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Post by galpharm2400 on Sept 4, 2024 18:32:02 GMT 1
I just meant summer really, the priority was obviously different in January and Kevin provided the necessary funds, unfortunately they weren't spent well and didn't have the desired affect. The priority in the summer was to build a squad capable of automatic promotion, by all accounts we received £5M for Rudoni. I guess what I'm saying is perhaps we could have done more, particularly with strikers. Maybe they assessed the squad and got it wrong.... again. No, think they assessed the squad and wanted another striker , and we had 2 practically in the door before, for reasons out of our clubs control, they both fell through at the last minute. A fair criticism would be that they didnt have a plan C ready and waiting after plans A and B failed,,,but maybe they looked at Healey and Bojan and decided someone better wasnt available?? Think signing good strikers is difficult unless youre paying well over the odds. Clubs just dont want to let them leave otherwise. The current issues up front are because Healey and Bojan are both out, but when theyre back, alongside the promising looking Marshall and Ward , whos probably 4th choice now, then its not the disastrous options some are making it out to be IMO. It's certainly a lot stronger I think than this time last season when warnock had us relying on Ward, then two kids in Harratt and huddlin as the only alternatives for the first half of the season. I look at Healey and Radoluvic and see 2 wages. I dont see players who offer enough time on the pitch to count them in the squad going forward. Their relative merits, which we have yet to see much if anything of are pretty immaterial if they simply cannot play the matches. We therefore have 3 strikers and 2 maybe's in the squad. Assessing the strengths of your players is not about previous clubs form or indeed what they might do in a injury free future, its about what they have done and are doing for you now. How you guess that these two are 'better' than any striker we may have been able to bring in, beats me. Im better on the bench than these two sitting in the crowd or at home..?? Cover was required, it may well have been Harratt or hudlin and may have meant we didnt end up with midfielders filling in up front, but cover for 2 definite sick notes and Ward was a no brainer..imo.. |
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Post by royrace on Sept 4, 2024 18:38:17 GMT 1
No, think they assessed the squad and wanted another striker , and we had 2 practically in the door before, for reasons out of our clubs control, they both fell through at the last minute. A fair criticism would be that they didnt have a plan C ready and waiting after plans A and B failed,,,but maybe they looked at Healey and Bojan and decided someone better wasnt available?? Think signing good strikers is difficult unless youre paying well over the odds. Clubs just dont want to let them leave otherwise. The current issues up front are because Healey and Bojan are both out, but when theyre back, alongside the promising looking Marshall and Ward , whos probably 4th choice now, then its not the disastrous options some are making it out to be IMO. It's certainly a lot stronger I think than this time last season when warnock had us relying on Ward, then two kids in Harratt and huddlin as the only alternatives for the first half of the season. I look at Healey and Radoluvic and see 2 wages. I dont see players who offer enough time on the pitch to count them in the squad going forward. Their relative merits, which we have yet to see much if anything of are pretty immaterial if they simply cannot play the matches. We therefore have 3 strikers and 2 maybe's in the squad. Assessing the strengths of your players is not about previous clubs form or indeed what they might do in a injury free future, its about what they have done and are doing for you now. How you guess that these two are 'better' than any striker we may have been able to bring in, beats me. Im better on the bench than these two sitting in the crowd or at home..?? Cover was required, it may well have been Harratt or hudlin and may have meant we didnt end up with midfielders filling in up front, but cover for 2 definite sick notes and Ward was a no brainer..imo.. The stuff with Radulovic has been a bit mysterious, I'm honestly not sure he'll play for us again. Healey looked very good at the end of last season but strangely subdued this season when be did play. Even when he's fit we'll need to ease him back in and if last seasons anything to go on it'll take a fair few games to get match fit. I don't think we can rely on either. |
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Post by FloridaTerrier on Sept 4, 2024 19:03:28 GMT 1
No, think they assessed the squad and wanted another striker , and we had 2 practically in the door before, for reasons out of our clubs control, they both fell through at the last minute.
A fair criticism would be that they didnt have a plan C ready and waiting after plans A and B failed,,,but maybe they looked at Healey and Bojan and decided someone better wasnt available?? Think signing good strikers is difficult unless youre paying well over the odds. Clubs just dont want to let them leave otherwise.
