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Post by mosher on Sept 5, 2024 16:59:22 GMT 1
Patience is a virtue,they say, it's a long season and players are adjusting to league 1, who knows where we will be come Christmas. For me, it's about watching Town and I am happy that we are still solvent and have the chance to air our views. - UTT Careful mate, just being thankful to have a club will be seen as lacking any kind of ambition đ |
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goodbet
Jimmy Glazzard Terrier
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Post by goodbet on Sept 5, 2024 17:04:17 GMT 1
The OP was specifically talking about the reaction to recent results. 2 of those bad results were in cups nobody cares about and the other, despite a poor performance, should have yielded at least a point but was derailed by one of the worst penalty decisions you are likely to see. We have brought in two new players for key positions at left sided CB and defensive midfielder. Both need to settle, Duffâs ideas need time and we have a mini injury crisis but sit on 9 points and only 1 point off autos. Surely we are allowed to see how things pan out and save the gnashing and wailing of teeth until, I dunno, 10 league games have passed? So tedious how far people look back to try and moan about the present. People canât move on. On the whole Iâm still optimistic about this season, wouldâve snapped your hand off for the league position we are in right now. Do I think some of the performances have been worrying/not up to standard? Yep. Do I wish we had got a striker? Yep. But life/football isnât linear, itâs what makes the game so great. I think weâve made a great appointment in the manager, I think weâve signed good players for this level in key positions. Itâs not perfect but it very rarely is. You have a point, but when we don't appear to learn any lessons and keep making the same mistakes you do wonder why and hope that by pointing this out we won't keep doing it. |
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Post by aksaiblue on Sept 5, 2024 17:07:15 GMT 1
Patience is a virtue,they say, it's a long season and players are adjusting to league 1, who knows where we will be come Christmas. For me, it's about watching Town and I am happy that we are still solvent and have the chance to air our views. - UTT Careful mate, just being thankful to have a club will be seen as lacking any kind of ambition đ Haha you are right, but the fact that we have a club, thanks to various benefactors, KN being the latest is a good thing. FOR more than 100 years the famous Huddersfield Town have graced the football league and we still are. |
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Post by Terriersmad on Sept 5, 2024 17:12:50 GMT 1
Fringe players might start a small handful and come of the bench a few more times. Say, 15 games. Most of the kids who played the other night aren't fringe players. They're kids called upon for a rare appearance to see if they could be fringe players, with the answers ranging from nowhere near ready to might be in a position to be called on from the bench if needed. I suspect most of Doncaster's side - from what my wife's uncle tells me - will feature a fair bit this season and are squad rotation players. There was only one of their starting 11 who was making his first appearance of the season (Ben Close, an experienced campaigner); all the rest of it have now played at least 4 times. It's somewhat unfair to compare half of our side to their entire side. Fair comment on others, but even their most inexperienced player had featured more just this season than Ashia, Vost, Iorpenda, and Thomas combined in their entire careers. Had we not been without 9 players, through injury and international duty, then things would have been different. As it is, we didn't have them, couldn't play them, and were weakened as a result. I don't mind that we played the kids, though. Good learning experience for them. We didn't look good when we brought the first teamers on though. It was a glorified friendly where they played a handful of minutes. The main thing is nobody got injured - because I can almost guarantee that will have been a thought among those coming off the bench. We also only lost to a very questionable pair of refereeing decisions. They got a penalty, we didn't. It could so easily have been flipped around and we're talking about a win. The international break has come at a good time. A chance to get on the training ground, get a couple back, and put a few things right. Poor form happens, even with the best sides. We've won 4 and lost 3 in a period of a little over 3 weeks. I suspect after the break we'll look far sharper. |
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Post by Tim Nice But Dim on Sept 5, 2024 17:14:46 GMT 1
Oh dear, here we go again and the truth is Town fans will be bed wetting for many years to come!!. We have two options as fans of this club, ever low prices for season tickets or pay a bit more and get better players to come in, but it's not that simple at Town. I don not blame Mr Nagle or anyone at the club over the May transfer, if the Blue noses want to pay outrageous money for a player/players let them it will come back and bite them big time because their fans will expect next season in the Championship.
Yes, we already have a lot of injuries but what really worries me is the lack of players are are willing to do battle when the going gets tough, because we haven't even started yet and the signs are already there. Bring back the scouts, do we have any anymore because since the Wagner promotion season it has been 50/50 on transfers some good some bad and the club did right to ship out Hudlin and Harratt on loan who in my eyes are league 2 players.
I am worried about this club and the fans because we have been there before i know i watched them go all the way to the old division 4 and stay there for years.
