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Post by Sugy , Paignton Devon Terrier on Feb 17, 2021 12:08:50 GMT 1
Surely Hoyle would have realised as a successful business man that is 25% stake return could be under threat when he took parachute money out of the club which was vital at the time for team rebuilding.
The club is under threat of going down the Sunderland route ,and cant see 11,000 season tickets being sold next season if treating fans as mugs.
Its usually the fans who end up paying the price for failure
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iangreaves
Jimmy Glazzard Terrier
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Post by iangreaves on Feb 17, 2021 12:12:00 GMT 1
Surely Hoyle would have realised as a successful business man that is 25% stake return could be under threat when he took parachute money out of the club which was vital at the time for team rebuilding. The club is under threat of going down the Sunderland route ,and cant see 11,000 season tickets being sold next season if treating fans as mugs.
It could be worse than that - it could be the Town 1970s route, which I recall all too painfully.
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Post by Sugy , Paignton Devon Terrier on Feb 17, 2021 12:12:58 GMT 1
Surely Hoyle would have realised as a successful business man that is 25% stake return could be under threat when he took parachute money out of the club which was vital at the time for team rebuilding. The club is under threat of going down the Sunderland route ,and cant see 11,000 season tickets being sold next season if treating fans as mugs.
It could be worse than that - it could be the Town 1970s route, which I recall all too painfully. Was there to as in footballing terms was like the road to hell and certainly a test of time
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Post by dynastydan on Feb 17, 2021 12:28:10 GMT 1
Aabsokute bollocks. Sick and tired of people using his illness as an excuse. Is DH the only businessman to fall ill? Does pancreatitis affect your decision to sell to an absolute moron? Abuse towards their running of the club and how the sale happened is deserved. Abuse towards them or families, I agree, is out of order. They are 2 crooks who have absolutely ruined our club. Majority of fans work hard all week to earn the money for SC and merchandise etc for these 2 to basically laugh at us whilst lining their own pockets.I for one have struggled by this season and the £250 I paid could have gone elsewhere. What is this clown PH going to do about my SC next season? Unless it's free as I have paid for a service and recieved nothing so want another in return m, I'm done. I cant wait for PH to shit his pants when only around 3 or 4 thousand renew. Congratulations. In amongst all the infantile entitlement and tantruming, that has to be the single most stupid comment yet. Libellous , inaccurate and stupid all in one go So are you saying that people dont work hard all week to be able to get a SC etc? I know I do. And it really has pissed me off this season the way the club has gone. They dont deserve my money anymore. Why should I give my hard earned cash to them anymore? My children and family deserve it more. It's not a tantrum, it's real life. So unless.your some prawn sandwich pompous person, you would not understand.
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Post by dynastydan on Feb 17, 2021 12:33:02 GMT 1
Aabsokute bollocks. Sick and tired of people using his illness as an excuse. Is DH the only businessman to fall ill? Does pancreatitis affect your decision to sell to an absolute moron? Abuse towards their running of the club and how the sale happened is deserved. Abuse towards them or families, I agree, is out of order. They are 2 crooks who have absolutely ruined our club. Majority of fans work hard all week to earn the money for SC and merchandise etc for these 2 to basically laugh at us whilst lining their own pockets. I for one have struggled by this season and the £250 I paid could have gone elsewhere. What is this clown PH going to do about my SC next season? Unless it's free as I have paid for a service and recieved nothing so want another in return m, I'm done. I cant wait for PH to shit his pants when only around 3 or 4 thousand renew. This is the type of post I am referring to. You have no idea but think it is your God given right to spout off anyway. I have a friend who had the same thing. He was weeks on ICU, as was Dean, and took probably a year to recover and has not got back to his pre-illness health. You literally have no clue. I do have a clue. I dont think it is my god given right to spout off at all. You dont know me, but I tell you what you fucking moron, I have had worse than what DH has had. So dont even start with that. I didn't say his illness wasnt bad or the recovery isnt long. I am saying it's sad that it is used an excuse. It is really sick and twisted that it is used as an excuse. Also, its fans using it as an excuse, I never said this has come from DH. The bottom line is. DH fucked us over with how he has acted during and since the takeover. And PH has just drip fed lie after lie.