The current issues up front are because Healey and Bojan are both out, but when theyre back, alongside the promising looking Marshall and Ward , whos probably 4th choice now, then its not the disastrous options some are making it out to be IMO. It's certainly a lot stronger I think than this time last season when warnock had us relying on Ward, then two kids in Harratt and huddlin as the only alternatives for the first half of the season. I look at Healey and Radoluvic and see 2 wages. I dont see players who offer enough time on the pitch to count them in the squad going forward. Their relative merits, which we have yet to see much if anything of are pretty immaterial if they simply cannot play the matches. We therefore have 3 strikers and 2 maybe's in the squad. Assessing the strengths of your players is not about previous clubs form or indeed what they might do in a injury free future, its about what they have done and are doing for you now. How you guess that these two are 'better' than any striker we may have been able to bring in, beats me. Im better on the bench than these two sitting in the crowd or at home..?? Cover was required, it may well have been Harratt or hudlin and may have meant we didnt end up with midfielders filling in up front, but cover for 2 definite sick notes and Ward was a no brainer..imo.. Unfortunately both situations WERE in the clubs hands. It was the club rightfully or wrongfully that didn't match what Birmingham offered May. As it's been said previously he was here to sign, but did the U-turn when town didn't match Birminghams offer. If we did, he'd be a Huddersfield Town player. With Taylor, I believe if the club had any conviction on signing Taylor, they'd have made an offer to good for Luton to refuse. Instead we allowed them to weigh up all their ducks, which didn't come to fruition and with Luton in the ascendency, that deal ended up being scuppered too. Because, we didn't "pay over the odds". It's that clinical conviction, that assertiveness and aggressive approach that the club lacks, I truly believe is the reason we're where we are. Previous examples are: Elijah Adebayo, Carlton Morris (Ironically, both at Luton too), but didn't have enough conviction to sign them. Good quality strikers in my opinion are worth their premiums, of course it's a risk. But the 1 of the 2 lads we tried to sign without true conviction were leagues top scorers in the current division we're in now. Not to bang on about Alfie May, but he's scored 23, 20 and 23 in the last 3 seasons. Taylor had 1 in 2 ratio. Then there was Devante Cole (A free agent) who was 3rd top goalscorer (Colby Bishop fired Pompey to promotion) who ended playing in the Championship. Any striker scoring 20+ goals this season effectively pays the club back (Fees and Wages) with promo and new increased revenues. Just IMO. It's the 1 area you don't go cheap on. Of course it's not my money. Pay peanuts, get monkeys. |
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Post by richhtfc on Sept 4, 2024 20:22:14 GMT 1
Would be very surprised if KN isn’t thinking hard about the money he spent on Healey, Balker and Radulovic at the moment
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Post by softboy on Sept 4, 2024 20:25:17 GMT 1
and what is he thinking?
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Post by richhtfc on Sept 4, 2024 20:28:48 GMT 1
Well if it was me it’d be - have I got the right people in charge |
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goodbet
Jimmy Glazzard Terrier
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Post by goodbet on Sept 4, 2024 20:33:23 GMT 1
What would you be thinking about those transfers? Money spent to keep us in the Championship that failed miserably and still not showing any results! |
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Post by royrace on Sept 4, 2024 21:05:52 GMT 1
What would you be thinking about those transfers? Money spent to keep us in the Championship that failed miserably and still not showing any results! Can't even get them on the pitch in the league below. I honestly don't think he could have done any worse in January. |
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Post by Captainslapper on Sept 5, 2024 0:11:59 GMT 1
I look at Healey and Radoluvic and see 2 wages. I dont see players who offer enough time on the pitch to count them in the squad going forward. Their relative merits, which we have yet to see much if anything of are pretty immaterial if they simply cannot play the matches. We therefore have 3 strikers and 2 maybe's in the squad. Assessing the strengths of your players is not about previous clubs form or indeed what they might do in a injury free future, its about what they have done and are doing for you now. How you guess that these two are 'better' than any striker we may have been able to bring in, beats me. Im better on the bench than these two sitting in the crowd or at home..?? Cover was required, it may well have been Harratt or hudlin and may have meant we didnt end up with midfielders filling in up front, but cover for 2 definite sick notes and Ward was a no brainer..imo.. Unfortunately both situations WERE in the clubs hands. It was the club rightfully or wrongfully that didn't match what Birmingham offered May. As it's been said previously he was here to sign, but did the U-turn when town didn't match Birminghams offer. If we did, he'd be a Huddersfield Town player. With Taylor, I believe if the club had any conviction on signing Taylor, they'd have made an offer to good for Luton to refuse. Instead we allowed them to weigh up all their ducks, which didn't come to fruition and with Luton in the ascendency, that deal ended up being scuppered too. Because, we didn't "pay over the odds". It's that clinical conviction, that assertiveness and aggressive approach that the club lacks, I truly believe is the reason we're where we are. Previous examples are: Elijah Adebayo, Carlton Morris (Ironically, both at Luton too), but didn't have enough conviction to sign them. Good quality strikers in my opinion are worth their premiums, of course it's a risk. But the 1 of the 2 lads we tried to sign without true conviction were leagues top scorers in the current division we're in now. Not to bang on about Alfie May, but he's scored 23, 20 and 23 in the last 3 seasons. Taylor had 1 in 2 ratio. Then there was Devante Cole (A free agent) who was 3rd top goalscorer (Colby Bishop fired Pompey to promotion) who ended playing in the Championship. Any striker scoring 20+ goals this season effectively pays the club back (Fees and Wages) with promo and new increased revenues. Just IMO. It's the 1 area you don't go cheap on. Of course it's not my money. Pay peanuts, get monkeys. So we should invent money we dont have? |