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goodbet
Jimmy Glazzard Terrier
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Post by goodbet on Sept 5, 2024 17:17:43 GMT 1
We didn't look good when we brought the first teamers on though. It was a glorified friendly where they played a handful of minutes. The main thing is nobody got injured - because I can almost guarantee that will have been a thought among those coming off the bench. We also only lost to a very questionable pair of refereeing decisions. They got a penalty, we didn't. It could so easily have been flipped around and we're talking about a win. The international break has come at a good time. A chance to get on the training ground, get a couple back, and put a few things right. Poor form happens, even with the best sides. We've won 4 and lost 3 in a period of a little over 3 weeks. I suspect after the break we'll look far sharper. I obviously pay more attention to form than you do, but let's hope that we do perform better after the break. |
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Post by runner76 on Sept 5, 2024 20:13:14 GMT 1
Oh dear, here we go again and the truth is Town fans will be bed wetting for many years to come!!. We have two options as fans of this club, ever low prices for season tickets or pay a bit more and get better players to come in, but it's not that simple at Town. I don not blame Mr Nagle or anyone at the club over the May transfer, if the Blue noses want to pay outrageous money for a player/players let them it will come back and bite them big time because their fans will expect next season in the Championship. Yes, we already have a lot of injuries but what really worries me is the lack of players are are willing to do battle when the going gets tough, because we haven't even started yet and the signs are already there. Bring back the scouts, do we have any anymore because since the Wagner promotion season it has been 50/50 on transfers some good some bad and the club did right to ship out Hudlin and Harratt on loan who in my eyes are league 2 players. I am worried about this club and the fans because we have been there before i know i watched them go all the way to the old division 4 and stay there for years. I think ive blocked our last season in the fourth division but am I right in thinking we played Gillingham? And they had a temporary stand? Or did I imagine that!?! |
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Post by andyboothscat on Sept 5, 2024 20:27:18 GMT 1
Oh dear, here we go again and the truth is Town fans will be bed wetting for many years to come!!. We have two options as fans of this club, ever low prices for season tickets or pay a bit more and get better players to come in, but it's not that simple at Town. I don not blame Mr Nagle or anyone at the club over the May transfer, if the Blue noses want to pay outrageous money for a player/players let them it will come back and bite them big time because their fans will expect next season in the Championship. Yes, we already have a lot of injuries but what really worries me is the lack of players are are willing to do battle when the going gets tough, because we haven't even started yet and the signs are already there. Bring back the scouts, do we have any anymore because since the Wagner promotion season it has been 50/50 on transfers some good some bad and the club did right to ship out Hudlin and Harratt on loan who in my eyes are league 2 players. I am worried about this club and the fans because we have been there before i know i watched them go all the way to the old division 4 and stay there for years. I think ive blocked our last season in the fourth division but am I right in thinking we played Gillingham? And they had a temporary stand? Or did I imagine that!?! No, Gillingham would have been in championship/second division equivalent in 03/04. |
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Post by FloridaTerrier on Sept 5, 2024 20:40:02 GMT 1
Unfortunately both situations WERE in the clubs hands. It was the club rightfully or wrongfully that didn't match what Birmingham offered May. As it's been said previously he was here to sign, but did the U-turn when town didn't match Birminghams offer. If we did, he'd be a Huddersfield Town player. With Taylor, I believe if the club had any conviction on signing Taylor, they'd have made an offer to good for Luton to refuse. Instead we allowed them to weigh up all their ducks, which didn't come to fruition and with Luton in the ascendency, that deal ended up being scuppered too. Because, we didn't "pay over the odds". It's that clinical conviction, that assertiveness and aggressive approach that the club lacks, I truly believe is the reason we're where we are. Previous examples are: Elijah Adebayo, Carlton Morris (Ironically, both at Luton too), but didn't have enough conviction to sign them. Good quality strikers in my opinion are worth their premiums, of course it's a risk. But the 1 of the 2 lads we tried to sign without true conviction were leagues top scorers in the current division we're in now. Not to bang on about Alfie May, but he's scored 23, 20 and 23 in the last 3 seasons. Taylor had 1 in 2 ratio. Then there was Devante Cole (A free agent) who was 3rd top goalscorer (Colby Bishop fired Pompey to promotion) who ended playing in the Championship. Any striker scoring 20+ goals this season effectively pays the club back (Fees and Wages) with promo and new increased revenues. Just IMO. It's the 1 area you don't go cheap on. Of course it's not my money. Pay peanuts, get monkeys. Alfie May is on a wage which is absolutely ridiculous for this level. We'd agreed a fee and agreed a deal with the player. Birmingham then offer him a lottery win. We would be stupid to compete with it, he would be stupid to turn it down. Taylor we'd agreed a deal with Luton and the player. Luton then decided they're not letting him go. They need players more than money they've just come down from the Premier League and not spent crazy money. Neither situation we could have done anymore about. We had conviction by having them both at the club in a position to sign before things happened out of our control. By "clinical conviction" you seem to just be saying "spending stupidly". As for Devante Cole even plenty on here were saying he wasn't good enough for us and not many wanted us to sign him we can't suddenly make out we were desperate for him amd shluld have signed him. Adebayo and Morris were way before Nagle you can't bring them in to this. You're totally entitled to your opinion Amigo as much as I am. Nor am I saying you're right, or I'm wrong and vice versa etc. However, let me respond to your points. 