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Post by Farsley Terrier (UK product) on Feb 17, 2021 12:34:56 GMT 1
Surely Hoyle would have realised as a successful business man that is 25% stake return could be under threat when he took parachute money out of the club which was vital at the time for team rebuilding. The club is under threat of going down the Sunderland route ,and cant see 11,000 season tickets being sold next season if treating fans as mugs. Its usually the fans who end up paying the price for failureor employees...
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Post by oldrain on Feb 17, 2021 12:46:45 GMT 1
Need to get deadwood on the bench for Swansea (Campbell, Bacuna, O’Brien, Pritchard, Holmes plus keeper that can command his area further than 3 yards) replaced by Phillips Rowe Daly Thomas Brown plus new keeper UTT
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Post by bluesandtwos on Feb 17, 2021 13:11:06 GMT 1
This is the type of post I am referring to. You have no idea but think it is your God given right to spout off anyway. I have a friend who had the same thing. He was weeks on ICU, as was Dean, and took probably a year to recover and has not got back to his pre-illness health. You literally have no clue. I do have a clue. I dont think it is my god given right to spout off at all. You dont know me, but I tell you what you fucking moron, I have had worse than what DH has had. So dont even start with that. I didn't say his illness wasnt bad or the recovery isnt long. I am saying it's sad that it is used an excuse. It is really sick and twisted that it is used as an excuse. Also, its fans using it as an excuse, I never said this has come from DH. The bottom line is. DH fucked us over with how he has acted during and since the takeover. And PH has just drip fed lie after lie. I know nothing about you, your Town supporting history or your medical history but I remember my friend who I visited on a recovery ward, which he was on for quite a while, after his weeks on ICU and he could hardly draw enough breathe to hold a conversation. I only stayed for 15 minutes on my first visit but just the effort of talking to me exhausted him. It was over a year before he returned to work and like me he had a pretty ordinary job, no management responsibilities or big decisions to make. He was also younger than Dean. People just cannot function after that level of illness and running a Premier League football club is a huge demanding job. That is why he asked Phil to take over. Not an excuse just common sense thinking of what was best for him and the club. Also please don't call me a 'fucking moron' because I challenge your opinion. Challenging and being abusive are very different things. I see from your profile you are a new poster, try to be more restrained.
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Post by bluesandtwos on Feb 17, 2021 13:12:23 GMT 1
Another match thread that has turned into a Dean/Hodgkinson debate.. 😴 Sorry, but it does tend to happen when we lose at the moment.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 17, 2021 14:03:43 GMT 1
Another match thread that has turned into a Dean/Hodgkinson debate.. 😴 Sorry, but it does tend to happen when we lose at the moment. Lose the game —> discuss the game —> discuss the players —> discuss transfers —> discuss budget —> discuss transfer windows —> debate and argue about whether it’s Phil’s or Dean’s fault... Aaaaaand repeat. I don’t mind it on a designated thread, but when every Match Thread follows that routine, it does get very tiresome. Not blaming you specifically, by the way.
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Post by bluesandtwos on Feb 17, 2021 14:30:51 GMT 1
Sorry, but it does tend to happen when we lose at the moment. Lose the game —> discuss the game —> discuss the players —> discuss transfers —> discuss budget —> discuss transfer windows —> debate and argue about whether it’s Phil’s or Dean’s fault... Aaaaaand repeat. I don’t mind it on a designated thread, but when every Match Thread follows that routine, it does get very tiresome. Not blaming you specifically, by the way. I don't disagree with you, I just struggle not rising to the bait sometimes. It would be nice if we all agreed that topic had been discussed enough but laying blame seems to be required by some. It feels like a long season, again.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 17, 2021 15:22:46 GMT 1
Lose the game —> discuss the game —> discuss the players —> discuss transfers —> discuss budget —> discuss transfer windows —> debate and argue about whether it’s Phil’s or Dean’s fault... Aaaaaand repeat. I don’t mind it on a designated thread, but when every Match Thread follows that routine, it does get very tiresome. Not blaming you specifically, by the way. I don't disagree with you, I just struggle not rising to the bait sometimes. It would be nice if we all agreed that topic had been discussed enough but laying blame seems to be required by some. It feels like a long season, again. I don’t mind the debate or discussion regarding Phil and Dean, but doesn’t it have a thread of its own? If it doesn’t, it probably should! I understand your point of view completely, but it’s just another Match Thread that has gone completely off track. Again, not blaming you, just an observation. Thankfully, it’s a Match Thread that I suppose not many want to keep checking on anyway 😉
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Post by Captainslapper on Feb 17, 2021 16:38:29 GMT 1
The fact hes only likely to get back about 77% of what he put in would suggest not. But he definitely still owns 25% of a debt-free club. You keep conveniently missing that point when you labour on about him maybe not getting 100% back. 25% of a loss making company. Which it will always be unless we get promoted again. How much do you think thats worth?
