those?

Citing shit quality catering in the stadium is nothing to do with it. I've had a SC for donkey's years, but I haven't spent a cent in the ground on catering for more than a decade.

On the 20th, it's not £33.50 as you said, it's only £10. That's more than 40% less than I've paid for the same game as a SC holder! Anybody complaining about ticket prices who choses not to go against MK loses all credibility in my book (that excludes of course, anyone who has a genuine reason why they can't go).

As I said, I've had a SC for a long time, yet I never see every game. I miss 4 or 5 every season yet I buy a SC knowing that. Why? Because I support the club & SC sales are the life blood of it.

I accept individual ticket prices for some games are way too high, but there's any number of offers on which people seem happy to ignore. Too many people (this is not necessarily directed at you), seem to have the attitude 'fuck em, I'll only go on my terms'. If we all did that, the club would go out of existence.

I do apologise, I got my dates mixed up.

Derby County (h) is £33.50 to sit in the same stand as my friends who pay £15.20 a game. That is a 120% increase - is that fair? No. Will I pay it? No. Will I go to the MK Dons game, yes. I'd go if it was £20.

I am not laying down any conditions to the club, they are in fact laying down conditions to pay on the day fans and charging a price for something that I and many others deem not value for money. I chose not to spend the little money I have as disposable income on £33.50. I cannot dedicate every Saturday/Tuesday to the club I support due to work commitments and the fact I would rather play sport as I'm in my 20's.

And choosing not to go because of the high prices means I don't support the club? Two words for you and the second one is off.

I say I make 7/8 home games a season these days - sometimes less, sometimes more. I don't want to pay into the Take10 when I may not get any value for money from it.

But again we're going in circles and I really do suspect some posters on here, as Captain Cadman says, don't get it - like yourself. If you run a business and customers are declining you try and address the issue, not simply go to customers should put your money into the business that you are supposed to support. Like it or not - Football is a business. Like it or not - Fans are customers. They vote with their feet and in declining attendances they are saying the football's not been good enough and the prices are too high.

[Deleted]

Having the first home game of this season at over £30 on the day, has probably cost the club an absolute fortune.

How many pay on the dayers turned up, a couple of thousand?

If they price had been £28 then the club would have been down by about £7 grand (approximately)

Now if you divide that £7K by a ticket price of £28 you get a number of 250.

I'll guarantee that the decision to push the price over £30 has already cost us way more than 250 ticket sales in the first few opening games of the season.

[Deleted]

Oct 3, 2015 10:55:14 GMT 1 @billynomates said:

Having the first home game of this season at over £30 on the day, has probably cost the club an absolute fortune.

How many pay on the dayers turned up, a couple of thousand?

If they price had been £28 then the club would have been down by about £7 grand (approximately)

Now if you divide that £7K by a ticket price of £28 you get a number of 250.

I'll guarantee that the decision to push the price over £30 has already cost us way more than 250 ticket sales in the first few opening games of the season.

I know a few lads, some who support Town some who just like watching football who went down one week when cricket was rained off - saw the price and went for a few beers instead.

[brighousebandbred]

You asked earlier would I be going to the mkdons game, genuinely don't know at this moment I like to chose often on the day if I attend games, but saying that the price did make me decide to go to the forest game, so if I'm wanting near the day to go the price will against mkdons will make it a definite on the day. Where as I've already committed in my head to never pay £30 plus to watch town this season maybe apart from Leeds or a major importance game.

[rocky]

Oct 3, 2015 10:46:47 GMT 1 @t26 said:

Oct 3, 2015 10:13:15 GMT 1 rocky said:

This is exactly what I mean when I say people are laying down their own conditions to the club. I don't see how you can claim to support the club, then chose not to go.

So you can't go to every game. Fair enough, that's what Take 10 was designed for. Why can't you get one of those?

Citing shit quality catering in the stadium is nothing to do with it. I've had a SC for donkey's years, but I haven't spent a cent in the ground on catering for more than a decade.

On the 20th, it's not £33.50 as you said, it's only £10. That's more than 40% less than I've paid for the same game as a SC holder! Anybody complaining about ticket prices who choses not to go against MK loses all credibility in my book (that excludes of course, anyone who has a genuine reason why they can't go).

As I said, I've had a SC for a long time, yet I never see every game. I miss 4 or 5 every season yet I buy a SC knowing that. Why? Because I support the club & SC sales are the life blood of it.

I accept individual ticket prices for some games are way too high, but there's any number of offers on which people seem happy to ignore. Too many people (this is not necessarily directed at you), seem to have the attitude 'fuck em, I'll only go on my terms'. If we all did that, the club would go out of existence.