1). Agreed May's wage is ridiculously high for this level. I haven't said it wasn't. If we're being pedantic here, "we would be stupid to compete with it" and "Neither situation we could have done anymore about" - Both quotes by you here. My point was that very much that situation was still in our hands, as my response alluded to based on a previous comment. We were just not WILLING to do so. That's not an issue for me, but the claim to say it wasn't in our hands is false. The owner didn't say we couldn't afford to pay those wages. The owner said we didnt want to overpay, and didn't want any disruption in the changing room about pay. There is a difference between in our hands vs not in our hands then. 2). We agreed a deal for Taylor on loan. Once again not an issue. But, there was a comment saying that Luton were unwilling to sell only loan, which is also fine. But, a lot of clubs aren't necessarily willing to sell a player etc, but EVERYBODY has a price. Some clubs price other clubs out of a player a case in example here would be Guehi at Palace. Once again that's also fine. I am sure our club, our board and our management team wanted to keep Nicholls and Helik, so accordingly they priced them accordingly. Our club, board and management team were open to offers for Sorba Thomas. He would have had a price, which wasn't met, so that's why he was loaned out with an option to buy. His agent obviously did a good job. Both options (May and Taylor) in essence were still in our hands (unless I've missed somewhere that the owner has said we DON'T have any money). Which once again, is not an issue if so. Like I said it's not my money and I am not entitled to say spend it here or spend it there. It's a case of not WILLING to spend X amount on wages or a fee. Once again that's totally ok. But, to say it wasn't in our hands I am saying it was in our hands. We just chose to opt out. Which is like I have said numerous times here is TOTALLY fine. For example, and somewhat similarly I could opt in or out on paying a car dealership a $30,000 ADM fee over MSRP for a car that I want. If I have that money to do so, but if I chose to opt out from doing so, because I don't think a dealer should be charging anything over MSRP, the car purchase I want is still very much in my hands. Due to me really wanting the car though, I am WILLING to commit to get the car I want so others don't get the opportunity. BUT, let's not kid ourselves here, with all respect to KN. What does KN truly know about May or Taylors ability to justify not "overpaying"? What do I know for that matter. He didn't know who Huddersfield were until 2-3 weeks before he purchased the club, so I don't think he'd have done any scouting reports on those players, nor watch any previous league one games. Not a slight on the owner whatsoever by the way. That's not within his remit. That feedback however would have come from someone, correct? A scouting team, a board member, a manager etc. Who that someone is I don't know, I could fathom a guess though. Would paying May what Birmingham offered him be smart in League One? Nope. But you can bet your mortgage that if was Haaland, Messi or Ronaldo (For the record, just incase you think I am comparing a May to Haaland, Ronaldo or Messi. I"M NOT). KN would have said absolutely, if we can afford it pay whatever is necessary. But, that's neither here or there. "By "clinical conviction" you seem to just be saying "spending stupidly"." - Not to be combative but, I actually disagree, that's not what I am saying at all. But, your defensiveness and misdirection and or/ misunderstand on a few of my statements seem to have clouded your judgement in your response. Not an issue, not to get into an online debate. It's how you perceived my statement. So let me correct your viewpoint on what I meant, to give you clarity, whether you agree or disagree. Clinical conviction is meant in the context I wrote with was getting some over the line. Putting a team to bed, finishing a game off, truly committing to getting a player we want. Not overspending. Similarly to boxing if an opponent is on the ropes being clinical and punching with conviction is punching and hitting the opponent to get them out of the ring, for a KO, for TKO, for the referee to  off the fight, for their corner to throw in the white towel. Does the boxer put a bit more into the punches to do so? Probably, does the boxer bite down on the gum shield and throw more punches maybe when theyre tired? probably. Could there be a risk of getting hit back and giving the opponent a punchers chance? Yes, but being clinical and having conviction in not to leave it up to the judges. Apparently Devante Cole was good enough for a team in the league above us, who are currently 2nd in their division. By a coach, who took our polished turd to a play off final. He was a player who was available at the start of the summer. So my point still stands, and would have been an upgrade on any of the following: Simpson, Harratt, Phillips, Hudlin, Ward etc. "Adebayo and Morris were way before Nagle you can't bring them in to this." - C'mon now, you seem smart enough to not assume with a statement " It's that clinical conviction, that assertiveness and aggressive approach that the club lacks, I truly believe is the reason we're where we are.
Previous examples are: Elijah Adebayo, Carlton Morris (Ironically, both at Luton too), but didn't have enough conviction to sign them."Since when was Nagle, THE Club? "Previous" Examples would suggest a previous moment in time. If I meant KN I would have said KN and/or the board, not THE Club. And it is within my opinion the CLUB as an entirety for years has lacked any form of conviction. We've developed a losing culture, a culture or acceptance for under performance on and off the field, justifying bad decisions after bad decisions often lapped up by some fans (rightfully or wrongfully) with rose tinted goggles. KN has done A LOT right with investments he's made into the club. Which I have been one of his biggest advocates. In fact, I am thankful he took over the club. But, those he's trusted to come through at times with decisions have let him down too. Big time on some occasions. Many believe he's been naive in trusting those people too much. I tend to agree. I'd like to consider myself a very logical person, running a business organization myself. I don't think on emotion (outside of a game/match) very often. I'm just calling it how I see it. |
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Post by runner76 on Sept 5, 2024 20:51:36 GMT 1
I think ive blocked our last season in the fourth division but am I right in thinking we played Gillingham? And they had a temporary stand? Or did I imagine that!?! No, Gillingham would have been in championship/second division equivalent in 03/04. Thatâs the season we were in the basement wasnât it? |
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Post by FloridaTerrier on Sept 5, 2024 21:01:13 GMT 1
No, Gillingham would have been in championship/second division equivalent in 03/04. Thatâs the season we were in the basement wasnât it? Think your right andyboothscat. I have no idea why but I remember a few players from that era with them. Andy Hessenthaler (Check spelling), Nicky Southall, that big strong F'er up top Darius Henderson and I think they had Matt Jarvis coming through then too, and former Rangers player Rod Wallace. < Maybe that's why I remember them. I used to love that Glasgow Rangers team in that late 90s era. |
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Post by townarentbest on Sept 5, 2024 22:48:38 GMT 1
Think it was 2000 when they pulled the stand down.
They'd have had Marcus Browning at the time.
