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Post by Deleted on Jul 31, 2019 13:23:23 GMT 1
when you have been in a Warnock and Horton dressing room towns would be quite by comparison.im sure lessons will have been learned on both sides. its nothing We live in a different time Positive this isn't the 1990s. Whether we like it or not the player is now king. A lot of the job of a premier league manager is mollycoddling egos. I bet you a pound to a penny Warnocks managerial style is a lot different now to in 1995. It's about getting people on your side and wanting to work for you. Throwing teacups is becoming redundant . you have to know your players some need a gee up some a arm around them but a dressing room is a harsh place at times and weakness will be seized upon. AS I SAID LESSONS WILL HAVE BEEN LEARNED BY ALL PARTIES AND WE MOVE ON |
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Post by galpharm2400 on Jul 31, 2019 13:31:57 GMT 1
You can have your say and get your agent working on a move without shouting the odds in the media. He forgot he was an employee on a contract with a boss who was prepared to fuck him up if really necessary. The more the power is rebalanced the better.
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Post by Convictatthemac on Jul 31, 2019 13:42:10 GMT 1
when you have been in a Warnock and Horton dressing room towns would be quite by comparison.im sure lessons will have been learned on both sides. its nothing We live in a different time Positive this isn't the 1990s. Whether we like it or not the player is now king. A lot of the job of a premier league manager is mollycoddling egos. I bet you a pound to a penny Warnocks managerial style is a lot different now to in 1995. It's about getting people on your side and wanting to work for you. Throwing teacups is becoming redundant . The manager showed his inexperience imo It certainly was a rookie move by a rookie coach. I’m still a believer in the hairdryer treatment, but it has its time and place to make it effective. TBH I think it goes back to players getting frustrated with Wagner. There were a number of times last season where players got in a discussion with Wagner and it appeared as though players got frustrated with Wagner. Some got shipped out to other clubs while others stayed. I honestly don’t think JS knew what he was getting into, other than be had been offered a dream job way ahead of schedule. Personally, I’m as concerned as you about JS, but he appears to be learning. Can he learn fast enough? That will be the difference between finishing top 6 or having ‘another’ season. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 31, 2019 13:55:37 GMT 1
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Post by tockyterrier on Jul 31, 2019 15:24:28 GMT 1
Can't quite understand the level of vitriol and depth of dislike aimed at young Phil. He certainly had a laid back style to his play - some say that made him look lazy but the stats - distance covered, tackles etc - suggest otherwise. I wish him well and, certainly in financial terms, the club has done marvellously from him. I think we could all name several Town players that we've bought recently that we are going to have to sell at a loss, or can't get rid of - some we loaned out unsuccessfully and others still haven't staked a regular place near the first team. People seem to be giving him a large part of the blame for our awful season last year. Certainly towards the end of the season he did not help and I would not condone his going public with his criticism of Jan Siewert (I think, and I may be wrong as I have no idea at all what went on behind the scenes, he was only saying what a lot of Town players felt, allegedly - we all heard the rumours from Schindler downwards). There are certainly other people I would blame more for our pathetic giving up of Premier League status and I would start with David Wagner - signs contract then very very soon decides he will be leaving/buying players for a system he then doesn't use/ ultra negative defensive football/ loss of our "identity" from the Spurs match onwards etc etc. Many of the players (new signing and usual offenders), as well as and even more than Billing, did not contribute. All in all he had his faults certainly but, for me, I wish him well and thank him for some excellent performances. Some of our current squad, who are still defended on here, have contributed a bloody site less in the last two years than Philip Billing did and we're not going to get £15m for them - as has been said we'll either sell them at a loss or have to subsidise their wages/pay them off if other clubs do acquire them. Those other clubs hardly seem to be rushing to get them. The quote I believe attributed to Schindler was "he just shouts at us" It's possible this quote was referring to Winkler. Didn't PH ask Jan if he was getting what he needed from Winkler and the up shot of this is Colin Bell is now here? |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 31, 2019 15:28:04 GMT 1
He is going to have to work hard to get to match fitness unless he has been training whilst at Town ? |
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Post by benhomly on Jul 31, 2019 15:36:35 GMT 1
He is going to have to work hard to get to match fitness unless he has been training whilst at Town ? Blimey, with 3 midfielders out he really will have nowhere to hide down there will he; will be interesting to see how he copes. |
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Post by galpharm2400 on Jul 31, 2019 15:46:15 GMT 1