I do apologise, I got my dates mixed up.

Derby County (h) is £33.50 to sit in the same stand as my friends who pay £15.20 a game. That is a 120% increase - is that fair? No. Will I pay it? No. Will I go to the MK Dons game, yes. I'd go if it was £20.

I am not laying down any conditions to the club, they are in fact laying down conditions to pay on the day fans and charging a price for something that I and many others deem not value for money. I chose not to spend the little money I have as disposable income on £33.50. I cannot dedicate every Saturday/Tuesday to the club I support due to work commitments and the fact I would rather play sport as I'm in my 20's.

And choosing not to go because of the high prices means I don't support the club? Two words for you and the second one is off.

I say I make 7/8 home games a season these days - sometimes less, sometimes more. I don't want to pay into the Take10 when I may not get any value for money from it.

But again we're going in circles and I really do suspect some posters on here, as Captain Cadman says, don't get it - like yourself. If you run a business and customers are declining you try and address the issue, not simply go to customers should put your money into the business that you are supposed to support. Like it or not - Football is a business. Like it or not - Fans are customers. They vote with their feet and in declining attendances they are saying the football's not been good enough and the prices are too high.

Yeah, we're never going to agree on this, but I can't see why you wouldn't get a Take 10, based on your attendance record. Anyone seeing all 10 gets in free for 2 & a bit games compared to POTD, so you only need to see your average number of games to break even. If you see more, you'll be in front, less & you'll lose out a bit, but overall you'd probably be no worse off.

The club are clearly trying to address the price issue, but it's an evolving process & there are currently solutions available for most situations. My view is that I think more people should support the initiatives currently in place.



 

[Captainslapper]

Oct 3, 2015 8:17:38 GMT 1 @nt said:

It is indeed a vicious circle.

But the important point is that attendance's are ALREADY falling and have been since we joined the Championship.

Reducing prices may not "get the crowds back". But what will " doing nothing " (slight trickle rise on the gate and £25 off the price of a season ticket) do?

Where the club is now it's not really about increasing revenue or increasing crowds, its about halting a dangerous decline.

Men like Dean Hoyle don't stand by and watch their customer base shrink and do nothing about it.

Id imagine Dean Hoyles attitude would be that the club ARE doing something about it- they're establishing themselves as a championship club for the first time in a long while and gradually moving up the division year after year.
People don't seem to want to give them any credit for that.

What you seem to be wanting is for Dh to finance that improvement on the pitch AND also at the same time cover the costs of the apathetic support this area has for a championship club.
It should be a 2 way street, but it all seems very 1 way to me.

Theyve already given fans the chance to watch every game for £16.50 per game through season cards AND for those that can't make that many fixtures, the chance to watch the 10 most attractive ones for about £25 a game if they want to cherry pick.
Theyve made our individual pay on the door prices one of the cheapest in the division.

So i think its unfair to say they aren't trying to do something about it.

If it isn't enough ( and ok it seems it isn't) then it once again boils down to DH dipping in his pockets even more than he already is- isn't that unfair if anything is?
At what point do you point the finger at the people of Hudds and surrounding areas and say 'YOU don't deserve a championship club!'

I have great sympathy for anyone who can't afford to watch his team, but its a wider football problem that can only be addressed in a wider football way.

[Deleted]

The club need to do something radical here.

The last time they did was the centenary offer, that gave us the boost in season ticket sales that carried through for a few years, but that has now tailed off.

Its no good saying "A winning team will bring the fans back", we (the club) have to devise a policy that will reverse the trend based on our form over the last few seasons, cos we're more than likely going to be continuing to compete around the mid to lower end of the table. If we do manage to develop a team that's winning regularly, than that has to be seen as a bonus, rather than something we are reliant on.

If it was up to me.

Keep the season ticket prices as they are - I don't see too many complaints from SC holders on price.

Ditch categorisation.

Base match day prices on SC price +40% - that would mean a price of about £22 in the popular areas.

Ditch offers. 8500 home fans against Forest. The offer didn't really work.

Offer anybody purchasing 16 or more match day tickets in a season, the chance of early bird renewal prices on a season card for the following season (They'll have spent the equivelant of a SC at 16 games.

That's it.

Straight forward, sensible pricing. No gimmicks, no stealth charges, just open and honest pricing.

[Deleted]

Oct 3, 2015 10:55:14 GMT 1 @billynomates said:

Having the first home game of this season at over £30 on the day, has probably cost the club an absolute fortune.

How many pay on the dayers turned up, a couple of thousand?