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Post by rougeboy31 on Sept 5, 2024 0:36:07 GMT 1
Unfortunately both situations WERE in the clubs hands. It was the club rightfully or wrongfully that didn't match what Birmingham offered May. As it's been said previously he was here to sign, but did the U-turn when town didn't match Birminghams offer. If we did, he'd be a Huddersfield Town player. With Taylor, I believe if the club had any conviction on signing Taylor, they'd have made an offer to good for Luton to refuse. Instead we allowed them to weigh up all their ducks, which didn't come to fruition and with Luton in the ascendency, that deal ended up being scuppered too. Because, we didn't "pay over the odds". It's that clinical conviction, that assertiveness and aggressive approach that the club lacks, I truly believe is the reason we're where we are. Previous examples are: Elijah Adebayo, Carlton Morris (Ironically, both at Luton too), but didn't have enough conviction to sign them. Good quality strikers in my opinion are worth their premiums, of course it's a risk. But the 1 of the 2 lads we tried to sign without true conviction were leagues top scorers in the current division we're in now. Not to bang on about Alfie May, but he's scored 23, 20 and 23 in the last 3 seasons. Taylor had 1 in 2 ratio. Then there was Devante Cole (A free agent) who was 3rd top goalscorer (Colby Bishop fired Pompey to promotion) who ended playing in the Championship. Any striker scoring 20+ goals this season effectively pays the club back (Fees and Wages) with promo and new increased revenues. Just IMO. It's the 1 area you don't go cheap on. Of course it's not my money. Pay peanuts, get monkeys. So we should invent money we dont have? Obviously from fans points of view we don’t know all the financial ins and outs. But on the face of it we’ve sold rudoni for good money, sorba loan fee, small fees for simpson, Jackson, jones and spent less than a million. Now I don’t want us to go crazy with signings but it does once again feel like they’re doing this ‘smart and sensible’ approach which to me translates to no risks and no ambition. |
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Post by FloridaTerrier on Sept 5, 2024 2:12:27 GMT 1
Unfortunately both situations WERE in the clubs hands. It was the club rightfully or wrongfully that didn't match what Birmingham offered May. As it's been said previously he was here to sign, but did the U-turn when town didn't match Birminghams offer. If we did, he'd be a Huddersfield Town player. With Taylor, I believe if the club had any conviction on signing Taylor, they'd have made an offer to good for Luton to refuse. Instead we allowed them to weigh up all their ducks, which didn't come to fruition and with Luton in the ascendency, that deal ended up being scuppered too. Because, we didn't "pay over the odds". It's that clinical conviction, that assertiveness and aggressive approach that the club lacks, I truly believe is the reason we're where we are. Previous examples are: Elijah Adebayo, Carlton Morris (Ironically, both at Luton too), but didn't have enough conviction to sign them. Good quality strikers in my opinion are worth their premiums, of course it's a risk. But the 1 of the 2 lads we tried to sign without true conviction were leagues top scorers in the current division we're in now. Not to bang on about Alfie May, but he's scored 23, 20 and 23 in the last 3 seasons. Taylor had 1 in 2 ratio. Then there was Devante Cole (A free agent) who was 3rd top goalscorer (Colby Bishop fired Pompey to promotion) who ended playing in the Championship. Any striker scoring 20+ goals this season effectively pays the club back (Fees and Wages) with promo and new increased revenues. Just IMO. It's the 1 area you don't go cheap on. Of course it's not my money. Pay peanuts, get monkeys. So we should invent money we dont have? I'm not saying we do/don't. Like I said it's not my money. But, 1 consistent message from those who run the club, said they didn't want to "overpay" for said player (Alfie May), which to a lot of degree I do understand. However, if you're looking/wanting a player to fire you back up the leagues you have to be willing to pay a premium. Now, if we take what we were willing to pay Charlton for May services and reallocated that to Taylor with an offer to buy. I'm obviously not in the know, BUT, it would have had put Luton in a situation with a decision to make. There is loss of revenue with relegation. But, the reduced/cut players wages would have balance that, some of which are players we signed in the championship, some of which even with a reduced salary would still be in the higher echelons of the pay structure the club have in place. Off loading additional players wages (releasing and selling) would have done too (but we decided to keep a few of those) AND revenue from Rudoni sale and previous income sales. Do we still receive revenue from the Karlan Grant sale? Like I said it's not my money, so it's certainly not mine to spend. My point/opinion still stands though. We should have committed and had more conviction to bring in an additional striker. |
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Post by Captainslapper on Sept 5, 2024 8:19:13 GMT 1
I doubt the cut in wages would have come close to offsetting the loss of revenue dropping out of the championship causes.
Pretty sure its about £7 million less in TV money alone.
For all I know...and Im guessing youre the same...we might have offered to buy Taylor with a decent offer, but found Luton werent interested in a sale, only a loan ( theyre presumably financially very well off after their season in the PL ).