Billing takes his part of the blame for just how bad last season was. There are certain circumstances in football seasons where the blame can be apportioned and some bear a heavier burden but a lot of last year was so poor everybody must have been arseing about to some tune. We were a team short plus short of ideas and graft mostly. Billing didn't help but was very far from being the catalyst or main problem.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 31, 2019 17:18:12 GMT 1
Billing takes his part of the blame for just how bad last season was. There are certain circumstances in football seasons where the blame can be apportioned and some bear a heavier burden but a lot of last year was so poor everybody must have been arseing about to some tune. We were a team short plus short of ideas and graft mostly. Billing didn't help but was very far from being the catalyst or main problem. I've made it plain by supporting Billing on a few occasions that I don't agree with most of the criticisms. Player of the year, voted for by his own team mates and deservedly so in my opinion for his contributions prior to what is an early vote. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 31, 2019 17:26:10 GMT 1
when you have been in a Warnock and Horton dressing room towns would be quite by comparison.im sure lessons will have been learned on both sides. its nothing We live in a different time Positive this isn't the 1990s. Whether we like it or not the player is now king. A lot of the job of a premier league manager is mollycoddling egos. I bet you a pound to a penny Warnocks managerial style is a lot different now to in 1995. It's about getting people on your side and wanting to work for you. Throwing teacups is becoming redundant . The manager showed his inexperience imo If you think 'attitude' comes from the 90s you're a bit out. I recall a true story concerning one of our future stars not pulling his weight involving apprenticeship/trainee duty's. What can I do said the junior manager at the time wringing his hands. 'He's worth money". |
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Post by Chips Longhorn on Jul 31, 2019 17:31:29 GMT 1
We live in a different time Positive this isn't the 1990s. Whether we like it or not the player is now king. A lot of the job of a premier league manager is mollycoddling egos. I bet you a pound to a penny Warnocks managerial style is a lot different now to in 1995. It's about getting people on your side and wanting to work for you. Throwing teacups is becoming redundant . The manager showed his inexperience imo If you think 'attitude' comes from the 90s you're a bit out. I recall a true story concerning one of our future stars not pulling his weight involving apprenticeship/trainee duty's. What can I do said the junior manager at the time wringing his hands. 'He's worth money". Where have I said "attitude" comes from the 1990s ? What I'm saying is A some managerial practices are now seen as inappropriate. Let's face it many were just barefaced bullying. But also B the huge sums of money invested in players has led to a realligning of power. I'm not saying its right or wrong I'm saying that's how it is |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 31, 2019 18:18:05 GMT 1
If you think 'attitude' comes from the 90s you're a bit out. I recall a true story concerning one of our future stars not pulling his weight involving apprenticeship/trainee duty's. What can I do said the junior manager at the time wringing his hands. 'He's worth money". Where have I said "attitude" comes from the 1990s ? What I'm saying is A some managerial practices are now seen as inappropriate. Let's face it many were just barefaced bullying. But also B the huge sums of money invested in players has led to a realligning of power. I'm not saying its right or wrong I'm saying that's how it is And all i pointed out is player power through player value is not new. |
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Post by Chips Longhorn on Jul 31, 2019 18:20:50 GMT 1
Where have I said "attitude" comes from the 1990s ? What I'm saying is A some managerial practices are now seen as inappropriate. Let's face it many were just barefaced bullying. But also B the huge sums of money invested in players has led to a realligning of power. I'm not saying its right or wrong I'm saying that's how it is And all i pointed out is player power through player value is not new. And I'm saying that prior to jean marc bosman it was a completely different ball game |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 31, 2019 18:39:10 GMT 1
And all i pointed out is player power through player value is not new. And I'm saying that prior to jean marc bosman it was a completely different ball game Got fo agree there. |
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Post by Boaty McBoatface on Jul 31, 2019 19:17:17 GMT 1
And all i pointed out is player power through player value is not new. And I'm saying that prior to jean marc bosman it was a completely different ball game So what you're saying is people should live like lobsters? |
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Post by terriertim on Jul 31, 2019 19:33:04 GMT 1
I feel a song a coming on
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Post by Chips Longhorn on Jul 31, 2019 19:34:29 GMT 1
And I'm saying that prior to jean marc bosman it was a completely different ball game So what you're saying is people should live like lobsters? I'd answer you if I knew what you were talking about |
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Post by terriertim on Jul 31, 2019 19:34:44 GMT 1
Can we close this thread now - the lanky piece of piss has fooked off down south - he doesnt play for us anymore - we got 15m for him - ta ta Billing have a good life !