If they price had been £28 then the club would have been down by about £7 grand (approximately)

Now if you divide that £7K by a ticket price of £28 you get a number of 250.

I'll guarantee that the decision to push the price over £30 has already cost us way more than 250 ticket sales in the first few opening games of the season.

This, all day long.

[Deleted]

Oct 3, 2015 11:23:54 GMT 1 @billynomates said:

The club need to do something radical here.

The last time they did was the centenary offer, that gave us the boost in season ticket sales that carried through for a few years, but that has now tailed off.

Its no good saying "A winning team will bring the fans back", we (the club) have to devise a policy that will reverse the trend based on our form over the last few seasons, cos we're more than likely going to be continuing to compete around the mid to lower end of the table. If we do manage to develop a team that's winning regularly, than that has to be seen as a bonus, rather than something we are reliant on.

If it was up to me.

Keep the season ticket prices as they are - I don't see too many complaints from SC holders on price.

Ditch categorisation.

Base match day prices on SC price +40% - that would mean a price of about £22 in the popular areas.

Ditch offers. 8500 home fans against Forest. The offer didn't really work.

Offer anybody purchasing 16 or more match day tickets in a season, the chance of early bird renewal prices on a season card for the following season (They'll have spent the equivelant of a SC at 16 games.

That's it.

Straight forward, sensible pricing. No gimmicks, no stealth charges, just open and honest pricing.

Think that's a straight forward and fair way of pricing it. However, I also think it would have virtually no impact on attendances.

As you say, when we've had one off offers, there has been no real increase on how many come. If people were put off going purely by the price, then surely they'd be straight down when it was only a tenner? That's not the case and I think it's just total guess work to say floaters would come if it were priced somewhere between £20/25 on the gate for every game.

We proved with the £100 offer and Bradford have done with their offer that big increases in ST sales can be achieved. Obviously we couldn't afford to go that low again, but somewhere around £250 seems manageable and would be an attractive offer. Either way, it'd have to be a substantial reduction, as I can't see anyone being too enticed by, say, a 10% reduction. As DH hinted at, we could push this from Jan as well.

Once people stop getting a ST, it becomes easier to stop going altogether, we need to get them back into the habit. 

[Deleted]

Oct 2, 2015 20:51:15 GMT 1 @t26 said:

Oct 2, 2015 17:07:26 GMT 1 rocky said:

Maybe, but if enough people took advantage of what offers are actually available, it might encourage the club to do what you suggest. Why can't sufficient people turn up v MK on a Tuesday night for the offer a success? (There will obviously be some who can't do a night match, but the majority will be able to).

It's like some fans are trying to lay down conditions to the club. 'Nah, I can't be arsed if it's a tenner on a Tuesday night, but I might consider it on a Saturday & oh, make sure it's against good opposition'!

Everyone knows how hard it is for club's like Town in the Championship & some fans need to get back to actually supporting the club, rather than thinking of reasons not to.

And here lies the problem, the floating fans aren't being listened to.

I, like many, can't dedicate every Saturday to watching the football team I support. I choose to play cricket and my career path means that Saturday's aren't necessarily free, in fact many people don't work 9-5 mon-fri anymore. These are genuine reasons - many will have them. I as a floating fan have to pay double what the ST pays, is that fair? No. Will I pay it? No.

Some people commute to work to, some Town fans even live in other cities. Tuesday nights are a pain in the arse compared to Saturday's when you're replying on trains etc to get you home. I said this earlier in the thread - imagine getting back from Manchester or wherever at 7pm after a long day - do you go watch football eating a rancid pie and drinking overpriced piss or go home for a home cooked tea? 

When will I part with my money to watch my football club? When it's cheaper and represents value for money. So on the 20th when my freinds are watching Town I'm going to do something else with the £33.50 the club think it's ok to charge. And criticising fans who chose not to pay their hard earned cash for their own reasons isn't the way to encourage them to return.

Oh and I support the club, just not the way it's currently being run in regards to pricing.

So if it were £20 a game, you'd stop playing cricket, being in a job that requires you to work weekends and isn't located far away from Huddersfield? I'm guessing not, so it wouldn't really have much of an impact on how many games you attend, or anyone in a similar situation, would it? That's not to say I think £33.50 pay on the gate is a fair price, it clearly isn't, but if we're looking at ways to increase how many we get through the gate, then this is a good example of why I don't think charging £20 would have much impact.

[Deleted]

Oct 3, 2015 11:42:49 GMT 1 @waltersobchak said:

Oct 3, 2015 11:23:54 GMT 1 @billynomates said:

The club need to do something radical here.