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Post by Captainslapper on Sept 5, 2024 22:54:07 GMT 1
Fringe players and promising kids, what about high earners who are neither fringe or promising. Sport is becoming a joke, just look at the Olympics. Devaluing competition will be another nail in the coffin. The end will come when finally nobody turns up because competition and entertainment have been replaced by BS politics and greed. The EFL Trophy is already all but valueless. It was devalued by the powers that be. May as well use it as a ground for blooding kids in a low-pressure game. Hope to win, test out a few things, not the end of the world if we don't. All cups have been devalued to the point of being nothing but an inconvenience for all but the big clubs who might win it. We havent taken a cup seriously for years, so it amazes me that some fans still bother. If I lived in Doncaster I wouldn't have been arsed to go along and watch that. Couldn't believe it was live on sky. I thought at the time..what viewing figure are they getting for this? Might have broken a record for the lowest figure for a live game that theyve shown I watched a bit at the start,,lost interest and tuned back in for the final 5 minutes. |
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Post by Captainslapper on Sept 5, 2024 23:04:56 GMT 1
It was a glorified friendly where they played a handful of minutes. The main thing is nobody got injured - because I can almost guarantee that will have been a thought among those coming off the bench. We also only lost to a very questionable pair of refereeing decisions. They got a penalty, we didn't. It could so easily have been flipped around and we're talking about a win. The international break has come at a good time. A chance to get on the training ground, get a couple back, and put a few things right. Poor form happens, even with the best sides. We've won 4 and lost 3 in a period of a little over 3 weeks. I suspect after the break we'll look far sharper. I obviously pay more attention to form than you do, but let's hope that we do perform better after the break. But arent you paying attention to the form of a side that isnt our team that will play in the games that matter? So that team lost at Doncaster? So what,.. that side isnt ever going to play in League 1 for us or anything remotely like it. Same for walsall to a lesser degree. You might aswell pay attention to the B team games and worry about that form. The form that matters is 3 wins out of 4, and the loss was mostly down to some shambolic refereeing decisions that handed the opposition the win...even accepting we didnt play well at all after half time. So 9 points from 12, without even playing that well. And I do think this side WILL play a lot better given a little time to gel,,,and of course getting some of the injured players back will help too. |
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Post by araucaria on Sept 6, 2024 9:20:56 GMT 1
Relegated from Prem to L1,now we lost 3 in a row. Reminds me of the Giants at the start of every season, this season will be different. Losing is losing there are no tin pot cups, professionals don't always win but that should always be the goal (goals are the problem). As for fans who say it doesn't matter âThose who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it.â George Santayana. Good effort by George, but Mark Twain does better with 'history doesn't repeat itself, but it often rhymes'. |
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goodbet
Jimmy Glazzard Terrier
Posts: 4,601
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Post by goodbet on Sept 6, 2024 9:45:35 GMT 1
I obviously pay more attention to form than you do, but let's hope that we do perform better after the break. But arent you paying attention to the form of a side that isnt our team that will play in the games that matter? So that team lost at Doncaster? So what,.. that side isnt ever going to play in League 1 for us or anything remotely like it. Same for walsall to a lesser degree. You might aswell pay attention to the B team games and worry about that form. The form that matters is 3 wins out of 4, and the loss was mostly down to some shambolic refereeing decisions that handed the opposition the win...even accepting we didnt play well at all after half time. So 9 points from 12, without even playing that well. And I do think this side WILL play a lot better given a little time to gel,,,and of course getting some of the injured players back will help too. I am paying attention to the form of our players and the shape of the team. We have seen some of our players some of our players uninterested and not prepared to dig deep to cover the opposition so it does matter if we have players that don't care. Three wins out of four is the stat that matters, but the prospect of maintaining that form looks impossible considering how we have been playing, even KN agrees with that. So as I said lets hope we play better after the break. |
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Post by townarentbest on Sept 6, 2024 10:39:52 GMT 1
I obviously pay more attention to form than you do, but let's hope that we do perform better after the break. But arent you paying attention to the form of a side that isnt our team that will play in the games that matter? So that team lost at Doncaster? So what,.. that side isnt ever going to play in League 1 for us or anything remotely like it. Same for walsall to a lesser degree. You might aswell pay attention to the B team games and worry about that form. The form that matters is 3 wins out of 4, and the loss was mostly down to some shambolic refereeing decisions that handed the opposition the win...even accepting we didnt play well at all after half time. So 9 points from 12, without even playing that well. And I do think this side WILL play a lot better given a little time to gel,,,and of course getting some of the injured players back will help too. Spot on, the form, in points terms, is GOOD. 9/12 maintained across a season gets you comfortably promoted. The problem is that form as you say has come off the back of "not playing that well". Obviously we're all hopeful we WILL play a lot better and benefit from some injured players returning. If that hope is fruitless, and we don't play a lot better, the likelihood of maintaining the points return form we've had so far is pretty low...you can't "get away" with performing poorly for very long. My concern is Bojan looks like he'll still be out of his depth...if he'd been playing for Guiseley in pre-season nobody would have blinked an eye, and then there's something about Rhys. We don't know the full story of why he was keen to leave Watford so soon after joining, "to get more game time" is pretty laughable, I do have a concern that his head has gone a bit after a career that has been a pretty constant bit part low scoring striker, who then bangs in a load in a poor French second division, quickly gets dropped to the B team on promotion, and returns to England where he seems to have dropped into being a bit-part striker when we need him to be the main man. Throw in his bizarre reaction after the final home game last season where he seemed to lose his shit, because of some crowd venting not even aimed at him...and there's big question marks for me. I wonder if he's just "done" as a footballer. It happens. HOPEFULLY NOT though, as there were glimmers of something pretty special in his games last season, he SHOULD be bagging 15+ in this league. |
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ldotm
David Wagner Terrier
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Post by ldotm on Sept 6, 2024 11:58:36 GMT 1