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Post by explorer on Jul 31, 2019 19:45:40 GMT 1
Can we close this thread now - the lanky piece of piss has fooked off down south - he doesnt play for us anymore - we got 15m for him - ta ta Billing have a good life ! Fair point - his physical self has gone to Bournemouth and “Digital Phil” should be offed to the ex-player thread. |
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Post by Porrohman on Jul 31, 2019 19:51:06 GMT 1
Can't quite understand the level of vitriol and depth of dislike aimed at young Phil. He certainly had a laid back style to his play - some say that made him look lazy but the stats - distance covered, tackles etc - suggest otherwise. I wish him well and, certainly in financial terms, the club has done marvellously from him. I think we could all name several Town players that we've bought recently that we are going to have to sell at a loss, or can't get rid of - some we loaned out unsuccessfully and others still haven't staked a regular place near the first team. People seem to be giving him a large part of the blame for our awful season last year. Certainly towards the end of the season he did not help and I would not condone his going public with his criticism of Jan Siewert (I think, and I may be wrong as I have no idea at all what went on behind the scenes, he was only saying what a lot of Town players felt, allegedly - we all heard the rumours from Schindler downwards). There are certainly other people I would blame more for our pathetic giving up of Premier League status and I would start with David Wagner - signs contract then very very soon decides he will be leaving/buying players for a system he then doesn't use/ ultra negative defensive football/ loss of our "identity" from the Spurs match onwards etc etc. Many of the players (new signing and usual offenders), as well as and even more than Billing, did not contribute. All in all he had his faults certainly but, for me, I wish him well and thank him for some excellent performances. Some of our current squad, who are still defended on here, have contributed a bloody site less in the last two years than Philip Billing did and we're not going to get £15m for them - as has been said we'll either sell them at a loss or have to subsidise their wages/pay them off if other clubs do acquire them. Those other clubs hardly seem to be rushing to get them. Combination of football tribal mentality, the desire or need to scapegoat someone and be a focus of fans’ understandable bitterness at the embarrassment that was last season. At the end of the day Phil Billing’s responsibilities are too himself, just like any other player and person in history. Players that stayed with us over the years did so because it suited them to do so. Not because of loyalty. Funny how no-one (except me) ever slammed Pilkington for his behaviour. He made his name with us, we got him fully fit after terrible injury. The moment he was fit again he forced a move and we got a sum roughly a fifth of what he was worth. Virtually no recriminations from fans about that. Why? Because he was English or just popular as a player. Roberts had a much bigger impact than him but isn’t remembered as fondly. Fans have selective memories and selective players they like and don’t like. ‘‘Twas ever thus. We didn't get Pilks fit, he was still on crutches at OT. How did jug ears have a bigger impact ? I'd take Pilks every time |
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Post by stanton1969 on Aug 1, 2019 8:16:47 GMT 1
I don't think Phil is as good as he or his agent think he is. He needs a lot around him to perform well and he's not a leader.
All this stuff about stats.....lies, damn lies, and statistics. He could run in 5 yard circles nowhere near the action all match.....would that count as ground covered? I'd rather have someone who runs half as far but is twice as effective.
He's a reasonable footballer, but I doubt we'll see him progress any higher than Bournemouth.
All things considered, 15m is a great price. I honestly don't think he contributed a vast amount to us, despite him being a decent player. In the season he did stand out a bit......we got relegated. He won't be missed.