No idea what the surplus is between sales and buys , presuming there is one after Rudoni left.
There are many things to factor in that fans tend not to consider. Wimbledons cut of that Rudoni fee...agents fees, signing on fees for new players, contract settlements for players we sell...
But the club will be losing millions in its normal everyday running. As fans we dont contribute enough to even cover that, never mind being able to splash money on expensive signings( refer you to the thread about SC prices for fans views on that )
So the money for this 'ambition' is basically down to Nagles generosity, just as it used to be down to Hoyles.
In that respect hes probably thinking weve ( he's) spent somewhere in the region of £3 million on strikers in the last 8 months, so might be wanting to see something for that before spending money on another one who might , or might not, be any better than what we already have.
If we've learned anything in the past few years , it should be that spending lots of money on a player doesnt guarantee anything really.
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Post by runner76 on Sept 5, 2024 8:48:56 GMT 1
I doubt the cut in wages would have come close to offsetting the loss of revenue dropping out of the championship causes. Pretty sure its about £7 million less in TV money alone. For all I know...and Im guessing youre the same...we might have offered to buy Taylor with a decent offer, but found Luton werent interested in a sale, only a loan ( theyre presumably financially very well off after their season in the PL ). No idea what the surplus is between sales and buys , presuming there is one after Rudoni left. There are many things to factor in that fans tend not to consider. Wimbledons cut of that Rudoni fee...agents fees, signing on fees for new players, contract settlements for players we sell... But the club will be losing millions in its normal everyday running. As fans we dont contribute enough to even cover that, never mind being able to splash money on expensive signings( refer you to the thread about SC prices for fans views on that ) So the money for this 'ambition' is basically down to Nagles generosity, just as it used to be down to Hoyles. In that respect hes probably thinking weve ( he's) spent somewhere in the region of £3 million on strikers in the last 8 months, so might be wanting to see something for that before spending money on another one who might , or might not, be any better than what we already have. If we've learned anything in the past few years , it should be that spending lots of money on a player doesnt guarantee anything really. Certainly a lesson Chelsea learned in recent seasons |
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Sept 5, 2024 9:25:29 GMT 1
Regarding Taylor I am pretty sure the Luton manager did not want to let him go unless he got the replacements in he wanted, which did not appear to happen. After missing out on May we wanted a proven striker at this level so held out hoping things would fall in place. I think Marshall may have been an insurance policy.
On May we have always been comparitively low payers, wage wise. Warnock mentioned it when he approached a striker who had been offered a lot more at another club. That isn't going to be thrown out because of one player and one club going bonkers with their money. The implications, especially as we haven't been well funded for players for many years, would have been too much.
Radoluvic, no idea what is happening there. Some foreign windows are still open so he may still go or he may be injured. The lack of comment by the club is strange though.
Healey, it sounds like he has niggles which, given his previous problems, he probably struggles with. Training hard enough to get fully fit when you think you may knacker yourself again must be very hard mentally. It is up to the medical and coaching staff to get him through it.
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goodbet
Jimmy Glazzard Terrier
Posts: 4,601
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Post by goodbet on Sept 5, 2024 9:43:37 GMT 1
I doubt the cut in wages would have come close to offsetting the loss of revenue dropping out of the championship causes. Pretty sure its about £7 million less in TV money alone. For all I know...and Im guessing youre the same...we might have offered to buy Taylor with a decent offer, but found Luton werent interested in a sale, only a loan ( theyre presumably financially very well off after their season in the PL ). They should have blown it all like we did.No idea what the surplus is between sales and buys , presuming there is one after Rudoni left. There are many things to factor in that fans tend not to consider. Wimbledons cut of that Rudoni fee...agents fees, signing on fees for new players, contract settlements for players we sell... But the club will be losing millions in its normal everyday running. As fans we dont contribute enough to even cover that, never mind being able to splash money on expensive signings( refer you to the thread about SC prices for fans views on that ) So the money for this 'ambition' is basically down to Nagles generosity, just as it used to be down to Hoyles. In that respect hes probably thinking weve ( he's) spent Wasted somewhere in the region of £3 million on strikers in the last 8 months, so might be wanting to see something for that before spending money on another one who might , or might not, be any better than what we already have. We will never buy anyone with that attitude, I just do not believe that there were only two strikers that were better than what we have. If we've learned anything in the past few years , it should be that spending lots of money on a player doesnt guarantee anything really. We have also learned that spending on old past it Town players and punts at lower league players leads you to relegation. KN has bought a club that is now worth less than he paid for it and without some investment in the playing staff it never will be. Maybe it is just the stadium and land he is interested in, I have no idea where his strategy is leading us. |
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Post by townarentbest on Sept 5, 2024 9:58:06 GMT 1