So tedious how far people look back to try and moan about the present. People canât move on. On the whole Iâm still optimistic about this season, wouldâve snapped your hand off for the league position we are in right now. Do I think some of the performances have been worrying/not up to standard? Yep. Do I wish we had got a striker? Yep. But life/football isnât linear, itâs what makes the game so great. I think weâve made a great appointment in the manager, I think weâve signed good players for this level in key positions. Itâs not perfect but it very rarely is. You have a point, but when we don't appear to learn any lessons and keep making the same mistakes you do wonder why and hope that by pointing this out we won't keep doing it. Whatâs the key mistake this summer? I assume youâre going to say not getting a top striker? My answer to that is we tried and were unfortunate in not getting there. If we hadnât changed and âkept making the same mistakeâ weâd have got another Bojan or Healey, that everyone is moaning about not repeating. Therefore, we are clearly operating in a different way. Just because the outcome isnât what we wanted doesnât mean the process isnât different. |
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Post by Amigo on Sept 6, 2024 12:05:50 GMT 1
Alfie May is on a wage which is absolutely ridiculous for this level. We'd agreed a fee and agreed a deal with the player. Birmingham then offer him a lottery win. We would be stupid to compete with it, he would be stupid to turn it down. Taylor we'd agreed a deal with Luton and the player. Luton then decided they're not letting him go. They need players more than money they've just come down from the Premier League and not spent crazy money. Neither situation we could have done anymore about. We had conviction by having them both at the club in a position to sign before things happened out of our control. By "clinical conviction" you seem to just be saying "spending stupidly". As for Devante Cole even plenty on here were saying he wasn't good enough for us and not many wanted us to sign him we can't suddenly make out we were desperate for him amd shluld have signed him. Adebayo and Morris were way before Nagle you can't bring them in to this. You're totally entitled to your opinion Amigo as much as I am. Nor am I saying you're right, or I'm wrong and vice versa etc. However, let me respond to your points. 1). Agreed May's wage is ridiculously high for this level. I haven't said it wasn't. If we're being pedantic here, "we would be stupid to compete with it" and "Neither situation we could have done anymore about" - Both quotes by you here. My point was that very much that situation was still in our hands, as my response alluded to based on a previous comment. We were just not WILLING to do so. That's not an issue for me, but the claim to say it wasn't in our hands is false. The owner didn't say we couldn't afford to pay those wages. The owner said we didnt want to overpay, and didn't want any disruption in the changing room about pay. There is a difference between in our hands vs not in our hands then. 2). We agreed a deal for Taylor on loan. Once again not an issue. But, there was a comment saying that Luton were unwilling to sell only loan, which is also fine. But, a lot of clubs aren't necessarily willing to sell a player etc, but EVERYBODY has a price. Some clubs price other clubs out of a player a case in example here would be Guehi at Palace. Once again that's also fine. I am sure our club, our board and our management team wanted to keep Nicholls and Helik, so accordingly they priced them accordingly. Our club, board and management team were open to offers for Sorba Thomas. He would have had a price, which wasn't met, so that's why he was loaned out with an option to buy. His agent obviously did a good job. Both options (May and Taylor) in essence were still in our hands (unless I've missed somewhere that the owner has said we DON'T have any money). Which once again, is not an issue if so. Like I said it's not my money and I am not entitled to say spend it here or spend it there. It's a case of not WILLING to spend X amount on wages or a fee. Once again that's totally ok. But, to say it wasn't in our hands I am saying it was in our hands. We just chose to opt out. Which is like I have said numerous times here is TOTALLY fine. For example, and somewhat similarly I could opt in or out on paying a car dealership a $30,000 ADM fee over MSRP for a car that I want. If I have that money to do so, but if I chose to opt out from doing so, because I don't think a dealer should be charging anything over MSRP, the car purchase I want is still very much in my hands. Due to me really wanting the car though, I am WILLING to commit to get the car I want so others don't get the opportunity. BUT, let's not kid ourselves here, with all respect to KN. What does KN truly know about May or Taylors ability to justify not "overpaying"? What do I know for that matter. He didn't know who Huddersfield were until 2-3 weeks before he purchased the club, so I don't think he'd have done any scouting reports on those players, nor watch any previous league one games. Not a slight on the owner whatsoever by the way. That's not within his remit. That feedback however would have come from someone, correct? A scouting team, a board member, a manager etc. Who that someone is I don't know, I could fathom a guess though. Would paying May what Birmingham offered him be smart in League One? Nope. But you can bet your mortgage that if was Haaland, Messi or Ronaldo (For the record, just incase you think I am comparing a May to Haaland, Ronaldo or Messi. I"M NOT). KN would have said absolutely, if we can afford it pay whatever is necessary. But, that's neither here or there. "By "clinical conviction" you seem to just be saying "spending stupidly"." - Not to be combative but, I actually disagree, that's not what I am saying at all. But, your defensiveness and misdirection and or/ misunderstand on a few of my statements seem to have clouded your judgement in your response. Not an issue, not to get into an online debate. It's how you perceived my statement. So let me correct your viewpoint on what I meant, to give you clarity, whether you agree or disagree. Clinical conviction is meant in the context I wrote with was getting some over the line. Putting a team to bed, finishing a game off, truly committing to getting a player we want. Not overspending. Similarly to boxing if an opponent is on the ropes being clinical and punching with conviction is punching and hitting the opponent to get them out of the ring, for a KO, for TKO, for the referee to off the fight, for their corner to throw in the white towel. Does the boxer put a bit more into the punches to do so? Probably, does the boxer bite down on the gum shield and throw more punches maybe when theyre tired? probably. Could there be a risk of getting hit back and giving the opponent a punchers chance? Yes, but being clinical and having conviction in not to leave it up to the judges. Apparently Devante Cole was good enough for a team in the league above us, who are currently 2nd in their division. By a coach, who took our polished turd to a play off final. He was a player who was available at the start of the summer. So my point still stands, and would have been an upgrade on any of the following: Simpson, Harratt, Phillips, Hudlin, Ward etc. "Adebayo and Morris were way before Nagle you can't bring them in to this." - C'mon now, you seem smart enough to not assume with a statement " It's that clinical conviction, that assertiveness and aggressive approach that the club lacks, I truly believe is the reason we're where we are.