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Post by otium (EPBS) on Aug 1, 2019 19:33:05 GMT 1
when you have been in a Warnock and Horton dressing room towns would be quite by comparison.im sure lessons will have been learned on both sides. its nothing We live in a different time Positive this isn't the 1990s. Whether we like it or not the player is now king. A lot of the job of a premier league manager is mollycoddling egos. I bet you a pound to a penny Warnocks managerial style is a lot different now to in 1995. It's about getting people on your side and wanting to work for you. Throwing teacups is becoming redundant . The manager showed his inexperience imo He said as much in his third autobiography. |
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Post by Amigo on Aug 1, 2019 19:50:40 GMT 1
I don't think Phil is as good as he or his agent think he is. He needs a lot around him to perform well and he's not a leader. All this stuff about stats.....lies, damn lies, and statistics. He could run in 5 yard circles nowhere near the action all match.....would that count as ground covered? I'd rather have someone who runs half as far but is twice as effective. He's a reasonable footballer, but I doubt we'll see him progress any higher than Bournemouth. All things considered, 15m is a great price. I honestly don't think he contributed a vast amount to us, despite him being a decent player. In the season he did stand out a bit......we got relegated. He won't be missed. Fob the stats off because they don't agree with your perception if you like but the facts are in terms of tackling, interceptions, blocks he was right up there in the entire league. I guess he's really lucky that every time the opposition attacked they attacked in this 5 yard circle he ran around in... If he put no effort in during games would his fellow colleagues who are with him every day and played with him every week have voted him their best performer last season? I'm going to take a wild guess that your particular perception would lead you to believe Hogg was more effective? Yet when you look at the facts and not just your rose tinted specs I'm afraid to say he wasn't. |
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Post by Captainslapper on Aug 1, 2019 20:06:01 GMT 1
Pretty clear to me that he will indeed be missed, just like he was last season.
Results might not have been much better with him in the side up to xmas but the performances certainly were.
We went from being pretty unlucky to lose a lot of time to deservedly losing almost all the time.
Over the whole campaign, he was probably our best player last season. Losing your best player is always going to be a blow for any side.
But circumstances dictated he had to be sold and we got a decent price. Not as much as we'd have got if hed stayed playing in the way he was until he and/or JS decided he wouldn;t play anymore, but still a decent price.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 1, 2019 20:34:49 GMT 1
I doubt he will go further than Bournemouth and may not even be a regular there unless his attitude changes. Time will tell.
I am glad he’s gone as you simply can’t depend on someone with a piss poor attitude like that.
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Post by mayorofcov (BFHB) Honours on Aug 1, 2019 20:43:31 GMT 1
Phil who
Close the thread
WANKER
UTFT
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Post by otium (EPBS) on Aug 1, 2019 22:56:28 GMT 1
Phil who Close the thread WANKER UTFT Never seen the acronym UTFT before but i reckon i worked it out pretty quickly  |
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Post by themanfromatlantis on Aug 1, 2019 23:04:40 GMT 1
Still don't get the vitriol on here.
Imagine if the internet had been around when Tracy Austin was here or Supermac...
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Post by Headless Chicken on Aug 1, 2019 23:26:45 GMT 1
Phil who Close the thread WANKER UTFT Never seen the acronym UTFT before but i reckon i worked it out pretty quickly Come on Oti, that ain't an acronym. |
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Post by stanton1969 on Aug 1, 2019 23:41:59 GMT 1
I don't think Phil is as good as he or his agent think he is. He needs a lot around him to perform well and he's not a leader. All this stuff about stats.....lies, damn lies, and statistics. He could run in 5 yard circles nowhere near the action all match.....would that count as ground covered? I'd rather have someone who runs half as far but is twice as effective. He's a reasonable footballer, but I doubt we'll see him progress any higher than Bournemouth. All things considered, 15m is a great price. I honestly don't think he contributed a vast amount to us, despite him being a decent player. In the season he did stand out a bit......we got relegated. He won't be missed. Fob the stats off because they don't agree with your perception if you like but the facts are in terms of tackling, interceptions, blocks he was right up there in the entire league. I guess he's really lucky that every time the opposition attacked they attacked in this 5 yard circle he ran around in... If he put no effort in during games would his fellow colleagues who are with him every day and played with him every week have voted him their best performer last season? I'm going to take a wild guess that your particular perception would lead you to believe Hogg was more effective? Yet when you look at the facts and not just your rose tinted specs I'm afraid to say he wasn't. Wow. Remind me to be as aggressive in response to one of your posts sometime. This board sometimes. FFS. I happen to think he is an OK footballer worth about what has been paid for him. No more, no less. I thought my post was actually pretty balanced and reasonable, if you'd bother to read it properly. The stats point applies to everyone - not just Phil Billing. They can easily mask the true nature of performances.....and under-represent others who are being effective. I'm not a fan of stats full-stop. Not just regarding Phil Billing. So my point about 5 yards was illustrative - understand? A bit of advice - don't waste your energy on making wild guesses at how I perceive other players - you're putting words in my mouth and actually, you're wrong on the Hogg suggestion. What a pathetic thing to suggest - I never even mentioned him! Get a room with Phil if you like him that much. It looks like you're the one wearing the rose tinted specs. |
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