But Captain, Kevin Nagle actually said himself that the club had researched the whole thing extensively and concluded that Taylor was the ONLY target that fitted our brief, after the May fiasco. As for Ward (goodness me...) if the best that you can say is that he might "chip in with the odd goal" then fair enough, but then let's not talk about going for promotion this season. How many teams who have to play their 4th choice striker relatively regularly until, lets say November...end up promoted or getting in the play offs? Wrexham AREN'T playing Billy Waters, and if they were using him regularly, then YES, you'd rule them out of going for promotion this season. We've played Danny Ward in all seven games in all competitions so far. 100%. The problem is its over and over again, he gets involved with idiots and ends up with a "we know what we're doing, you're wrong" attitude which is not healthy. Its not helped that most of the things he has seemingly thought through have ended up not really going anywhere either... Such as... "We've got a Jumbotron but its too expensive/difficult to install" "The PA system investment ahead of LAST season" and its total non fitness for purpose "Talks on the stadium close...weeks away" (since maybe October 2023 if not earlier). "Things will be unrecognisable around match day NEXT (this) season"...translating to its exactly the same as last season but a silent movie is played beforehand to destroy the atmosphere! "Final episode of the 'How to Buy a Club' series is edited and ready to go, will be out after the end of (last) season" - sorry, we don't want a sad ending...even though the insight in this episode would potentially be the most interesting and watchable of all of them. "Commitment to submitting a motion to the EFL about flat price cap for away ticketing in the EFL" - hasn't happened. This is what I think. It happens. We got Healey BECAUSE we were a Championship club, zero chance he'd be here if we'd been in League 1 last season. Its not easy to bring in better players than that. But I also think that the judgement is wrong. There MUST be other players who would play at this level who fit in with the kind of budget we must have had available if May or Taylor were realistically in plan, who are pretty much guaranteed to be better than Ward and more ready than Bojan. |
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Post by townarentbest on Sept 5, 2024 10:03:29 GMT 1
I doubt the cut in wages would have come close to offsetting the loss of revenue dropping out of the championship causes. Pretty sure its about £7 million less in TV money alone. For all I know...and Im guessing youre the same...we might have offered to buy Taylor with a decent offer, but found Luton werent interested in a sale, only a loan ( theyre presumably financially very well off after their season in the PL ). They should have blown it all like we did.No idea what the surplus is between sales and buys , presuming there is one after Rudoni left. There are many things to factor in that fans tend not to consider. Wimbledons cut of that Rudoni fee...agents fees, signing on fees for new players, contract settlements for players we sell... But the club will be losing millions in its normal everyday running. As fans we dont contribute enough to even cover that, never mind being able to splash money on expensive signings( refer you to the thread about SC prices for fans views on that ) So the money for this 'ambition' is basically down to Nagles generosity, just as it used to be down to Hoyles. In that respect hes probably thinking weve ( he's) spent Wasted somewhere in the region of £3 million on strikers in the last 8 months, so might be wanting to see something for that before spending money on another one who might , or might not, be any better than what we already have. We will never buy anyone with that attitude, I just do not believe that there were only two strikers that were better than what we have. If we've learned anything in the past few years , it should be that spending lots of money on a player doesnt guarantee anything really. We have also learned that spending on old past it Town players and punts at lower league players leads you to relegation. KN has bought a club that is now worth less than he paid for it and without some investment in the playing staff it never will be. Maybe it is just the stadium and land he is interested in, I have no idea where his strategy is leading us. On the other side of the coin, he bought a club that is going to be COSTING less on an annual basis to keep afloat compared to the drain that is a Championship club with crappy revenues. Assuming we NEVER get to the PL, then from an ownership point of view, being in the lower league is potentially a benefit perversely enough! |
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goodbet
Jimmy Glazzard Terrier
Posts: 4,601
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Post by goodbet on Sept 5, 2024 10:28:02 GMT 1
KN has bought a club that is now worth less than he paid for it and without some investment in the playing staff it never will be. Maybe it is just the stadium and land he is interested in, I have no idea where his strategy is leading us. On the other side of the coin, he bought a club that is going to be COSTING less on an annual basis to keep afloat compared to the drain that is a Championship club with crappy revenues. Assuming we NEVER get to the PL, then from an ownership point of view, being in the lower league is potentially a benefit perversely enough! From your post it sounds like he bought us expecting us to go down that first season. If this were true it would explain why he was upset with Warnock when he saved us from relegation. So now we are in League one do you think he has any intention of getting us back in to the Championship as a minimum? It would explain the summer window. |
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Dan
Andy Booth Terrier
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Post by Dan on Sept 5, 2024 10:32:36 GMT 1
On the other side of the coin, he bought a club that is going to be COSTING less on an annual basis to keep afloat compared to the drain that is a Championship club with crappy revenues. Assuming we NEVER get to the PL, then from an ownership point of view, being in the lower league is potentially a benefit perversely enough! From your post it sounds like he bought us expecting us to go down that first season. If this were true it would explain why he was upset with Warnock when he saved us from relegation. So now we are in League one do you think he has any intention of getting us back in to the Championship as a minimum? It would explain the summer window. I mean I've read some shite on this website before but.... |