Previous examples are: Elijah Adebayo, Carlton Morris (Ironically, both at Luton too), but didn't have enough conviction to sign them."Since when was Nagle, THE Club? "Previous" Examples would suggest a previous moment in time. If I meant KN I would have said KN and/or the board, not THE Club. And it is within my opinion the CLUB as an entirety for years has lacked any form of conviction. We've developed a losing culture, a culture or acceptance for under performance on and off the field, justifying bad decisions after bad decisions often lapped up by some fans (rightfully or wrongfully) with rose tinted goggles. KN has done A LOT right with investments he's made into the club. Which I have been one of his biggest advocates. In fact, I am thankful he took over the club. But, those he's trusted to come through at times with decisions have let him down too. Big time on some occasions. Many believe he's been naive in trusting those people too much. I tend to agree. I'd like to consider myself a very logical person, running a business organization myself. I don't think on emotion (outside of a game/match) very often. I'm just calling it how I see it. 1. The May situation was in our hands, and then taken out of our hands. We agreed a deal, Birmingham blew us out of the water. Everyone agrees it would be too much to pay for our level, even you, so I don't know what your point is here. 2. Taylor, they didn't want to let him go because a deal fell through for someone else. They have money having just come down so the amount to get him would again have to be ridiculous to leave them short. On both points all you're saying is "we should be stupid and do the deals regardless of cost or upsetting other members of the squad". It's like saying signing Messi in the summer was in our hands, we just didn't offer him enough to relocate, where do you stop? We were clinical in the first 2 games, Peterborough, got one and quickly got another, pushed for another for the first 15 or 20 minutes in the 2nd half then coasted through the rest of the game without taking any risks. Blew Morecambe away. 2 examples from last month. We're a work in progress though. As for Devante Cole, a team in the Championship might think he's good enough for them, most of our own fans didn't think he was good enough for us (maybe carried away with May), he's also come in once in the league for 15 minutes so far this season. Is there anyone in positions of signing players that is around now that was there when Adebayo and Morris were available? I don't think there is so you can say "the club", but the club is completely different now in terms of its decision makers so it's completely irrelevant. Unless you also run a football club I'd imagine it's incredibly easy to have next to no emotion involved in it and it's decisions. I'm not sure you can say he's been naive to trust the people he's employed when they have more knowledge than he does. He should trust them but that's not to say they're going to get every decision right. |
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goodbet
Jimmy Glazzard Terrier
Posts: 4,601
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Post by goodbet on Sept 6, 2024 12:09:44 GMT 1
You have a point, but when we don't appear to learn any lessons and keep making the same mistakes you do wonder why and hope that by pointing this out we won't keep doing it. Whatâs the key mistake this summer? I assume youâre going to say not getting a top striker? My answer to that is we tried and were unfortunate in not getting there. If we hadnât changed and âkept making the same mistakeâ weâd have got another Bojan or Healey, that everyone is moaning about not repeating. Therefore, we are clearly operating in a different way. Just because the outcome isnât what we wanted doesnât mean the process isnât different. The new owners team have had three windows and we can't claim that any of them have been great. Process? it appears to be more than a little broken. |
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Post by mosher on Sept 6, 2024 12:11:42 GMT 1
You have a point, but when we don't appear to learn any lessons and keep making the same mistakes you do wonder why and hope that by pointing this out we won't keep doing it. Whatâs the key mistake this summer? I assume youâre going to say not getting a top striker? My answer to that is we tried and were unfortunate in not getting there. If we hadnât changed and âkept making the same mistakeâ weâd have got another Bojan or Healey, that everyone is moaning about not repeating. Therefore, we are clearly operating in a different way. Just because the outcome isnât what we wanted doesnât mean the process isnât different. I was going to say pretty much the same. The same people moaning about the crapness of our current strikers and the scattergun approach of previous windows seem to be the same people (my perception anyway) that are now saying sign a striker, any striker, they've got to be better than the ones we've got. That's partly how we got such an unbalanced squad in the first place, hoovering up frees and "prospects". |
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goodbet
Jimmy Glazzard Terrier
Posts: 4,601
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Post by goodbet on Sept 6, 2024 12:24:10 GMT 1
Whatâs the key mistake this summer? I assume youâre going to say not getting a top striker? My answer to that is we tried and were unfortunate in not getting there. If we hadnât changed and âkept making the same mistakeâ weâd have got another Bojan or Healey, that everyone is moaning about not repeating. Therefore, we are clearly operating in a different way. Just because the outcome isnât what we wanted doesnât mean the process isnât different. I was going to say pretty much the same. The same people moaning about the crapness of our current strikers and the scattergun approach of previous windows seem to be the same people (my perception anyway) that are now saying sign a striker, any striker, they've got to be better than the ones we've got. That's partly how we got such an unbalanced squad in the first place, hoovering up frees and "prospects". Who ever said "sign a striker, any striker"? The last three windows have not been good for us have they. We can trawl through some others to try and find a good one! |
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Post by Captainslapper on Sept 6, 2024 13:13:53 GMT 1
People talk about 'learning lessons' like its as easy as just deciding to stop making bad signings and start making good signings.
I doubt weve ever signed a player without the people making the decision thinking it was a good one.
But there are so many variables, so many things that can effect it, its easy to make a bad choice and as we know all too well, even spending vast sums doesnt really alter that.
Ultimately all you can really do is look at the person/ people making the decisions, and if they get too many wrong, look to change them.