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Post by Captainslapper on Feb 17, 2021 16:46:32 GMT 1
Congratulations. In amongst all the infantile entitlement and tantruming, that has to be the single most stupid comment yet. Libellous , inaccurate and stupid all in one go So are you saying that people dont work hard all week to be able to get a SC etc? I know I do. And it really has pissed me off this season the way the club has gone. They dont deserve my money anymore. Why should I give my hard earned cash to them anymore? My children and family deserve it more. It's not a tantrum, it's real life. So unless.your some prawn sandwich pompous person, you would not understand. Im sure you work very hard for the £5 a week your season card costs.. that was the only bit that wasnt infantile tantruming really. They dont deserve your £5 a week,, but boy, do you deserve their millions eh! Youre entitled to it...you deserve it. If I was you, Id wind my bottom lip in and ask one of the admins to delete the post where you libelled them both on a public forum with a truly stupid, inaccurate accusation. You could rely on them just ignoring it as the rantings of a moron, but you should get it deleted to be on the safe side.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 17, 2021 16:52:11 GMT 1
But he definitely still owns 25% of a debt-free club. You keep conveniently missing that point when you labour on about him maybe not getting 100% back. 25% of a loss making company. Which it will always be unless we get promoted again. How much do you think thats worth? But is he financing that loss? I'd take 25% of Town right now if I didn't have to finance it. How much do I think it's worth? If we can avoid the drop, it's got to be an interesting proposition to one of the myriad of investors who feel that English football is worth it. That we don't have to spend millions and millions on stadium upkeep is a massive bonus. But my point remains: You constantly mention about DH not getting all his money back, but never acknowledge that he retains 25% of the club.
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Post by bluesandtwos on Feb 17, 2021 16:54:46 GMT 1
Congratulations. In amongst all the infantile entitlement and tantruming, that has to be the single most stupid comment yet. Libellous , inaccurate and stupid all in one go So are you saying that people dont work hard all week to be able to get a SC etc? I know I do. And it really has pissed me off this season the way the club has gone. They dont deserve my money anymore. Why should I give my hard earned cash to them anymore? My children and family deserve it more. It's not a tantrum, it's real life. So unless.your some prawn sandwich pompous person, you would not understand. Could be a WUM this guy. Signed up earlier this month. Likes to throw the insults around.
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Post by Captainslapper on Feb 17, 2021 17:17:34 GMT 1
25% of a loss making company. Which it will always be unless we get promoted again. How much do you think thats worth? But is he financing that loss? I'd take 25% of Town right now if I didn't have to finance it. How much do I think it's worth? If we can avoid the drop, it's got to be an interesting proposition to one of the myriad of investors who feel that English football is worth it. That we don't have to spend millions and millions on stadium upkeep is a massive bonus. But my point remains: You constantly mention about DH not getting all his money back, but never acknowledge that he retains 25% of the club. a 25% stake wouldnt be of any interest to anyone. Who'd want to buy a quarter share of something that loses money? 51% stake maybe. Id imagine PH would much rather own 51% than the 75% he does. As a stakeholder he will be financing the ongoing debts I would imagine, which is why the likes of you and me dont get involved in owning such things. I only mention DH getting 77% of what he put in back because people keep banging on about him getting all his money back, or even 'lining his pockets with profits'. Just thought a bit of reality might be useful.