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Post by heycarpet on Sept 5, 2024 10:44:21 GMT 1
On the other side of the coin, he bought a club that is going to be COSTING less on an annual basis to keep afloat compared to the drain that is a Championship club with crappy revenues. Assuming we NEVER get to the PL, then from an ownership point of view, being in the lower league is potentially a benefit perversely enough! From your post it sounds like he bought us expecting us to go down that first season. If this were true it would explain why he was upset with Warnock when he saved us from relegation. So now we are in League one do you think he has any intention of getting us back in to the Championship as a minimum? It would explain the summer window. Well this is an interesting conspiratorial rabbit hole to go down 😅 I would say however that the potential revenue the stadium could bring to KN, he’s made no secret about that, and the redevelopment of land in the surrounding area is more lucrative than running a championship club, even more so a L1 side. I’m not necessarily saying this is at all true but it’s a novel thought. |
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Post by Scott Chegg on Sept 5, 2024 10:53:45 GMT 1
On the other side of the coin, he bought a club that is going to be COSTING less on an annual basis to keep afloat compared to the drain that is a Championship club with crappy revenues. Assuming we NEVER get to the PL, then from an ownership point of view, being in the lower league is potentially a benefit perversely enough! From your post it sounds like he bought us expecting us to go down that first season. If this were true it would explain why he was upset with Warnock when he saved us from relegation. So now we are in League one do you think he has any intention of getting us back in to the Championship as a minimum? It would explain the summer window. That is one of the strangest posts I've ever seen on here (taking galph and "happy to wait and see" bloke out of the equation) |
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Post by ShortbreadPete on Sept 5, 2024 11:02:07 GMT 1
I look at Healey and Radoluvic and see 2 wages. I dont see players who offer enough time on the pitch to count them in the squad going forward. Their relative merits, which we have yet to see much if anything of are pretty immaterial if they simply cannot play the matches. We therefore have 3 strikers and 2 maybe's in the squad. Assessing the strengths of your players is not about previous clubs form or indeed what they might do in a injury free future, its about what they have done and are doing for you now. How you guess that these two are 'better' than any striker we may have been able to bring in, beats me. Im better on the bench than these two sitting in the crowd or at home..?? Cover was required, it may well have been Harratt or hudlin and may have meant we didnt end up with midfielders filling in up front, but cover for 2 definite sick notes and Ward was a no brainer..imo.. Unfortunately both situations WERE in the clubs hands. It was the club rightfully or wrongfully that didn't match what Birmingham offered May. As it's been said previously he was here to sign, but did the U-turn when town didn't match Birminghams offer. If we did, he'd be a Huddersfield Town player. With Taylor, I believe if the club had any conviction on signing Taylor, they'd have made an offer to good for Luton to refuse. Instead we allowed them to weigh up all their ducks, which didn't come to fruition and with Luton in the ascendency, that deal ended up being scuppered too. Because, we didn't "pay over the odds". It's that clinical conviction, that assertiveness and aggressive approach that the club lacks, I truly believe is the reason we're where we are. Previous examples are: Elijah Adebayo, Carlton Morris (Ironically, both at Luton too), but didn't have enough conviction to sign them. Good quality strikers in my opinion are worth their premiums, of course it's a risk. But the 1 of the 2 lads we tried to sign without true conviction were leagues top scorers in the current division we're in now. Not to bang on about Alfie May, but he's scored 23, 20 and 23 in the last 3 seasons. Taylor had 1 in 2 ratio. Then there was Devante Cole (A free agent) who was 3rd top goalscorer (Colby Bishop fired Pompey to promotion) who ended playing in the Championship. Any striker scoring 20+ goals this season effectively pays the club back (Fees and Wages) with promo and new increased revenues. Just IMO. It's the 1 area you don't go cheap on. Of course it's not my money. Pay peanuts, get monkeys. A lot of our supporters were certainly adamant that they were only prepared to pay peanuts |
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ram
Andy Booth Terrier
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Post by ram on Sept 5, 2024 11:02:17 GMT 1
On the May wages debate,the rest of the players would well happy of we were winning every week, and went up as champions.{Yes I know Brum lost t,other night}
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Sparrow
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Post by Sparrow on Sept 5, 2024 11:02:37 GMT 1
With regards to Taylor.
Even with "an offer they can't refuse" Luton wouldn't have sold him, a loan was the only option they would entertain this season. A successful loan either develops him for them or increases his value.
They play 2 up top and he is essentially the first option of the bench. He offers a different option to the other 2 upfront. They were never ever going to let him go to another club until they got a replacement.
They were approached by us very early on and they were keen on sending him to us, but only once they got a replacement sorted. We were in constant dialog with them and it looked like there was definitely a deal to be done. Both clubs wanted to do a deal. They wanted him to get a full season at League one, whilst getting a replacement in.
He came up here and was doing everything he needed to do to join, because Luton thought they had a replacement. When that fell through, they realised they wouldn't get anyone else in and pulled the plug on the deal with Town, because they would need him in their first team squad.