The last time they did was the centenary offer, that gave us the boost in season ticket sales that carried through for a few years, but that has now tailed off.

Its no good saying "A winning team will bring the fans back", we (the club) have to devise a policy that will reverse the trend based on our form over the last few seasons, cos we're more than likely going to be continuing to compete around the mid to lower end of the table. If we do manage to develop a team that's winning regularly, than that has to be seen as a bonus, rather than something we are reliant on.

If it was up to me.

Keep the season ticket prices as they are - I don't see too many complaints from SC holders on price.

Ditch categorisation.

Base match day prices on SC price +40% - that would mean a price of about £22 in the popular areas.

Ditch offers. 8500 home fans against Forest. The offer didn't really work.

Offer anybody purchasing 16 or more match day tickets in a season, the chance of early bird renewal prices on a season card for the following season (They'll have spent the equivelant of a SC at 16 games.

That's it.

Straight forward, sensible pricing. No gimmicks, no stealth charges, just open and honest pricing.

Think that's a straight forward and fair way of pricing it. However, I also think it would have virtually no impact on attendances.

As you say, when we've had one off offers, there has been no real increase on how many come. If people were put off going purely by the price, then surely they'd be straight down when it was only a tenner? That's not the case and I think it's just total guess work to say floaters would come if it were priced somewhere between £20/25 on the gate for every game.

We proved with the £100 offer and Bradford have done with their offer that big increases in ST sales can be achieved. Obviously we couldn't afford to go that low again, but somewhere around £250 seems manageable and would be an attractive offer. Either way, it'd have to be a substantial reduction, as I can't see anyone being too enticed by, say, a 10% reduction. As DH hinted at, we could push this from Jan as well.

Once people stop getting a ST, it becomes easier to stop going altogether, we need to get them back into the habit. 

Don't forget, we're in a downward trend at the moment, so stopping that trend would be seen as a positive.

It'd be interesting to see some figures as to what the average adult pay on the day price was last season including all the offers/vouchers etc. My guess is it wouldn't be too far from the £20-£25 range.

[Deleted]

Oct 3, 2015 11:20:40 GMT 1 Captainslapper said:

Oct 3, 2015 8:17:38 GMT 1 @nt said:

It is indeed a vicious circle.

But the important point is that attendance's are ALREADY falling and have been since we joined the Championship.

Reducing prices may not "get the crowds back". But what will " doing nothing " (slight trickle rise on the gate and £25 off the price of a season ticket) do?

Where the club is now it's not really about increasing revenue or increasing crowds, its about halting a dangerous decline.

Men like Dean Hoyle don't stand by and watch their customer base shrink and do nothing about it.

Id imagine Dean Hoyles attitude would be that the club ARE doing something about it- they're establishing themselves as a championship club for the first time in a long while and gradually moving up the division year after year.
People don't seem to want to give them any credit for that.

What you seem to be wanting is for Dh to finance that improvement on the pitch AND also at the same time cover the costs of the apathetic support this area has for a championship club.
It should be a 2 way street, but it all seems very 1 way to me.

Theyve already given fans the chance to watch every game for £16.50 per game through season cards AND for those that can't make that many fixtures, the chance to watch the 10 most attractive ones for about £25 a game if they want to cherry pick.
Theyve made our individual pay on the door prices one of the cheapest in the division.

So i think its unfair to say they aren't trying to do something about it.

If it isn't enough ( and ok it seems it isn't) then it once again boils down to DH dipping in his pockets even more than he already is- isn't that unfair if anything is?
At what point do you point the finger at the people of Hudds and surrounding areas and say 'YOU don't deserve a championship club!'

I have great sympathy for anyone who can't afford to watch his team, but its a wider football problem that can only be addressed in a wider football way.

Why on earth do you (and others not prepared to understand why attendance's are dwindling) always jump on the "you're expecting Dean to put more in to cover your own lack of support" line?

It's rubbish. I don't expect or want Dean to put more in, in fact I'd feel a lot better about the club if Dean didn't have to put ANYTHING in.

What I want is for the club to take the radical action to protect the income they have and start to look towards potential growth... Rather than go, "I/we threw a load of cash at getting into and staying in this league, now come along and pay for it to help us stay there"


Nobody asked for, or demands a Championship club (other in fact, than Dean!), and as an "average fan" i'm sure like others, the league that Town play in is largely irrelevant and it would seem to be incredibly naive to build a business plan seemingly on assumed increased attendance's...given how predictable Towns support is, it's not as though we're like Preston (a similar club with similar fan base and similar distant memory of success) swinging from 5000 fans one week to 12000 the next.