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Post by rantinray on Feb 17, 2021 17:24:25 GMT 1
Have you been drinking meths? None of that makes any sense whatsoever. Davy gifted himself the 40% HTFC share in the stadium for a nominal value of £2 - "put on a shelf". He then demanded £2 million to take them back off the shelf, after already relinquishing control of the football club. How is that the same? if Town had never got to the Premier League under his stewardship then he wouldn't have taken any money back, as we were spending an amount that was acceptable to him and his family. The club was his "train set". However, we did reach 'the promised land'. We did receive shedloads of money. But we also spent a chuffing fortune. Our record transfer fee spent increased from £1.8 million to around £15 million for Mounie. The wage bill increased existentially as well. Dean Hoyle funded a lot of that at levels beyond the acceptability of him and his family. In the second season things went wrong. The football was poor, Wagner lost his mojo, Dean got gravely ill, and there was nobody at the club capable of stepping up to cover for him. He wanted to sell, and he needed to sell. He arranged a deal that was acceptable to both parties and he arranged to receive part of his spend/investment back over a prolonged period of time. If he had left the funds in do you, or anyone, truly believe that HTFC would have continued spending millions on players and their inflated contracts....even before the effects of covid? The bile directed at Dean (and Phil) is frankly embarrassing for supposed grown ups. By all means be upset at Town's abysmal last few weeks but don't blindly blame either of those two custodians as being the sole reason for things slipping. It's been a consequence of many factors, and chiefly the players (most of whom are Championship class) making mistakes, being injured, or not caring enough - and the coaching team not being able to change things to the benefit of the team during a match. To sum up: People who’s fault it is that we have a threadbare squad and no pot to piss in: the players, the manager, the coaching staff, the man who sold us in 2008. People who’s fault it isn’t: the chairman, the former chairman. Regarding Teddinton Teds remarks. I wish I could get back all the money I had put into cars, petrol, servicing, insurance, road tax etc. It would be nice.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 17, 2021 17:28:32 GMT 1
But is he financing that loss? I'd take 25% of Town right now if I didn't have to finance it. How much do I think it's worth? If we can avoid the drop, it's got to be an interesting proposition to one of the myriad of investors who feel that English football is worth it. That we don't have to spend millions and millions on stadium upkeep is a massive bonus. But my point remains: You constantly mention about DH not getting all his money back, but never acknowledge that he retains 25% of the club. a 25% stake wouldnt be of any interest to anyone. Who'd want to buy a quarter share of something that loses money? 51% stake maybe. Id imagine PH would much rather own 51% than the 75% he does. As a stakeholder he will be financing the ongoing debts I would imagine, which is why the likes of you and me dont get involved in owning such things. I only mention DH getting 77% of what he put in back because people keep banging on about him getting all his money back, or even 'lining his pockets with profits'. Just thought a bit of reality might be useful. But that's not my point. Not at all. I was talking about DH. I said I'd happily take 25% of any business in the world if I wasn't financing it. Does anyone know if he is? The other thing I find remarkably convenient is the fact that the biggest supporters of Dean's - by far - are two fellow Heavy Woollen lads with a decent-sized personal connection to him. Which makes it all the more galling when I remember what a decent job you both did holding Davy's feet to the flames (I'm sure you were aided in no small part by DH at the time). If you cannot see at all that DH is souring his legacy at this club by the speed and volume which he demanded repayment (the bulk of the money he stated on many occasions he expected to write off) then I don't know what else to suggest.
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Post by rantinray on Feb 17, 2021 17:50:22 GMT 1
Sorry, but it does tend to happen when we lose at the moment. Lose the game —> discuss the game —> discuss the players —> discuss transfers —> discuss budget —> discuss transfer windows —> debate and argue about whether it’s Phil’s or Dean’s fault... Aaaaaand repeat. I don’t mind it on a designated thread, but when every Match Thread follows that routine, it does get very tiresome. Not blaming you specifically, by the way. Groundhog Day the days after match days.
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bigtruck
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Post by bigtruck on Feb 17, 2021 19:06:55 GMT 1
To bring it back in track, I blame CC solely for last night. Mbenza getting injured was a blow but why bring Vallejo on for him when we had wingers on the bench? Changed the system and we never looked right after that. CC said when Holmes came, that he’s there to play in the middle and link the attack and Bacuna can then play wide left. That’s never happened and Holmes was stuck out there again. Then we changed system again when Pritchard went off for Rowe. So at least 3 changes in formation and style in around 40 minutes of football. That for me is the definition of clueless. It’s ok going on about the number of injuries we have but let’s be honest apart from Koroma and possibly Eiting, those injuries haven’t really affected us in the positions. Replacements at the back are all similar to what’s out.
So for me this is all about tactics and shape and unfortunately CC seems to be naive in what’s needed to succeed at this level. Can anyone really, honestly say this is any different to Siewart??
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