Could this be revisited in January. Depends on how Luton are doing and how he is performing for them.
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Post by Amigo on Sept 5, 2024 11:11:02 GMT 1
I look at Healey and Radoluvic and see 2 wages. I dont see players who offer enough time on the pitch to count them in the squad going forward. Their relative merits, which we have yet to see much if anything of are pretty immaterial if they simply cannot play the matches. We therefore have 3 strikers and 2 maybe's in the squad. Assessing the strengths of your players is not about previous clubs form or indeed what they might do in a injury free future, its about what they have done and are doing for you now. How you guess that these two are 'better' than any striker we may have been able to bring in, beats me. Im better on the bench than these two sitting in the crowd or at home..?? Cover was required, it may well have been Harratt or hudlin and may have meant we didnt end up with midfielders filling in up front, but cover for 2 definite sick notes and Ward was a no brainer..imo.. Unfortunately both situations WERE in the clubs hands. It was the club rightfully or wrongfully that didn't match what Birmingham offered May. As it's been said previously he was here to sign, but did the U-turn when town didn't match Birminghams offer. If we did, he'd be a Huddersfield Town player. With Taylor, I believe if the club had any conviction on signing Taylor, they'd have made an offer to good for Luton to refuse. Instead we allowed them to weigh up all their ducks, which didn't come to fruition and with Luton in the ascendency, that deal ended up being scuppered too. Because, we didn't "pay over the odds". It's that clinical conviction, that assertiveness and aggressive approach that the club lacks, I truly believe is the reason we're where we are. Previous examples are: Elijah Adebayo, Carlton Morris (Ironically, both at Luton too), but didn't have enough conviction to sign them. Good quality strikers in my opinion are worth their premiums, of course it's a risk. But the 1 of the 2 lads we tried to sign without true conviction were leagues top scorers in the current division we're in now. Not to bang on about Alfie May, but he's scored 23, 20 and 23 in the last 3 seasons. Taylor had 1 in 2 ratio. Then there was Devante Cole (A free agent) who was 3rd top goalscorer (Colby Bishop fired Pompey to promotion) who ended playing in the Championship. Any striker scoring 20+ goals this season effectively pays the club back (Fees and Wages) with promo and new increased revenues. Just IMO. It's the 1 area you don't go cheap on. Of course it's not my money. Pay peanuts, get monkeys. Alfie May is on a wage which is absolutely ridiculous for this level. We'd agreed a fee and agreed a deal with the player. Birmingham then offer him a lottery win. We would be stupid to compete with it, he would be stupid to turn it down. Taylor we'd agreed a deal with Luton and the player. Luton then decided they're not letting him go. They need players more than money they've just come down from the Premier League and not spent crazy money. Neither situation we could have done anymore about. We had conviction by having them both at the club in a position to sign before things happened out of our control. By "clinical conviction" you seem to just be saying "spending stupidly". As for Devante Cole even plenty on here were saying he wasn't good enough for us and not many wanted us to sign him we can't suddenly make out we were desperate for him amd shluld have signed him. Adebayo and Morris were way before Nagle you can't bring them in to this. |
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Post by Amigo on Sept 5, 2024 11:13:42 GMT 1
On the May wages debate,the rest of the players would well happy of we were winning every week, and went up as champions.{Yes I know Brum lost t,other night} And what if we weren't winning every week? Or he got injured? Would players be happy then knowing he was earning over £10-15k more than them a WEEK. |
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Post by rougeboy31 on Sept 5, 2024 11:19:18 GMT 1
All we’ve heard for the last few years is this ‘smart’ approach. From Hoyles ‘not blowing our brains out’ to that weird Karlan Grant sale and now Nagles insistence on our strike force. And where has it got us. There’s a difference between smart and cutting your nose off to spite your face. Don’t they ever look at the benefits of signing better players rather than just the cost
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Post by waggers on Sept 5, 2024 11:19:30 GMT 1
Unfortunately both situations WERE in the clubs hands. It was the club rightfully or wrongfully that didn't match what Birmingham offered May. As it's been said previously he was here to sign, but did the U-turn when town didn't match Birminghams offer. If we did, he'd be a Huddersfield Town player. With Taylor, I believe if the club had any conviction on signing Taylor, they'd have made an offer to good for Luton to refuse. Instead we allowed them to weigh up all their ducks, which didn't come to fruition and with Luton in the ascendency, that deal ended up being scuppered too. Because, we didn't "pay over the odds". It's that clinical conviction, that assertiveness and aggressive approach that the club lacks, I truly believe is the reason we're where we are. Previous examples are: Elijah Adebayo, Carlton Morris (Ironically, both at Luton too), but didn't have enough conviction to sign them. Good quality strikers in my opinion are worth their premiums, of course it's a risk. But the 1 of the 2 lads we tried to sign without true conviction were leagues top scorers in the current division we're in now. Not to bang on about Alfie May, but he's scored 23, 20 and 23 in the last 3 seasons. Taylor had 1 in 2 ratio. Then there was Devante Cole (A free agent) who was 3rd top goalscorer (Colby Bishop fired Pompey to promotion) who ended playing in the Championship. Any striker scoring 