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iangreaves
Jimmy Glazzard Terrier
[M0:0]
Posts: 4,197
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Post by iangreaves on Sept 6, 2024 13:14:21 GMT 1
I was going to say pretty much the same. The same people moaning about the crapness of our current strikers and the scattergun approach of previous windows seem to be the same people (my perception anyway) that are now saying sign a striker, any striker, they've got to be better than the ones we've got. That's partly how we got such an unbalanced squad in the first place, hoovering up frees and "prospects". Who ever said "sign a striker, any striker"? The last three windows have not been good for us have they. We can trawl through some others to try and find a good one! AHTTC podcast lads reckon, and I agree with them, that the biggest concern at the moment is midfield. Itâs the area of the team that we supposedly addressed but itâs not working. Evans has been poor and, after a decent start, Wiles has reverted to the player of last season. |
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Post by mosher on Sept 6, 2024 14:03:09 GMT 1
I was going to say pretty much the same. The same people moaning about the crapness of our current strikers and the scattergun approach of previous windows seem to be the same people (my perception anyway) that are now saying sign a striker, any striker, they've got to be better than the ones we've got. That's partly how we got such an unbalanced squad in the first place, hoovering up frees and "prospects". The last three windows have not been good for us have they. We can trawl through some others to try and find a good one! Slight exaggeration maybe but somebody posted a list of "out of contract" strikers, a few of whom had stats no better than the strikers we've got. There's previously been complaints about how we've signed quantity over quality and yet people are now saying sign a striker who is 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th choice on our list. No doubt those same people would be bitching about signing a load of crap if we signed the person down in 4th or 5th on our list of wants. We missed out on our two first choices, nobody on here knows if we had other irons in the fire that got screwed up because Luton strung us along. I personally don't think we should have waited so long for Luton to reel in their catch (fish pun invitation?) but I also don't think we should sign anybody just for the sake of it. FFS there was a thread about Devante Cole where people were saying he's shite and we don't want him, yet now people are complaining because a club (in a higher fkn division) have signed him instead. |
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ldotm
David Wagner Terrier
Posts: 2,890
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Post by ldotm on Sept 6, 2024 15:58:19 GMT 1
Whatâs the key mistake this summer? I assume youâre going to say not getting a top striker? My answer to that is we tried and were unfortunate in not getting there. If we hadnât changed and âkept making the same mistakeâ weâd have got another Bojan or Healey, that everyone is moaning about not repeating. Therefore, we are clearly operating in a different way. Just because the outcome isnât what we wanted doesnât mean the process isnât different. The new owners team have had three windows and we can't claim that any of them have been great. Process? it appears to be more than a little broken. How can you say this window hasnât been great yet? We are only a handful of games in and on the whole have got a decent points tally. Duff - happy with. Sorensen and Miller - look great. Kane, Evans both excelled at this level. Longwijk & Hodge too early to say. Marshall - promising. Perfect window? Nope. But on the whole a decent one. Your repeated card is well why should we trust them theyâve got previous windows wrong, is such a defeatist and negative outlook that Iâm glad I donât have. How about, give them a bloody chance and then in a few months if it looks a disaster, get stuck into them by all means. You canât move forward if youâre constantly looking back. |
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Post by FloridaTerrier on Sept 6, 2024 16:25:34 GMT 1
The new owners team have had three windows and we can't claim that any of them have been great. Process? it appears to be more than a little broken. How can you say this window hasnât been great yet? We are only a handful of games in and on the whole have got a decent points tally. Duff - happy with. Sorensen and Miller - look great. Kane, Evans both excelled at this level. Longwijk & Hodge too early to say. Marshall - promising. Perfect window? Nope. But on the whole a decent one. Your repeated card is well why should we trust them theyâve got previous windows wrong, is such a defeatist and negative outlook that Iâm glad I donât have. How about, give them a bloody chance and then in a few months if it looks a disaster, get stuck into them by all means. You canât move forward if youâre constantly looking back. I agree with the most of this. The window has been half decent, I really like MD and the signings we've made. The improvements in and around the club also big improvement. The start to the season in the league. I don't know what it is though something about our performances has irked me, the way our squad has capitulated in games, and not having a killer instinct to kill games off. We've rode our a luck a little with the results. On the flip side we've been hard done by some decisions.
I just can't help feel we came a bit short in the window though. It needed a big window to recover from the poor 1st window (board and owner I think had hands tied behind their back that window, so I'll give benefit of doubt). 2nd window was ok, but we have to argue with the signings Healey, Bojan and Balker. Most have been crocked and haven't had any impact unfortunately. That's not on the owner. But, we have to say the window wasn't successful because it didn't have the impact we required. Ultimately, we got relegated. This window has and was a much better improvement, the best window yet. But a needed one. I just can't help feel we could have done better if we got the clinical goal scorer we needed. I like Marshall, and I like him a lot. But it's an awful lot of pressure on a young mans shoulders. We've enforced the midfield. There's not been a signing I've disliked. However, the window for me was like doing all the good ground work winning over that 10/10, wining and dining, telling her sweet nothings, you've invited her back, she obliges, she wants the night of her life, as you promised when whispering in her ear. She starts to undress, and she's laying there waiting for you and yet you don't close the deal, because you couldn't get it up, because you had a bit too much to drink. The dates were fantastic, the laughter, the fun, the moments were really good. But, you're left a little embarrassed and frustrated, because what you promised you didn't deliver on. I think the difference between this window being a good window and a great window was getting that elusive goal scoring striker that continues to elude us year over year. We thought we had it in Healey and Bojan last January. But, they're as fragile as picture frame glass. We needed an improvement on what he had, if we are to commit to our "3 year prem" goal and "auto promotion" but we didn't deliver. It's still very early days, and I just hope it doesn't come to bite us in the ass again. |
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Post by Captainslapper on Sept 6, 2024 16:46:46 GMT 1
How can you say this window hasnât been great yet? We are only a handful of games in and on the whole have got a decent points tally. Duff - happy with. Sorensen and Miller - look great. Kane, Evans both excelled at this level. Longwijk & Hodge too early to say. Marshall - promising. Perfect window? Nope. But on the whole a decent one. Your repeated card is well why should we trust them theyâve got previous windows wrong, is such a defeatist and negative outlook that Iâm glad I donât have. How about, give them a bloody chance and then in a few months if it looks a disaster, get stuck into them by all means. You canât move forward if youâre constantly looking back. I agree with the most of this. The window has been half decent, I really like MD and the signings we've made. The improvements in and around the club also big improvement. The start to the season in the league. I don't know what it is though something about our performances has irked me, the way our squad has capitulated in games, and not having a killer instinct to kill games off. We've rode our a luck a little with the results. On the flip side we've been hard done by some decisions.
I just can't help feel we came a bit short in the window though. It needed a big window to recover from the poor 1st window (board and owner I think had hands tied behind their back that window, so I'll give benefit of doubt). 2nd window was ok, but we have to argue with the signings Healey, Bojan and Balker. Most have been crocked and haven't had any impact unfortunately. That's not on the owner. But, we have to say the window wasn't successful because it didn't have the impact we required. Ultimately, we got relegated. This window has and was a much better improvement, the best window yet. But a needed one. I just can't help feel we could have done better if we got the clinical goal scorer we needed. I like Marshall, and I like him a lot. But it's an awful lot of pressure on a young mans shoulders. We've enforced the midfield. There's not been a signing I've disliked. However, the window for me was like doing all the good ground work winning over that 10/10, wining and dining, telling her sweet nothings, you've invited her back, she obliges, she wants the night of her life, as you promised when whispering in her ear. She starts to undress, and she's laying there waiting for you and yet you don't close the deal, because you couldn't get it up, because you had a bit too much to drink. The dates were fantastic, the laughter, the fun, the moments were really good. But, you're left a little embarrassed and frustrated, because what you promised you didn't deliver on. I think the difference between this window being a good window and a great window was getting that elusive goal scoring striker that continues to elude us year over year. We thought we had it in Healey and Bojan last January. But, they're as fragile as picture frame glass. We needed an improvement on what he had, if we are to commit to our "3 year prem" goal and "auto promotion" but we didn't deliver. It's still very early days, and I just hope it doesn't come to bite us in the ass again. Cant disagree with any of that really. And loving the analogy!  |
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Post by runner76 on Sept 7, 2024 9:16:54 GMT 1
I agree with the most of this. The window has been half decent, I really like MD and the signings we've made. The improvements in and around the club also big improvement. The start to the season in the league. I don't know what it is though something about our performances has irked me, the way  our squad has capitulated in games, and not having a killer instinct to kill games off. We've rode our a luck a little with the results. On the flip side we've been hard done by some decisions.
I just can't help feel we came a bit short in the window though. It needed a big window to recover from the poor 1st window (board and owner I think had hands tied behind their back that window, so I'll give benefit of doubt). 2nd window was ok, but we have to argue with the signings Healey, Bojan and Balker. Most have been crocked and haven't had any impact unfortunately. That's not on the owner. But, we have to say the window wasn't successful because it didn't have the impact we required. Ultimately, we got relegated. This window has and was a much better improvement, the best window yet. But a needed one. I just can't help feel we could have done better if we got the clinical goal scorer we needed. I like Marshall, and I like him a lot. But it's an awful lot of pressure on a young mans shoulders. We've enforced the midfield. There's not been a signing I've disliked. However, the window for me was like doing all the good ground work winning over that 10/10, wining and dining, telling her sweet nothings, you've invited her back, she obliges, she wants the night of her life, as you promised when whispering in her ear. She starts to undress, and she's laying there waiting for you and yet you don't close the deal, because you couldn't get it up, because you had a bit too much to drink. The dates were fantastic, the laughter, the fun, the moments were really good. But, you're left a little embarrassed and frustrated, because what you promised you didn't deliver on. I think the difference between this window being a good window and a great window was getting that elusive goal scoring striker that continues to elude us year over year. We thought we had it in Healey and Bojan last January. But, they're as fragile as picture frame glass. We needed an improvement on what he had, if we are to commit to our "3 year prem" goal and "auto promotion" but we didn't deliver. It's still very early days, and I just hope it doesn't come to bite us in the ass again. Cant disagree with any of that really. And loving the analogy! Second that! Itâs like a round of golf where we have teed off beautifully and landed on the green, but then cocked up the putting and come away with 1 over par not a birdie. |
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drewden
Andy Booth Terrier
Posts: 3,804
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Post by drewden on Sept 7, 2024 10:10:30 GMT 1
Cant disagree with any of that really. And loving the analogy! Second that! Itâs like a round of golf where we have teed off beautifully and landed on the green, but then cocked up the putting and come away with 1 over par not a birdie. I think we are in a bit of a hole at the minute, let's hope we can swing back into action to drive us forward, the golf in teams in this division is huge. |
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off the fight, for their corner to throw in the white towel. Does the boxer put a bit more into the punches to do so? Probably, does the boxer bite down on the gum shield and throw more punches maybe when theyre tired? probably. Could there be a risk of getting hit back and giving the opponent a punchers chance? Yes, but being clinical and having conviction in not to leave it up to the judges.