20+ goals this season effectively pays the club back (Fees and Wages) with promo and new increased revenues. Just IMO. It's the 1 area you don't go cheap on. Of course it's not my money. Pay peanuts, get monkeys. Alfie May is on a wage which is absolutely ridiculous for this level. We'd agreed a fee and agreed a deal with the player. Birmingham then offer him a lottery win. We would be stupid to compete with it, he would be stupid to turn it down. Taylor we'd agreed a deal with Luton and the player. Luton then decided they're not letting him go. They need players more than money they've just come down from the Premier League and not spent crazy money. Neither situation we could have done anymore about. We had conviction by having them both at the club in a position to sign before things happened out of our control. By "clinical conviction" you seem to just be saying "spending stupidly". As for Devante Cole even plenty on here were saying he wasn't good enough for us and not many wanted us to sign him we can't suddenly make out we were desperate for him amd shluld have signed him. Adebayo and Morris were way before Nagle you can't bring them in to this. Can't argue with this really, even though I'm very frustrated by the striker issue. Can't blame the club for Alfie May, nothing at all they could have done there other than desperately match the terms and get bent over. May would have likely opted for Birmingham anyway. Taylor, again we weren't in control of that decision. All I'd argue is there should have been a few more plans, a C a D an E. Seems like we've opted to gamble that injuries sort themselves out and strikers we already have do the job on their return. |
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Post by Captainslapper on Sept 5, 2024 11:24:09 GMT 1
I doubt the cut in wages would have come close to offsetting the loss of revenue dropping out of the championship causes. Pretty sure its about £7 million less in TV money alone. For all I know...and Im guessing youre the same...we might have offered to buy Taylor with a decent offer, but found Luton werent interested in a sale, only a loan ( theyre presumably financially very well off after their season in the PL ). They should have blown it all like we did.No idea what the surplus is between sales and buys , presuming there is one after Rudoni left. There are many things to factor in that fans tend not to consider. Wimbledons cut of that Rudoni fee...agents fees, signing on fees for new players, contract settlements for players we sell... But the club will be losing millions in its normal everyday running. As fans we dont contribute enough to even cover that, never mind being able to splash money on expensive signings( refer you to the thread about SC prices for fans views on that ) So the money for this 'ambition' is basically down to Nagles generosity, just as it used to be down to Hoyles. In that respect hes probably thinking weve ( he's) spent Wasted somewhere in the region of £3 million on strikers in the last 8 months, so might be wanting to see something for that before spending money on another one who might , or might not, be any better than what we already have. We will never buy anyone with that attitude, I just do not believe that there were only two strikers that were better than what we have. If we've learned anything in the past few years , it should be that spending lots of money on a player doesnt guarantee anything really. We have also learned that spending on old past it Town players and punts at lower league players leads you to relegation. KN has bought a club that is now worth less than he paid for it and without some investment in the playing staff it never will be. Maybe it is just the stadium and land he is interested in, I have no idea where his strategy is leading us. Luton probably learned from us and the mistakes we made. I dont know, but their fans might be on their message board bemoaning their owners for not 'going for it more'..or 'showing ambition'. 'Wasted'..yeah so far. Cant argue with that. Whether we're still thinking the money weve spent on Radoluvic, Healey and loaning Marshall was wasted in 6 months, time will tell. Think patience is needed on that one. There are lots of strikers better than what we have.. But you have to firstly afford to get their club to let them go , potentially beat off competition from clubs with more money than us, and in most cases persuade them to drop to league 1. But either way, you cant magic up money that isnt there. Are fans going to moan that the millions that Nagle is putting in isnt enough to match what they think the ambition should be, whilst simultaneously coughing up a lung if theyre asked to contribute another quid a week?! When we brought in ex players ( to much moaning about it on here ) we finished 3rd in the championship the following season. Theyd all left again by the season we went down! So, no I doubt weve learned that. |
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Post by townarentbest on Sept 5, 2024 11:39:31 GMT 1
On the other side of the coin, he bought a club that is going to be COSTING less on an annual basis to keep afloat compared to the drain that is a Championship club with crappy revenues. Assuming we NEVER get to the PL, then from an ownership point of view, being in the lower league is potentially a benefit perversely enough! From your post it sounds like he bought us expecting us to go down that first season. If this were true it would explain why he was upset with Warnock when he saved us from relegation. So now we are in League one do you think he has any intention of getting us back in to the Championship as a minimum? It would explain the summer window. That is not what I think he EXPECTED or HOPED for at all !! He expected and hoped we'd stay up. Undoubtedly. All I'm saying is that relegation is potentially less impactful for the owner of a club that requires ongoing monetary support than it might be to a fan. |
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